MI MI - Jessica Heeringa, 25, Norton Shores, 26 April 2013 #9 (J. Willis GUILTY)

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Wouldn't the person who owned the vehicle have come forward by now since the person has nothing to hide? ... The lack of anyone coming forward to own up to owning the van in the picture is almost 100% proof that the van in the picture is in fact the one used in Jessica's disappearance.

Apologies, but this claim seems pretty outlandish to me. Has it been confirmed (via security cam footage, etc.) that the van had Michigan plates? If not it could've come from anywhere in the country. At the very least it could be from anywhere in the state. Especially in this age of watching TV shows online, getting all your news from Facebook, etc., it's entirely possible the person driving the van has never heard of this case. And, indeed, that no one who knows that person has heard of it, or thought to connect it to their friend's car if they have, or thought it a likely enough match to bear bringing it to their friend's attention, or what have you.

It's also possible that the person driving the van HAS heard about the case, but is reluctant to inject themselves into it for fear of arousing undue suspicion. Sometimes cops railroad a suspect for the sake of closing a high-profile case. Sometimes people are harassed/intimidated into giving false confessions. Sometimes just the fact of being publicly associated with a case like this is enough to cost people their job, place to live, etc. (Look at the guy recently who was drummed out of the service and can't find an apartment due to false rape accusations). The driver might also have a record of some kind, and thus fears getting involved with the police.

Any which way you slice it, there are plenty of plausible reasons why a (non-guilty) party may not have made themselves known to the police in this situation.

In terms of the plausibility of the Exxon manager's actions, presuming they were involved in Jessica's abduction (or know who was): I don't know the precise circumstances under which they came forward, or for that matter, how/when the manager's relative somehow came to be involved in the situation. It's possible they feared having it come back to bite them if they didn't say anything, then someone later reported seeing them lurking in a nearby parking lot spying on the Exxon station (or a security camera picked them up, or something). It's possible it was an 'A Simple Plan'-type situation, where they thought it clever to make up a story that would presumably distract attention away from themselves and their relative, only later to have it come back and cast undue suspicion on them.

All that being said, I'm not saying I think the manager was involved, either. Her story has just never made much sense to me -- first saying she suspected the store was being robbed, then that she 'had no reason to believe a crime had been committed,' etc. -- and the later reveal of her family connection to one of the POI's only makes it seem more fishy.
 
Totally agree on all counts. I "silver" van on a black and white video may have been a light blue van, a white van, ... and the owners might very well have said "well that cant be me... my van is light blue..." and gave the matter no further thought. And while WE here on WS obviously follow the news closely, I live local to the area, and while people know of the case, many gave it a cursory glance and maybe never even saw the video.
I always wondered if the 'witness' initially made things up to look important... ( hence posting about it on Facebook the next day about seeing the whole thing and not realizing what she saw.. blah blah...) and was then stuck with her story... Maybe enjoyed the attention. The whole idea of a kidnapper driving slowly past her.... close enough and light enough inside for her to get a good look at his face... no. Im sure she lied. But... was it really sinister ( involved in the disappearance?) or merely liked feeling important and giving the police what they asked for. Could not really back out at that point, could she?
 
Apologies, but this claim seems pretty outlandish to me. Has it been confirmed (via security cam footage, etc.) that the van had Michigan plates? If not it could've come from anywhere in the country. At the very least it could be from anywhere in the state. Especially in this age of watching TV shows online, getting all your news from Facebook, etc., it's entirely possible the person driving the van has never heard of this case. And, indeed, that no one who knows that person has heard of it, or thought to connect it to their friend's car if they have, or thought it a likely enough match to bear bringing it to their friend's attention, or what have you.

It's also possible that the person driving the van HAS heard about the case, but is reluctant to inject themselves into it for fear of arousing undue suspicion. Sometimes cops railroad a suspect for the sake of closing a high-profile case. Sometimes people are harassed/intimidated into giving false confessions. Sometimes just the fact of being publicly associated with a case like this is enough to cost people their job, place to live, etc. (Look at the guy recently who was drummed out of the service and can't find an apartment due to false rape accusations). The driver might also have a record of some kind, and thus fears getting involved with the police.

Any which way you slice it, there are plenty of plausible reasons why a (non-guilty) party may not have made themselves known to the police in this situation.

In terms of the plausibility of the Exxon manager's actions, presuming they were involved in Jessica's abduction (or know who was): I don't know the precise circumstances under which they came forward, or for that matter, how/when the manager's relative somehow came to be involved in the situation. It's possible they feared having it come back to bite them if they didn't say anything, then someone later reported seeing them lurking in a nearby parking lot spying on the Exxon station (or a security camera picked them up, or something). It's possible it was an 'A Simple Plan'-type situation, where they thought it clever to make up a story that would presumably distract attention away from themselves and their relative, only later to have it come back and cast undue suspicion on them.

All that being said, I'm not saying I think the manager was involved, either. Her story has just never made much sense to me -- first saying she suspected the store was being robbed, then that she 'had no reason to believe a crime had been committed,' etc. -- and the later reveal of her family connection to one of the POI's only makes it seem more fishy.

I pumped gas all of my life in North Jersey. We were off of 2 major hi-ways; used to get people from NY, PA and a handful of other states. I've been seeing TV commercials for MI tourism for the last year; at what point does the tourist season start? I've always felt the van if involved could be from anywhere due to the location of the Exxon.
 
Outlandish? Really? It seems some people liked it. Well, let me give it another shot . . .

You're exactly right that some people may not come forward--and you gave some various reasons why they might not. But adding up all those types of people, what percentage is that of the entire population? 5%? 6%? It's exactly the reason I said "almost 100%" and not "absolutely 100%". Because it seems to me that police usually get A LOT of help from the general public when it comes to solving cases--what did they see? what did they hear? Where were they? Etc. And most people are more than happy to help. In fact, despite what we think about DNA, fingerprints, etc., it's usually thru witnesses and a concerned public that criminals get caught. I mean, how many criminals end up getting turned in by their gf/mother/ex-wife? MANY.

Also, as far as cops railroading people, there are more criminals walking the streets who've never been caught than innocent people in jail. Yep, mistakes are made--some big time ones, in fact. But I think our perception of that is overblown because so much is made of innocent people in jail, not because there are many of them.

Even given all that, all these theories that it wasn't really a minivan, and the mgr and her husband picked out a random vehicle, etc. Does anybody realize how outlandish that is? Granted, I'll give you this: Whoever made Jessica disappear has gotten away with it to this point. But, that person or people would've NEVER planned to perpetrate a crime this way.

-What happens if no cars happen to be on that street that night? Then how would they have picked out a random car?
-What happens if the random car they pick happens to be the car of the mayor or a prosecutor or a community organizer or a newcaster? You know, someone who keeps up on crime in that city? And immediately knows about Jessica's disappearance. Wouldn't the mgr and her husband look like total idiots?

In fact, as I type this, and I follow disappearances and unsolved mysteries pretty well, I don't know of one case where a criminal or co-conspirator picked out a REAL car to blame the crime on (but I suppose there is at least one case that contradicts the rule). However, I do know plenty of cases where criminals tried to blame the crime on a PHANTOM car and a phantom person, i.e. fake identifications. Why? Because every criminal knows that when you start pointing the finger at real people and real cars, the odds that the cops will track down those people and figure out they had nothing to do with it are quite high.

But that van wasn't a phantom--it's on those video tapes.

As far as possibly a lot of people not knowing about the case, I live in FL, I know about it. I'm sure there are people in HA, ME, CA, and everywhere else that know about it. In fact, given that more and more people get their news from Facebook--as you say, I think it's more likely they know about Jessica's case because I explicitly remember it being on one of those sidebars of my homepage on Facebook when she disappeared.

I think the trap too many people fall into--including myself--regarding cases like this is we forget to look at it through the criminal's eyes, trying to get into his/her head as they planned to commit the crime. Instead, we look at it like Monday Morning qb's, which skews our perception.

Here's what I mean . . .

Let's just say, to keep it as simple as possible, that some relative of the mgr or her husband abducted Jessica. (I hope that doesn't get this post edited by the Moderator) Let's call this relative, Zeke. If Zeke wants to abduct Jessica for whatever reason, he has two choices--doing it himself or getting others to help him.

So, let's say he wants to do this crime on his own. Why? The most likely answer is because he knows it's a crime and he doesn't think anyone else will assist him, right? I mean, one slip of the tongue and somebody is likely to alert police. So, he plans, he schemes, he readies himself. He pulls into that parking lot, seizes Jessica, and I don't think I wanna detail the rest.

Well, doing it on his own, there is NO way he could predict that a relative--who just happened to be driving by at that very second--would lie for him, create a false lead, and virtually get him off the hook. Could he have predicted that? Not in a million years. Remember: He chose to do this crime by himself for the most likely reason that he thought others might not go along with it. Instead, in the preceding scenario, others--his relatives--involve themselves in it VOLUNTARILY, without one request from Zeke, the true criminal. So, in the plalnning Zeke rejects the idea of involving others, including relatives. But for some reason, those relatives couldn't wait to be involved in the kidnapping of someone. Doesn't that seem outrageous? Furthermore, if the mgr and her husband did involve themselves after the fact, why on Earth would they identify a vehicle that Zeke may have access to (since it turns out a relative does have a silver/gold Town & Country)? Once again: Outrageous.

Second scenario: The manager and her husband are involved from the outset with Zeke. They get together to plan Jessica's abduction. Now, I ask all of you fair-minded people here: Who in their right mind, with all the time in the world to concoct a story for that night, would come up with the story the manager and her husband tell about what they did and what they saw that night? It makes them look like idiots. And keep in mind, in the days before Jessica's abduction, they'd be knowing they'd have to have a story that would be solid enough to keep them out of jail. I maintain nobody would come up with the story the manager and her husband have told if, in fact, they were involved beforehand in the disappearance of Jessica.

Sure, if the two were in fact involved, their story has worked to this point. But they never could've predicted that beforehand. All the riding around, seeing a car from 1000ft away, following the van but not getting the license plate, etc. It's all too twisty and turn-y for it to be a planned, canned, concocted story.

Now, as you all now know, I think the timeline regarding Jessica's disappearance is off. I wish the police would correct it because it does make the mgr and her husband look suspicious. Why? Because the times don't match up with what they claim they did. But that doesn't mean they didn't do what they did (wow, that's a bad sentence).

I guess what I'm saying is when you start to de-grade the police and the concerned citizens of MI, and instead start to come up with theories that are at the fringe of possibility and probability, I have to draw a line. That's when I go back to the facts of crime history and bank on the ideas, though they are not quite 100%, that citizens want criminals in jail even if that means citizens may expose themselves in the process, the police want guilty people in jail even though there are a few bad police apples out there, and people don't voluntarily make themselves co-conspirators in crimes even if it's a relative who is the main criminal.
 
TB Rhine, let me take your second point first . . .

Way, way, way earlier in this thread, somebody also brought up the idea the manager and her husband might've randomly picked out a vehicle they saw on the street so as to cover up the actual vehicle involved in Jessica's disappearance. And as somebody else responded shortly after: Then where is the innocent driver of the Town and Country in those pictures? Wouldn't the person who owned the vehicle have come forward by now since the person has nothing to hide? Sure, maybe the person doesn't know anything about Jessica's case. But several people in Michigan do. And wouldn't one of them have pointed out to their friend--the owner of the gold Town & Country--that "Hey, that looks like your van!"? The lack of anyone coming forward to own up to owning the van in the picture is almost 100% proof that the van in the picture is in fact the one used in Jessica's disappearance.

As for your first point, the problem with the manager and her husband noticing that a family member's vehicle was at the store is that they would've been doing it from several hundred feet away at night. Either they would have only been able to see the tail lights as it drove in behind the store OR after it turned around and parked with its lights off. Frankly, I don't think I could identify my own car from that far away at night. Yes, they might have seen "a vehicle". But there would've been no one way to tell WHOSE vehicle it was or what kind or what make or what color, etc. until they turned around and came back, and got much closer.

I want everyone to think about one more point: The manager and her husband, if they are co-conspirators in Jessica's disappearance, would've been best off to say they saw nothing, i.e. they went by the store, saw nothing, and kept on cruising to wherever they were going that night. I mean, if you think about it, them saying they saw something that night has only made them MORE suspicious, not less. Even if they saw a van pull in there, turned around down at the next intersection, came back and discovered it was one of their own kidnapping Jessica, and if at that point the couple decided to cover up for their family member, why would the two of them say anything about seeing anything? The best choice is to say, "We didn't see anything when we cruised by the store that night." Then there would be no van. No timeline. No exact time of when Jessica disappeared. Etc., Etc., Etc. Her disappearance would even be a bigger mystery than it already is.

And there would surely be no heat coming down on the manager and her husband, if they kept their mouths shut . . . if in fact they are involved in Jessica's disappearance. Which I'm pretty sure they aren't.

I think they copped to following the unknown perp b/c they knew if cameras were ever viewed they would be seen on tape following the van that kidnapped Jessica.

I think they were involved, I think they were the lookout in case someone else showed up at the store while she was being killed & shoved into the van.

Other family members gave the ex-bf an alibi and said that they had the van the entire time.
 
I think they copped to following the unknown perp b/c they knew if cameras were ever viewed they would be seen on tape following the van that kidnapped Jessica.

I think they were involved, I think they were the lookout in case someone else showed up at the store while she was being killed & shoved into the van.

Other family members gave the ex-bf an alibi and said that they had the van the entire time.


Hey, everybody, I'm new at this posting thing and this is my first quote on Jessica's case. I have read all you guy's comments with interest. My question is for the poster of the above quote..... what do you think the motive would have been for the relatives to have kidnapped and killed Jessica? Just wondering what your line of thought was .....Thanks!
 
He/she is probably referencing the fact that the manager's brother was at one time a suspect in the case... she was apparently seeing him behind her fiance's back, he got a place hoping she would move in with him, but she ultimately threw him over in favor of her fiance. I doubt the family conspired to kill her, personally, but I think it's possible they found out after the fact and conspired to alibi him out. (Always assuming he's guilty, of course, which is far from a certainty).
 
Hey, everybody, I'm new at this posting thing and this is my first quote on Jessica's case. I have read all you guy's comments with interest. My question is for the poster of the above quote..... what do you think the motive would have been for the relatives to have kidnapped and killed Jessica? Just wondering what your line of thought was .....Thanks!

I think it started as a gag to scare her but something happened; the perp freaked & took heronce cops were called it was too late to change anything.
 
Snow is now Falling in Michigan, I had hoped the deer hunters would have started hunting before this happened. Temperatures are still high enough it will melt perhaps they will find a clue to what happened to her.IMO
 
Snow is now Falling in Michigan, I had hoped the deer hunters would have started hunting before this happened. Temperatures are still high enough it will melt perhaps they will find a clue to what happened to her.IMO

Not snowing here yet... supposed to much further up north on Tuesday ( like by Traverse City and north) Supposed to get some light snow later this week but nothing real significant. ANd it has been Bow season here for a bit already...
 
Hearing held on Jessica Heeringa Act
9:19 a.m. EST November 12, 2014
http://www.wzzm13.com/story/news/local/lakeshore/2014/11/12/hearing-underway-heeringa/18903341/

The bill is sponsored by lakeshore representative Collene Lamonte and is a result of the disappearance of Jessica Heeringa from a Norton Shores gas station over a year ago.

The bill would require the owner or operator of a convenience store or gas station to ensure that, between the hours after 11 p.m. and before 5 a.m., at least two employees are on duty at all times or, if there is only one employee on duty, that there is a security camera system in good working order operating continuously at all times.
 
Hearing held on Jessica Heeringa Act
9:19 a.m. EST November 12, 2014
http://www.wzzm13.com/story/news/local/lakeshore/2014/11/12/hearing-underway-heeringa/18903341/

The bill is sponsored by lakeshore representative Collene Lamonte and is a result of the disappearance of Jessica Heeringa from a Norton Shores gas station over a year ago.

The bill would require the owner or operator of a convenience store or gas station to ensure that, between the hours after 11 p.m. and before 5 a.m., at least two employees are on duty at all times or, if there is only one employee on duty, that there is a security camera system in good working order operating continuously at all times.

The hours can be changed later on, they were chosen to get the bill started
 
Doesn't sound too unreasonable, given the high propensity of such stores to be targeted by armed robbers, etc.
 
Hey, Long time follower,here..I've stumbled across something quite astonishing at least IMHO. I think it might be related to the case; but I don't want to ring out all kinds of bells and whistles yet. I was researching another case when I stumbled across this doenetwork MP. The M.O. of the perp is about spot-on, I mean, it's almost the exact same scenario. You'd think that this was a copy-cat or same person because the details match up so closely. Anywho, see what you think, please? Also, I did a little deeper of a search to see if anyone by the same suspect's name lives in Michigan..and guess what?..there is.. http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1095dfny.html
 
Jenstar , that is extremely interesting.
Does suspect come up anywhere near where JH went missing?
Is he even out of jail?
 
The only connection I can find are people with similar names. New suspects also just might be accessories; but I think they got the right guy in jail. According to supporting articles; the "new" POI that's already IN Jail as of late for stealing tractors; was one that "junked" the van for the T brothers back in '94. and that the van they're "holding as evidence" isn't the one that was used with Heidi. MOO http://www.syracuse.com/news/index....othing_to_do_with_heidi_allens_kidnappin.html
 
Very interesting! Wasn't Jess a witness for something too? I want to say credit card related.

Key Heidi Allen witness texts pal: I lied to police about what I know
While reviewing the new evidence, Peebles pointed to statements that appeared to implicate the Vicious Circle Motorcycle Club in Allen's disappearance.

Steen told another witness, Megan Shaw, that members of the motorcycle club weren't happy that Allen was trying to incriminate them, "so one night she was taken from her work by members of the gang," Shaw's police statement said.

According to Shaw, Steen explained that "Heidi was trying to get her boyfriend out of the gang (Vicious Circle) and trying to get people in trouble that were in the gang."

Wescott named a member of Vicious Circle in the recorded phone call with Priest while explaining why she was scared to tell police what she knew about Allen's disappearance.

In another portion of her response, Peebles also argues that prosecutors withheld from Thibodeau's defense lawyer crucial evidence before his trial showing that Allen was a confidential police informant.
 
The only connection I can find are people with similar names. New suspects also just might be accessories; but I think they got the right guy in jail. According to supporting articles; the "new" POI that's already IN Jail as of late for stealing tractors; was one that "junked" the van for the T brothers back in '94. and that the van they're "holding as evidence" isn't the one that was used with Heidi. MOO http://www.syracuse.com/news/index....othing_to_do_with_heidi_allens_kidnappin.html

Good find on this similar case! I don't believe they are related though IMO.

I disagree with you about them having the "right guy" based on what one of the new POI's said in an interview. Is there evidence to back up the claim that the T brothers scrapped a different van in 94? Sounds to me like he is in CYA mode so if the van he scrapped was used in the murder and it comes back to him, he's framing it on the T's.
 
O/T from Jessica::He said in the video interview, CIIW that he "took a van to Canada; with the other two men; being paid by the T brothers." Now that doesn't make the new POI's necessarily "guilty"..but it does suggest some "accessory involvement". Also the GF is redacting her story in recent articles. I wonder if she'd been threatened? Either way; it was too similar not to post. Thanks everyone for looking at it. :)
 
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