Not sure Caylee is dead, Not sure she's alive

[gibby207]

none intended, apologize if it came across that way... this case has just obsessed me...

I am as obsessed as they come....:blowkiss::blowkiss:

 

[Sable]

try searching for postmortem root band

 

[treeseeker]

I'm not a fence-sitter about Caylee, but rather whether her gparents had actual involvement. I don't want to get involved with the bashing, though.

I'll admit that any glimmer of hope Caylee's alive catches my attention.
I can't fathom Casey doing all the things required by various theories by herself, if for no other reason than the ick factor (I'm so sorry I had to say that). But then again, that exposure could have caused her present demeanor, I imagine. Total shock in herself.

 

[NewsyBuffalo]

I keep reading about the "death band" on Caylee's hair and how this has led investigators to believe Caylee is dead. Did they ever refer to the death band by some other name? I wanted to read up on this (not just as it relates to the Caylee case, but just scientific information in general) but can't find anything about a "death band" on google.

http://www.astm.org/JOURNALS/FORENSIC/PAGES/JFS4610015.htm

Journal of Forensic Sciences abstract discussing postmortem root band.

 

[Amity]

OK, about the DNA and dogs alerting at the trunk...and my apologies beforehand but Mr. Amity was last in line when it came to getting himself some tact.

I asked him after dinner what his thoughts were about my having the teensy weensy gut feeling that Caylee was alive (I hate giving up hope even when logic tells me different) being that DNA and dogs alerted and his words were:

"Easy. She aborted and threw it in the trunk".


I said "Well that's a theory I hadn't explored!"

 

[not_my_kids]

OK, about the DNA and dogs alerting at the trunk...and my apologies beforehand but Mr. Amity was last in line when it came to getting himself some tact.

I asked him after dinner what his thoughts were about my having the teensy weensy gut feeling that Caylee was alive (I hate giving up hope even when logic tells me different) being that DNA and dogs alerted and his words were:

"Easy. She aborted and threw it in the trunk".


I said "Well that's a theory I hadn't explored!"

I now feel horrible. My first reaction to reading that was a shocked burst of laughter.
But anyway, unfortunately, and I do hate to say this, it wouldn't explain the banding on the hair.
I am just pointing out fact, some days I too am a fence sitter.

 

[Amity]

I now feel horrible. My first reaction to reading that was a shocked burst of laughter.
But anyway, unfortunately, and I do hate to say this, it wouldn't explain the banding on the hair.
I am just pointing out fact, some days I too am a fence sitter.

Yea, I know, I know *shaking head*
But I warned ya!
He doesn't say much but when he does it usually leaves me with my jaw hanging open....as with his after dinner comment.

He's made other, even more bizarre comments that I wouldn't dare post here for fear of being laughed out of WS's front door. But hey, at least he's finally showing an interest. ....gotta love him for that. :blowkiss:

 

[ScreenName]

DNA can't determine dead.

If it weren't for the decomp and hair in the trunk...I'd think this was all a hoax by the A's. Nothing makes sense in this case. I do believe it's Caylee decomp though. by process of elimanation, of course.

 

[cjcord]

OK, about the DNA and dogs alerting at the trunk...and my apologies beforehand but Mr. Amity was last in line when it came to getting himself some tact.

I asked him after dinner what his thoughts were about my having the teensy weensy gut feeling that Caylee was alive (I hate giving up hope even when logic tells me different) being that DNA and dogs alerted and his words were:

"Easy. She aborted and threw it in the trunk".


I said "Well that's a theory I hadn't explored!"

what, herself? Do they have "at home" kits for that? I'm pretty sure it's not common practice for docs to volunteer souvenirs of that procedure...>.>

 

[drumstick]

In the beginning I wanted to believe so badly that this little girl was still alive.

I looked at her mother and nothing fit. No background of a broken home, child abuse, abandonment or other typical profiles we normally see in a case such as this one.
Nothing seemed to add up (at first look) so I explored the possibility that somewhere in all of the lies there would be a small truth about what happened.

I even explored the possibility of GA's girlfriend (mistress) as being involved with the child behind the scene way before the 400 pages came out. (Deductive reasoning from the divorce filing-public records)


And then the test results started coming out....
Decomposition doesn't lie.

After that I joined TES and went with everyone to search.

I've also educated myself about the growing problem in this country about mothers who kill their children.

"Homicide is the leading cause of death in children under four.
Not crib death as many believe and not by a maniacal stranger but by a parent.
More than 200 women kill their children in the US every year."
Kelly Sons

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/298480/mommy_dearest_why_do_some_mothers_who.html?cat=25

This is a good article, to start with, if you want to learn more.

If you know a mother on the edge, maybe by learning about this problem we can help another child from becoming the next victim.


~drumstick

 

[FootballMom]

For the fence sitters and others wanting to ponder IF by some miracle there might be a "reason" for Casey's "behavior" see my post from last night (link below, post #59). It contains, choloform, Kio, death band, etc....

If anyone is worried about providing an idea for the defense, please don't... they'd have to prove it and no matter what it is, if it didn't happen then they wouldn't be able to....

Again for the record, I think Caylee is passed and that it was Casey's fault...

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70621&page=3

 

[amethyst221]

I think she is deceased, and it's in part based on the information that has come from LE about decomposition in the trunk, DNA, etc. Yes, the defense can challenge scientific evidence in court, but that doesn't make it unreliable. I find the massive amount of behavior by CA that shows consciousness of guilt really persuasive also. Her juvenile, ever-changing ridiculous stories about kidnappers lacks any credibility to me, and the way she changes the story to mask her guilt as her lies are revealed is persuasive. She does not act like a person worried to death about her missing, in terrible danger daughter. We are diverted to look at vague tips, but the person who could actually give more information keeps silent and allows more and more time to pass. Local LE and the FBI can't be told or involved because that could put Caylee in danger. Yet the public is supposed to track down the dangerous kidnappers, which somehow won't put Caylee or them in danger. The "script" has run out. Why not tell LE now and let them look for Caylee. Why wait for trial to tell? There is no longer anything to suggest that Caylee is alive, though I wish it was different.

 

[drumstick]

I think she is deceased, and it's in part based on the information that has come from LE about decomposition in the trunk, DNA, etc. Yes, the defense can challenge scientific evidence in court, but that doesn't make it unreliable. I find the massive amount of behavior by CA that shows consciousness of guilt really persuasive also. Her juvenile, ever-changing ridiculous stories about kidnappers lacks any credibility to me, and the way she changes the story to mask her guilt as her lies are revealed is persuasive. She does not act like a person worried to death about her missing, in terrible danger daughter. We are diverted to look at vague tips, but the person who could actually give more information keeps silent and allows more and more time to pass. Local LE and the FBI can't be told or involved because that could put Caylee in danger. Yet the public is supposed to track down the dangerous kidnappers, which somehow won't put Caylee or them in danger. The "script" has run out. Why not tell LE now and let them look for Caylee. Why wait for trial to tell? There is no longer anything to suggest that Caylee is alive, though I wish it was different.

"The script has run out." Is right!

No more crazy stories from this family!

Enough is enough!

Justice for Caylee!

:furious:

 

[seagull65]

Prove that to us???

Someone was asking for someone to prove the statement that "DNA doesn't prove someone is dead"?
Well, that's right, isn't it? DNA can only identify a person (within a reasonable margin of error), it can't determine if that person was dead.

 

[seagull65]

The only thing the investigators supposedly have that suggests a person could be dead is the air sample (a new technique that may or may not be strong enough to use for evidence/stand up in court), and possibly a hair sample that may or may not show "banding". (The media have said that the hair is definitely Caylee's and that it definitely shows banding but of course we'd have to hear expert testimony in court on this evidence to know what it shows or doesn't show.) Banding pattern on hair can be caused when a person dies and the hair is still attached to them, gas or chemicals given off by the body get in the hair shaft and cause air pockets that appear like bands, apparently. Some experts say it is not certain if other conditions may also cause this to happen to hair. In other words, there could still be the possibility that this is hair that got into the trunk in the normal ways, for example, it was on a blanket or car seat or coat or toy that was thrown in trunk, then after it was there for a time, it started to decompose. If mitochondrial DNA was used, mitochondrial DNA can't differentiate between Caylee or Casey's DNA, so in that case, it wouldn't be proved if the hair was Casey's or Caylee's. If nuclear DNA was used it can be determined if the hair was Caylee's. You notice how cautious the official statements have been about the evidence so far. Only the media have said the evidence is conclusive/definite and that it means Caylee was definitely dead and was definitely in the trunk, no authority has said anything stronger than "could have been", "suggests that", etc. We won't know how strong the forensic evidence is until it's presented in detail in court. The fact that they haven't brought any charges yet probably means that they don't have much of a case yet and that they're hoping to find more, some of these leaks could be for the purpose of bluff/trying to get Casey to confess to something. All that is a GOOD reason to keep hoping that Caylee is alive.

 

[seagull65]

Thanks for this thread, Unsaid!
I started the other fence-sitter thread (at least a recent one, there may have been others before, I'm not sure) and we got a lot of very good discussion on it, but then a couple of people (not fence-sitters at all) got the thread closed by continually getting on the thread and calling the fence-sitters "Cindy" and "troll" and bogging the board down, the mods became aware of the rudeness and off-topic posts and finally closed the thread. The mods were great about it and said if any name-calling or rudeness goes on again to be sure to hit the alert button right away. It's very important to have a thread like this where discussion can still go on, since on many of the threads, they are already exclusively locked on one the one theory (that Casey murdered Caylee).

 

[lilllbird]

The science proves Caylee is dead. Logically I know Caylee is dead yet I still find myself hoping she'll come home alive. I'm still looking for proof that she is safe. I'm not really a fence sitter just a wishful thinker.

 

[seagull65]

Have we seen any specific evidence presented in a court of law yet? Have charges been brought? No, only leaks and suggestion so far. Thank heavens. It is one possibility that Caylee is no longer alive or that Casey harmed Caylee, but luckily no evidence has been made public yet that proves that. Keep your fingers crossed that she's alive.

 

[seagull65]

That's one half positive thinking and one half haven't seen the evidence yet.

 

[seagull65]

I really hope the authorities have been investigating ALL the people surrounding this case throughout these weeks. And I don't mean just taking their statement and leaving it at that.