MA MA - Phillip Markoff, Craigslist Killer

[Lola]

Accused 'Craigslist Killer' Evicted From Massachusetts Apartment

 

[joga]

i have a question, why is Markoff being allowed a private lawyer at public expense? wouldn't this be more expensive than a public defender? is this a normal thing that happens often? thanks! (i apologize if this has been discussed somewhere, i only have limited time to check the threads!)

QUOTE
"ABC News has also obtained court documents in which Markoff, a medical student, pleads poverty. The documents claim that he has not received any financial support from his family for several years and that he is living off student loans that total $130,000.

In response, the court ordered Markoff's lawyer, John Salsberg, to defend him at the public's expense, the court documents state"

http://abcnews.go.com/US/Story?id=7464224&page=2

 

[Melanie]

Whoa... Quote from this article:

"A law enforcement source told ABC News Wednesday that police found 16 pairs of women's panties in the home of Philip Markoff, the Boston University Medical student charged with the murder of a sex worker who was shot dead in an upscale hotel room.

The panties were hidden under Markoff's bed in the Quincy home he shared with his fiancee. Along with the panties was a large bag with roughly 60 pairs of plastic flex-cuff restraints, the law enforcement source said."

No way -- 16 pairs of underwear, and flex-cuff restraints....underneath the bed they shared? I can't even begin to imagine what kind of mind this man has (Dahmer is coming to mind). I guess you never know when you're sleeping with the enemy huh? Thankfully, we have a cat, and I'm always looking for him under the bed - shewww. I also have a house cleaner who would probably catch something like that.

I can't fault the fiance though, as I have an ex who had a double life, which has made me real weary. He didn't kill anyone, but he liked to have girlfriends on the side. ICK.

I hope she can move on with her life, and he gets what he deserves!

 

[daisy.faithfull]

Accused 'Craigslist Killer' Evicted From Massachusetts Apartment

I went to the above article, can't even imagine what their neighbors are thinking as they walk by the door with the notice on it. Can't even imagine how creeped out I would be if it turned out of my neighbors was a serial killer. The article had a link to another article about a PM Copycat in Washington. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,518382,00.html

As to what his x-fiancee is feeling... I want to say that I know she is going to persevere, but its going to be so hard for her. No matter how strong a person is, there are events, people, relationships that leave us scared. This woman is so young... to have all of these heaped on her, I don't know if I would still be standing.

After reading one of the articles on the foxnews.com, I scrolled down to the comments and they were just ripping on PM's x-fiancee. My heart just fell too my stomach, would've gone to my toes if I were standing. Especially after reading what Hermione shared I don't think that it at all reasonable to point the finger at her and say she should have known. Creatures like that get away with so many henious crimes because they are so good at hiding it.

When I look at a person who is joyful, I identify with them, I have felt joy too. Its the same way for all of us and all of our emotional experiences, except these monsters. We cannot identify what is truly going on inside them because we have no point of reference. We may see "it", but we cannot identify with "it" so we tell ourselves it is nothing, because who in the world would think that "it" is an empty conscious?

And it makes me so sad and mad that people have to live that and all the crazy head/heart trip stuff that you described, Hermione. It took a lot of strength to put it behind you and you are safe right now, right? You kinda trailed off on one of your posts and it had me a little concerned. If PM is reminding you of the man you were with maybe connect with some friends you feel safe with, because I do know that sometimes the memories can feel so real, your right there again. I don't know if you are still online, but thank you again for sharing your pain.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

I'm wondering why she never found any of this stuff: 16 pr of panties (not hers) and a bag of 60 of those plastic tie-up thingies. Maybe she never vacuumed under the bed? I guess if she went to school in St. Kitts she might not have been in the apartment enough to do any cleaning or look under the bed.

Maybe he had them in shoe boxes, who ever looks in their boyfriends shoe boxes? The could've been in a lock box... who knows.

I was freaked out about the 16 pairs of underwear, what is scaring me even more is that no more women have stepped forward as victims. I would've thought that if there were more they would've been found since he left the girl he killed in the room.

The time when his brother and sister-n-law were photographed I really thought that the sis-n-law was smiling. I'd bet you money she knew something was "off" w/PM for awhile, probably caused some tension in the relationship. Her husband sitting next to her just had the look of a husband who had just heard, "didn't I always tell you." Husbands must hate to hear that.

 

[Lola]

i have a question, why is Markoff being allowed a private lawyer at public expense? wouldn't this be more expensive than a public defender? is this a normal thing that happens often? thanks! (i apologize if this has been discussed somewhere, i only have limited time to check the threads!)

QUOTE
"ABC News has also obtained court documents in which Markoff, a medical student, pleads poverty. The documents claim that he has not received any financial support from his family for several years and that he is living off student loans that total $130,000.

In response, the court ordered Markoff's lawyer, John Salsberg, to defend him at the public's expense, the court documents state"

http://abcnews.go.com/US/Story?id=7464224&page=2

Not sure how this works in MA, but in many states there is a flat rate for public defenders no matter who it is and some bigger more prestigious firms do their bit and take a case now and then.

Pretty, clear that this is gonna be a high profile trial and you just can't buy this kind of publicity. Once this gets really rolling, all the shows will want this guy to be on and it's gotta help his firm. Geragos, Tacopina, all the "supahstahs" seem to operate this way.

 

[LoisDenominator]

Some interesting quotes in this article about MM moving on with her life:

"Honecker said his client has been physically ill over reports of Markoff collecting women’s panties, keeping a handgun in his Quincy apartment and seeking liaisons with transvestites."

“The more and more information that came out in the media put added stress on her,” Honecker told the Herald. “She’s going back to New Jersey and I don’t expect her to come back.”

“It’s done,” said the New Jersey beauty’s attorney.

“The wedding is off and being dismantled," Honecker added. "She has other things in her life that are important ... his fate rests in the court of law."

(Hoping "It's done" means the relationship -- not just the wedding.)

 

[Columbo]

Maybe he had them in shoe boxes, who ever looks in their boyfriends shoe boxes? The could've been in a lock box... who knows.

I was freaked out about the 16 pairs of underwear, what is scaring me even more is that no more women have stepped forward as victims. I would've thought that if there were more they would've been found since he left the girl he killed in the room.

The time when his brother and sister-n-law were photographed I really thought that the sis-n-law was smiling. I'd bet you money she knew something was "off" w/PM for awhile, probably caused some tension in the relationship. Her husband sitting next to her just had the look of a husband who had just heard, "didn't I always tell you." Husbands must hate to hear that.

That's right--we don't know...the stuff could have been in shoeboxes. I wonder if the other women are either missing or dead (shudder).

I also think the relatives are smiling because they had a feeling he was off, and relief that he is finally caught.

 

[Lovejac]

ITA! 16 pairs of panties !

I sure hope some more victims come forward, because if they don't, I fear they are dead.

 

[YellowDog]

The question in my mind is "Was it the thrill of the kill or the thrill of gambiling?" I tend to favor the first. I'm sure that LE is checking on any missing women. And couldn't they take DNA from the missing women's clothing and match it up to the panties?

This man was a train wreck rolling at full speed. Thank God they caught him.

 

[Columbo]

The question in my mind is "Was it the thrill of the kill or the thrill of gambiling?" I tend to favor the first. I'm sure that LE is checking on any missing women. And couldn't they take DNA from the missing women's clothing and match it up to the panties?

This man was a train wreck rolling at full speed. Thank God they caught him.

Well said.

 

[fairydusted]

Hello fellow WS'ers..I'm not really a poster, but am an avid reader..this time, I had to weigh in..after reading everything out there to read on this case, my opinion is that Markoff was a killer by accident. I don't believe he ever intended to physically harm his victims..one of them said her was very polite, and assured her that no harm would come to her if she was quiet...she was, and he kept his word..no physical harm.Another victim stated that he ran when her husband came in..if he were intent on killing his victims, or, was afraid of being identified, they would both be dead. I believe his reaction to JuLissa was his survival instinct kicking in..not survival in the literal sense, but, survival of his life as he knew it..she was threatening to take that away. I could go for the "heat of the moment" defense, if I were on the jury. I'm certainly not condoning his robbery of them, but, I do understand gambling addictions..they are as addictive as heroine and nicotine. At some point, all that matters is finding the means to play another hand..they can't see beyond that.I believe he felt that the money he was taking was ill-gotten gains via prostitution, and in his mind it was no different than ill-gotten gains from robbery..from one criminal to another.As far as his sexual perversions are concerned..I see him not much different than 95% of the rest of the human race..it may not be talked about, but, it is certainly not uncommon.

 

[hockeymom]

Hello fellow WS'ers..I'm not really a poster, but am an avid reader..this time, I had to weigh in..after reading everything out there to read on this case, my opinion is that Markoff was a killer by accident. I don't believe he ever intended to physically harm his victims..one of them said her was very polite, and assured her that no harm would come to her if she was quiet...she was, and he kept his word..no physical harm.Another victim stated that he ran when her husband came in..if he were intent on killing his victims, or, was afraid of being identified, they would both be dead. I believe his reaction to JuLissa was his survival instinct kicking in..not survival in the literal sense, but, survival of his life as he knew it..she was threatening to take that away. I could go for the "heat of the moment" defense, if I were on the jury. I'm certainly not condoning his robbery of them, but, I do understand gambling addictions..they are as addictive as heroine and nicotine. At some point, all that matters is finding the means to play another hand..they can't see beyond that.I believe he felt that the money he was taking was ill-gotten gains via prostitution, and in his mind it was no different than ill-gotten gains from robbery..from one criminal to another.As far as his sexual perversions are concerned..I see him not much different than 95% of the rest of the human race..it may not be talked about, but, it is certainly not uncommon.

Maybe so,but things could have been escalating. It seems that the collecting of souvenirs and his sexual perversion,add something different to the picture. Its possable he started out just robbing,to feed his addiction,but found he was getting gratification from it.I'm thinking if he didn't get caught after this murder,he might have liked that feeling and committed again.

 

[fairydusted]

As for the collecting of souvenirs, we don't yet know who they belong to..could be old girlfriends, for all we know..the keeping of these items, again, is not uncommon..I've had boyfriends in past relationships want to keep them..some asked, and one took them without asking, I later learned..it IS a souvenir of their conquest..nothing deviant about that. We also don't KNOW whether or not there was any sexual contact with his victims..it's not like they are going to be exactly upfront about prostituting themselves, especially to authorities.Lastly, I'm not yet ready to go out on the limb and say that interest in trannys or same gender sex is deviant or perverted behavior..again, if it is,then society consists of mostly deviants..your neighbors, your doctors, your attorneys, and teachers..

 

[Jelly Doughnut]

Regarding his lawyer, John Salsberg - he initially came to be on the case because he is...

Founding member and co-chair of Suffolk Lawyers for Justice, a non profit organization coordinating the provision of private assigned counsel to indigent criminal defendants charged with superior and district court felonies and misdemeanors.

http://www.zimbio.com/John+Salsberg/articles/1/John+Salsberg+Defense+attorney+accused+Craigslist

I cannot find the original article that mentioned this - it was in one of the very first articles when the case first broke. I imagine the state has a standard fee they pay lawyers under these circumstances, and I don't think he will be receiving his usual and customary fees.

 

[Lovejac]

Regarding his lawyer, John Salsberg - he initially came to be on the case because he is...

Founding member and co-chair of Suffolk Lawyers for Justice, a non profit organization coordinating the provision of private assigned counsel to indigent criminal defendants charged with superior and district court felonies and misdemeanors.

http://www.zimbio.com/John+Salsberg/articles/1/John+Salsberg+Defense+attorney+accused+Craigslist

I cannot find the original article that mentioned this - it was in one of the very first articles when the case first broke. I imagine the state has a standard fee they pay lawyers under these circumstances, and I don't think he will be receiving his usual and customary fees.

Thank's jelly, that makes me feel a little better.

 

[hockeymom]

As for the collecting of souvenirs, we don't yet know who they belong to..could be old girlfriends, for all we know..the keeping of these items, again, is not uncommon..I've had boyfriends in past relationships want to keep them..some asked, and one took them without asking, I later learned..it IS a souvenir of their conquest..nothing deviant about that. We also don't KNOW whether or not there was any sexual contact with his victims..it's not like they are going to be exactly upfront about prostituting themselves, especially to authorities.Lastly, I'm not yet ready to go out on the limb and say that interest in trannys or same gender sex is deviant or perverted behavior..again, if it is,then society consists of mostly deviants..your neighbors, your doctors, your attorneys, and teachers..

I stand corrected on the sexual perversion. Too each his own. I think its more the double life he was clearly living.

 

[LoisDenominator]

I cannot find the original article that mentioned this - it was in one of the very first articles when the case first broke. I imagine the state has a standard fee they pay lawyers under these circumstances, and I don't think he will be receiving his usual and customary fees.

The Boston Globe goes into a bit of detail about the attorney arrangement in this article. I swear I remember reading somewhere that they cap the attorney fees at $100 per hour for indigent cases -- but of course I can't track it down anywhere... It's tough getting old!

 

[LoisDenominator]

I swear I remember reading somewhere that they cap the attorney fees at $100 per hour for indigent cases -- but of course I can't track it down anywhere... It's tough getting old!

Found it - the great Joe Dwinell of the Boston Herald breaks it down.

"State-appointed defense attorneys earn a mandatory $100 an hour to defend broke murder defendants. For big cases, you can bet two attorneys will be assigned to the case."

 

[daisy.faithfull]

It is possible that the owners are alive and have not stepped forward for the same reason they did not report the crime to begin with. They have to worry about being charged with the crime, but having to come forward and identify themselves as prostitutes to the media, at the trial etc. might be information they want to keep private.