Mystery couple murdered in South Carolina, 1976 - #6

[Onaliv]

I find all this information fascinating. I do not understand why LE hasn't solved this case. Does anyone know if a book has been written about this case? I would like to point out a few things LE did not check on. If the couple had fruit/ice cream where did they purchase it and when? The only place I remember that sold ice cream and would have possibly been open 24 hours a day is the Stuckey's. I think LE needs to follow up on every lead no matter how small. Also the campground witnesses stated that the couple had suitcases. Have you ever seen a hitchhiker with suitcases? IF they really did have suitcases, then they must have had a vehicle. In my opinion, they were not murdered at the location that the bodies were found. I think they were just dumped there. I cannot get this off my mind and will continue to research this case.

All very good points; to the best of my recollection (after following this case for years) I think:

The suspected source of the fruit/ice cream was from a fruit stand/convenience store (possibly it was Stuckey’s, who knows??).

I’ve never seen anything conclusive that the couple was actually the same persons seen at the KOA and the witness where that originated evidently died or was otherwise gone and not able to be further questioned. In other words, I don’t think the KOA “sighting” has ever been validated, yet so much discussion of this case has centered around that. It’s very possible that the couple never actually stayed in Sumter County at all but simply met their unfortunate end there. It’s been speculated that they might have had a car and it was the motive for robbery - we’ll probably never know. I personally suspect they were robbed (there being no wallet/purse/ID found and the jewelry that they were left with was not considered high value) including their vehicle and killed to prevent identifying the perps which further makes it likely that it was a crime by locals.

I think there’s an ear-witness who is on record as having heard the gunshots near the discovery scene, so I’m not in total agreement that they were killed elsewhere and just dumped there.

Would really like to see closure on this case one day!






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[information junkie]

I started reading back issues of The Item and found in an article where the employee( that stated the victim was trying to pawn a ring to him) of the campground said that the victims had suitcases. I am a child of the 70's and I have never seen hitchhikers carrying suitcases. Duffle bag or back pack -yes. The male was clean shaven and both bodies were clean indicating that they had showered somewhere. It was not uncommon back then not to shave your legs. So far I have not found any report about the fibers found on their clothing or the labels inside their clothing. I cannot find a report where their shoes were tested, especially the soles, for evidence. Based on tests on their shoes, LE could determine if they had done alot of walking or if there were carpet fibers from inside of a car. So many questions?? I did see where someone reported that they possible purchased fruit from a fruit stand in Florence County. I wish the coroner had narrowed down the stomach contents to determine if it was just fruit or if it was ice cream. The Stuckey store is between Santee and Florence on I-95. When I have time I am going back to the library to read more back issues of The Item. The only problem with the Item articles is that there is way too much speculation and opinion and little facts.

 

[Brainy]

I just found this site while helping a college student find more info on the I-95 couple. I just sent an email to the LE suggesting that the couple's DNA be sent to Ancestry.com to attempt to match relatives. I got this idea from watching Long Lost Family. It is a long-shot but could provide a relative. I have not read through all the posts so I don't know if this has already been done.

Great idea. However, most of the time, ancestry and similar genealogy organizations do not work with law enforcement as they do not serve as DNA databases to match people up for legal/criminal reasons.

 

[Brainy]

If I remember correctly, bullet shells were found near their bodies. To assume that they were killed at a different location and then dumped where they were found would mean that the killer had staged the scene. I believe they were either taken or followed to the location, either suddenly attacked or subdued and then murdered. It was secluded. The scene also looks very "clean". I don't believe the autopsy revealed any signs of struggle or attack which makes me believe that they were possibly shot suddenly. Perhaps the killer(s) suddenly drew their weapon(s) and ordered them not to move and then shot, execution-style. I also believe that their bodies were not damaged/disfigured as the killer(s) wanted them to be found but not identified. I strongly believe they were killed for a personal reason to threaten or send a message to others. I have also previously suggested the theory that their faces may have been kept intact for photography and visual recognition by loved ones.

 

[Sweetluv]

Hitch hiking in pink wedged sandals? I find that a little hard to believe. If your going to randomly shoot someone, would you do it execution style....doesn't make much sense. If they bought ice cream,they needed payment. No wallet, purse, or cash/change in pockets.

 

[Ozoner]

If I remember correctly, bullet shells were found near their bodies. To assume that they were killed at a different location and then dumped where they were found would mean that the killer had staged the scene. I believe they were either taken or followed to the location, either suddenly attacked or subdued and then murdered. It was secluded. The scene also looks very "clean". I don't believe the autopsy revealed any signs of struggle or attack which makes me believe that they were possibly shot suddenly. Perhaps the killer(s) suddenly drew their weapon(s) and ordered them not to move and then shot, execution-style. I also believe that their bodies were not damaged/disfigured as the killer(s) wanted them to be found but not identified. I strongly believe they were killed for a personal reason to threaten or send a message to others. I have also previously suggested the theory that their faces may have been kept intact for photography and visual recognition by loved ones.

I don't think the killers wanted them to be identified; I don't think the killers cared whether they were identified. That suggests that there was no prior connection between the killers and the victims.

Hitch hiking in pink wedged sandals? I find that a little hard to believe. If your going to randomly shoot someone, would you do it execution style....doesn't make much sense. If they bought ice cream,they needed payment. No wallet, purse, or cash/change in pockets.

I think that they had a motorcycle, and I think that the theft of it was the motive for the crime. I also think that they were Canadian francophones and that xenophobia may have been a contributing factor.

 

[Onaliv]

Hitch hiking in pink wedged sandals? I find that a little hard to believe. If your going to randomly shoot someone, would you do it execution style....doesn't make much sense. If they bought ice cream,they needed payment. No wallet, purse, or cash/change in pockets.

Agree that they probably were not hitchhikers... BUT it’s very possible they were being transported by someone who decided to wack them while traveling through SC. I never really bought into the KOA story, in an RV campground people move in and out all the time.


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[ChefOtheRuler]

The gun used, does it hold six rounds? If so, that would mean the killer emptied his gun on them. Sounds

.38 caliber is a revolver round. Generally speaking (I suppose there are exceptions). Any gun firing that round would hold six. Smith & Wesson, the manufacturer of the LH gun makes and has produced a variety of revolvers in that caliber, all of them that I’ve found and are aware of hold six shots.

Edit: There are 5 round .38 revolvers produced by S&W, though they are not as common and I’m not actually sure any of them were available for purchase at the time of the murders. I think it is fairly safe to think this murder was committed with a six shot revolver and the murderer emptied the weapon and did not reload during the act.

 

[Ozoner]

.38 caliber is a revolver round. Generally speaking (I suppose there are exceptions). Any gun firing that round would hold six. Smith & Wesson, the manufacturer of the LH gun makes and has produced a variety of revolvers in that caliber, all of them that I’ve found and are aware of hold six shots.

Edit: There are 5 round .38 revolvers produced by S&W, though they are not as common and I’m not actually sure any of them were available for purchase at the time of the murders. I think it is fairly safe to think this murder was committed with a six shot revolver and the murderer emptied the weapon and did not reload during the act.

I'm not a gun person, but I've heard that most people store most revolvers with one chamber empty so the hammer can rest easy. Would that me the case with this particular gun? If so, I wonder whether the killer loaded the gun that night with the intention of killing the two victims.

 

[ChefOtheRuler]

I'm not a gun person, but I've heard that most people store most revolvers with one chamber empty so the hammer can rest easy. Would that me the case with this particular gun? If so, I wonder whether the killer loaded the gun that night with the intention of killing the two victims.

Though that may be a thing, I’ve never heard of anyone I know doing it. I just asked a few friends who carry revolvers (I’m a semi auto guy). None of them practice this, they all carry six rounds...

I would imagine, if you were taking a pair out onto a country road to kill them, you would load all six chambers...

While I was typing this I had a thought... If these people were travelers being robbed... Why bother killing them? It seems to me this was very deliberate. I’d be willing to bet money/drugs were involved.




Edited for grammatical mistake

 

[ChefOtheRuler]

Interestingly, I’ve read many pages and articles about this case, but today I read the Wiki, I realize Wiki pages are not always accurate, but it states the weapon was a .357 revolver, not a 38, and that they were each shot once in the back, once in the chest and once in the neck... It also states a hermit saw them get dropped off on the side of the road... Has anybody else seen reference to this?

 

[Giucy]

Based on the sketches, I thought about Eastern European couple trying to flee communism.
Or a couple fleeing the Greek colonels dictatorship. But I think it's a long shot.

Do you think that the Greek Orthodox church might be helpful ?

 

[PaulR]

Interestingly, I’ve read many pages and articles about this case, but today I read the Wiki, I realize Wiki pages are not always accurate, but it states the weapon was a .357 revolver, not a 38, and that they were each shot once in the back, once in the chest and once in the neck... It also states a hermit saw them get dropped off on the side of the road... Has anybody else seen reference to this?

Another alternative, it could have been a .357 revolver but were using .38 rounds: https://outdoors.stackexchange.com/...fire-38-caliber-rounds-in-a-357-magnum-pistol

 

[ChefOtheRuler]

Another alternative, it could have been a .357 revolver but were using .38 rounds: https://outdoors.stackexchange.com/...fire-38-caliber-rounds-in-a-357-magnum-pistol

Ahhh I forgot about that...

I honestly think the couple is Michael and Cordelia McMinn, I wish there was more info on them. Comparisons are very compelling, and despite that they supposedly left for Hawaii in a sailboat, if they were involved in illegal drug trafficking, they might have told their family that as an excuse for their absence?

 

[Ozoner]

Ahhh I forgot about that...

I honestly think the couple is Michael and Cordelia McMinn, I wish there was more info on them. Comparisons are very compelling, and despite that they supposedly left for Hawaii in a sailboat, if they were involved in illegal drug trafficking, they might have told their family that as an excuse for their absence?

But they don't look anything like the McMinns . . .

 

[ChefOtheRuler]

But they don't look anything like the McMinns . . .

Found this on google with a rather compelling article. I think they look quite similar, especially the part on Michaels hair, and Cordelia’s nose... She also has a mole on her cheek.

 

[Onaliv]

But they don't look anything like the McMinns . . .

Agreed - there are comparisons out there that bear a slight (IMO very slight) resemblance if you squint but I just cannot align the two couples as being the same.


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[Ozoner]

Found this on google with a rather compelling article. I think they look quite similar, especially the part on Michaels hair, and Cordelia’s nose... She also has a mole on her cheek.

I've seen those photos before, but I still think they look like completely different people. There are quite a few things that don't match, such as the skin tones. And while it's true that Cordelia had a mole on her left cheek, that mole doesn't match Jane Doe's moles.
I suspect that DNA testing will eventually rule out the match. (The McMinns were probably lost at sea.)

 

[Sweetluv]

Was the mcminns DNA ever compared to our deceased couple?

 

[ChefOtheRuler]

I really think their appearance is uncanny... Mr. McMinn’s hair is identical down the sideburns, his chin is shaped similarly, and the extremely bushy eyebrows... Both he and the Mrs have identical noses to the deceased, as well as very similar bone structure overall...

As for the moles being different on Cordelia? Makeup... The Doe photos don’t have whatever makeup the deceased might have worn while she was amongst the living. I dated a woman some years back who had a very distinct mole on her cheek which she concealed with makeup daily.

While the McMinn’s allegedly set sail for Hawaii. I believe it’s quite possible that if they were involved in the drug trade that may have just been a story to explain their absence to work/friends/family.

Also worth noting is the mechanic who claimed to have worked on their car claiming it had tags from Washington or Oregon. The McMinn’s hailed from Oregon.

I don’t necessarily give a ton of gravity to the campground story, because if you were trafficking drugs, you’d likely have a cover story. I see no reason to necessarily believe that what he told the man over a game of pool was true, about the doctor father and where they came from. The ring also may be something of a red herring as there is really no way of knowing if the initials were his or not. The book of matches was likely from a truck stop in Nebraska, it’s likely one would pass through Nebraska if driving from Oregon to South Carolina.

I understand the brother said it didn’t look like them, others clearly disagree, having been to quite a few viewings in my life, corpses rarely look quite like the person you remember in life.

I suppose DNA would be the only conclusive answer. Is it known if it had been compared? Also, is there a better picture of John Doe’s ears?