MI MI - Oakland County Child Killer, "The Babysitter Murders", 1976-77

[margaret_diane]

Has anyone else noticed the pattern of the abductions? The kids were taken in the following order:
-> Sunday February 15, 1976 (Mark Stebbins). Abducted.
-> Found Dead - Thursday February 19, 1976.
-> Wednesday December 22, 1976 (Jill Robinson). Abducted.
-> Found Dead - Sunday December 26, 1976.
-> Sunday, January 2, 1977 (Kristine Mihelich). Abducted.
-> Found Dead - Thursday January 21, 1977.
-> Wednesday March 16, 1977. (Timmy King). Abducted.
-> Found Dead - Tuesday March 22, 1977

In addition to being on or near holidays, the kids were abducted on Sunday and Wednesdays.

The kids bodies were found on Tuesday, Sunday and Thursday. This is an interesting point to consider:
-> The first and third victims were abducted on Sunday, and found on Wednesday.
-> The second victim disappeared on a Wednesday and found on a Sunday.
- > The fourth victim went missing on a Wednesday and was found on a Tuesday.

This makes me wonder what the significance of the of the dates? Did the abductor have a job maybe that kept him busy perhaps on an alternating schedule? One week he worked such and such and was off on such and such dates, and then the week after, perhaps it was the opposite schedule?

No one would have noticed a man absent from work, if it wasn't his scheduled day to be AT work. Its possible (if he were employed) that he even worked while he HAD the kids (tied up?) at his place (or a cottage, or cabin, or shed... wherever he kept them).

There is a definite pattern noted in his abductions, and when bodies were found. The only variance from the pattern was the last victim (Timmy King) who was found on a Tuesday.

I'm planning to do some more checking into the times the kids disappeared vs. when they were found, but it seems (off the top of my head) that they disappeared in the late afternoon / early evening, and were found laid out in the mornings (between 9:30-1:00pm)? I'm not 100% sure about this as yet, but if I'm correct, then this might also be an important clue.

So I ask again - why are the kids disappearing on Sundays and Wednesdays, and being found on Wednesdays and Thursdays (all but Timmy who was found on a Tuesday)??

I've not really had a chance yet to scan the calendar for the entire timeline, but I suspect that the pattern above will line up with a schedule of sorts (like a work week schedule).

 

[Omori]

Yes, I've noticed the Sunday-Wednesday pattern. A lot of people have. It's also noteworthy that the Sunday victims vanished in the afternoon and the Wednesay victims vanished at nightfall. It's a pattern that certaily cannot be ignored.

The vanishing near holidays and "hinge" days (equinoxes and solistices) is also one that cannot be ignored. I just named a few off the top of my head and AKWILKS added a few more and when you look at that total picture, we ignore it at our peril.

The days that the bodies were found I had not considered but it deserves consideration. That fact that King doesn't fit it is another 3 and 1.

I also had not considered the nature angle AKWILKS brought up. I don't know how much stock can be put in it but it's something to consider. It could mean for example, that he was picturing himself as a predator in the wilderness. Hence he might be a hunting enthusiast.

Another pattern, even though it's out of order is that the victims were taken in December, January, February and March. Strangely, one month occurs before the New Year and the other three after it--another 3 and 1.

I agree that employee records migh give a clue--but where to start?

There's lots of patterns to be found in these murders. Whether they help us pinpoint a suspect who proves to be the real deal is doubtful after all this time. There's virtually no chance a killer wll ever be caught or even named in this crime after so much time had passed. But there's always that chance. It's hard to let it sit unsolved.

 

[Omori]

I think the King family has asked her not to name the suspect publicly. Maybe she can PM
his name to you so she can respect their wishes.
It seems she was one of their victims when she was a child so maybe we can be gentle with her. Just sayin...

If the King family wants this kept secret then it would only be because they are not sure this person is the Babysitter but Terri Lynn talks as though there's no doubt about it. That this person went under the radar for 35 years only to now emerge as a strong suspect is doubtful.

When I pointed out that the girls weren't molested, she said BTK didn't rape every victim. BTK didn't rape ANY victim, he wasn't a rapist. I find it hard to believe the killer forced the girls to perform fellatio on him. He didn't have the sand to sodomize the boys with his own tool--he had to use a dildo--but then he turns around and forces it into the mouths of his female victims? Not hardly. He is either sexually inadequate or he is not a "he."

And I am very surprised by her statement that she knew Allen. Really? Because as far as I know (and please correct me if I am wrong), the press does not know who Allen is, LE does not know who Allen and Dr. Bruce Danto does not know who Allen is. Now how could she know?? And to know his identity and not tell anybody?? That might be important, don't you think? Or did the King family not want her to talk about him either?

I'm sorry but her story does not compute.

 

[katydid23]

If the King family wants this kept secret then it would only be because they are not sure this person is the Babysitter but Terri Lynn talks as though there's no doubt about it. That this person went under the radar for 35 years only to now emerge as a strong suspect is doubtful.

When I pointed out that the girls weren't molested, she said BTK didn't rape every victim. BTK didn't rape ANY victim, he wasn't a rapist. I find it hard to believe the killer forced the girls to perform fellatio on him. He didn't have the sand to sodomize the boys with his own tool--he had to use a dildo--but then he turns around and forces it into the mouths of his female victims? Not hardly. He is either sexually inadequate or he is not a "he."

And I am very surprised by her statement that she knew Allen. Really? Because as far as I know (and please correct me if I am wrong), the press does not know who Allen is, LE does not know who Allen and Dr. Bruce Danto does not know who Allen is. Now how could she know?? And to know his identity and not tell anybody?? That might be important, don't you think? Or did the King family not want her to talk about him either?

I'm sorry but her story does not compute.

As for BTK, I guess it depends upon how you define rape. There was semen of his found on the bodies of some of his victims, so...? A sexual predator for sure.

 

[Terri Lynn]

How did you post the map on here ?

 

[docwho3]

. . . If you go west on 7 Mile past Haggerty Road, you'll come
across the Northville Psychiatric Hospital. It's just a hulking ruins now and has been since
about 2002 or 3 when it was closed. . .

I did read some speculation in this thread about the possible use of muscle relaxing meds.
Granted, I have not seen any actual evidence to prove it but it is one possibility
out of many & if true then I suppose one source of meds to use on a victim might
come from a place that gives out psych meds.
(Note: I am only commenting on it as a possibility out of thousands & not
making it my own personal pet theory.)

. . . The most perplexing 3 and 1 to me is the dumping of Tim King's body.
The other three were dumped in Oakland County.
King was dumped in Wayne County across 8 Mile. The thing is, why there? . . .

. . . I heard there was a lot of construction there at the time
and signs all over the place redirecting traffic. Why choose that spot? . . .

You may have answered your own question.
If you are a killer with a captive or a body in your vehicle you might be a bit paranoid
about having to stop and wait for traffic to move on at a construction site & this might
cause you to panic and dump a body. Especially if you are getting close to an area where
you might be known on sight to some of the other people also
slowed or stopped & waiting on construction.

Or then again it might simply have been that the boy told him he liked construction tools
and construction vehicles so he was taken there at the last.

*****************************
Note: The 'why' giving the children last meals or other last gifts might
point to a slightly narrowed list of suspects.
Perhaps the killer was mad at God over having lost a child, hence the
snow
and the blood (being washed by the blood or sins covered by it to be whiter than snow)
especially being on or near a mound . . .as being similar
to going up the hill of golgotha (hill of the skull.)

Or maybe the 'last gifts' were merely a way of proving to himself that he was not a monster
even if he needed to kill for some 'reason' of his own.

The rest of you may even come up with better ideas. I just wanted to
start the ball rolling a bit.

 

[zadari]

Ooooooooh - Richard - thanks so much for posting this one!!!! I live in Oakland County, minutes from Troy, Royal Oak, and the other cities mentioned here, and this case has ALWAYS fascinated me......

hey that is cool u live so close to me i live in shelby township .. and my mother in law knew one of the victims i guess i cannot remember which one tho

 

[Omori]

I did read some speculation in this thread about the possible use of muscle relaxing meds.
Granted, I have not seen any actual evidence to prove it but it is one possibility
out of many & if true then I suppose one source of meds to use on a victim might
come from a place that gives out psych meds.
(Note: I am only commenting on it as a possibility out of thousands & not
making it my own personal pet theory.)

Of course. Nobody knows what the killer's motivation was. <mod snip>

You may have answered your own question.
If you are a killer with a captive or a body in your vehicle you might be a bit paranoid
about having to stop and wait for traffic to move on at a construction site & this might
cause you to panic and dump a body. Especially if you are getting close to an area where
you might be known on sight to some of the other people also
slowed or stopped & waiting on construction. Or then again it might simply have been that the boy told him he liked construction tools
and construction vehicles so he was taken there at the last.

First of all, I don't know that there was any construction in the area. I said I had heard or read it somewhere from a source that was not authoritative. I have no idea if there was any construction there at all. I could be confusing that info with another case I might have read about. When I start off a sentence with "I read that..." ir "I heard that..." that's exactly what I mean--I read or heard it somewhere and it may or may not be true--I don't have any idea myself. My mere word is not gospel and I don't want it to be regarded that way. I don't know who the killer is and I don't claim to.

As for panicking, what was there to panic about? If I'm cruising around at night with a body in my car, what am I going to panic about? Nobody's going to know. Nobody's going to see it. The killer obviously was not in a hurry as you-know-who speculates because the body was way off the beaten track compared to the others. If you're in a hurry, you don't go miles out of your way--that's somewhat counter-productive.

The kille put the body there because he wanted it to be found there. This guy left nothing to chance. Everything he did was planned out. He knew exactly what he was going to do and how he was going to do it. If there was a lot of construction on Gill Road, then his dumping Timmy there could have been simply a taunt--he dumps a body where it would be difficult to do so without being seen. Just his way of saying, "You can't catch me. Nobody can catch me." And 34 years later, he's been right.

Note: The 'why' giving the children last meals or other last gifts might
point to a slightly narrowed list of suspects.
Perhaps the killer was mad at God over having lost a child, hence the
snow
and the blood (being washed by the blood or sins covered by it to be whiter than snow)
especially being on or near a mound . . .as being similar
to going up the hill of golgotha (hill of the skull.)

Or maybe the 'last gifts' were merely a way of proving to himself that he was not a monster
even if he needed to kill for some 'reason' of his own.

The rest of you may even come up with better ideas. I just wanted to
start the ball rolling a bit.

I think we have to do away with all the current suspects and all this "I know who it was" garbage and start from square 1. So I commend you for that. We have to deduce from the killer's actions what he or she was thinking. This person may very well have lost a child (maybe even deliberately so) but that also brings us perilously close to the "killer was a woman" theory again. No matter how far away from it you try to get, you circle back around to it again. 34 years of looking at male suspects nets us nothing.

I remember when Sandra Cantu was first missing. Everybody thought it was some sexual offender who just got released from prison. Her body too had been violated with an object. And who turned out to be her killer? A woman. In the case of the Babysitter, how long do we continue to ignore it?

 

[docwho3]

Note: (Not intending to be rude or mean, I am just discussing points back & forth.)
**************************

. . . .First of all, I don't know that there was any construction in the area.
I said I had heard or read it somewhere from a source that was not authoritative. . .

As far as I read and copied & pasted from your post you said,
'. . .I heard there was a lot of construction there at the time
and signs all over the place redirecting traffic. Why choose that spot? . . .'
While you did say it was something you heard, you did not say you doubted the source
but, either way, you had put out the statement that you had 'heard' it & then went on
to pose a question as to why someone would choose that spot under such conditions.
I then read your post & responded accordingly.
'What if' what you heard was true . . . .then it might lead to
certain other possibilies such as I mentioned.

This does point to the fact that playing the 'what if' sort of loose discussion of a case
can at times make it difficult to stick close to actual case details as reported in MSM.

'. . .My mere word is not gospel and I don't want it to be regarded that way. I don't know
who the killer is and I don't claim to. . .'
I never took your words to mean anything other than a loose sort of 'what if'
sort of discussion of case possibilities. Looking at a case from all sorts of possibilities can
sometimes lead to new thoughts about the case that were overlooked in years past.

'. . .As for panicking, what was there to panic about? If I'm cruising around at
night with a body in my car, what am I going to panic about? Nobody's going to know.
Nobody's going to see it. . .'
If what you had heard about construction was so then a person might panic
and I would need to reread reports about the case to see if the body was most likely
dumped at night or during the day. I do recall that in at least one post it was mentioned that
one of the bodies was still warm when found. Not saying it was this instance but just
that such details, if available, might prove helpful.
Also I do not know if any night construction was ongoing in that area at that time or if any
drunk driving checkpoints were happening then.
Although it might seem unlikely, construction does sometimes happen at all hours, even into night or
into the evening hours in some places if there is need for it to do so.
And again, I was only responding to the post of the possible contruction which you
had 'heard' was taking place then.

'. . .because the body was way off the beaten track compared to the others.
If you're in a hurry, you don't go miles out of your way--that's somewhat counter-productive. . .'
Actually we do not know it was out of the killer's way to dump this body in that spot.
It might have been on his way to somewhere. We just do not know.
Also if it was in the construction area you 'heard' of then it was not so much
off the beaten track was it?


'. . .The killer put the body there because he wanted it to be found there. This guy left
nothing to chance. Everything he did was planned out. . .'
The killer does indeed seem to have planned & staged his body dumps in almost all of his
dumps so the one dump site that at least has a possibility of being unplanned
is of great interest to me. It might yield more clues about the killer than the other sites.
A planned or staged dump only lets one see what the killer wants one to see
(to the best of his/their ability) but an unplanned dump could mean the killer/s did not
have time to control what evidence was seen or what conclusions might be drawn from the location.

' . . .I think we have to do away with all the current suspects and all this "I know who it was"
garbage and start from square 1. So I commend you for that. We have to deduce from
the killer's actions what he or she was thinking. This person may very well have lost
a child (maybe even deliberately so) but that also brings us perilously close to the
"killer was a woman" theory again. No matter how far away from it you try to get,
you circle back around to it again. 34 years of looking at male suspects nets us nothing. . . '
I certainly would not rule out female participation without evidence to support it.
Yet it also seems that a huge male ego was at work here too.
I agree that we need to look at this case from square one and think it through.

'. . .I remember when Sandra Cantu was first missing. Everybody thought it was some
sexual offender who just got released from prison. Her body too had been violated with
an object. And who turned out to be her killer? A woman. In the case of the Babysitter,
how long do we continue to ignore it?. . .'
Point taken. We must keep an open mind to who the killer/s might have been.

I have read of cases where the victims were violated with an object that had male perps
and I have read of similar cases where females were the perp.

I wish we had a good trained & experienced criminal profiler to tell us more of what that sort of
violation means. What does it tell us about the perp/s?

 

[katydid23]

I, for one, really appreciate your posts here Terri LYnn. I feel that you have a lot of important information. <mod snip> I like reading your thoughts about this case and I value your input.

Thanks
kate

 

[imamaze]

We have went through and removed several posts and edited some that is against our TOS.
Terms of Service Terms of Service - Short, Plain Language Version
We have a detailed, formal Terms of Service (TOS) posted separately, and that TOS is what you will be held to as a member here. It's long and detailed because it has to be in the world we live in, and you are expected to read it, understand it and abide by it. However, we can sum it up as follows:
1) Be a decent human being;
2) Treat your fellow posters as the decent human beings they are;
3) Keep in mind that whatever you post will likely live on forever, so think before you press "Submit Reply".
4) It's a big world. People will disagree with you. You will disagree with them. This can be done with respect, and that's what we expect.

BBM...

Lets get back to discussing the case in a respectful manner. Thanks.

Ima

 

[Omori]

I have read of cases where the victims were violated with an object that had male perps
and I have read of similar cases where females were the perp.

I wish we had a good trained & experienced criminal profiler to tell us more of what that sort of
violation means. What does it tell us about the perp/s?

From what I've read, it can mean the perp is sexaully inadequate or a woman. John Douglas profiled BTK and noted that he never raped a victim but rather masturbated on them as they were dying. He took it to mean that BTK did not get off on sexually dominating his victims but on tying them up. Here's what he wrote in his book, Inside the Mind of BTK:

"Without a doubt, BTK was a sadist who inflicted unfathomable horrors upon his victims. Yet he also differed from all the other sexual sadists I'd studied, guys who needed to inflict physical torture in order to be sexually satisfied. He got off by employing a form of torture that was predominantly mental, not physical. Although he seemed obsessed with physical torture, it wasn't part of what's referred to as his 'signature,' which is what a killer must do to satisfy himself psychologically. BTK's signature was bondage--not physical torture.

"BTK never penetrated any of his victims. It would have been easy to interpret this type of behavior as though he were trying to say You're not even good enough for me to rape. But I knew better.

"His decision to not rape his victims or engage in necrophilia actually told me that despite BTK's sexual obsessions, deep down inside his mind he felt hopelessly inadequate. His opinion of himself was so low--and his fear of women so great--that he could never bring himself to thrust himself so intimately into any of his victims. They were used purely as props. Masturbation was the only sexual activity he enjoyed during his binding, torture and killing."

Why should we believe Douglas? Well, for one, he was the first to profile the Unabomber and said that whoever it was, he was very intelligent, had a degree or degrees from a prestigious university and may even teach at one. A new crop of profilers discarded this profile contemptuously and said, "Nah, he's probably some blue collar guy like an airplane mechanic--some technical expertise and good with his hands but otherwise blue collar." Of course, they couldn't have been more wrong. Kaczynski was so bad with his hands that he'd buy a new car instead of trying to fix one that only needed a new belt or battery. Douglas, on the other hand, was on the money--eerily so. So my money is on whatever Douglas says.

So whoever assaulted Mark Stebbins and Tim King was either sexually inadequate and unable to penetrate them with his own penis or the perp was a female. The other possibility is that the perp was not a pedo and had done these things for totally different reasons and I'm starting to lean towards this one.

 

[Omori]

• All were abducted or recovered on or the day after holidays: Stebbins vanished the day after Valentine's Day and was his body was recovered the day Aquarius ends. Robinson was abducted on the winter solstice and her body recovered the day after Christmas (a.k.a. Boxing day). Mihelich was abducted the day after the New Year and her body recovered on the day Aquarius commences. Timmy King was abducted the day after the Ides of March (the day that Caesar and Christ were said to have died) and his body was recovered the day after the vernal equinox. There is no reason to believe this is a coincidence since the murders betray a number of other patterns. The holidays, in fact, may have dictated why each victim was held for the length of time they were. All four victims' bodies were recovered within the month in which each vanished. None straddled two months.

• Robinson was abducted the latest into the month and kept for the least amount of time. Mihelich was abducted the earliest in the month and kept for the longest time while the two male victims were abducted in the middle of the month. Robinson vanished on December 22, Mihelich’s body was recovered on January 21. Stebbins vanished on February 15 and King disappeared on March 16. So the two female victims share a month-and-a-day relationship as do the two male victims.

It’s too much to be coincidence. I said earlier that this angle may have dictated why the children were held the length of time they were. Or is it coincidence that Kristine Mihelich was abducted the day after New Year's and her body found on the commencement of Aquarius? Then another victim is found at the close of Aquarius. That’s a bit much to chalk up to coincidence.

So I think we have to seriously entertain that the killer was an astrology nut. He was consulting the stars about when to kill, whom to kill, how to kill them and where to place the bodies. This would mean the killer was adept at casting horoscopes. Or was he? He could have been seeing an astrologer adept at casting horoscopes.

What is striking is that just a short walk from where Mihelich vanished is the Mayflower Bookstore and the owner does indeed cast horoscopes and has many clients including some very famous ones. When I asked him how long his store was at that location, he said since 1985—long after the killing spree. But he also said he founded Mayflower in 1971 and that it was originally located on Woodward near 9 Mile (where the Om Café now sits) close to where Stebbins disappeared. There is no other bookstore in this area with the extensive catalog of books and astrology clients that Mayflower has—it’s kind of the 800 lb gorilla in the room. So, I wonder if the killer was a client of Mayflower? It is possible the owner may have cast this individual’s horoscope. It is possible the killer is still a customer or client of Mayflower.

I cast no aspersions on Mayflower itself, it is a very fine establishment offering a catalog of books that can’t be found anywhere else in this area that I know of. Usually, one has to go to California or New York to find such a place. I have never spoken with the owner about OCCK. It’s not the kind of subject one wants to have brought up in one’s own business establishment with customers roaming around and what not. But he has been in business here for 40 years and knows all kinds of people. I would be very interested in getting his take on the killings. I don’t know if the cops ever questioned him because I don’t know if they ever noticed the astrological connections. I cast no aspersions on the owner. I’ve known him for many years and he’s a good guy. But I do wonder if among his clientele going back four decades if one of them might possibly be the one now known as the Babysitter. And could he still be a client?

• There seems to be a 3 and 1 pattern concerning certain aspects. For instance, three of the bodies were found in Oakland County but one was found in Wayne. Three bodies were found in pristine condition but one had been shot in the face. Three of the victims were kept less than a week while one was kept for 19 days. Of the months each victim was taken—December, January, February and March—three of them occur after the New Year and one before it.

When I look at the 3 and 1 aspect, it seems to me to be more than a coincidence. I don’t know if the killer was consciously setting one victim off from the others, it could be something done subconsciously so I began searching through Jung, who has done so much work on the subconscious and I’ll quote verbatim what he wrote. Jung recounts various fairytales which he asserts carry a plethora of subconscious symbolism. This is from his book Archetypes and the Collection Unconscious:

“Between the three and the four there exists the primary opposition of male and female, but whereas fourness is a symbol of wholeness, threeness is not. The latter, according to alchemy, denotes polarity, since one triad always presupposes another, just as high presupposes low, lightness darkness, good evil. In terms of energy, polarity means a potential, and wherever potential exists there is the possibility of a current, a flow of events, for the tension of opposites strives for balance….In psychological language we should say that when the unconscious wholeness becomes manifest, i.e. leaves the unconscious and crosses over into the sphere of consciousness, one of the four remain behind, held fast by the horror vacui of the unconscious. There thus arises a triad, which as we know—not from the fairytale but from the history of symbolism—constellates a corresponding triad in opposition to it—in other words, a conflict ensues. Here too we could ask with Socrates, ‘One, two, three—but, my dear Timaeus, of those who yesterday were banqueters and today are banquet-givers, where is the fourth?’ He has remained in the realm of the dark mother, caught by the wolfish greed of the unconscious, which is unwilling to let anything escape from its magic circle save at the cost of a sacrifice.”

I did not ever read this before today and yet we can see the three and one explained psychologically. Three are set free and one remains behind with the “dark mother” which again nags at us with the idea of a female killer. Someone had brought up that the killer seemed to choose locales, streets and roads with nature themes: Oakland, Oakshire, Greenfield, Woodward, Maple, Big Beaver, Gill, Forest Drive and so on. I brought up the possibility that perhaps the killer fancies himself a predator in the wilderness and may be a hunting enthusiast. Here is what Jung writes regarding psychological symbolism:

“The hunter or old magician and the witch correspond to the negative parental images in the magic world of the unconscious. The hunter first appears in the story as a black raven. He has stolen away the princess and holds her prisoner. She describes him as ‘the devil.’ But it is exceedingly odd that he himself is locked up in the one forbidden room of the castle and fixed to the wall with three nails, as though crucified. He is imprisoned, like all jailers, in his own prison, and bound like all who curse….The crucifixion evidently betokens a state of agonizing bondage and suspension, fit punishment for one foolhardy enough to venture like a Prometheus into the orbit of the opposing principle. This was what the raven, who is identical to the hunter, did when he ravished a precious soul from the upper world of light; and so, as a punishment, he is nailed to the wall in that upper world….In our fairytale, the peculiar instrument of the magic spell is the triad of nails. Who it was that made the raven captive is not told in the tale, but it sounds as if a spell had been laid upon him in the triune name.”

I'm not going to comment on this angle any further. I don't want to tell anyone how to think on this. You may discard completely if you wish. But it's somewhat eerie, is it not?

 

[Omori]

The conclusion then is that the killer is not a pedophile. The killer took two boys and two girls to represent both unity and balance as well as perfect innocence. S/he then destroys this unity and balance by setting one off from the other three. Justice is represented by a scale or balance so by setting one off and upsetting the balance, justice or unity would never be realized. The killer will only allow it if the world makes the proper sacrifice&#8212;whatever that is.

Another 3 and 1 pattern that cannot be denied once one notices it, is that starting in the winter of &#8217;76, the killer took Jill Robison. After the New Year of that same winter, he took Kristine Mihelich. These abductions occurred in December and January. The killer was on a roll and so the next victim should have vanished by February but instead that month was skipped and Tim King vanished in March. Why was February skipped? Because Mark Stebbins had been abducted in February the year before. That month was already taken. Does this sound like a pedophile just trying to get his rocks off? The killer was very mindful of the months he was killing. As I mentioned, Kristine was taken earliest in the month and kept the longest and Jill was taken latest in the month and kept the shortest. What more proof do we need that the killer had an aversion to overlapping into another month? Would a pedophile care about something like that? No. This person was not a pedophile. This person was abducting children as some type of sacrifice. The sodomizing of the two boys may have been ritualistic or could have been done in hopes of making people think a pedophile had done the deed. For some reason, he couldn&#8217;t bring him/herself to molest the girls.

Still not convinced? In astrology, there is there are what are known as decans. When a zodiacal constellation such as Libra or Virgo or Cancer rises, the priests of the temples would watch for certain non-zodiacal constellations or asterisms (a smaller grouping of stars within a larger constellation) to appear every 10 days&#8212;hence the term &#8220;decan.&#8221; So each zodiacal constellation is attended by three decan constellations that rise ten days apart.

· Jill Robinson vanished on December 22, that&#8217;s the very day Capricorn commences and the first decan of Capricorn rises&#8212;Sagitta the arrow (not Sagittarius the archer). He is depicted as in the acting of drawing his bow and Jill was found shot in the face.
· Kristine Mihelich vanished on January 2, that&#8217;s the very day the second decan of Capricorn rises&#8212;Aquila the eagle. Her body was recovered at the commencement of Aquarius but the first decan of Aquarius&#8212;Piscis Australis the Southern Fish&#8212;and the third decan of Capricorn&#8212;Delphinus the dolphin&#8212;are both visible.
· Mark Stebbins&#8217;s body was recovered on February 19, which ended Aquarius but which is also listed as the commencement of Pisces and on that very day, the first decan of Pisces rises&#8212;an asterism called The Band which binds the two fish of Pisces together.
· Tim King vanished on March 16, during the third decan of Pisces&#8212;Andromeda. Andromeda in myth was chained to rock to be sacrificed to a sea monster. That monster was Cetus the whale. Likewise the band that holds the two fish of Pisces was joined to Cetus (making a triad again).
· The killer either saw him/herself as Cetus the monster who devours the sacrifice or as the one who offers the sacrifice to Cetus. The fish of Pisces are represented then as Mark and Tim and hence both were bound. Both were claimed by the killer in the form of sodomizing the boys with an object.
· The symbolism is that fish represent the redeemed multitudes and the goat is traditionally the animal sacrificed for atonement of sins&#8212;what is known as the scapegoat. Capricorn is half-fish and half-goat which is shown collapsing and dying in the front goat half but full of vigor in the back fish half. It represents &#8220;the goat of the atonement slain for the redeemed.&#8221;


http://philologos.org/__eb-tws/images/17sagitta.gif

&#8220;This strange goat-fish, dying in its head, but living in its afterpart--falling as an eagle pierced and wounded by the arrow of death, but springing up from the dark waves with the matchless vigour and beauty of the dolphin--sinking under sin's condemnation, but rising again as sin's conqueror--developing new life out of death, and hearlding a new springtime out of December's long drear nights--was framed by no blind chance of man. The story which it tells is the old, old story on which hangs the only availing hope that ever came, or ever can come, to Adam's race. To what it signifies we are for ever shut up as the only saving faith. In that dying Seed of the woman we must see our sin-bearer and the atonement for our guilt, or die ourselves unpardoned and unsanctified. Through His death and bloodshedding we must find our life, or the true life, which alone is life, we never can have.&#8221; &#8211;Dr. Joseph Seiss, The Gospel in the Stars

Then we look at the names of the victims: Mark named after Mars the god of war, Jill a feminine form of Julius or &#8220;son of Jove,&#8221; Tim or Timothy or &#8220;honoring God&#8221; and Kristine which is a form of &#8220;Christ.&#8221; Jill was the sacrificial goat to atone for the masses and redeem them. She is a child of god but must die and be reborn in order for this to be realized because she has been sullied in this life by an unjust war (Vietnam) represented by Mark. Kristine is Christ the son who is pierced with an arrow and dies for our sins just as Aquila is shown dying after being pierced and then rises as Delphinus the dolphin springing up from the raging sea or matter&#8212;this defiled, bloody world&#8212;as the risen Christ who conquers sin and redeems the masses. Tim represents Andromeda whose purity is offered to War in order to honor God. He is the sacrificial lamb, a purified form of the scapegoat represented by Jill and so his body is left on Gill(ian) Road in March&#8212;named after Mars, the God of War to whom he is offered to honor God and redeem the masses.

Seen in this way, then, Allen may have been legit. The Babysitter may, in fact, have been someone who killed children in Vietnam and sought to redeem American society by offering four innocents to the war&#8212;a mission he saw as divine, as one written in the stars. Allen, in fact, means &#8220;rock.&#8221; Andromeda was chained to a rock when offered to Cetus as a sacrifice. Dr. Bruce Danto, who actually spoke with Allen over the phone, thought the man sounded somewhat Middle Eastern and hence Allen may have been Arabic or Persian. Strangely, in the 4th and 5th centuries, a large Iranian tribe emigrated to Europe called the Alans.

 

[katydid23]

I don't know that the killer was into all of that symbolism. If he was, wouldn't he have left
some astological glyphs or some charts or some symbolism?

I have a strong connection to Astrology as I made a living as an astrologer for 25 years. But in this case, I don't know that I see the connection. I see a sick and twisted pedophile who got off on killing his young innocent victims. I do not believe that he/she waited for the next decan of a sign to kidnap his next victim. Decans are very rarely used in modern or contemporary astrology. They are of minor importance in the scheme of things.
As for the symbolic names, how could someone manage to abduct a child of a particular name in a particular order? That would have to mean they scoped out a particular child and watched and stalked them for long enough to find them off alone somewhere. How could that work if they needed to follow that specific decan date as well? I don't know, it just seems way too intricate and complicated. I could be wrong of course.

But I keep going back to the old saying, the simplest explanation is usually the truth.

 

[peeples]

Interesting case..
did hoppyfrog ever come back with info after finding the name of that reporter and getting a hold of her. about the pastor and the cabin???

 

[believe09]

I am not sure what is going on here, but please remember that TOS requires respectful posting. You dont have to agree with one another, but insults arent well tolerated here. Opinions are always welcome however. Please feel free to hit the alert button when a post bothers you and then sail on....as always, you can set another poster on Ignore via the PM function you have at the top of the page.

 

[Omori]

I don't know that the killer was into all of that symbolism. If he was, wouldn't he have left
some astological glyphs or some charts or some symbolism?

Shouldn't Ted Bundy have written taunting letter so the cops? They're all different and on their own trip.

I have a strong connection to Astrology as I made a living as an astrologer for 25 years. But in this case, I don't know that I see the connection.

Am I to convince you? I gave my reasons, if you don't buy them then you don't buy them. Sorry about that.

I see a sick and twisted pedophile who got off on killing his young innocent victims.

You can see anything you want. It's a free country last I checked.

I do not believe that he/she waited for the next decan of a sign to kidnap his next victim. Decans are very rarely used in modern or contemporary astrology. They are of minor importance in the scheme of things.

Ok, so you don't buy it. Fine.

As for the symbolic names, how could someone manage to abduct a child of a particular name in a particular order? That would have to mean they scoped out a particular child and watched and stalked them for long enough to find them off alone somewhere. How could that work if they needed to follow that specific decan date as well?

It's called stalking <modsnip>

I don't know, it just seems way too intricate and complicated. I could be wrong of course.

Any of us could be wrong. ANY of us.

But I keep going back to the old saying, the simplest explanation is usually the truth.

Usually.

 

[believe09]

Please continue the discussion here:
"The Babysitter" Oakland County Michigan - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community