OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #53

[Cool Cats]

I’m of the opinion that the forged custody documents were fabricated to secure custody after the murders. If an attorney were to walk into court and submit that there were intentions before the murders for Hanna Mae to allow JW full custody of the child. Now an attorney stands before the judge with documents and anyone that could differ is dead, what is the judge to do. I never have learned if these documents were actually submitted and if so when and where. If my assumptions are known to be incorrect please correct me. All speculation on my part.

BBM
Your assumptions are not right or wrong because everyone is entitled to their own assumptions/opinions on this case. Please continue to assume all you want - as long as you make it clear that these are your own assumptions/opinions and not facts. For facts we need MSM links. Thankx.

None of us know at this point what the trials will reveal. What the facts truly are.

 

[Cool Cats]

Sorry I haven't had a chance to respond to your earlier post, BettyP. I agree he is not a suspect. But I do believe he became a part of the investigation the moment JW and his family did. I don't know at what point that was. IMO, LE was onto the Wagners much sooner than JM's arrest. Does anyone remember the orange Cadillac?

Based on the overall "reaction" to the Dailey files' discovery, I think this attorney and those files are paramount to the motive in these murders.

I don't know how long he has been in the area. His wife is from there.

Me being the digger I am, anything can be found online these days. I can't always connect the info in a sweet line, but I sure can put 2 and 2 together, and not even half as well as my fellow sleuthers. And I will say, I am not privy to ANY inside information, which gives me a strong advantage, in that I am clean as a whistle, should ACrun my profile tomorrow.
The Dailey files were stopped dead in their tracks. Wonder why?

BBM

I don't know why Loomis, but you sure make us think. Thankx for that.......Thankx for being so dedicated for justice....God only knows the families need justice.

 

[rsd1200]

I remember. Do you think he has any business connections with FW and thats why he withdrew the reward.

I always felt he had second thoughts after he came down on the bus, and very possibly became convinced it was cartel after the brutality of it all started to come out. Many folks did believe that it was cartel related, especially early on.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Oxygen Chanel is playing, (The Piketon Familie Murders) right now this morning.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

The morning of the murders, has anyone find out if one if any of the Wagners showed up at the Church the morning of the murders when Pastor Phil opened it up to the family, also has it been said who contacted the Wagners to find out where SW was, for all the surviving family new SW was with Hanna May that night other than Cory H. would have new where & what time she was picked, IMO

 

[Betty P]

The morning of the murders, has anyone find out if one if any of the Wagners showed up at the Church the morning of the murders when Pastor Phil opened it up to the family, also has it been said who contacted the Wagners to find out where SW was, for all the surviving family new SW was with Hanna May that night other than Cory H. would have new where & what time she was picked, IMO

Haven't seen any reports the W's were at the church or any of the funerals. They're quoted in the news media later on and assume LE contacted them when they couldn't find S.

JMO, I still consider it an open question as to when JW went to Dana Rhoden's home to pick up S. Of the survivors, Kendra R may have known where S was that night as she had spoken with Hanna that evening. There's probably a lot of evidence in the texts, cell phone calls, etc. of many people that night.

 

[Dudly]

A good older article that lists all the agencies involved in this investigation. With all this help, could the prosecution have it wrong anyway?
How big was the Pike County murders investigation?

 

[Cool Cats]

So I have a question, is this a stupid question?
What did Rita lie about?

“It’s not a good, Christian thing to lie, so I didn’t want to do that anymore,” she (Rita) said.

It's my understanding Angie wanted her to lie and claim she signed the documents but that is not how Rita pleaded. Rita pleaded not guilty and that is not a lie, she wasn't guilty.

 

[rsd1200]

So I have a question, is this a stupid question?
What did Rita lie about?

“It’s not a good, Christian thing to lie, so I didn’t want to do that anymore,” she said.

It's my understanding Angie wanted her to lie and claim she signed the documents but that is not how Rita pleaded. Rita pleaded not guilty and that is not a lie, she wasn't guilty.

Did she lie in her GJ testimony? Is that what she was referring to? Did she lie, and say she was there and stamped the docs, when she wasn't and didn't? Is it possible one of them asked her to lie to the GJ, b/c the timing of it all made things "look bad" for the W4. they just created the docs to take S to AK... for example.

 

[Cool Cats]

Did she lie in her GJ testimony? Is that what she was referring to? Did she lie, and say she was there and stamped the docs, when she wasn't and didn't? Is it possible one of them asked her to lie to the GJ, b/c the timing of it all made things "look bad" for the W4. they just created the docs to take S to AK... for example.

She was indicted for lying to the grand jury = Obstruction and Perjury. Yes Canepa said Angie wanted Rita to take responsibility for the documents because Angie said the custody documents made them look bad (I need to find out where she said this, its been awhile and I want to know exactly what she said). Angie probably figured Rita could legitimize them so they wouldn't look fake.

So I'm going to take a stab that Rita lied to the grand jury that the documents were not forged when in fact they were, and that is how she got charged with Obstruction and Perjury.

And then she did what Angela wanted and lied that she signed them so the prosecution had her signature on fake documents and the prosecution thought it was her real signature.

Then the house of cards falls apart because now the prosecution's own handwriting experts are saying that it is not Rita's signature, her signature was faked, likely by Angela.

So Gerlach confronts her and she tells him the truth and he tells her to take a plea pronto! He is working to keep her out of prison. If she cooperates fully, Canepa will ask that she gets a lighter sentence which means no jail time.

So she will be sentenced in the far future because I think they will call her as a witness in all 4 trials. Happy mothers day from Angela.
...2 Cents...

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Did she lie in her GJ testimony? Is that what she was referring to? Did she lie, and say she was there and stamped the docs, when she wasn't and didn't? Is it possible one of them asked her to lie to the GJ, b/c the timing of it all made things "look bad" for the W4. they just created the docs to take S to AK... for example.

IMO The Wagners had no thoughts of moving to Alaska until they started being questioned very hard by LE, JMO they ran to Alaska so if they where caught they could flee to Canada where they would not be extradited back to US if it’s a death penalty case, Mike DeWine used the news media to his advantage when they would do press conference telling the public that LE had no evidence of how to arrest anyone and was asking the public for help, that made the Wagners feel that that they was smarter than LE, that’s why the Wagners came back to Ohio, I would really not like to play cards with DeWine, What’s Everyone Though To That?

 

[Cool Cats]

IMO The Wagners had no thoughts of moving to Alaska until they started being questioned very hard by LE, JMO they ran to Alaska so if they where caught they could flee to Canada where they would not be extradited back to US if it’s a death penalty case, Mike DeWine used the news media to his advantage when they would do press conference telling the public that LE had no evidence of how to arrest anyone and was asking the public for help, that made the Wagners feel that that they was smarter than LE, that’s why the Wagners came back to Ohio, I would really not like to play cards with DeWine, What’s Everyone Though To That?

Incredible. Didn't know this. Why didn't they move to Canada?

Extradition - Wikipedia

Death penalty : Many jurisdictions, such as Australia, Canada, Macao, New Zealand, South Africa, and most European nations except Belarus, will not allow extradition if the death penalty may be imposed on the suspect unless they are assured that the death sentence will not be passed or carried out.

Supposedly they moved so S wouldn't hear them being accused of the murders
but the rumors followed them there (according to Jake who lies all the time). But Billy needed his mom's money and went back to work for her, I assume because they were back within a year and he was arrested (poor Robin) taking a horse to the vet hospital

 

[Puzzles8]

IMO The Wagners had no thoughts of moving to Alaska until they started being questioned very hard by LE, JMO they ran to Alaska so if they where caught they could flee to Canada where they would not be extradited back to US if it’s a death penalty case, Mike DeWine used the news media to his advantage when they would do press conference telling the public that LE had no evidence of how to arrest anyone and was asking the public for help, that made the Wagners feel that that they was smarter than LE, that’s why the Wagners came back to Ohio, I would really not like to play cards with DeWine, What’s Everyone Though To That?

A ways back, there was a conversation about theories on why they didn't go to Canada. I remember someone mentioning it was difficult to get non-resident work permits there.

Also, I wonder if Billy's SSI and at least one of the children's SS support/benefits would have continued if they took up residence in Canada?

JMO, MOO

 

[Loomis124]

I think we will be surprised when we hear the witnesses at trial. Notice that certain family members have not been seen in the court gallery. I wager they will be some of the first to be called as witnesses to testify as to Jake's violent aggressive tendencies toward custody and control.

I am waiting for Deering's ruling on this motion, the motion to allow evidence at trial to come in, in regards to Jake being violent before the murders.

***Note (2 Cents) he acts very jovial in court = Smile Smile Smile
He wants to give the distinct impression he wouldn't hurt a flea.
This is strange, maybe he wants to impress the judge? The jury in some way? ***

“There is some evidence Mr. Wagner was violent with one of the victims prior to the murders,” said state Special Prosecutor Angela Canepa, seemingly indicating the prosecution wants to present that alleged incident as part of the case against Wagner.

As one example of the motions argued Tuesday, defense attorney Gregory Meyers asked the court not to allow the prosecution to mention his client’s alleged previous behavior during his murder trial.

Past suspect behaviors, grisly murder scene photos may play parts in Rhoden trials - Portsmouth Daily Times

If the witnesses can testify that Jake got violent in regards to custody that would go miles in establishing motive, the custody motive.
The Jury needing to understand a motive is critical in my opinion.
...2 Cents...

Agree, CC. Great post.

I remember early on, some FB posts from one of HR's cousins, telling about how JW treated HR. One post included him pushing her down outside porch steps. I always acquainted this episode eith the alleged fight between BW and CWSR at the time. JMO since I don't have links.

Does anyone remember the article where LM said, 'They (LE) was dowm there just a week ago" (referring to Dana's place, I think)? So many things were happening then...the Road Rage Lady and her threats, FB threats against CRJR from Mongold and Jones, and prior to these, Tommy Gorman, Jr. and Frankie having words on FB (reason for FR and CRJR going to the Gormans). So many things unknown. Drugs and derby cars. IMO, the Wagners were baiting and egging it all on. But I do think drugs were involved, too, especially with Jones and Mongold, who were attempting to collect a debt. All JMO

 

[Loomis124]

Oxygen Chanel is playing, (The Piketon Familie Murders) right now this morning.

I saw it today for the first time. Didn't think too much of it.

 

[Loomis124]

I think we will be surprised when we hear the witnesses at trial. Notice that certain family members have not been seen in the court gallery. I wager they will be some of the first to be called as witnesses to testify as to Jake's violent aggressive tendencies toward custody and control.

I am waiting for Deering's ruling on this motion, the motion to allow evidence at trial to come in, in regards to Jake being violent before the murders.

***Note (2 Cents) he acts very jovial in court = Smile Smile Smile
He wants to give the distinct impression he wouldn't hurt a flea.
This is strange, maybe he wants to impress the judge? The jury in some way? ***

“There is some evidence Mr. Wagner was violent with one of the victims prior to the murders,” said state Special Prosecutor Angela Canepa, seemingly indicating the prosecution wants to present that alleged incident as part of the case against Wagner.

As one example of the motions argued Tuesday, defense attorney Gregory Meyers asked the court not to allow the prosecution to mention his client’s alleged previous behavior during his murder trial.

Past suspect behaviors, grisly murder scene photos may play parts in Rhoden trials - Portsmouth Daily Times

If the witnesses can testify that Jake got violent in regards to custody that would go miles in establishing motive, the custody motive.
The Jury needing to understand a motive is critical in my opinion.
...2 Cents...

CC, what motion are you referring to? Thanks.

 

[Loomis124]

Sorry I haven't had a chance to respond to your earlier post, BettyP. I agree he is not a suspect. But I do believe he became a part of the investigation the moment JW and his family did. I don't know at what point that was. IMO, LE was onto the Wagners much sooner than JM's arrest. Does anyone remember the orange Cadillac?

Based on the overall "reaction" to the Dailey files' discovery, I think this attorney and those files are paramount to the motive in these murders.

I don't know how long he has been in the area. His wife is from there.

Me being the digger I am, anything can be found online these days. I can't always connect the info in a sweet line, but I sure can put 2 and 2 together, and not even half as well as my fellow sleuthers. And I will say, I am not privy to ANY inside information, which gives me a strong advantage, in that I am clean as a whistle, should ACrun my profile tomorrow.

The Dailey files were stopped dead in their tracks. Wonder why?

A Canepa is who I was referring to.

 

[Loomis124]

I think we will be surprised when we hear the witnesses at trial. Notice that certain family members have not been seen in the court gallery. I wager they will be some of the first to be called as witnesses to testify as to Jake's violent aggressive tendencies toward custody and control.

I am waiting for Deering's ruling on this motion, the motion to allow evidence at trial to come in, in regards to Jake being violent before the murders.

***Note (2 Cents) he acts very jovial in court = Smile Smile Smile
He wants to give the distinct impression he wouldn't hurt a flea.
This is strange, maybe he wants to impress the judge? The jury in some way? ***

“There is some evidence Mr. Wagner was violent with one of the victims prior to the murders,” said state Special Prosecutor Angela Canepa, seemingly indicating the prosecution wants to present that alleged incident as part of the case against Wagner.

As one example of the motions argued Tuesday, defense attorney Gregory Meyers asked the court not to allow the prosecution to mention his client’s alleged previous behavior during his murder trial.

Past suspect behaviors, grisly murder scene photos may play parts in Rhoden trials - Portsmouth Daily Times

If the witnesses can testify that Jake got violent in regards to custody that would go miles in establishing motive, the custody motive.
The Jury needing to understand a motive is critical in my opinion.
...2 Cents...

The 500+ text messages in an Excel spreadsheet in a Discovery document surely tells the true story. IIRC, those were on Billy's phone the months of Mar and Apr 2016. JMO

 

[Johnny B Bad]

The 500+ text messages in an Excel spreadsheet in a Discovery document surely tells the true story. IIRC, those were on Billy's phone the months of Mar and Apr 2016. JMO

Loomis
Am I right saying that those documents about the 500 text in excel spreadsheet was found at Big Bear Lake, or am I wrong?

 

[Loomis124]

BBM

I don't know why Loomis, but you sure make us think. Thankx for that.......Thankx for being so dedicated for justice....God only knows the families need justice.

Thank you CC. I think we all stimulate each other in different ways, and I think that's a good thing. I love your bolded words and your strong feelings for Justice showing through. It is encouraging to me to see others who don't try to straddle the fence here. It's fine if some haven't decided sides yet, but this site is a victim-friendly site and it gets on my last nerve when they are bashed or the alleged killers are supported. JMO

Thank you for being here!