GUILTY MI - Mariha Smith, 5, Detroit, 24 July 2011

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CN2Souls said:
ETA: and why Crush the skull she was already dead by asphyxiation!!!
Click to expand...

Respectfully snipped.

IIRC MSM indicated she was asphyxiated before the fire was set. I don't recall reading if she was asphyxiated prior to her skull being crushed. I pray she was....

-Party in the home.
-Lots of people in the house.
-3 hours from time last seen until time fire started.
-IIRC the .57 cents worth of gas was purchased just prior to the start of the fire. (which is oddly about 1/4th a gallon or about 32 oz worth leading me to think the person who purchased the gas could have used a large plastic cup to purchase it in rather than a legal container.)
-We know the family didn't recognize the POI -likely from grainy video of the person who purchased the gas.
-Has LE interviewed those who attended the party? Could this POI have been associated with someone who attended the party and not known to the family?
-It's very possible mom and aunt forgot to lock the door and are afraid to admit it, or were kind of messed up from the party and don't remember if they locked the doors or not.

We know as soon as LE identifies this person they will take a dna sample and compare it to any dna found on Mariha, especially if she was sexually assaulted. I'd be shocked if she wasn't and I will be shocked if the person responsible isn't a non compliant RSO.

Also, who would know there was a mattress in this vacant home? Probably someone local.

Also, I find it appalling the bank or current property owner ( likely a bank ) isn't held responsible for removing items left in abandoned or foreclosed homes and properly securing the property.

jmo
 
MsFacetious said:
Mariha is 5 years old. She is NOT too young for dental records. She just hasn't been taken to the dentist yet. Many children go when they get their first molars. My kids had been to the dentist at least twice when they were 5.
Click to expand...

Respectfully snipped. If Mariha hadn't started kindergarten yet, she probably hadn't had her first dental visit. For those bordering the poverty line and on state insurance, most of those kids do not see a dentist prior to the usually required dental appointment required in Kindergarten (in most states). Especially if she didn't have any of the usual signs of childhood tooth decay due to juices or didn't complain of any tooth aches.

State insurance is probably limited on dental exams for children and only when medically necessary or required by law for school.

My son had his first dentist appointment at 3.

FWIW, when I was growing up in the 70's I didn't have my first dental appointment until 4th grade. And it had nothing to due with being near the poverty line, far from it. It had to do with not having any need to see a dentist until then for an abcess tooth and the schools didn't require physicals and dental appointments then like they do today. And despite my not having seen a dentist until 4th grade I had no cavities....

I don't fault the mom for postponing a dental exam if it wasn't necessary until required in kindergarten, if MI is one of the states that requires a dental exam sometime during kg.

Mariha appears to have been well cared for. She doesn't appear to have been neglected by the photo's we've seen of her. She doesn't exhibit bruises, looks well nourished though petite like her mother. And appears to be a happy child.

MSM indicates she has a surrogate grandpa. While her dad may not be in her life, she appears to have adult male role models who cared for her.

Until further information becomes available that her mother was somehow responsible or involved I am going to treat her like the victim she is.

JMO
 
I don't really think Mom was involved, I don't have enough information to form an opinion... and I'm not faulting Mom for not taking her to the dentist.

But the wording in the article, or by law enforcement... was that she was "too young for dental records." Which is false... it made it sound like she could not have gone to the dentist at 5 years old... and just bugged me and caused me to need to clarify as the granddaughter, niece and cousin of dentists.

Medicaid pays for the first dental visit at 3 years old, as well as sealants for the permanent teeth... but I have no clue about anything in Michigan.

The suggestion is to take the child in once they get molars. Of course the suggestion is also to take the child in for regular pediatrician check ups. To use an age appropriate car seat. Many people can't do any of those things.

There are many things that those at or below the poverty line do not have the ability to do. Photographs of their children being one of them... which is why I offer frequently to photograph families like Raquel Nelson's and Mariha's... they should have pictures of their children too.

I hope the family isn't involved in this case. We've seen cases where kids were taken from the house and nobody could believe it could happen. Maybe the person came in through the door and they just don't realize it.
 
Good points MsFacetious. Thank you for further explaining what you meant. I misunderstood what you meant in the post I replied to.

The MSM comment "too young for dental records" could mean having all her baby teeth with no dental restorations such as extractions, fillings or even temporary caps making dental records insufficient for a positive legal identification.

Spending a lot of time myself in the Unidentified forum, dentals are sometimes deemed insufficient for legal positive identification if the person has 'perfect teeth' or no restorations of any kind. Whether they are a child or adult. In those cases only dna can make a postive legal id.

hth
 
Konesha Smith said she believes someone kidnapped her daughter.
But she said she couldn't remember anything because when the disappearance of 5-year-old Mariha Trenice Smith was discovered early Sunday, Konesha Smith was drunk and passed out on the couch after a party at the home she shared with her sister in the 3800 block of Burlingame.

That's what she told investigators. And a polygraph test Monday indicated she was being truthful, according to an official familiar with the investigation.

<snip>

a small piece of fabric found between her body and the mattress she was set ablaze on matched the clothing Mariha reportedly was wearing when she disappeared: a black shirt with pink flowers on it, an investigator said.

Much more at link:

http://www.freep.com/article/20110726/NEWS01/107260418/Burned-girl-s-body-may-linked-missing-child


Based on the above article there were only 10 minutes between the time the gasoline was purchased. (This article states .41 worth) and the time the body was found.

Now I am wondering how late the children were up if the adults were partying until about 3am. Was the perp someone at the party? Someone associated with persons who attended the party? or was this a crime of opportunity and someone who happened to see the adults partying and children awake late. Waited for the opportunity to get into the house and then abducted the child, sexually assaulted her leaving her in the vacant home to purchase the gas and then went back to destroy the evidence.

So incredibly sad. I'm sure this mother will never forgive herself for getting so drunk she wasn't capable of properly caring for her child.
 
I'm guessing she just hasn't been to the dentist.
Regardless of why they can't use dental records... it's frustrating that it is just longer everyone has to wait for a positive ID on her.

Then once they make an ID... are they going to make a quick arrest? Do they already have a suspect?
Or is this going to be a situation where they will say they do and then it drags on forever, like Raven Jeffries has?

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41726&page=6

This is just such a weird case... regardless of who did it.
You don't usually see predators do this (burn the body of a child, especially in a house) and you don't usually see parents do this.
And apparently when it DOES happen it goes unsolved most of the time. :banghead:

Cubby said:
Good points MsFacetious. Thank you for further explaining what you meant. I misunderstood what you meant in the post I replied to.

The MSM comment "too young for dental records" could mean having all her baby teeth with no dental restorations such as extractions, fillings or even temporary caps making dental records insufficient for a positive legal identification.

Spending a lot of time myself in the Unidentified forum, dentals are sometimes deemed insufficient for legal positive identification if the person has 'perfect teeth' or no restorations of any kind. Whether they are a child or adult. In those cases only dna can make a postive legal id.

hth
Click to expand...
 
Konesha Smith said she believes someone kidnapped her daughter.

But she said she couldn't remember anything because when the disappearance of 5-year-old Mariha Trenice Smith was discovered early Sunday, Konesha Smith was drunk and passed out on the couch after a party at the home she shared with her sister in the 3800 block of Burlingame.

"I can't even close my eyes because my daughter's missing," said Smith, 24, who also has a 5-month-old son.

Today, investigators may interview other people believed to have been at the party, which began Saturday night and was attended by up to six adults -- while four or five children were in the house, the official said.

http://www.freep.com/article/20110726/NEWS01/107260418/Burned-girl-s-body-may-linked-missing-child

We had earlier heard that Mariha had 3 younger siblings? This implies that is only one younger brother.


Yeah, the three siblings are mentioned here...


Mariha, her mother and three siblings &#8212; ages 4, 2 and 6 months &#8212; had been staying there for the past couple months, her grandmother, Diane Henry said.

http://detnews.com/article/20110726...rred-body-is-missing-5-year-old#ixzz1TCo6Ha24


Regardless...

I am not attacking this mother... I am truly confused. I cannot comprehend getting drunk with a 5 year old and 5 month old in the house.

I REALLY cannot comprehend getting drunk with a 5 year old, 4 year old, 2 year old and 5/6 month old in the house.

Maybe I'm fortunate that my children had special needs because I am more vigilant?
Maybe if they had been typical I wouldn't have been concerned about the 5 year old climbing out the window, the 4 year old getting out the door, the 2 year old doing who knows what or the 5 month old having a seizure?

That amazes me. Were all the adults drunk?

I'm having Joshua Davis flashbacks now... 6 adults in the house... at least if they have found Mariha they have that advantage over Joshua's case...
 
IIRC one of the early articles said three younger cousins.

I do think this case will be solved quickly. There is a strong tie to the POI who purchased the gasoline.

I can think of a few cases where the remains were burnt and the perp id'd and charged/convicted. Toni Keller the missing student from NIU and her remains were burnt so badly they had a difficult time obtaining usable dna. The perp in her case is currently awaiting trial. Then there was another case on the east coast where a child was found abandoned in a gas station restroom and her mother was found burnt in a park. The childs father was arrested for abandoning the child and murdering his childs mother and pled guilty IIRC.

Based on the map at the above MSM link with the distance between the house Mariha went missing from and the house she was located I think the perp was a local. He may have noticable burns on him as a result of starting the fire. LE still has a lot of canvassing and interviews to do. Forensics to process. This is not a case of a first time offender. It's a matter of identifying and then apprehending him. LE has an excellent clue with the purchase of that small amount of gasoline. The timeline works... I'm confident this will be solved.
 
I also tend to think this was a crime of opportunity since the perp had to purchase gasoline. If it was preplanned the perp would have already had an accelerant available and not had to leave the crime scent to purchase an accelerant.

JMO
 
A black male, approximately 5 feet 8 inches, purchased 41 cents worth of gasoline at 7:47 a.m. Sunday from a BP station two blocks from the burned, two-family flat, one of the store's workers said Monday. Detroit police took the store's surveillance videos for its investigation, said the worker, who asked to not be named.



​
 
No excuse for drinking until you pass out with small babies that need parental care.

The sister said KS was taking pain meds.

Ok. Which one is it? Or is it both???

Not acceptable.

KS said she didn't understand how someone could crawl over her head to get her baby??? Well, hello!!!

Negligence. Pure and simple.
 
Morning all... Was going to say "Good Morning" but reading about this little angel.....Welll...:cry:


I am still under the impression the window was not used.

I am think a door some how was and they just don't remember not locking it and when the prep left they locked it behind them.


Also,

Not being Snarky,

But that is the fastest Fire department ever....

Approx. 41 cents worth of gas = 13 oz of Gas bought at 7:41 am 3 blocks from burned building,

Call made by neighbors who saw fire 7:47 am called fire department.

Childs body found in building at 7:55 am by fire department
 
IMO the too young for dental records comment means that even if she had been to dentist there could be little to definitely identify her in the dentist's paperwork. They usually don't take x-rays of children unless they absolutely have to, and young children may not have had any special dental work done. They may have just had check-ups, no cavities filled, no crowns and bridges, no broken teeth, no dentures, no wisdom teeth pulled out, no gold teeth, etc. And given that a five year old is starting to lose her baby teeth, if it's been a few months since the last dental check up even the the number of teeth in the baby's mouth may have changed and the dentist's records are no longer accurate.
 
last week we took a late nap about 4 pm, we all slept until almost 12midnight
well my son got us up and we went back to bed at about 4 am and didnt get back up until noon, so I guess this can happen

we had been to the park all day and with the heat, I guess we were just overly tired

so, this can happen

my son is very heavy sleeper, he goes to sleep there no waking him up until he ready to wake up.

yes, he has fallen asleep on the floor,the couch and that is where he stays (with cover and pillow of course)
 
I do see that someone can sleep heavy;

I just think that the whole ability to climb with a child in your arms over a couch with someone sleeping on it.

through a window that is only approx. 20 inches wide and then jump down approx. 6 feet to the ground is really a stunt.

Especially, when there is a perfectly good door to walk out of.
 
Cubby said:
Respectfully snipped. If Mariha hadn't started kindergarten yet, she probably hadn't had her first dental visit. For those bordering the poverty line and on state insurance, most of those kids do not see a dentist prior to the usually required dental appointment required in Kindergarten (in most states). Especially if she didn't have any of the usual signs of childhood tooth decay due to juices or didn't complain of any tooth aches.

State insurance is probably limited on dental exams for children and only when medically necessary or required by law for school.
Click to expand...

Michigan requires NO Dental exam for entrance to Kindergarten (there is never a requirement for a dental exam regardless of age). Michigan requires the full battery of vaccinations including Hep C. and a Vision and Hearing Exam before being enrolled in a Michigan school. These can be obtained without charge through the County Health Department.
 
Thank you Redtailhawk. Illinois requires a dental exam by May 1st of the school year for all kindergartners. I wasn't sure what the requirements were for MI so just went with IL's.

I looked up the BP. It is a straight shot two blocks down Waverly at the interesection of Dexter and Waverly. The BP runs the block between Dexter and Davidson. The perp would not have had to cross a street with commercial businesses to get to this BP.

The home on Waverly is also a block away from the local elementary school. Actually if one were to make a straight line from the home on Waverly through the two back yards that back to each other or across the street and through the same they would arrive at the local elementary school.

2918 Waverly Street, Detroit, MI - Google Maps
 
If you are going to have a party at your home, and you will be getting drunk, please have a babysitter come to your home to take care of your children until you're past your hangover, and able to return to your parental responsibilities. Or send the kids to grandma for the night.

Parental responsibility. It's a good thing.

Thank you.
 
Anther thing that puzzles me,

Why were the children not put to bed upstairs in the bedroom with the fan in the window, (at a descent hour)

Why were they put on the living room floor with there cousins??
 
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