OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #52

[RAISINISBACK]

Right. Let's stick to the facts. You are right nobody can believe a word out of this guy, whether in court papers or talking to MSM.

Unless a family member like LM says it, we really don't know if S is his or if he's even on her Birth Certificate. I assume she's his but then why not simply do a DNA test? Why all the nonsense about photos and saying she looks like him and trying to do custody documents?

If your going to kill everyone then why not pretend your happy with custody the way it is? Why get fake custody documents? This just gets more convoluted with time.

The trials will tell us most of this I think. Getting a headache need some motrin..

It is no secret on here that I think Jake was the driving force behind these murders. He was the one who had the most to gain. It was Jake's show all the way. His GF, his child, his GF's family. I think Jake is a master manipulator who badgered his mother every day by saying that they were going to lose SW if Hanna decided not to let him see SW, by bringing in the crime Hanna's grandfather was charged with, by pounding it into everyone's head that if Hanna so decided no one would ever see the child again. Angie may have planned the murders, but Jake was the driving force behind the decision to carry them out. And he did it simply because Hanna had the strength to leave him and stay away from him. Keep in mind the first year after a woman leaves is the most dangerous for her and the murders occurred less than a year after she booted him to the curb.

JMO

 

[Myland]

Jmo my big question is why does Gerlach want the recording still?

 

[Dudly]

Betty, I don't believe Rita actually "pled" yesterday, did she? My understanding is that is what she has agreed to do. Anyone? JMO

Did you look at the plea RD signed that I posted? She plead guilty.

 

[Betty P]

Jmo but the prosecutor didn’t have a big win in Rita case at this point. What Rita admitted to opened up an out for Angela not a slam dunk. She didn’t say when those papers were forged. Jmo

It will not be difficult for the prosecution to convict AW on the forgery charges (Count 18), with RN's testimony along with that of the state's forgery experts. That will also help with Count 16 - Tampering w/ Evidence (custody documents), also possibly Count 21 - Obstructing Justice.

It will also reveal to jurors that AW is a chronic liar who deceives her own mother, tried to involve her in the cover up of a murder, etc. She'll have zero credibility with the jury.

 

[Ann99]

Jmo my big question is why does Gerlach want the recording still?

This is a good question.
My opinion. It indicates there are many things that we don’t know.
I would think Gerlach would let sleeping dogs lie. Things look pretty good for his client right now.
Or, maybe he is working for someone else too.

 

[Betty P]

This is a good question.
My opinion. It indicates there are many things that we don’t know.
I would think Gerlach would let sleeping dogs lie. Things look pretty good for his client right now.
Or, is he working for someone else too?

I'm out of the loop, exactly which recording was he asking for? The recording of AW and RN's forbidden phone conversations? If so, it's probably because the other attorneys and FW want to hear what was said.

 

[Myland]

It will not be difficult for the prosecution to convict AW on the forgery charges (Count 18), with RN's testimony along with that of the state's forgery experts. That will also help with Count 16 - Tampering w/ Evidence (custody documents), also possibly Count 21 - Obstructing Justice.

It will also reveal to jurors that AW is a chronic liar who deceives her own mother, tried to involve her in the cover up of a murder, etc. She'll have zero credibility with the jury.

Jmo but Angela could tell some big one to cover for this. Was those documents actually ever used or were they only found in a tote?jmo Rita can still get on a stand and lie she just can’t lie and say she signed them and must say Angela told her other than that she can still lie if needed. Jmo Rita made a point to make sure max was 90 days jmo

 

[Betty P]

Jmo but Angela could tell some big one to cover for this. Was those documents actually ever used or were they only found in a tote?jmo Rita can still get on a stand and lie she just can’t lie and say she signed them and must say Angela told her other than that she can still lie if needed. Jmo Rita made a point to make sure max was 90 days jmo

The documents are part of the custody battle, the intimidation of HMR before the murders and a major part of the motivation for the crime. The forgeries are an important part of the timeline leading up to the murders.

The prosecution will still have to present their evidence linking the 4W's to the Rhoden/Gilley murders, but the custody fight, forgeries, the cyber-stalking and monitoring of HMR, etc. are all part of the series of events and motive leading to the murders.

ETA: Remember, there's a family member who has told the news media they knew of the big fight when Wagners came to HMR's house 2 weeks before the murders to try to get her to sign custody documents. We know from previous news video (that has since been scrubbed) which family member told the news media about the W's confrontation over custody. That family hasn't given a lot of details about that confrontation to the news media, but it's possible there was some kind of violence involved between the W's and the R's.

 

[Ann99]

I'm out of the loop, exactly which recording was he asking for? The recording of AW and RN's forbidden phone conversations? If so, it's probably because the other attorneys and FW want to hear what was said.

I could be wrong.
I thought at the end of the hearing Gerlach asked for the audio of the Grand Jury testimony.
I assumed Myland was talking about that.
If Gerlach asked for something other than Grand Jury audio, I‘m off base.

 

[Myland]

The documents are part of the custody battle, the intimidation of HMR before the murders and a major part of the motivation for the crime. The forgeries are an important part of the timeline leading up to the murders.

Jmo I’ve haven’t seen where it was proven that “those documents” were used for that yet. Jmo

 

[Loomis124]

Jmo but why would she tell all she knows? 90 days is not enough to send your dgt to the electric chair Jmo I was saying Angela can swear up and down now to more lies, if she is lying. Rita only said Angela asked her to lie due to the investigation. Think about how many lies Angela could try to explain why she had those papers and why she asked her mother to lie Jmo

Agree. I think AW definitely benefited yesterday. JMO

 

[Myland]

I could be wrong.
I thought at the end of the hearing Gerlach asked for the audio of the Grand Jury testimony.
I assumed Myland was talking about that.
If Gerlach asked for something other than Grand Jury audio, I‘m off base.

That is what I was referring to. Why would he possibly need that? The only reason I can think is to somehow help the other four. Jmo

 

[Ann99]

That is what I was referring to. Why would he possibly need that? The only reason I can think is to somehow help the other four. Jmo

Yes, the other 4 plus the other 1. FW. She is not completely off the hook.

 

[Loomis124]

Did you look at the plea RD signed that I posted? She plead guilty.

I remember seeing a document with a lot of "IF"s on it. Was that it? Why didn't she plead verbally and openly in court, for the record? Just asking.

 

[ColMustard]

Gerlach said the audio from the Grand Jury has no bearing on the plea agreement, but is still asking for it.

So how many clients does he have in this case?

RN made a plea deal, the other charges are dropped. Why does he need the GJ audio? A question JD or AC should ask.

Am I correct in remembering that Judge Deering came out of retirement for this case?

 

[RAISINISBACK]

It will not be difficult for the prosecution to convict AW on the forgery charges (Count 18), with RN's testimony along with that of the state's forgery experts. That will also help with Count 16 - Tampering w/ Evidence (custody documents), also possibly Count 21 - Obstructing Justice.

It will also reveal to jurors that AW is a chronic liar who deceives her own mother, tried to involve her in the cover up of a murder, etc. She'll have zero credibility with the jury.

It also tells us that Jake had Angie scared enough that she would never see SW again if Hanna decided she would stop visitation that Angie resorted to stealing her mother's stamp and forging custody documents. Those forged custody documents are the biggest clue to the motive in this crime.

Think about it in the context of your own life. You have a son. He has a GF. The GF has a child. They break up and the GF takes the child but allows your son to have every other week visitation. So if this is your situation would you instantly steal a notary stamp and forge custody documents? Plan to kill the mother and her whole family?

Keep in mind people these murders occurred 8 months after the breakup. So why go straight to forging custody papers? Why not demand a DNA test to establish paternity? Why not go to court to set a legal visitation schedule? Why go to forging papers and killing 8 people?

There has to be a reason Jake and his family did not believe they could win in court against Hanna. And don't give me that old line about him being afraid of being charged with statuary rape. The girl was 16, that's the age of consent. He would have got a slap on the wrist if they even charged him which is doubtful. Plenty of girls get pregnant at 16 all over the USA. Younger even. Nobody goes to jail for it. The court just makes the father pay child support.

JMO

 

[Myland]

The documents are part of the custody battle, the intimidation of HMR before the murders and a major part of the motivation for the crime. The forgeries are an important part of the timeline leading up to the murders.

The prosecution will still have to present their evidence linking the 4W's to the Rhoden/Gilley murders, but the custody fight, forgeries, the cyber-stalking and monitoring of HMR, etc. are all part of the series of events and motive leading to the murders.

ETA: Remember, there's a family member who has told the news media they knew of the big fight when Wagners came to HMR's house 2 weeks before the murders to try to get her to sign custody documents. We know from previous news video (that has since been scrubbed) which family member told the news media about the W's confrontation over custody. That family hasn't given a lot of details about that confrontation to the news media, but it's possible there was some kind of violence involved between the W's and the R's.

Jmo I have heard about that on here, but never saw that article. I would like to see the article and know who witnessed this fight to be able to decide if I would feel they are credible. Jmo Kendra was extremely close to Jake and in her interviews didn’t reveal any custody fights and I find that very odd. Jmo

 

[Loomis124]

It will not be difficult for the prosecution to convict AW on the forgery charges (Count 18), with RN's testimony along with that of the state's forgery experts. That will also help with Count 16 - Tampering w/ Evidence (custody documents), also possibly Count 21 - Obstructing Justice.

It will also reveal to jurors that AW is a chronic liar who deceives her own mother, tried to involve her in the cover up of a murder, etc. She'll have zero credibility with the jury.

What about the other 3 Ws forgery charges? Where do they fit in all of this?

 

[Loomis124]

It will not be difficult for the prosecution to convict AW on the forgery charges (Count 18), with RN's testimony along with that of the state's forgery experts. That will also help with Count 16 - Tampering w/ Evidence (custody documents), also possibly Count 21 - Obstructing Justice.

It will also reveal to jurors that AW is a chronic liar who deceives her own mother, tried to involve her in the cover up of a murder, etc. She'll have zero credibility with the jury.

I sure hope you're right.

 

[Ann99]

Jmo but Angela could tell some big one to cover for this. Was those documents actually ever used or were they only found in a tote?jmo Rita can still get on a stand and lie she just can’t lie and say she signed them and must say Angela told her other than that she can still lie if needed. Jmo Rita made a point to make sure max was 90 days jmo

This is a stretch, as we don’t have any facts.. but in my opinion -
Documents found in a tote, signed Docs or others that are hand written, can be used to further identify a forged signature. I believe investigators can even identify ink. Same ink on hand written documents as forged signature? That kind of thing. Not to mention finger prints. And also paper stock. Paper can be identified and traced back to a purchase. What if “someone” used the same paper in all of these documents in the tub, and even used the same paper in the printer. There could be a mountain of traceable evidence in the tub of Important Documents,
This is why I say Prosecution had a big win with RN plea deal. No need to reveal what was in the tub of “Important documents”.
AC wants to save that evidence for one or all 4 trials.

edit to add paper