MA - Professor Karen Read, 43, charged with murdering police officer boyfriend John O'Keefe by hitting him with car, Canton, 14 Apr 2023 #3

[ch_13]

I thought the Albert kids today were mostly truthful. Caitlin came across as pretty likable, if verbose, and Brian Jr. was clearly pretty nervous. He said he had anxiety and I can believe it from his demeanor. Very different, personality wise, from his dad. Whatever happened that night it's hard to believe these two were involved. (I'll add that I do think they may have shaded the truth some. Caitlin testified that she hadn't heard anything about the trial, but she definitely had an answer prepped for how she knew Katie McLaughlin.)

Compared to his kids though, Brian Sr. came across as not so honest. The almost-simultaneous butt-dials by him and Higgins is very hard to believe. And for a senior police detective to get rid of his phone right before receiving a protective order is pretty suspect. Then he kept quiet about it and didn't tell the DA what he did.

Also, Michael Proctor's fingerprints are all over this case. First, neither of the kids were interviewed by Proctor until after the federal grand jury. And then Brian Sr. was allowed to be over at his sister-in-law's house when she was being questioned. Just more examples of how the police investigation was thoroughly compromised.

 

[Wishbone]

I thought the Albert kids today were mostly truthful. Caitlin came across as pretty likable, if verbose, and Brian Jr. was clearly pretty nervous. He said he had anxiety and I can believe it from his demeanor. Very different, personality wise, from his dad. Whatever happened that night it's hard to believe these two were involved. (I'll add that I do think they may have shaded the truth some. Caitlin testified that she hadn't heard anything about the trial, but she definitely had an answer prepped for how she knew Katie McLaughlin.)

Compared to his kids though, Brian Sr. came across as not so honest. The almost-simultaneous butt-dials by him and Higgins is very hard to believe. And for a senior police detective to get rid of his phone right before receiving a protective order is pretty suspect. Then he kept quiet about it and didn't tell the DA what he did.

Also, Michael Proctor's fingerprints are all over this case. First, neither of the kids were interviewed by Proctor until after the federal grand jury. And then Brian Sr. was allowed to be over at his sister-in-law's house when she was being questioned. Just more examples of how the police investigation was thoroughly compromised.

At this point, those "kids" know it all and are keeping it to themselves....JMOO

 

[Ray_of_hope]

Just something I wondered about last night. Is it possible between all of the comings and goings at the Albert house, that someone leaving or coming hit JO? People seemed to be drinking continuously that evening and even at the Albert home. I doubt any other cars were checked or tested for DNA besides Karen's (if the prosecution has ruled out any other incident). But to me, there is something hinky about one of the women who has inserted herself into this mess. MOO and just a random wondering.

 

[DeDee]

I just wrote then edited my kind of same comment. His stairs are more than I have had and envisioned. One to take the top and one to hold his feet. I've felt with ongoing reading of this , more info, that JO went through some NOT obvious and easily seen door, with other guests nearby that were not 'wanted' for the event, if this was preplanned. Was Jen Mc the 'alerter'? They're here, not knowing that KR would not be coming in after all. That bulkhead entry/exit is so convenient.

Are you implying that the people who were inside the Albert home when John and Karen arrived at 34 Fairview intended to kill both of them? They didn't know Karen would not be coming inside but wanted her dead, too?

 

[keek]

Are you implying that the people who were inside the Albert home when John and Karen arrived at 34 Fairview intended to kill both of them? They didn't know Karen would not be coming inside but wanted her dead, too?

NO. It's not known WHAT happened and that was absolutely NOT the plan for JO either but either way it ended up with his demise. KR unintentionally or Albert or a guest of his. K was expected as well we think or it was confirmed by K that it was for both, I don't remember seeing that. Who knows what was on some of their minds? JM or Higgins with the invitation, JM was very welcoming and helping via text where to park, but WHO knows why? Normal behavior for people or wanted to observe behaviors unfold or JUST ALL INNOCENT till something happened to him via someone (s). This is if not K's SUV backing up onto him.

 

[thebedbug]

There's nothing fishy going on.

Karen Read hit him.
Karen Read went home.
Karen Read woke (or never went to bed) and knew/remembered that she'd hit him. That's why she didn't behave like a normal person, that morning.
Nobody goes into a full panic at 4:45am - simply because their boyfriend hasn't come home after extending the night drinking with friends - and especially not in a blizzard.
Whether Karen Read said 'I hit him' or 'did I hit him?' - it's all nonsense. When you drop someone off at a party - you don't think you might've run them over and killed them! They get out of the car - they say bye - they walk up the door. You drive off.
Again, you don't think maybe you've run them over and killed them.

 

[HarmonyE.]

There's nothing fishy going on.

Karen Read hit him.
Karen Read went home.
Karen Read woke (or never went to bed) and knew/remembered that she'd hit him. That's why she didn't behave like a normal person, that morning.
Nobody goes into a full panic at 4:45am - simply because their boyfriend hasn't come home after extending the night drinking with friends - and especially not in a blizzard.
Whether Karen Read said 'I hit him' or 'did I hit him?' - it's all nonsense. When you drop someone off at a party - you don't think you might've run them over and killed them! They get out of the car - they say bye - they walk up the door. You drive off.
Again, you don't think maybe you've run them over and killed them.

You should watch the trial.

 

[LvsAMystry]

There's nothing fishy going on.

Karen Read hit him.
Karen Read went home.
Karen Read woke (or never went to bed) and knew/remembered that she'd hit him. That's why she didn't behave like a normal person, that morning.
Nobody goes into a full panic at 4:45am - simply because their boyfriend hasn't come home after extending the night drinking with friends - and especially not in a blizzard.
Whether Karen Read said 'I hit him' or 'did I hit him?' - it's all nonsense. When you drop someone off at a party - you don't think you might've run them over and killed them! They get out of the car - they say bye - they walk up the door. You drive off.
Again, you don't think maybe you've run them over and killed them.

What evidence (actual not conjecture or assumed) has convinced you?

 

[TristanP]

Respectfully, disagree in this case. There were issues about certain things when it came to her taking care of the kids. There are articles that have been posted here which relates to this (her feeling as if he was taking advantage of her care), but no link, so it's moo.

Did she get mad that he get to have the fun, and I am stuck here with...
Typical that he would not call or text.
Again... moo

Nothing to base this on but common sense.

She wasn’t stuck anywhere. The boy was at a sleepover with a friend. The girl was old enough to take care of herself. She had been home while John & Karen were out.

 

[acutename]

So if the dog bites, attacks a person in your home and lets say the attack was only due to playing around with each other…
Example: boxing or play fighting as guys like to do. The dog of the house viciously attacks the stranger because that is what some dogs will do. The homeowner/dog owner decides to drag the person out to the cold and let the person die. Instead of calling 911 and getting help for the person’s dog bites that typically are not life threatening.

moo

they are saying the dog was not out... but with all the door openings and closings, how do they know?
suppose the dog jumped on JO... he has been drinking... he wrestles with it and falls...I do not even know why they think they know every car that was on the street that night... IMO.

 

[waldojabba]

Bulkheads are not used enough I'd say to be so annoying if old and creaky to go through the expense of replacing. I know he was planning to sell and maybe wanted to 'upgrade' things like that, but I doubt it.. more like no chance of DNA or fibers found on the doors and who knows what he did to the stairs and sidewalls. if anything.

This is the first thing I thought of - who replaces their bulkhead door? Sometimes it gets repainted but I have never known anyone to replace - I cannot imagine it improves the resale value
JMO

 

[waldojabba]

Aren’t the buttons to silence a call in a different position, to the side than the power button or scroll area to answer and reject a call though? Would he really get those two spots confused?

Also did the phone ring? Because if so I feel he would possibly look at the phone to verify who was calling just out of parental instinct since his daughter had left that night and he would want to check to see if the caller was her in case she needed help or he would just check out of concern or worry for his party guests who were driving in the snow unfortunately after consuming alcohol or becoming inebriated. And if he did check his in this scenario would he have been less likely to silence or hang up Higgins call since he was looking directly at it?

JMO/ MO speculation

Yes. Especially since he took the phone into the bed with him for that very reason bc he said he had kids. So if that’s the case you don’t turn off the ringer - bc your kids might need you. JMO

 

[HarmonyE.]

This is the first thing I thought of - who replaces their bulkhead door? Sometimes it gets repainted but I have never known anyone to replace - I cannot imagine it improves the resale value

When there is water intrusion or rodents are coming in.

It's possible the new owner replaced the bulkhead door and the interior door as BA claimed not to recognize either. But then again, he's clearly lying on the stand about so much else that it's hard to believe anything he says.

 

[HanniBJeter]

BA lied on the stand almost immediately this morning. He said he didn’t speak to Lally. Then said oh yeah, he did, but misunderstood Jackson’s question. Uh huh. And I couldn’t stand how BA addressed the jury directly…yuck. He gives me the creeps.
And why did the judge continue to allow Caitlin to answer every question with “I don’t know, I think” or “I’m not sure, I believe”…she seemed to be guessing at every answer, nothing definitive.

 

[keek]

This is the first thing I thought of - who replaces their bulkhead door? Sometimes it gets repainted but I have never known anyone to replace - I cannot imagine it improves the resale value
JMO

Yes, repainted and prepped, primed is normal if someone wants to bother. If it was creaky and could be heard in the house, normal, you just throw some WD 40 on the hinge things, even if making nicer appearing towards putting the house on the market. (mahkit, for those mocking my accent as well )

 

[acutename]

for those who have been following this story all along, why have the Alberts said that they sold their house and to where did they move?

 

[Wishbone]

for those who have been following this story all along, why have the Alberts said that they sold their house and to where did they move?

Said they wanted to downsize since kids were grown and I don't know where they moved to.

 

[DeDee]

There's nothing fishy going on.

Karen Read hit him.
Karen Read went home.
Karen Read woke (or never went to bed) and knew/remembered that she'd hit him. That's why she didn't behave like a normal person, that morning.
Nobody goes into a full panic at 4:45am - simply because their boyfriend hasn't come home after extending the night drinking with friends - and especially not in a blizzard.
Whether Karen Read said 'I hit him' or 'did I hit him?' - it's all nonsense. When you drop someone off at a party - you don't think you might've run them over and killed them! They get out of the car - they say bye - they walk up the door. You drive off.
Again, you don't think maybe you've run them over and killed them.

If the Defense wants to say the Albert's are good for John's death, then why does Karen confess? Many of Karen's confessions heard were then testified to it in court. She panicked.

How did she know precisely where John's body was under the snow by the flagpole when her two companions were blind to it without her knowing where he landed? She and John were at the curb of 34 Fairview for about 5 minutes. Arguing is the most likely reason. She pulled her vehicle down closer to the flagpole area. Maybe that's when he exited the SUV.

It's possible John thought she was going to come inside, but instead she zoomed forward, then sped in reverse that knocked him into the air and his head hit the concrete birdbath or whatnot in order to gash the back of his skull.

A document claims she called John and left a voicemail just following the hit and run. She hit him because she hated him.
Karen screamed at John that she hated him. @ 2:48


moo

 

[Wishbone]

Read a theory about why nobody saw a body in the yard to include the snowplow driver. It's because he wasn't put there until much later. On one of the plow driver passes by the house Loughran noticed a ford edge parked on the street in front of where JO's body was later found. Here's the theory....JO died in the basement was wrapped up in a tarp, moved into the ford edge that was parked the in garage. Sometime later the ford was parked in the street in front of where the body was found and while parked there it concealed the dirty work of them moving JO. Something to think about.....

Brian Loughran, according to the defense motion, emphatically told both a private investigator hired by Read and officers of the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) that he made multiple passes by the Alberts’ home between 2:30 and 3:30 a.m. on January 29, 2022 and O’Keefe’s body was not on the lawn where he was found by Read shortly after 6 a.m. Loughran’s testimony, the defense motion alleges, directly contradicts the commonwealth’s assertion that O’Keefe had been “lying incapacitated in Brian Albert’s front yard” since around 12:30 a.m., when he was allegedly struck by Read. The defense also cites additional testimony by Loughran claiming to have observed a vehicle he believed to be a Ford Edge parked near the location of where O’Keefe’s body was discovered sometime after 3:30 a.m.

Lawyers in Karen Read case set to argue new motions | Canton Citizen

www.thecantoncitizen.com

 

[Kittybunny]

There's nothing fishy going on.

Karen Read hit him.
Karen Read went home.
Karen Read woke (or never went to bed) and knew/remembered that she'd hit him. That's why she didn't behave like a normal person, that morning.
Nobody goes into a full panic at 4:45am - simply because their boyfriend hasn't come home after extending the night drinking with friends - and especially not in a blizzard.
Whether Karen Read said 'I hit him' or 'did I hit him?' - it's all nonsense. When you drop someone off at a party - you don't think you might've run them over and killed them! They get out of the car - they say bye - they walk up the door. You drive off.
Again, you don't think maybe you've run them over and killed them.

I've been lurking here and just wanted to jump in here. As a recovering alcoholic, I think this is certainly possible. I'm not proud of it, but I had so many blackouts, and drove during some of them, and not once did I ever think that I had potentially hit someone.

However, approaching this case from a completely objective point of view, it's impossible NOT to think that something fishy is going on. Why all the evasiveness and lack of transparency from those that were there? Is it just super fuzzy memories from a night of hard drinking? Or is it guilt? And trying to avoid civil liability for something? I could believe a situation where someone did see him out there, and not seeing any obvious injuries, just assumed that he was passed out drunk, laughed about it and went to bed. Then when they realized he was dead and maybe they could have saved him, panicked. I'm the least conspiracy minded person that ever was, but certainly do believe in people who are incompetent and protect other members of the police force. There could also be other illegal activities that happened that night that the parties do not want to come to light, which could be an explanation as well for the weird behavior.

The investigation was cursory at best, and that's being kind, which does not help the prosecution at all. I don't strongly believe that anyone killed JO on purpose, and that includes KR. And from what I've heard so far, I could absolutely not convict her beyond a reasonable doubt. I agree with those that say the defense is running circles around the prosecution at this point, and that probably this case should never have gone to trial, I could maybe go with an involuntary manslaughter charge here but even that needs stronger evidence than what they've shown so far.

Ok, back to lurking!