Deceased/Not Found NY - Etan Patz, 6, New York, 25 May 1979 #2 *P. Hernandez guilty*

[STANDREID]

Do you think the judge will allow this to go through a second weekend without declaring a mistrial?

 

[gregjrichards]

Do you think the judge will allow this to go through a second weekend without declaring a mistrial?

I am not optimistic this jury will be able to reach a majority decision. I don't know how long the judge is going to allow deliberations to continue before believing the jury will be unable to ever reach a verdict. Does every person on the jury have to agree on a verdict in New York or is it a majority decision?

 

[epiphany]

[/QUOTE]

I am not optimistic this jury will be able to reach a majority decision. I don't know how long the judge is going to allow deliberations to continue before believing the jury will be unable to ever reach a verdict. Does every person on the jury have to agree on a verdict in New York or is it a majority decision?

Respectfully BBM ^^

The jury has to be unanimous to find him guilty in NY:


Verdict
In a criminal case, only a unanimous vote by the jury results in a verdict on any crime charged. If a jury reaches a verdict on some charges but deadlocks on others, the trial judge may allow the jury to report the partial verdict. If a jury cannot reach a unanimous verdict on any charges, it is referred to as a “hung jury.” In the case of a hung jury, the judge may declare a mistrial, and the prosecution will consider whether or not to re-try the case.

p26/64

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...YeOYda0qhfpYVsGzJVd0a7A&bvm=bv.91427555,d.cWc


They will continue deliberating...no reason for judge to interfere in the deliberation process at this point in time imo. System appears to be working.

 

[gregjrichards]

Respectfully BBM ^^

The jury has to be unanimous to find him guilty in NY:


Verdict
In a criminal case, only a unanimous vote by the jury results in a verdict on any crime charged. If a jury reaches a verdict on some charges but deadlocks on others, the trial judge may allow the jury to report the partial verdict. If a jury cannot reach a unanimous verdict on any charges, it is referred to as a “hung jury.” In the case of a hung jury, the judge may declare a mistrial, and the prosecution will consider whether or not to re-try the case.

p26/64

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...YeOYda0qhfpYVsGzJVd0a7A&bvm=bv.91427555,d.cWc


They will continue deliberating...no reason for judge to interfere in the deliberation process at this point in time imo. System appears to be working.[/QUOTE]

Thanks epiphany I thought it would be unanimous.

 

[gregjrichards]

Day 8 of jury deliberations Friday April 24th 2015

Update part one

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 3h 3 hours ago

They've now moved to the cross examination readback of Stuart GraBois. Prosecutor Illuzi-Orbon got testy with him. #EtanPatz #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 3h 3 hours ago

#ramos was immediately rearrested in 2012 for listing bogus address in violation of @meganslaw #EtanPatz now due parole 2020 #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4h 4 hours ago

GraBois said while interrogating #Ramos in 1980s he saw @rudygiulianiGOP and said "you look thinner than you do on television." #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4h 4 hours ago

Fmr fed prosecutor claims #Ramos, asked if HE took #EtanPatz "I'm 90 percent sure it was the same boy I took back to my apartment." #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4h 4 hours ago

Fmr fed prosecutor claims #Ramos, asked if HE took #EtanPatz "I'm 90 percent sure it was the same boy I took back to my apartment." #nbc4ny

Andrew SiffVerified account
‏@andrewsiff4NY

Former fed agent grilled #EtanPatz family, as part of case.
"I wanted to eliminate them....I know it was painful for them." #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 5h 5 hours ago

Jurors, with pen and paper, listening intently to readback of the key defense witness: federal agent convinced of Ramos guilt. #nbc4ny


Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 5h 5 hours ago

Readback from Stuart GraBois has begun. Former federal agent who believes Jose Ramos is real #EtanPatz killer NOT #pedrohernandez #nbc4ny


Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 6h 6 hours ago

Jurors soon in court to hear #federal investigators readback: they believed Jose Ramos took #EtanPatz #nbc4ny

 

[gregjrichards]

Day 8 of jury deliberations Friday April 24th 2015 - DAY 8 NO VERDICT - DAY 9 ON MONDAY 27TH APRIL 2015

Update part two

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 3m 3 minutes ago

Defense lawyer: "I think we're all tired." #EtanPatz #pedrohernandez #deliberations #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 44m 44 minutes ago

The #EtanPatz jury has been sent home for the weekend. They'll be back on Monday for day NINE of deliberations. #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 7m 7 minutes ago

An incensed interrogator, tired of what he viewed as Jose Ramos's lies about #EtanPatz raised voice and said "stop the bull***t." #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 19m 19 minutes ago

"That was our speculation," conceded Stuart GraBois, former prosecutor, about Jose Ramos killing #EtanPatz. #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 26m 26 minutes ago

One juror has his head in his hands. Five others actively taking notes as readback continues, all related to #Ramos #EtanPatz #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 1h 1 hour ago

Readback: #patz family wrote to #Giuliani in mid 1980s asking fed pros GraBois to be removed from the #EtanPatz case. #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 1h 1 hour ago

Several jurors nodding and chuckling as #judge explains that he can't get them a printer. Readback has now resumed. #EtanPatz #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 1h 1 hour ago

First the jury wanted a spreadsheet. Now they want a printer. Very tech-minded in #deliberations #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 3h 3 hours ago

Former federal pros admits he thought #EtanPatz case was "a lost cause" so he shredded evidence accumulated in #Ramos case #nbc4ny

 

[Indy Anna]

<< Respectfully snipped for space>>
Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 3h 3 hours ago

Former federal pros admits he thought #EtanPatz case was "a lost cause" so he shredded evidence accumulated in #Ramos case #nbc4ny

:maddening:

It's so frustrating to think this might have been a cut-and-dried case had all of the evidence been preserved. How can a prosecutor make such an irresponsible decision?! We've seen here on WS cold cases that have been solved decades later because evidence was preserved.

 

[gregjrichards]

Etan Patz Trial day 9 of deliberations Monday 27th April 2015

Update part one

Trial Updates from twitter:

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 16m 16 minutes ago

Galligan asks Ramos about his comment "they'll never find #patz body." His reply? He didn't remember saying that. #EtanPatz #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 27m 27 minutes ago

map shows two key locations - where Ramos said he abducted etan - and apartment he claims he took the boy. #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 29m 29 minutes ago

The map defense claims Jose Ramos drew of where he took #EtanPatz - but Feds also saw Ramos as serial liar #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 36m 36 minutes ago

Jailhouse informant gave #FBI map that he claims #Ramos drew; purports to show where Ramos took #EtanPatz prosecution: not credible #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 40m 40 minutes ago

Readback has resumed in #EtanPatz case. Jury may return to deliberation room late this afternoon. #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 2h 2 hours ago

Despite more than 100 tapes of Ramos from prison, Feds concede they could hear "mostly static" due to technical probs. #EtanPatz #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 3h 3 hours ago

To bolster credibility, defense told jurors #FBI agent Mary Galligan, who ran #EtanPatz case for decade, was top 9/11 investigator #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 3h 3 hours ago

Jurors now hearing read-back of fmr FBI agent Mary Galligan. She testified Ramos claimed kid he met day #etan disappeared: "Jimmy" #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 3h 3 hours ago

After brief recess readback testimony has resumed. Jury won't get back to true #deliberations until after #lunch #EtanPatz case #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4h 4 hours ago

Rudy #giuliani figures in some of #EtanPatz readback. As USatty helped send former investigator to #israel to pursue leads. #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4h 4 hours ago

Grabois on Morgenthau decision NOT to prosecute longtime #EtanPatz suspect Ramos: "I though it was the wrong position." #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4h 4 hours ago

#readback of Stuart Grabois cross examination: he admits earning more than $30,000 for helping author of a book about #EtanPatz #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4h 4 hours ago

suspect #ramos said met a boy day #etanpatz disappeared.
Q: recall the name the boy gave?
A: to the best of my recollection it was Jimmy.

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4h 4 hours ago

Key readback of federal agent:
Q: not one single piece of evidence that Ramos was talking about Etan?
A: that was my understanding. #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4h 4 hours ago

Attentive jury of 7 men and 5 women have pads, pens and yellow highlighters out as they listen to readback. #etanpatz #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 5h 5 hours ago

Deliberations - day NINE now underway at criminal court in #EtanPatz case. #nbc4ny

https://twitter.com/andrewsiff4ny

 

[gregjrichards]

Etan Patz Trial day 9 of deliberations Monday 27th April 2015 - Update part 2

NO VERDICT ON DAY NINE OF DELIBERATIONS

Trial Updates from twitter:

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 35m 35 minutes ago

No verdict in day NINE of #etanpatz deliberations. Jury returns tomorrow for day 10. #nbc4ny

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4m 4 minutes ago

Actual #deliberations have resumed in #EtanPatz case after nearly two DAYS worth of readback. #nbc4ny

 

[MsFacetious]

Etan Patz Murder Trial: Judge Sends Jury Back to Deliberate After Jurors Say They Are Deadlocked

The judge in the Etan Patz murder trial has sent the jury back for further deliberations after the group sent a note stating they are deadlocked after 11 days of considerations.

According to NBC New York, the jury sent a note to the judge asking to replay the closing arguments, a process that would take six hours. The judge granted the replay after receiving the group&#8217;s deadlock note.

http://www.people.com/article/etan-patz-murder-trial-jury-deadlocked

 

[dotr]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/30/nyregion/etan-patz-trial-jury.html?_r=0

"Because Etan&#8217;s body was never found, the prosecution&#8217;s case rested almost entirely on Mr. Hernandez&#8217;s own words in videotaped confessions he gave to the police, a prosecutor and to several psychiatrists who examined him while he was in state custody.

Prosecutors had no scientific evidence from a crime scene or an autopsy to buttress Mr. Hernandez&#8217;s account. The police never found the boy&#8217;s clothes or the pilot&#8217;s hat he was wearing, nor a small tote bag crammed with toy cars and pencils that he carried".

 

[gregjrichards]

Thank you MsFacetious and dotr for your updates. I've not been able to follow the trial closely today and yesterday as my mum and I found a much loved family member dead in his bed yesterday. He died in his sleep he was only in his early 50s and it has been a terrible shock.

 

[STANDREID]

My condolences Greg. Sorry for that.

 

[dotr]

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/announcing-deadlock-jurors-press-etan-patz-case-30692451

" New York jurors in the murder trial stemming from the 1979 disappearance of 6-year-old Etan Patz (AY-tahn payts) have decided to rehear hours of closing arguments before resuming deliberations.

A stenographer is reading the hourslong defense closing argument Thursday in the case against Pedro Hernandez.

Jurors will then break to discuss it before rehearing the prosecution's closing remarks"

 

[dotr]

"During closing arguments, prosecutors used PowerPoint slides to show jurors quotes from witness testimony, as well as photographs of the alleged crime scene.

Defense lawyers also presented exhibits from the trial, including photos of the store where Hernandez worked, police documents from the 1979 search for Patz and excerpts of Hernandez's video confession.

If the jury stalemate holds and a mistrial is declared, the prosecution will have to decide whether to retry the case."

rbbm.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/04/30/us-usa-crime-patz-idUSKBN0NF1PW20150430

 

[dotr]

"After deliberating for 10 days, the jury informed the judge, State Supreme Court Justice Maxwell Wiley, that they were deadlocked and could not reach a unanimous decision.

As usually happens in such an instance, the judge issued a so-called &#8220;Allen charge,&#8221; asking them to try one last time to reach a verdict. If it remains a hung jury, it will be declared a mistrial.

As of Wednesday, the judge was said to be &#8220;reviewing options.&#8221;

http://thevillager.com/2015/04/30/etan-patz-jury-deadlocked/

 

[Indy Anna]

Thank you MsFacetious and dotr for your updates. I've not been able to follow the trial closely today and yesterday as my mum and I found a much loved family member dead in his bed yesterday. He died in his sleep he was only in his early 50s and it has been a terrible shock.

Greg, I am so sorry for your loss. :hug: Condolences to you and your family.

Thank you for all that you have done in keeping us updated on this trial.

 

[gregjrichards]

Greg, I am so sorry for your loss. :hug: Condolences to you and your family.

Thank you for all that you have done in keeping us updated on this trial.

Thank you Indy Anna, STANDREID and everyone for your kind messages here. And in addition for private messages I have also received from other members it has been very kind of you all. Hope you all have a nice weekend.

I am able to update Etan's case again from today it has been no problem updating everyone from the start of deliberations. Thank you.

 

[gregjrichards]

ETAN PATZ Trial deliberations day 13. Friday 1st May 2015

PART ONE OF UPDATE

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 20m 20 minutes ago

"Wow. Wow." Prosecutor on #pedrohernandez describing boiler room next to basement where he claimed to have dumped #Etan. Owner confirms.

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 31m 31 minutes ago

Jurors are listening intently, but they seem locked in to their various views. Hard to figure who would change their opinion. #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 1h 1 hour ago

prosecutors close suggests motive of #pedrohernandez
"He said that he tried to abuse a child. The child didn't let him." #EtanPatz #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 1h 1 hour ago

Prosecution via readback. On #pedrohernandez
"What is he hiding? He is hiding the motive for this crime....looking and watching children."

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 1h 1 hour ago

Per prosecution in: #EtanPatz is in a sense, key witness: because he had a dollar for a soda and defendant said he lured boy w soda #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 1h 1 hour ago

"Etan is larger than his very little important life. He represents a moment in this city and this country where trust was a way of life."

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 2h 2 hours ago

JURORS request #readback of prosecution summations originally deliv April 14; pushes #EtanPatz resolution til afternoon at LEAST #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 2h 2 hours ago

Poss scenarios today: #jury reaches #verdict; #jury asks more #readback; jury stays deadlocked=mistrial. #EtanPatz #EtanPatzjury #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 2h 2 hours ago

#DELIBERATIONS in the #EtanPatz case have resumed. Day 13. Last #NYC case that went this long #Bronx trial in 2000. #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 3h 3 hours ago

Day THIRTEEN. #EtanPatz #pedrohernandez #verdictwatch #nbc4ny

 

[gregjrichards]

ETAN PATZ Trial deliberations day 13. Friday 1st May 2015

PART TWO OF UPDATE

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 6m 6 minutes ago

#readback is winding to a close. Interesting to see if jurors deliberate - or go home. #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 2m 2 minutes ago

lot more note-taking now as prosecution summation hits #Ramos theory. The real killer? Reasonable doubt? Or distraction? #EtanPatz #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 58s 59 seconds ago

Far less note-taking by jurors in this portion of readback. May have heard what they needed to; or simply exhausted. #EtanPatz #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4m 4 minutes ago

On day THIRTEEN of #EtanPatz delibs, judge says #readback could last rest of day. If so might mean we are back Monday for day 14. #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 5m 5 minutes ago

2) 2 sketch artists. 1 defendant. Defendant's wife and daughter. #EtanPatz #verdictwatch #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 6m 6 minutes ago

1) There are about 51 people in the courtroom. 12 jurors. 1 judge. 8 lawyers/paralegals. 3 court officers. 21 reporters. ...#NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 9m 9 minutes ago

"He never takes it back." Prosecutors nudge jurors on why #pedrohernandez never retracted confessions of 30 yrs ago #EtanPatz #NBC4NY

Andrew Siff @andrewsiff4NY · 4m 4 minutes ago

After brief recess #readback resumed w diff stenographer. About 1/3 of way thru. On course to finish 3:15. #EtanPatz Verdict then? #NBC4NY