Mystery couple murdered in South Carolina, 1976 - #6

[Mando]

I apologize if this has already been mentioned as I am way behind on this thread. What about Pierre Gariepy missing since 1973 from Montreal. Height matches as well as a scar located on his abdomen. His hair color and eye color is listed as black which could be mistaken for dark brown. And his eye color was likely dark brown because I don't know anyone with a black eye color. Weight is off but you can lose a great deal of weight in 3 years. Age is off by about 4 years but wasn't it determined that this doe may actually be older by his dental records. I may just be rambling on as I'm sure he has probably been mentioned before.

 

[Brainy]

I looked up Pierre Gariepy. With all honesty, he does not resemble John Doe at all. Also, he was a big fellow. 6'4" and over 220 lbs. Our guy is tall and has a small drame, about 6 feet tall and around 150 pounds. Faces do not look similar at all. Pierre has a round/ oval face, John Doe's features are more angular and pronounced.


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[Brainy]

Watched a little documentary today on Argentina's Dirty War. I know there has been a speculation in the past regarding Maria Marta Vasquez and Cesar Lugones and their possible connection to our Does here. I don't know if this theory has ever been tested or if Maria or Cesar have been ruled out.

While I was watching the documentary, I couldn't help but think that our Does are very possibly from Argentina/ South America. I tried to locate Argentina's missing persons database but I didn't come up with much. There is definitely a huge disconnect there. I wonder if anyone could recognize our Does if their pictures were made more popular to their culture/ audience.

I tried looking for leads in the Disappeared website. It a website of people who were abducted, arrested, killed and disappeared during the brutal revolution. It is assumed that there were close to 30,000 people who went missing. That's a ton of people to go missing without a trace! I wonder if our Does were from South America and ended up here in the States to escape the political tension and avoid arrest and abduction. Perhaps some who were involved in this politics tracked them down and killed them to make a point that they can't escape.

I have always thought that our Jane and John done were not robbed and that their murder was not random. It was a display, no effort was made to hide their bodies. They were fatally shot and left where they could be seen by drivers on the interstate.

Another thing... I honestly don't believe they are from Canada. It just doesn't make sense, also, I believe the story of them from Canada is either fake or is not well-remembered by the witness. The person claiming that John Doe told him about his father and his life in Canada doesn't even remember his name for sure. Also, why would John Doe share this very personal information with a stranger. By all accounts, no one seems to know this couple or much about them, and I am assuming that they kept their anonymity well.


I really don't know... Just thinking out loud. Would love to know what you think as well.


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[LadyL]

This is O/T but are you saying that Canada has more of a problem than other countries with transparency? Generalizations ...

Let's not talk about the totally disconnected LE instances in Canada...especially in those days.....they are still so scattered and not working together...are not transparent (in some cases they still don't want so share case files with direct family) pffffff

 

[carbuff]

My parents came to the US in the late 1950's; my father came alone, my mother came with her sister. I have one cousin here; the rest of my family is there. Unfortunately my parents stopped speaking Hungarian in order to learn English; so I can barely speak to my cousin with google translate; to talk to my dads brother I have to find someone to translate the email.

I guess you could say I'm 1st generation Hungarian - American. I was always told they were the 1st to come over but I know that's incorrect because I did my DNA; I have a 4th cousin on my mothers side in the US since the early 1900's which was pretty shocking to me. I guess she didn't know they came over lol

Families are different in what they count. I know people who count anybody they can trace as "family"; there's a person who shares a relative in England in the 1600's who says I'm her cousin. But I don't even consider fourth cousins to be relatives, to be honest. I barely know who my second cousins are, and while I probably have third cousins, if LE came to me looking for information because they had found a DNA connection to an unidentified person, I would not be able to give them any help even if I wanted to.

 

[Bit of hope]

Watched a little documentary today on Argentina's Dirty War. I know there has been a speculation in the past regarding Maria Marta Vasquez and Cesar Lugones and their possible connection to our Does here. I don't know if this theory has ever been tested or if Maria or Cesar have been ruled out.

While I was watching the documentary, I couldn't help but think that our Does are very possibly from Argentina/ South America. I tried to locate Argentina's missing persons database but I didn't come up with much. There is definitely a huge disconnect there. I wonder if anyone could recognize our Does if their pictures were made more popular to their culture/ audience.

I tried looking for leads in the Disappeared website. It a website of people who were abducted, arrested, killed and disappeared during the brutal revolution. It is assumed that there were close to 30,000 people who went missing. That's a ton of people to go missing without a trace! I wonder if our Does were from South America and ended up here in the States to escape the political tension and avoid arrest and abduction. Perhaps some who were involved in this politics tracked them down and killed them to make a point that they can't escape.

I have always thought that our Jane and John done were not robbed and that their murder was not random. It was a display, no effort was made to hide their bodies. They were fatally shot and left where they could be seen by drivers on the interstate.

Another thing... I honestly don't believe they are from Canada. It just doesn't make sense, also, I believe the story of them from Canada is either fake or is not well-remembered by the witness. The person claiming that John Doe told him about his father and his life in Canada doesn't even remember his name for sure. Also, why would John Doe share this very personal information with a stranger. By all accounts, no one seems to know this couple or much about them, and I am assuming that they kept their anonymity well.


I really don't know... Just thinking out loud. Would love to know what you think as well.


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See my earlier posts about this....nobody from Argentina's family of missing persons (horrible what happened) would ever say that Jane and Jack Doe where there missing family...I don't have to explain why....I hope

 

[Brainy]

See my earlier posts about this....nobody from Argentina's family of missing persons (horrible what happened) would ever say that Jane and Jack Doe where there missing family...I don't have to explain why....I hope

Why? Fear of prosecution?

Our Does have very distinct features. If somebody knew them they would have recognized them immediately due to their pronounced appearance. Many decades have passed since the Dirty War. Although many who were involved in the abductions are still free, some very prominent participants have been brought to justice in the recent years. I could certainly understand why people wouldn't come forward or refused to share any information. Still, I would believe it would be helpful if their information was shared in the South American culture, and mainly in Argentina. We might be surprised what we find out.

 

[Brainy]

Families are different in what they count. I know people who count anybody they can trace as "family"; there's a person who shares a relative in England in the 1600's who says I'm her cousin. But I don't even consider fourth cousins to be relatives, to be honest. I barely know who my second cousins are, and while I probably have third cousins, if LE came to me looking for information because they had found a DNA connection to an unidentified person, I would not be able to give them any help even if I wanted to.

Yes, very true. Being biologically related doesn't mean you know them. I haven't seen my parents or my sibling in many years. If somebody came to me with questions, I would be of no help as I have no relationship with them. So, yes, being part of blood family doesn't mean you are close or connected.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

Families are different in what they count. I know people who count anybody they can trace as "family"; there's a person who shares a relative in England in the 1600's who says I'm her cousin. But I don't even consider fourth cousins to be relatives, to be honest. I barely know who my second cousins are, and while I probably have third cousins, if LE came to me looking for information because they had found a DNA connection to an unidentified person, I would not be able to give them any help even if I wanted to.

But a keen family historian probably could at least give the police some lines of enquiry based on their database of individuals and previous correspondence with traced rellies.

 

[Ozoner]

Why? Fear of prosecution?

Our Does have very distinct features. If somebody knew them they would have recognized them immediately due to their pronounced appearance. Many decades have passed since the Dirty War. Although many who were involved in the abductions are still free, some very prominent participants have been brought to justice in the recent years. I could certainly understand why people wouldn't come forward or refused to share any information. Still, I would believe it would be helpful if their information was shared in the South American culture, and mainly in Argentina. We might be surprised what we find out.

The French Canadian angle is far more likely than the Argentinian angle. For one thing, the murder weapon was found in the position of local redneck Lonnie Henry, who is not someone would have had any connection to the US government or any Argentinian faction. If the man and woman were from Argentina, their murder must have nevertheless been a fairly random act of violence, not a political act. The male victim's conversations with the campground employee also suggest the he was French Canadian. More importantly, there is no evidence for the Argentinian angle beyond a suggestion that the two victims look like two missing Argentinians; in my opinion, the Does do not closely resemble the two people who have been proposed.

 

[trisha_mc]

Kind of a long shot, but a little over a year ago I was watching old game shows on BUZZR network (I love to see the old "brand new" prizes, as it's like opening a time capsule!). During an episode of "Press Your Luck" I saw a contestant that looked really familiar, but I couldn't quite figure out where I knew him from. Suddenly I started freaking out because I realized he looked like Jock Doe! I took as many pictures of my TV screen as I could, trying to get a good picture to post here for comparison. I even got one with his eyes closed, like the PM photo. During the episode I checked the BUZZR website to find out what year the episode was from. DAMMIT! 1983! But you wanna know the best part? His freakin' nametag said his name was JACK! Possible relative?

Hopefully I'm allowed to just post a random pic of my TV here:

 

[WyomingSkyAngel]

I suspect that part of the motivation for LE not following up on this case might have been that they didn't want friends/neighbors/other good ol' boys to get in trouble for getting rid of a couple of "dirty city hippies." Putting words into their mouths...but in 1976, hostility between country law enforcement and traveling young people.

This is very likely.

I agree with other posters that Facebook could solve this case.

I keep wondering if the Does had an association with someone (relative or employer) who was in trouble with the law & they were "on the run" & being elusive to avoid problems. It happens.

& The killings themselves might have just been robbery/assault based with no connection to the mystery of the Does origins. A good friend of mine was almost assaulted while hitchhiking to a Rainbow Family festival WITH her boyfriend. The would-be rapists actually whipped out a knife & were laughing at her boyfriend before she freaked out and ran away from the truck they were in (boyfriend followed her obviously.) Those things happen.

 

[Peppered_peach]

Hi! First post here. Honestly I just found this site last night, after trying to find out more about this couple. For some reason this lady's unidentified person profile popped up on my Pinterest page and after I saw her I couldn't get her out of my mind. I came a crossed her page on doe network while looking around and learned more about her and the guy she was found with.
After finding this thread I started to look around and kinda put a few things together. I haven't read this entire thread yet, but from what I did, I didn't see any of theses things brought up so I thought I'd throw them out there.

On the Doe Network page for the male, they show a ring that they call a "linde star ring" with the engraving JPF. Many on the thread have brought up that it could be his initials, but what I thought of right away was something else. I have a customer that is Jewish that has a similar pendant. Many Jewish wear star sapphire (which I believe is in his ring) as a sign of their religion and is nicknamed the Star of Adam. So what If "JPF" stands for Jewish Peace Fellowship. I looked into the Jewish fellowship and found that there are connections to Sumter County where the bodies were found, as well as in all the states that the truck stop matches could have came from. The fellowship has a yearly book, that shows the Jewish population in several states ( that I'm assuming have connections to this fellowship). Sumter county has a Jewish historical society which I found weird for such a "good ol' boy town" as described in some threads I read.

This could be far fetched, but I figured I'd share it.

 

[Karanjeff]

Good catch! Wonder if this might pan out? Somebody out there knows these people.
I wish I was down there to check into this.

 

[south fishy]

Hi! First post here. Honestly I just found this site last night, after trying to find out more about this couple. For some reason this lady's unidentified person profile popped up on my Pinterest page and after I saw her I couldn't get her out of my mind. I came a crossed her page on doe network while looking around and learned more about her and the guy she was found with.
After finding this thread I started to look around and kinda put a few things together. I haven't read this entire thread yet, but from what I did, I didn't see any of theses things brought up so I thought I'd throw them out there.

On the Doe Network page for the male, they show a ring that they call a "linde star ring" with the engraving JPF. Many on the thread have brought up that it could be his initials, but what I thought of right away was something else. I have a customer that is Jewish that has a similar pendant. Many Jewish wear star sapphire (which I believe is in his ring) as a sign of their religion and is nicknamed the Star of Adam. So what If "JPF" stands for Jewish Peace Fellowship. I looked into the Jewish fellowship and found that there are connections to Sumter County where the bodies were found, as well as in all the states that the truck stop matches could have came from. The fellowship has a yearly book, that shows the Jewish population in several states ( that I'm assuming have connections to this fellowship). Sumter county has a Jewish historical society which I found weird for such a "good ol' boy town" as described in some threads I read.

This could be far fetched, but I figured I'd share it.

This is interesting. I grew up in the 70's in a county near Sumter and the "history" of the Jewish families there were well known and documented bc there were basically only 3-4 families. This was also true in a couple of other surrounding counties.
I'm visiting family (now in NC) for the holiday weekend so I will ask about JPF or historical societies or anything they might know of that is related.
Thanks!


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[Peppered_peach]

It could just be a ring that he picked up somewhere, but I figured I throw it out there. I just can't believe that after all this time no one is missing these two.

 

[Ozoner]

It could just be a ring that he picked up somewhere, but I figured I throw it out there. I just can't believe that after all this time no one is missing these two.

I think part of the problem is that they were (apparently) traveling when they were killed. Did you hear about the Grateful Doe case, the case in which a Grateful Dead fan died in a car accident in 1995 but wasn't identified until 2015? His mother attempted to report him missing but couldn't because he had been on the road and she didn't know which jurisdiction he had gone missing from. Not only that, but if the story about Jacques's dad disowning him is true, he may have been estranged from his family. The girl's family may have tried to report her missing and been turned away.

 

[carbuff]

I think part of the problem is that they were (apparently) traveling when they were killed. Did you hear about the Grateful Doe case, the case in which a Grateful Dead fan died in a car accident in 1995 but wasn't identified until 2015? His mother attempted to report him missing but couldn't because he had been on the road and she didn't know which jurisdiction he had gone missing from. Not only that, but if the story about Jacques's dad disowning him is true, he may have been estranged from his family. The girl's family may have tried to report her missing and been turned away.

Or reported her missing from somewhere else, and not known about the guy.

Or the other way around, for that matter.

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[SurrealisticSlumbers]

Hey y'all. Just got back from three grueling weeks of studying in France (primarily Avignon and Marseille). Saw a bunch of guys who looked like Jacques Doe!

 

[ginestra]

Just read an interesting missing persons case that made me think of this John Doe. The time frame is right. He would of had a little money as he was a successful surf photographer. I think they look similar....?http://www.orangecoast.com/features/ron-stoner/