OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #53

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Cool Cats

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Not if you wanted to frame James Manley for murder, just take the slingshot Drive By in a truck at Night Time and shoot evidence around LM property with Slingshot, ( like bullet casings to the murder weapon) so easy a genius Wagner would do, JMO
I never would have thought of that!
 

Cool Cats

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Didn’t Pastor Kelly Cinereski son perform George the 4th wedding ceremony? In 2012
Fletcher posted that he did.
The wedding and reception were in Fred's church with all the Rhodens there.

Fred said she didn't know the Rhodens yet they are all at the same Wedding and she said Billy and Chris were best friends and everyone loved Hanna, and that she knew what was going on with Jake and Hanna.

Yet she gets her charges dropped and that same day, suddenly she says she doesn't know any of the Rhoden family. She distanced herself from them.

Fred:
"Perhaps A Cartel? I don't know who killed those people,
I didn't know them."
 
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but it still remains the mystery to drive 8 miles down the road and kill KR, JMO

I come up with three possible scenarios for KR's death. His death has always been an anomaly to me. It doesn't fit the pattern of each of the other victims.

The first scenario is he knew about the issues between the two families regarding the child custody.

The second scenario would be he was killed to make the entire crime spree seem like a biker gang or cartel was getting payback over a deal gone bad. There were rumors money was scattered all over his body but i don't think its ever been substantiated?

And finally i believe he was killed out of necessity because he would have known it was the W's from the beginning.
 

Merrygirl

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We'll find out more later, but, other than CRSr., DR and possibly HG, I don't think the W's were sending a message with overkill of the other Rhodens. Most common opinion re KR was that he was killed because he would know who the killers were and would go after them. There's also been plausible speculation about killing KR first because he often got up very early to shower at CRSr.s before driving to Columbus to work.

Johnny B, your ideas about uses of the high tech sling shot are interesting. I think some of us have also wondered if such a tool was used to shoot out outdoor lights or surveillance cameras. Doing that at night would be difficult, though. They probably knew where the cameras were located, but couldn't risk disabling to removing them before the murders.

If they removed them, how did they do that in the middle of the night? If some were positioned in trees or along roof eaves of buildings, how did the W's reach them? CR Sr. and KR both had security cams on their properties.

‘Betty, I agree with you. It’s always been my thoughts that maybe there were others out removing cameras while shootings were happening. Perhaps it was accomplices that haven’t been known/arrested. I would think some of the cameras could be quickly removed from the homes with large snips and leave the mountings. All you need is the recording device (which could be as simple as a tape or disk). Some cameras are just cameras/sending devices to capture the image but transfer it to 1 recording device via wires or wirelessly and the recording device (like vcr—like perhaps the one found in the well) is stored in the home. Any monitors in the home would be for viewing from the recording device so snipping wires would do. The tricky part would be to know how each camera was hooked up and it’s possible JW may have helped with the initial install of at least some of them. My other theory is perhaps they disengaged a few ahead of time and either they went unnoticed or figured they had malfunctioned and maybe didn’t have time to replace them yet. The longer you have surveillance cameras you tend to not watch as they record for you to see later. These are JMOO. I’m interested in other theories by other sleuths.
 

Cool Cats

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I come up with three possible scenarios for KR's death. His death has always been an anomaly to me. It doesn't fit the pattern of each of the other victims.

The first scenario is he knew about the issues between the two families regarding the child custody.

The second scenario would be he was killed to make the entire crime spree seem like a biker gang or cartel was getting payback over a deal gone bad. There were rumors money was scattered all over his body but i don't think its ever been substantiated?

And finally i believe he was killed out of necessity because he would have known it was the W's from the beginning.
For all of those reasons. Alot was done at the crime scenes to mislead and throw off investigators and to cover their tracks, it has been said through various interviews.

So when Donald Stone said dollar bills were thrown on Kenny's legs from his knees down, I find it believable. No it has never been confirmed by LE, we are left to draw our own conclusions.
Also I find it believable that this happened because it fits in with the killers trying to throw law enforcement off their tracks and tampering with evidence. The money is a drug gangs' calling card. It is to send the message that the victim was greedy, he stole from them or owed them money.

Yes Kenny would have likely known about custody and I believe the Wagners were afraid of him. He would have went after them and confronted them and led LE to them.
He was too close to Chris and Gary to be left alive to tell the family secrets. Kenny would never let the investigation grow cold. He would hunt them the rest of his life, literally.
...2 Cents...
 
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Cool Cats

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‘Betty, I agree with you. It’s always been my thoughts that maybe there were others out removing cameras while shootings were happening. Perhaps it was accomplices that haven’t been known/arrested. I would think some of the cameras could be quickly removed from the homes with large snips and leave the mountings. All you need is the recording device (which could be as simple as a tape or disk). Some cameras are just cameras/sending devices to capture the image but transfer it to 1 recording device via wires or wirelessly and the recording device (like vcr—like perhaps the one found in the well) is stored in the home. Any monitors in the home would be for viewing from the recording device so snipping wires would do. The tricky part would be to know how each camera was hooked up and it’s possible JW may have helped with the initial install of at least some of them. My other theory is perhaps they disengaged a few ahead of time and either they went unnoticed or figured they had malfunctioned and maybe didn’t have time to replace them yet. The longer you have surveillance cameras you tend to not watch as they record for you to see later. These are JMOO. I’m interested in other theories by other sleuths.
Video evidence could go into an i cloud that the Wagners could not get rid of, so they would have to dismantle the cameras before going into the homes. Opinion.
 

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‘I’m not convinced it was RN who gave LE info for the last raid on FWF. The raid happened 11/4-11/7 or 8. If you look at her court entries FG subpoenaed all those witnesses and everyone was hell-bent on going to trial on 12/2. All the scuttle about the surprise hand he laid with witnesses he was bringing in and last minute paperwork came in 11/28 and the plea deal was hammered out on 12/2. I have a feeling someone else tipped them, perhaps someone other than the W4/RN. Not sure who did it but The timeline doesn’t fit for RN. Things were too hot & heavy at the end of the month if RN had already caved. This is JMOO unless someone convinces me otherwise.

Court records do not have journal entries with the behind the scenes conversations that the defense attorney would have with the prosecutor. Both sides would have to continue to prepare to go to trial up until a deal was reached. MOO
 

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Court records do not have journal entries with the behind the scenes conversations that the defense attorney would have with the prosecutor. Both sides would have to continue to prepare to go to trial up until a deal was reached. MOO

That’s true but I got the impression there was so much pressure at the end of the month and I think it would not have been so intense if RN had already spilled the beans a month earlier. Also, ICBW but as big as the FWF appears to be, I don’t envision RN as having a lot of knowledge about the farm other than where it is and how to get to the house & barns. Of course we haven’t been privvy to what BCI was looking for so maybe she knew more than I give her credit for. I would be willing to guess it's been years if she has been back in that area. I say that cuz she has no transportation and has been caring for her mother for several yrs.
 

RAISINISBACK

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I come up with three possible scenarios for KR's death. His death has always been an anomaly to me. It doesn't fit the pattern of each of the other victims.

The first scenario is he knew about the issues between the two families regarding the child custody.

The second scenario would be he was killed to make the entire crime spree seem like a biker gang or cartel was getting payback over a deal gone bad. There were rumors money was scattered all over his body but i don't think its ever been substantiated?

And finally i believe he was killed out of necessity because he would have known it was the W's from the beginning.
I always thought Kenny was killed because he was there at the mentioned (by Lenny in MSM) confrontation between Chris and Billy and Jake. I think he jumped in on it and by doing so earned the hatred of Billy and Jake. Keep in mind they passed the homes of other Rhoden brothers and kin to get to Kenny's home but those still living brothers and kin was not in on the confrontation with Billy in which according to Rhoden kin Billy lost.

Make no mistake, this was a crime of hatred. The W's killed every Rhoden they hated including Kenny.

JMO
 

RAISINISBACK

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‘I’m not convinced it was RN who gave LE info for the last raid on FWF. The raid happened 11/4-11/7 or 8. If you look at her court entries FG subpoenaed all those witnesses and everyone was hell-bent on going to trial on 12/2. All the scuttle about the surprise hand he laid with witnesses he was bringing in and last minute paperwork came in 11/28 and the plea deal was hammered out on 12/2. I have a feeling someone else tipped them, perhaps someone other than the W4/RN. Not sure who did it but The timeline doesn’t fit for RN. Things were too hot & heavy at the end of the month if RN had already caved. This is JMOO unless someone convinces me otherwise.
I am not convinced it was either. I think it was James because the case started moving fast after he was arrested and released.

JMO
 

Cool Cats

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That’s true but I got the impression there was so much pressure at the end of the month and I think it would not have been so intense if RN had already spilled the beans a month earlier. Also, ICBW but as big as the FWF appears to be, I don’t envision RN as having a lot of knowledge about the farm other than where it is and how to get to the house & barns. Of course we haven’t been privvy to what BCI was looking for so maybe she knew more than I give her credit for. I would be willing to guess it's been years if she has been back in that area. I say that cuz she has no transportation and has been caring for her mother for several yrs.
There were divers at FWF and Fred confirmed they were looking in bodies of H2O, albeit, small areas of H2O.
What do criminals usually throw into lakes, rivers, and ponds? Guns usually. They sink, where other items may not. So one guess I have is they were looking for weapons/items that would sink.

Also they were at the Etna cemetery bordering FWF property. Due to the fact they had metal detectors they may have been looking for weapons buried in the cemetery, guns would really alert a metal detector.

It is telling that Rita did not sign the custody documents. Why not ask her to sign? Well maybe Angela asked her but she refused. Also, it could be Angela didn't ask her because Angela knew she wouldn't do it or wouldn't approve, or Angela just wanted to keep her mom in the dark.

Because Rita did not sign the documents I don't think Angela would be giving out any hints to her that they got rid of evidence at FWF. I don't believe Angela could trust her mom with deadly secrets. She did not even know if her mom would or would not testify against them. She told her mom not to, that she did not have to do it.

Don't know about Fred, I think she would keep any and all deadly secrets but don't know when and how much she knew. She was right there during revenge talks in her own home which means she currently knows some secrets. How could she not?

I think she changed her story about knowing the Rhodens because she needs to distance herself from that entire family because she knows something she is uncomfortable knowing, a secret she is trying to "run" from.
...Opinions...

... " the truth is never far behind I've kept it hidden well... "
..." the secrets that I hide, will they grow cold?
How will they see? When will they learn? How will they know? "
... " the truth is never far behind they must be doing well... "

Madonna, At Close Range a true story, chilling theme song
 
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Johnny B Bad

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Fletcher posted that he did.
The wedding and reception were in Fred's church with all the Rhodens there.

Fred said she didn't know the Rhodens yet they are all at the same Wedding and she said Billy and Chris were best friends and everyone loved Hanna, and that she knew what was going on with Jake and Hanna.

Yet she gets her charges dropped and that same day, suddenly she says she doesn't know any of the Rhoden family. She distanced herself from them.

Fred:
"Perhaps A Cartel? I don't know who killed those people,
I didn't know them."
Remember what the Restaurant owner said when he withdrew the $25,000 dollar Reward, I am In Fear Of My Family’s (Safety)
 

Cool Cats

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Remember what the Restaurant owner said when he withdrew the $25,000 dollar Reward, I am In Fear Of My Family’s (Safety)

Ruby tweeted:
He rescinded the offer due to “recent complex criminal developments."

Ruby tweeted:
He did not want to attach his family name to the case by chance the Cartel is involved.

By FOX19 Digital Media Staff | April 28, 2016 at 4:23 PM EDT - Updated July 24 at 9:37 PM
Jeff Ruby cites reasoning for pulling $25K reward in family massacre
10431753_G.jpg

On Monday, Ruby visited the Union Hill Road area where bodies of six adults and a teenage boy were found in three homes along the rural road. (Corrected by me)
 
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Johnny B Bad

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There were divers at FWF and Fred confirmed they were looking in bodies of H2O, albeit, small areas of H2O.
What do criminals usually throw into lakes, rivers, and ponds? Guns usually. They sink, where other items may not. So one guess I have is they were looking for weapons/items that would sink.

Also they were at the Etna cemetery bordering FWF property. Due to the fact they had metal detectors they may have been looking for weapons buried in the cemetery, guns would really alert a metal detector.

It is telling that Rita did not sign the custody documents. Why not ask her to sign? Well maybe Angela asked her but she refused. Also, it could be Angela didn't ask her because Angela knew she wouldn't do it or wouldn't approve, or Angela just wanted to keep her mom in the dark.

Because Rita did not sign the documents I don't think Angela would be giving out any hints to her that they got rid of evidence at FWF. I don't believe Angela could trust her mom with deadly secrets. She did not even know if her mom would or would not testify against them. She told her mom not to, that she did not have to do it.

Don't know about Fred, I think she would keep any and all deadly secrets but don't know when and how much she knew. She was right there during revenge talks in her own home which means she currently knows some secrets. How could she not?

I think she changed her story about knowing the Rhodens because she needs to distance herself from that entire family because she knows something she is uncomfortable knowing, a secret she is trying to "run" from.
...Opinions...

... " the truth is never far behind I've kept it hidden well... "
..." the secrets that I hide, will they grow cold?
How will they see? When will they learn? How will they know? "
... " the truth is never far behind they must be doing well... "

Madonna, At Close Range a true story, chilling theme song
IMO Angela will RAT, Fredericka out before she goes to JAIL, JMO
 
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