Found Deceased NY - Jennifer Ramsaran, 36, Chenango County, 11 Dec 2012 - # 9

[LivingJuicy]

Perhaps, moo, the phone was home until someone put it where it was found. Like they "put" her where she was found?

Agreed.

I believe that the phone was home all day on the 11th. I think that it's possible that the phone was thrown about on the evening of the 11th and then moved on the 12th to it's final resting place.

There was a lot of "staging" IMO to make it appear that this was a crime by someone else.

Also, just a reminder about Jennifer leaving her husband or meeting someone online and leaving her family -

“Jen would NEVER EVER leave our kids and I willingly,” the posting continued. “She has never left home and not keep in contact within 2-3 hours via phone or text. She would never miss our daughters’ Winter Concert last night or her birthday tomorrow. I hate to say this but I have given up hope that she’ll be found safe and sound. The kids and I miss her so much, her laugh, her quirkiness, just everything. Today I went to Walmart and I grabbed my cell to call home and ask her a question about which item I should purchase and reality smacked me in the face and I started crying uncontrollably! That was rough! I am strong and I know the kids and I will get through this.”

Elaborating on the ordeal, Ganesh Ramsaran went on: “All I want is for Jen to come walking through our front door safe and sound and giving us all hugs, but I have lost all faith that will be the case. The helplessness and the not knowing is an additional nightmare which I can’t escape from right now. The lack of sleep, the loss of appetite, the stress of not knowing, the worrying where and how she is doing is a burden that I never thought I would have to carry but life comes with some curve balls.”

http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x1423436202/Officials-seek-leads-on-missing-area-woman/print

Ugh, makes me sick.

 

[dansmom]

I only threw it out there as I am trying to find another possibility that would not include GR - I am having a difficult time with any and all of the "scenarios" quite honestly unless whatever happened was done by a complete stranger!

I agree, the thought of someone so close and trusted being responsible is an awful thought. I too would want it to be random rather then have the three children lose both parents ( one to death, one to jail).

What I can't agree with right now is that it is actually another person not mentioned here. There is no information pointing to that. One of the big things, and quite objective, is there has been no warning to the general public of a killer among us, randomly murdering women. That, regardless of what anyone thinks they may know, speaks volumes.

 

[epiphany]

I have been racking my brain to think of who else it could be, and keep remembering that sometimes "truth is stranger than fiction". Often, the easiest answer isn't the right one.

But then again ......... :banghead: :facepalm:

IMO, if there was an intimate encounter engaged in that morning by Jennifer (IMO, a very strong possibility), it would have been one with her own long-term spouse after the children were dropped off at school!

Nothing we know of indicates that Jennifer was considering, nor had ever been involved in a sexual relationship with anyone outside her marriage...least of all, with an individual from LE.

 

[Magiefeu]

No - I believe she knew the person. I meant it as a "stranger" to those close to her (as in no one but she knew them) Again - just trying to go with other possibilites even if far out of reach - is plausible

 

[dansmom]

Agreed.

I believe that the phone was home all day on the 11th. I think that it's possible that the phone was thrown about on the evening of the 11th and then moved on the 12th to it's final resting place.

There was a lot of "staging" IMO to make it appear that this was a crime by someone else.

Also, just a reminder about Jennifer leaving her husband or meeting someone online and leaving her family -

“Jen would NEVER EVER leave our kids and I willingly,” the posting continued. “She has never left home and not keep in contact within 2-3 hours via phone or text. She would never miss our daughters’ Winter Concert last night or her birthday tomorrow. I hate to say this but I have given up hope that she’ll be found safe and sound. The kids and I miss her so much, her laugh, her quirkiness, just everything. Today I went to Walmart and I grabbed my cell to call home and ask her a question about which item I should purchase and reality smacked me in the face and I started crying uncontrollably! That was rough! I am strong and I know the kids and I will get through this.”

Elaborating on the ordeal, Ganesh Ramsaran went on: “All I want is for Jen to come walking through our front door safe and sound and giving us all hugs, but I have lost all faith that will be the case. The helplessness and the not knowing is an additional nightmare which I can’t escape from right now. The lack of sleep, the loss of appetite, the stress of not knowing, the worrying where and how she is doing is a burden that I never thought I would have to carry but life comes with some curve balls.”

http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x1423436202/Officials-seek-leads-on-missing-area-woman/print

Ugh, makes me sick.

This last quote from GR in msm has always bothered me: It's like a text book list of what a person experiences with stress of a missing loved one, it's even alphabetical: Lack of sleep, loss of appetite, stress of not knowing,worrying.....

moo

 

[dansmom]

No - I believe she knew the person. I meant it as a "stranger" to those close to her (as in no one but she knew them) Again - just trying to go with other possibilites even if far out of reach - is plausible

I bet if she was getting involved with someone new, she would tell her best friend. I wonder if that happened?

 

[epiphany]

No - I believe she knew the person. I meant it as a "stranger" to those close to her (as in no one but she knew them) Again - just trying to go with other possibilites even if far out of reach - is plausible

Welcome, Magie!

Yes, I'm glad you brought up the possibility of Jennifer engaging in an intimate encounter that morning with a person she knew (In your thoughts, a stranger only to others)...It triggered for me the thought that the most likely person involved in such an encounter with her that morning would be the man she had known for 17+ years. Her husband!

 

[epiphany]

This last quote from GR in msm has always bothered me: It's like a text book list of what a person experiences with stress of a missing loved one, it's even alphabetical: Lack of sleep, loss of appetite, stress of not knowing,worrying.....

moo

And a very well-written post, that particular FB post/s. Well composed.

 

[Ace85FL]

This last quote from GR in msm has always bothered me: It's like a text book list of what a person experiences with stress of a missing loved one, it's even alphabetical: Lack of sleep, loss of appetite, stress of not knowing,worrying.....

moo

BBM

I knew I noticed something strange about that statement.

 

[MissieMt]

Welcome Magiefeu! It's always nice to have a different perspective to stir things up and get our brains working. I have to wonder though, if she were meeting with someone she knew and there was time for an intimate encounter and possible drug use (whether willing or not), wouldn't there be phone pings to indicate that she was in that place for that time? If that were the case, wouldn't LE be asking people to please come forward if they recall seeing anything suspicious in that area at that time?
I like that you're offering different scenarios, and I can tell that you put a lot of thought into the one you posted. I just can't picture a devoted Mom, sunday school teacher, and caregiver in an intimate relationship outside of her marriage. I've seen the "type" before. Heck, some of my old high school friends are the type. They usually are also seeking attention in other ways. Like tons of pictures of themselves on FB (generally not with their husband and kids), usually wearing a certain type of clothing. Not necessarily revealing, but definitely not in the "Mom clothes" Jennifer was pictured in. They're usually vocal about being unhappy in their marriage, as a way to say "hey I'm married but....". There are other signs, but I don't see any signs in Jennifer so I'm not going to waste everyone's time listing all of them. And she lived in a small town. If she were seeing someone local the rumor mill probably would have indicated that by now, just like it did with GR. So although I think your theory may be very plausible in some cases, I can't make it "stick" here.

 

[Magiefeu]

I agree unlikely she was involved with someone else to that degree - but it could be possible is all I am suggesting

 

[dansmom]

We are careful not to use information not found in msm or sources such as verified insiders. We also only quote fb if there is a way to link to it. So, you can see why there are questions. If you have facts, please share. If you don't maybe it's better to no allude to them.
I know , I have had postings pulled. This case makes everyone get emotional but the real focus is to find out what really happened.

 

[voominvava]

IMO, if there was an intimate encounter engaged in that morning by Jennifer (IMO, a very strong possibility), it would have been one with her own long-term spouse after the children were dropped off at school!

Nothing we know of indicates that Jennifer was considering, nor had ever been involved in a sexual relationship with anyone outside her marriage...least of all, with an individual from LE.

Not sure why you quoted me, but I didn't bring up that theory .. :facepalm: I don't personally believe she was unfaithful, either.

 

[Magiefeu]

It is not - I want whoever did this or whatever happened to Jen solved - trust me - I am doing my best to bring another side based on what facts are available. <modsnip> Many things do not make sense or fit together for what we know or think we know. But lets be honest - everyone only lets what they want to be known to others - we all have private things no one knows or some may have limited knowledge of things others do not. Only ourself and God truly knows our hearts - which is why I am trying to look at all angles. Right now, I dont think that we know enough to know FOR SURE on who or what happened to her - just seems most on here are convinced GR did it and I am trying to consider other possibilites since they seem far and few between. Yes - he very well could have but also may not - each day I go back and forth and as I said if he was involved or if Jen did leave and something happened - either one devestates me - so I keep praying that it was someone else or something else! Just trying to bring that out.

I am sorry if my thoughts offended anyone - I honestly just want to know what happened to her.

 

[lovinglife]

It is not - I want whoever did this or whatever happened to Jen solved - trust me - I am doing my best to bring another side based on what facts are available. <modsnip> Many things do not make sense or fit together for what we know or think we know. But lets be honest - everyone only lets what they want to be known to others - we all have private things no one knows or some may have limited knowledge of things others do not. Only ourself and God truly knows our hearts - which is why I am trying to look at all angles. Right now, I dont think that we know enough to know FOR SURE on who or what happened to her - just seems most on here are convinced GR did it and I am trying to consider other possibilites since they seem far and few between. Yes - he very well could have but also may not - each day I go back and forth and as I said if he was involved or if Jen did leave and something happened - either one devestates me - so I keep praying that it was someone else or something else! Just trying to bring that out.

I am sorry if my thoughts offended anyone - I honestly just want to know what happened to her.

I don't feel your thoughts are offensive. After all, they are your opinion, which you are entitled to. I do think this process is easier for those of us that don't know the family. At least it's easier keeping emotions out of the way when looking at facts, timelines, etc. You knowing both JR and GR makes this very personal for you - especially since you appear to be fond of both of them and wanting to believe that neither are capable of doing something as horrible as murder or even as deceitful as cheating on a spouse. I understand you coming here looking/hoping for a scenario that doesn't devastate you in some way. I pray that you find what you are looking for but also that you prepare yourself for possible worst case scenarios.

 

[lovinglife]

bumping...

OK, here is our revised timeline ....


Dec 11 8am-3:30pm Jen went missing &#8211; husband GR claims she went shopping in Syracuse at 10:30am

Dec 11 5:30pm Husband GR calls father-in-law in Az &#8216;should I report Jen missing&#8217;

Dec 11 8pm Jen reported missing by husband GR

Dec 12 Husband GR found Jen&#8217;s cell phone along HW 23/Moon Hill Rd in Plymouth

Dec 16 Jen's vehicle found in town of Norwich at Plank Manor Apts by Jen&#8217;s father

Dec 18 Police carry out search warrants at GR/JRs 18 acre grounds, home, cars, computers and phone records

Dec 18 Rumour started that Jen had begun discussing possibility of separating from GR and had new online gaming friends, according to anonymous &#8216;family friend&#8217;

Dec 19 Investigators interviewed JRs children and other family members

Dec 19 Search continues at GR/JRs property

Dec 19 GR states on FB &#8220;Jen would NEVER EVER leave our kids and I willingly ... I hate to say this but I have given up hope that she&#8217;ll be found safe and sound&#8221;

Jan 1 GR public association with LnM/Cynthia Caron commences (MissingJenniferRamsaran FB page)

Jan 4 Authorities have examined cell phone and computer that Jen had been using, and are awaiting laboratory results

Jan 22 Chenango County Sheriff&#8217;s Office urges people not to privately search for Jen

Jan 22 Police awaiting telephone records to come back

Jan 22 Case registered with LostNMissing Inc

Jan 29 GR gives interview to WBNG-TV &#8230; &#8220;not giving up hope&#8221;

Feb 16 Shining Hope event

Feb 22 Blood found in Jen's van as reported by Mr. Mahoney of the Daily Star

Feb 26 Jen&#8217;s unclothed body found off side of Center Rd in Pharsalia by private citizen

Feb 28 Body confirmed as Jen

Feb 28 &#8220;Screw justice. I want vengeance,&#8221; said husband Ganesh Remy Ramsaran

Feb 28 Caron claimed Ramsaran&#8217;s sexual involvement with his female running companion was a one-time fling

Mar 2 GR gives last interview

from media maps & timelines

:werk:
OK, fellow sleuthers, I thought I'd make a list of the actual facts that we have at hand that relate to Jennifer's death. Please help me out by listing any I've ommitted.

1) Jenn is dead

2) Jenn's body was found nude, down a small embankment, about 10 feet off of Center Road.
http://www.wbng.com/news/video/Body-of-missing-person-Jennifer-Ramsaran-identified-193930381.html

3) The medical examiner said there were "no visible signs of trauma" and there were no personal belonging found near the body (same link as above)

4) Jenn's body was sent to Onondaga County Medical Examiners Office in Syracuse. COD has not yet been released.

5) Jenn was last known to be alive on the morning of December 11.
a) Apparently based on interviews with the children, Sherriff Cutting said, "&#8220;There was no problem (at the house) when they went to school"
http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x983997640/Investigators-interview-missing-womans-children
b) Jenn was apparently online with her gaming friends that morning, according to POB, who reports passed this info on to LE. Sherriff Cutting said that State Police Computer Experts were expected to reach out to Jenn's online contacts. (see link directly above)
c) The last person to see Jenn alive was her husband, Ganesh, who reports that she left the home about 10:30 a.m. to go to the Destiny USA mall in Syracuse for shopping.


6) Jenn's van was found at the Plank Road Manor apartments in Norwich by her father on December 16, 5 days after she was last seen alive, and 5 days after she was reported missing by her husband Ganesh Ramsaran.
a) Jenn's father said the van had an unusual amount of mud on it (I need a link for this)
b) Bloodstains were found inside the van, according to Cynthia Carron of LostNMissing, Inc., who said she learned that information from Jenn's husband, Ganesh Ramsaran
http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x1503756987/Report-Blood-found-in-missing-womans-van

7) Cynthia Caron reported that Jenn's husband, Ganesh, admitted to police he was involved in adultery with a married woman with children who was also a friend of Jennifer. Ganesh admitted to the Daily Star that his affair with his running partner, who was also a close friend of Jennifer, caused an estrangement between him and Jenn's mother and sister. "Last April, Ganesh Ramsaran, a marathon enthusiast, posted a note on a Facebook running club page in which he described the woman he now admits having a tryst with as his &#8220;Protege/Prodigy in running & working out.&#8221;"
http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x1503756987/Report-Blood-found-in-missing-womans-van
http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x1837420511/Missing-womans-sister-We-miss-you

8) Ganesh acknowledged that he and his wife experienced "marital difficulties"
http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x1503756987/Report-Blood-found-in-missing-womans-van

9) Ganesh reported that a life insurance policy was taken out for himself and his wife with his employer IBM
http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x1503756987/Report-Blood-found-in-missing-womans-van

10) According to Cynthia Caron, Ganesh provided an alibi to the police that he headed to a workout at the local YMCA at the time he believed his wife was driving to Syracuse. (A google map search reveals that the YMCA in Norwich is 1 mile from the Plank Road Manor apartments where Jenn's van was found). Ganesh arrived at the YMCA without a vehicle, as Cynthia Caron confirmed that he received a ride home from his female running partner.
http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x1503756987/Report-Blood-found-in-missing-womans-van
http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x1837420511/Missing-womans-sister-We-miss-you

11) Jennifers phone was located the day after she went missing by her husband Ganesh along route 23.

Sorry for the extremely long post but I thought it would be helpful to bump up what we do know :bump:

 

[imamaze]

It is not - I want whoever did this or whatever happened to Jen solved - trust me - I am doing my best to bring another side based on what facts are available. <modsnip> Many things do not make sense or fit together for what we know or think we know. But lets be honest - everyone only lets what they want to be known to others - we all have private things no one knows or some may have limited knowledge of things others do not. Only ourself and God truly knows our hearts - which is why I am trying to look at all angles. Right now, I dont think that we know enough to know FOR SURE on who or what happened to her - just seems most on here are convinced GR did it and I am trying to consider other possibilites since they seem far and few between. Yes - he very well could have but also may not - each day I go back and forth and as I said if he was involved or if Jen did leave and something happened - either one devestates me - so I keep praying that it was someone else or something else! Just trying to bring that out.

I am sorry if my thoughts offended anyone - I honestly just want to know what happened to her.

Mafiefeu, Welcome to Websleuths. Your doing just fine with your thoughts and opinion on this case, as long as we are all speculating with what we know at this time its fine. We do know that GR has alluded to Jennifer possibly meeting someone from online. So your speculation and questions are perfectly fine.

I hope you continue to give your thoughts on this case, and they are not in any way offensive.

:welcome5:

 

[epiphany]

The manner in which her body was found indicates that she either engaged in a consensual intimate encounter with someone she knew (not a stranger) that went awry, or she stumbled upon a sexual predator in broad daylight on her way to Destiny Mall.

 

[Sharoneonta]

The manner in which her body was found indicates that she either engaged in a consensual intimate encounter with someone she knew (not a stranger) that went awry, or she stumbled upon a sexual predator in broad daylight on her way to Destiny Mall.

I assume you mean unclothed?

 

[lovinglife]

The manner in which her body was found indicates that she either engaged in a consensual intimate encounter with someone she knew (not a stranger) that went awry, or she stumbled upon a sexual predator in broad daylight on her way to Destiny Mall.

I think the sexual predator can be ruled out for reasons previously stated....I don't think the manner in which she was found necessarily means she had an intimate encounter at all, consensual or not....the perp could have stripped her down to make it appear she encountered a sexual predator; or to remove evidence such as carpet fibers, etc; or to remove JR's dignity; I'm sure there are other reasons we could come up with.....IMHO