Found Deceased NY - Jennifer Ramsaran, 36, Chenango County, 11 Dec 2012 - # 9

[Portabella]

I keep checking back hoping to see the words "arrest made".... I pray for Jenn all the time, although I never knew her, I feel I did... I believe justice will be served eventually in this case... RIP beautiful lady.... Still so touched by her.... IMHO

 

[Caring4Many]

It seems we're all going around in circles here & to no avail. So I'll pose a question(s) I guess if people want to answer, great, maybe we will stumble onto something we haven't fully discussed yet. Maybe others will pose their own as well for the rest of us.

1)How did you hear about Jennifer's case?
2)Have you decided who you think is guilty?
3)What was it initially that made you believe they were?

My answers:
1) Jennifer's poster came across my Facebook feed from the HFJR room. I went there and read what I could. At the time I only knew that she was missing-nothing else.
2) Sadly, I believe it was GR-when I first started reading more on the case was just before the video interview. When I saw the interview, how long it took before one was done & the content. It didn't feel right, I had the feeling from right then, that he was involved.

Anyone else?

My apologies for quoting myself here but I really thought I should elaborate on my reasonings. It's come to my attn that certain people feel as if we "bullies" are only referring to demeanor. Yes we are no "true detectives" -after all of that was our jobs wouldn't we be working & not online here-but with access to more damning info! Anyways, there are some "unseen" things that we've all discussed that make me believe GRs guilty.
*iphone discovery using the "find my phone" app-after using this myself & trying different things in different locations the sequence as told by GR & CC/LD couldn't have taken place.
*VPN as part of the alibi-while most people dont know much about VPNs & their differences, I'm not one in this case. The utilization of a VPN from IBM doesn't hold up as even part of an alibi. Those stay connected for days while you aren't even near the pc & can be used from a phone as you travel anywhere.
*affair with the best friend-call it what you want-tryst, one night, alcohol fueled, etc. The locals have said they knew it was on going for 6mths, some saying even a yr recently. I know people talk & even embellish. I played the telephone game as a child. But seriously-a one time thing only known of between 2 people w regrets? How does an entire town grow to find this out? Whether Jennifer knew isnt even the issue. Everyone else did.
*GR said it himself-the husband is usually a suspect. But this is even more so when the wife was thinking of leaving.
*The last person ON RECORD is statistically the most logical & usually the one responsible. Look it up. It's true.
*JR reputation demoralizing. What's the purpose? I'm sorry but even if she had run-wouldn't you, if you were worried about what you're children saw & thought-tread lightly on what you said while speaking of their mother? Not just before she was found but after? Would you allow someone else to speak out that maybe their mother ran off & was killed by that person? I'm thinking if your children were your concern-you'd keep the tv off-minus maybe movies or kids channels like Disney, not allow them on FB, surround them by home videos of mom, pictures, family members, etc. You can't control the News, the town rumors, the Internet, etc but you can control what they're exposed to in your home-why blame others for what their posting or publishing instead of keeping what comes out of your mouth & your affiliates under wraps & positive & making sure what your kids are exposed to is limited.
*How Jennifer was found. The manner she was left in to me was very personal. Who else was that close to her to leave her in this position for all to see as she was found? It's just too personal. A slap in the face even. Demoralizing-see the pattern? I do. Question is how far back does it go?

I could continue here but I think I've taken up enough space from other WSers. I thought that considering someone misunderstood me I'd make sure that-seen or unseen-I had my reasons other than "demeanor" that I was looking to for reasons of guilt. Maybe some people will reevaluate how closed off they've keep their thoughts, go back to the beginning & think about this case fresh-as if it wasn't tied to people they're tied to. My guess is that they may change their minds. Trust me I wish I didn't think the way I do-I'd like Jennifer's kids to have at least one parent growing up, it isn't fair she was stolen from them.

 

[BearAngel]

:goodpost: Caring!!!!! :rocker:

 

[Abigail]

My apologies for quoting myself here but I really thought I should elaborate on my reasonings. It's come to my attn that certain people feel as if we "bullies" are only referring to demeanor. Yes we are no "true detectives" -after all of that was our jobs wouldn't we be working & not online here-but with access to more damning info! Anyways, there are some "unseen" things that we've all discussed that make me believe GRs guilty.
*iphone discovery using the "find my phone" app-after using this myself & trying different things in different locations the sequence as told by GR & CC/LD couldn't have taken place.
*VPN as part of the alibi-while most people dont know much about VPNs & their differences, I'm not one in this case. The utilization of a VPN from IBM doesn't hold up as even part of an alibi. Those stay connected for days while you aren't even near the pc & can be used from a phone as you travel anywhere.
*affair with the best friend-call it what you want-tryst, one night, alcohol fueled, etc. The locals have said they knew it was on going for 6mths, some saying even a yr recently. I know people talk & even embellish. I played the telephone game as a child. But seriously-a one time thing only known of between 2 people w regrets? How does an entire town grow to find this out? Whether Jennifer knew isnt even the issue. Everyone else did.
*GR said it himself-the husband is usually a suspect. But this is even more so when the wife was thinking of leaving.
*The last person ON RECORD is statistically the most logical & usually the one responsible. Look it up. It's true.
*JR reputation demoralizing. What's the purpose? I'm sorry but even if she had run-wouldn't you, if you were worried about what you're children saw & thought-tread lightly on what you said while speaking of their mother? Not just before she was found but after? Would you allow someone else to speak out that maybe their mother ran off & was killed by that person? I'm thinking if your children were your concern-you'd keep the tv off-minus maybe movies or kids channels like Disney, not allow them on FB, surround them by home videos of mom, pictures, family members, etc. You can't control the News, the town rumors, the Internet, etc but you can control what they're exposed to in your home-why blame others for what their posting or publishing instead of keeping what comes out of your mouth & your affiliates under wraps & positive & making sure what your kids are exposed to is limited.
*How Jennifer was found. The manner she was left in to me was very personal. Who else was that close to her to leave her in this position for all to see as she was found? It's just too personal. A slap in the face even. Demoralizing-see the pattern? I do. Question is how far back does it go?

I could continue here but I think I've taken up enough space from other WSers. I thought that considering someone misunderstood me I'd make sure that-seen or unseen-I had my reasons other than "demeanor" that I was looking to for reasons of guilt. Maybe some people will reevaluate how closed off they've keep their thoughts, go back to the beginning & think about this case fresh-as if it wasn't tied to people they're tied to. My guess is that they may change their minds. Trust me I wish I didn't think the way I do-I'd like Jennifer's kids to have at least one parent growing up, it isn't fair she was stolen from them.

Thanks for sharing, and I'm glad you brought up the question, because it's interesting getting the perspective from locals -- like the poster who heard about it in the grocery store, and then was told (not sure if directly or indirectly) (by ES) that Jenn ran off with her boyfriend from Florida. That sort of gives one an idea of how most of the local community was considering the case (ran away, not dead), adn also makes one wonder why ES would fabricate a boyfriend from Florida.

And yes, today I spent a lot of time soul-searching -- trying to come up with some other plausible scenario -- I don't want to be so closed minded that I would only fixate on one person, but with logistics and everything else considered, I could not come up with another scenario. At least not a plausible one. Every piece of evidence point glaringly to one (or two) person(s).

 

[lovinglife]

It seems we're all going around in circles here & to no avail. So I'll pose a question(s) I guess if people want to answer, great, maybe we will stumble onto something we haven't fully discussed yet. Maybe others will pose their own as well for the rest of us.

1)How did you hear about Jennifer's case?
2)Have you decided who you think is guilty?
3)What was it initially that made you believe they were?

My answers:
1) Jennifer's poster came across my Facebook feed from the HFJR room. I went there and read what I could. At the time I only knew that she was missing-nothing else.
2) Sadly, I believe it was GR-when I first started reading more on the case was just before the video interview. When I saw the interview, how long it took before one was done & the content. It didn't feel right, I had the feeling from right then, that he was involved.

Anyone else?

A friend of JR's who is also one of my FB friends re-posted GR's very first plea he wrote on FB (I think it's deleted now).

I have not because I don't have all the details. However, if GR is not guilty, he sure is not the brightest bulb on the tree :christmastree: He's said some things that make me :waitasec:

After reading the very first post from GR, I had a hunch. Something didn't sit right with me, the way it was worded. The tone came across very controlling to me. Since that time, there have been many facts that have added to my suspicion-GR finding the phone, as an example.

As for this secret info that the "others" keep talking about...has anyone asked JR's parents about this specifically, to get their thoughts? IMHO, it has to be something found on her phone or computer that points to a friendship with someone else...like I mentioned a day or two ago, I think some of her online friends were boosting her up, encouraging her to make a change if that is what she wanted, like leave GR. I would not be surprised if she left on her own that day...however, I do think that she went back home at some point and then met with foul play. Again, just MHO.

 

[Kimster]

Closed for administrator review.

 

[SoSueMe]

***REQUIRED READING***​

It's unfortunate in this case that we have some contentious issues/matters happening on the side. They have nothing to do with the case really, but it's hindering our efforts to find justice for Jennifer.

We have allowed the link to Cynthia Caron's LostNMissing Facebook site for Jennifer. We've allowed this link because at one time, in the role of victim's advocate, she was representing the husband of Jennifer, Ganesh Ramsaran. Ms. Caron has also served as a sort of spokesperson for Mr. Ramsaran, making several statements to the media, which we have allowed to be discussed.

We realize not everyone is pleased with Ms. Caron's representation where this case is concerned; however, it is her right to do as she deems fit for her organization. We're asking everyone who is displeased with Ms. Caron and/or her organization and its' representatives to please not bring it to Websleuths. This type of discussion does nothing to further the case. As of this moment, we will continue to allow links to the Jennifer L. Ramsaran - Missing Person page if it has something to do with case facts. However, if the discussion derails into disparaging opinions about the site, its' founder or its' representatives we will censor the site and disallow any discussion of it from Websleuths. How Ms. Caron conducts herself during an investigation is of no concern here. We can only say that prior to this case Ms. Caron had a stellar reputation and helped many families. We are not here to ruin anyone's reputation or career, so we are asking that all of the disparaging remarks about this subject cease.

Further, Websleuths doesn't allow the discussion of psychics. We have nothing against psychics, we just feel that there are very few credible psychics out there who have truly helped in solving cases. If someone associated with the case has retained a psychic, as I believe has happened in this case, and it is newsworthy, we will allow limited discussion of what is or has been reported in main stream media (MSM). That's it.

On the subject of Ganesh Ramsaran, some of you are getting pretty fast and loose with your accusations. I want to remind and caution everyone that Mr. Ramsaran has not been named a person of interest (POI) by law enforcement. We have allowed the discussion of him because he was the last person to have seen Jennifer; he's made several comments in the media; posted on various social media sites; and has given several interviews. Please be mindful of what you post and post responsibly.

You may continue to paraphrase and link to Facebook comments, but only if it helps in sleuthing this case. Please, we don't want to see anymore links to innocent parties (namely those who are now associated with this case, who were not associated with it prior to Jennifer's death) or gossip. It must be case related and hopefully you know what I mean by that at this juncture. If not, please shoot me a PM and I'll be happy to explain. Recently there have been slight references to accomplices. Do not go there folks. I cannot stress this strongly enough. Do not go there with no basis.

We discuss cases on Websleuths. We research and assemble case facts. We're not a gossip board and we don't partake in social media wars. This is what we like to think sets us apart from the rest of the sites where anything goes.

This forum in now re-opened for posting and thank you in advance for adhering to the rules set forth above.

:dance:

 

[momrids6]

The sweater she is wearing could be construed to be blueish-purple.

I bet the "clothing description" came from this pic

 

[Ace85FL]

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...a.485683711478339.108909.485680108145366&type

Somebody on that page commented that they believe that the van was stashed someplace and then moved.

It's also stated that the tenants at Plank Road Manor said that the van wasn't parked there until one or two days tops.

I would imagine that if it was stashed, it would be somewhere accessible to a roadway, but someplace that is hidden away from the road, or not be seen from the road.

There's plenty of woodland up there, and as to whether there's a place in the woodlands that a van could be hidden, I don't know.

There is a shale quarry up there on Moon Hill, in the "V" of Moon Hill/Blackman Road and Reservoir Hill Road.

The coordinates for the quarry are as follows:

42.585306, -75.596618

This would be an ideal location to hide evidence inside of the shale mound, and let the rocks fall back over the evidence to cover it.

Weather conditions depending, if one were able to pull the van around behind the mounds of quarried shale, they would be invisible from Reservoir Hill Road. There is also a quarried ledge there, and Blackman Road runs above it, so a van parked there may be invisible from Blackman Road with the ledge being in the way.

There's also woods around the back and sides of the quarry, which would block it from view from either direction.

If the wind was coming from the North or Northwest, any noises made would have possibly carried off towards the South and Southeast of the houses up there, and would possibly be blocked from carrying even further than that because of the quarried ledge there.

I'm not sure if people live in those houses that are there or not.

It's rather secluded, and not one that one would think to look because it's near houses, but so was the place that Jennifer's body was located.

Also, it's muddy in that area, and easy to get your tires stuck in the ground of the quarry area, which could be an explanation for the mud on the van when it was discovered at Plank Road Manor.

 

[SouthAussie]

The sweater she is wearing could be construed to be blueish-purple.

I bet the "clothing description" came from this pic

Looking at Jen’s smiling face … she is why we are here, every day.


bring someone to justice
arrest someone for a crime and ensure that they are tried in court:everything will be done to bring those responsible to justice

http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/justice

 

[Sharoneonta]

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...a.485683711478339.108909.485680108145366&type

Somebody on that page commented that they believe that the van was stashed someplace and then moved.

It's also stated that the tenants at Plank Road Manor said that the van wasn't parked there until one or two days tops.

I would imagine that if it was stashed, it would be somewhere accessible to a roadway, but someplace that is hidden away from the road, or not be seen from the road.

There's plenty of woodland up there, and as to whether there's a place in the woodlands that a van could be hidden, I don't know.

There is a shale quarry up there on Moon Hill, in the "V" of Moon Hill/Blackman Road and Reservoir Hill Road.

The coordinates for the quarry are as follows:

42.585306, -75.596618

This would be an ideal location to hide evidence inside of the shale mound, and let the rocks fall back over the evidence to cover it.

Weather conditions depending, if one were able to pull the van around behind the mounds of quarried shale, they would be invisible from Reservoir Hill Road. There is also a quarried ledge there, and Blackman Road runs above it, so a van parked there may be invisible from Blackman Road with the ledge being in the way.

There's also woods around the back and sides of the quarry, which would block it from view from either direction.

If the wind was coming from the North or Northwest, any noises made would have possibly carried off towards the South and Southeast of the houses up there, and would possibly be blocked from carrying even further than that because of the quarried ledge there.

I'm not sure if people live in those houses that are there or not.

It's rather secluded, and not one that one would think to look because it's near houses, but so was the place that Jennifer's body was located.

Also, it's muddy in that area, and easy to get your tires stuck in the ground of the quarry area, which could be an explanation for the mud on the van when it was discovered at Plank Road Manor.

Hopefully mud samples were taken. I wish we had more information to go on, it's starting to feel like we're going in circles.

On a side note: Rickblaine, PLEASE COME BACK. :-(

 

[BearAngel]

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...a.485683711478339.108909.485680108145366&type

Somebody on that page commented that they believe that the van was stashed someplace and then moved.

It's also stated that the tenants at Plank Road Manor said that the van wasn't parked there until one or two days tops.

I would imagine that if it was stashed, it would be somewhere accessible to a roadway, but someplace that is hidden away from the road, or not be seen from the road.

There's plenty of woodland up there, and as to whether there's a place in the woodlands that a van could be hidden, I don't know.

There is a shale quarry up there on Moon Hill, in the "V" of Moon Hill/Blackman Road and Reservoir Hill Road.

The coordinates for the quarry are as follows:

42.585306, -75.596618

This would be an ideal location to hide evidence inside of the shale mound, and let the rocks fall back over the evidence to cover it.

Weather conditions depending, if one were able to pull the van around behind the mounds of quarried shale, they would be invisible from Reservoir Hill Road. There is also a quarried ledge there, and Blackman Road runs above it, so a van parked there may be invisible from Blackman Road with the ledge being in the way.

There's also woods around the back and sides of the quarry, which would block it from view from either direction.

If the wind was coming from the North or Northwest, any noises made would have possibly carried off towards the South and Southeast of the houses up there, and would possibly be blocked from carrying even further than that because of the quarried ledge there.

I'm not sure if people live in those houses that are there or not.

It's rather secluded, and not one that one would think to look because it's near houses, but so was the place that Jennifer's body was located.

Also, it's muddy in that area, and easy to get your tires stuck in the ground of the quarry area, which could be an explanation for the mud on the van when it was discovered at Plank Road Manor.

At the time of JRs disappearance...certainly possible...and some of that area was searched....Am hoping to get our equine team up there once there is less ice...horses have a keen sense of smell, and we even have one who will dig a hole for us with his hooves...it is only passable at the moment by foot, or atvs, snow mobiles...even 4wd is risky at this time for me...but I have your info already to go...thanks!:rocker:

 

[zwiebel]

Did Jennifer require specially made shoes due to her pins, does anyone know?

Does anyone have recent pics of her in her everyday footwear (people often stick to one comfortable pair), and know her shoe size?

 

[zwiebel]

I think it would be useful for a pic to go out with any info, along with her shoe size.

Locals, is the snow still too thick to spot any burn sites, maybe in muddy areas?

 

[zwiebel]

Do we have a list of local storage/lock up facilities in relevant areas?

 

[LolaAngelina]

I think it would be useful for a pic to go out with any info, along with her shoe size.

Locals, is the snow still too thick to spot any burn sites, maybe in muddy areas?

When you ask shoe size, are you meaning in case a shoe is found?

 

[zwiebel]

Yes, so people could be asked to look for one - even a partially burnt one. Without a size though, LE could get inundated.

 

[zwiebel]

I think there might be something along/just off the routes we think Jennifer might have taken/been taken. It would be even more helpful to have a list of all her clothes sizes too. I wonder if a female family member could help out? They can be better at that sort of thing than men, imo.

 

[Abigail]

Moderators, please accept my apologies for misbehaving! Thanks for reminding us that we need to stick with the facts that we know, and concentrate attention on how Jenn met her untimely death, without getting distracted by the side show uke:


:gomods:

 

[MissieMt]

I think it would be useful for a pic to go out with any info, along with her shoe size.

Locals, is the snow still too thick to spot any burn sites, maybe in muddy areas?

Yes, so people could be asked to look for one - even a partially burnt one. Without a size though, LE could get inundated.

I'm confused.....was there information given about a fire?