OK OK - Jamison Family: Truck, IDs and Dog Found Abandoned, Latimer Co, 8 Oct 2009 - #13

[watcher9]

Why not get in the truck for extra protection from the cold ?
Sorry if this was already discussed at length.

I need to catch up, and will peruse this thread later.
Have watched a few documentaries, but at WS one really gets the in-depth information.

Sorry I missed your question.
According to LE, if I remember right, they supposedly went walking and ended up on the other side of the mountain from where their truck was parked. It got too dark or they got too tired to walk back to the truck. They ended up lying down next to each other where they succumbed to the weather.

 

[Sillybilly]

Sorry I missed your question.
According to LE, if I remember right, they supposedly went walking and ended up on the other side of the mountain from where their truck was parked. It got too dark or they got too tired to walk back to the truck. They ended up lying down next to each other where they succumbed to the weather.

<bbm>

Medical examiner never determined COD.

 

[LietKynes]

This is still very mysterious and sad, imo.

I never really thought it was a 'deal' that went bad as they had their daughter with them.
And the fact that the dog was alive but dehydrated and hungry makes it seem like they'ed recently died.

 

[Dnp2be]

MOO however I think the succumbing to weather theory is far fetched. I really feel like they were set up and killed for the money which was known by whomever presumably took their lives. I think the perpetrators either did not know about the rest of the money or did not take the time to make sure it was all there after the murders were committed. As far as the remains being there/moved there at another time after the searches were called off, I just do not know. For such a sad and unusual case, I feel like there is nearly no information provided about this case. Why is it all kept so secretive, why is everyone so damn quiet? Why has this case been seemingly swept under the rug by LE. It’s not right at all.

I do want to add, I could be wrong about the weather theory. I am from flat lands and to be honest I’ve never hiked a mountain so it’s hard for me to imagine getting lost to the point of dying form the elements. However I know it does happen. Just hard for me to envision it without no personal experience.

I hope some answers come soon.

 

[St.Michelle]

I don’t think the Jamison family is difficult to explain at all, just weird. The husband and wife showed all the classic signs of a psychotic episode. They appeared to have delusions, possibly hallucinations. The slow movement with long pauses and blank facial expressions is a characteristic of this kind of episode. The willful isolation is, too.


There’s two ways this happens. Either it’s drug-induced or it’s a mental illness.


Amphetamine psychosis is a possible explanation people have. People keep talking about meth, because their area is notorious for meth. Police say they didn’t find anything drug related in the house, so some people say this isn’t possible. But I don’t know that this means too much. Not every drug abuser leaves bags and paraphernalia laying on the living room table. Meth paraphernalia can be quickly improvised and disposed. It could also be prescription amphetamines they might have gotten off the street.


What’s probably more likely is mental illness. Sherilyn is known to have bipolar disorder. Both hypo/manic and depressive episodes can involve psychotic symptoms. Bobby was diagnosed with major depression disorder. Depression can also develop psychotic features, particularly when under chronic stress. Their family was under constant stress leading up to this. They had their house burn down. Bobby’s parents had a weird divorce and probate issues they had to fight in order to secure their daughter’s inheritance for her. His father was stalking, threatening, and harassing them. Sherily had also stopped taking meds. There was a child abuse investigation, probably instigated as a revenge tactic by Bobby’s father. Sherilyn also depended on child support that some refused to pay. Under-treated disorders amplified by stress make it not unlikely to develop psychotic symptoms.


This becomes a classic *Folie à deux*. The disease supplies the form of delusion or hallucination, but patients take the content from their surroundings and circumstances. It does happen for two closely-connected people to create a common, mutually-reinforcing psychotic episode. The reinforcement between two people isolated together, creating an us-against-the-world mentality, makes these situations particularly dangerous.


People in a psychotic episode usually have delusions of persecution, which makes them feel they have to escape. These people tend to act impulsively in response to the delusions. This often does involve suicide. I don’t think there’s any difficulty in explaining this as I murder-suicide.


Things like the dog being left in the car, or the cash, are possible signs of irrational thinking that usually occurs. Many responses to the murder-suicide hypothesis point out behaviors that would be irrational if a person just wanted to die. There is a difference between suicide based on life situation or depression: these are planned and rational, in the sense that they’re calculated means to an end. But suicide in psychosis tends to be more impulsive.



The statistics for suicide in these groups are tragically high. About 1 in 3 persons with bipolar disorder will attempt suicide, and 1 out of 5 completes it. The 11-page, incoherent rant letter is almost stereotypical. From experience, writing long, incoherent rants is one of the uniting features of anyone in a hypo/manic state.


Psychotic features during depression also increases the risk of suicide, although the statistics aren’t so clear. These are an episodic part of the disorder and tend to strike people at certain times and then remit.


The facts of this case are strange. But none of this is unprecedented. There are numerous cases of parents with psychosis murdering their child. We hear almost every two years about a parent drowning their child because they think he’s possessed, etc.

 

[Dnp2be]

What do you believe they committed suicide with? And why do you believe they walked such a distance to end their lives?

I’m familiar with psychosis and mental illness. I worked many years on an intensive locked psychiatric unit. I honestly don’t know enough about their thoughts and behaviors to make a decision either way. Were both displaying homicidal or suicidal ideation? Were they both having paranoid or other type of delusions or intrusive thoughts? What hallucinations were they having? What medications were either of them prescribed and when did they stop tasking them? Did they wean themselves off or just stop cold turkey? Did either of them have a previous history or suicide attempts or being a danger to others?

IMO there’s not enough information unless you have their medical records in front of you or were personally close to and communicated with them prior to their death. Not saying it wasn’t a suicide but I don’t think we will ever know the answers to what actually happened that day.

 

[Truman]

I don’t think the Jamison family is difficult to explain at all, just weird. The husband and wife showed all the classic signs of a psychotic episode. They appeared to have delusions, possibly hallucinations. The slow movement with long pauses and blank facial expressions is a characteristic of this kind of episode. The willful isolation is, too.


There’s two ways this happens. Either it’s drug-induced or it’s a mental illness.


Amphetamine psychosis is a possible explanation people have. People keep talking about meth, because their area is notorious for meth. Police say they didn’t find anything drug related in the house, so some people say this isn’t possible. But I don’t know that this means too much. Not every drug abuser leaves bags and paraphernalia laying on the living room table. Meth paraphernalia can be quickly improvised and disposed. It could also be prescription amphetamines they might have gotten off the street.


What’s probably more likely is mental illness. Sherilyn is known to have bipolar disorder. Both hypo/manic and depressive episodes can involve psychotic symptoms. Bobby was diagnosed with major depression disorder. Depression can also develop psychotic features, particularly when under chronic stress. Their family was under constant stress leading up to this. They had their house burn down. Bobby’s parents had a weird divorce and probate issues they had to fight in order to secure their daughter’s inheritance for her. His father was stalking, threatening, and harassing them. Sherily had also stopped taking meds. There was a child abuse investigation, probably instigated as a revenge tactic by Bobby’s father. Sherilyn also depended on child support that some ******* refused to pay. Under-treated disorders amplified by stress make it not unlikely to develop psychotic symptoms.


This becomes a classic *Folie à deux*. The disease supplies the form of delusion or hallucination, but patients take the content from their surroundings and circumstances. It does happen for two closely-connected people to create a common, mutually-reinforcing psychotic episode. The reinforcement between two people isolated together, creating an us-against-the-world mentality, makes these situations particularly dangerous.


People in a psychotic episode usually have delusions of persecution, which makes them feel they have to escape. These people tend to act impulsively in response to the delusions. This often does involve suicide. I don’t think there’s any difficulty in explaining this as I murder-suicide.


Things like the dog being left in the car, or the cash, are possible signs of irrational thinking that usually occurs. Many responses to the murder-suicide hypothesis point out behaviors that would be irrational if a person just wanted to die. There is a difference between suicide based on life situation or depression: these are planned and rational, in the sense that they’re calculated means to an end. But suicide in psychosis tends to be more impulsive.



The statistics for suicide in these groups are tragically high. About 1 in 3 persons with bipolar disorder will attempt suicide, and 1 out of 5 completes it. The 11-page, incoherent rant letter is almost stereotypical. From experience, writing long, incoherent rants is one of the uniting features of anyone in a hypo/manic state.


Psychotic features during depression also increases the risk of suicide, although the statistics aren’t so clear. These are an episodic part of the disorder and tend to strike people at certain times and then remit.


The facts of this case are strange. But none of this is unprecedented. There are numerous cases of parents with psychosis murdering their child. We hear almost every two years about a parent drowning their child because they think he’s possessed, etc.

This is one heck of a well-written and thought-provoking post. I appreciate the time you took to share your ideas.

 

[St.Michelle]

As far as I am aware, it doesn’t appear police did a thorough search of the area around their remains. It’s theoretically possible they did use the .22 and it was never recovered. Perhaps they did simply lie down and wait to die in the cold. I’m really unsure about the mechanics of it.

From what we know, it seems they were having delusions of persecution. The ones that stick out to me are the demons that not only existed but had to be killed. The notes left everywhere in the house telling Satan to get out seem similar. With the spray paint on the storage container, assuming a particular person killed one’s cats because the cats died, and then having to send a message confronting them seems similar.

If they were having persecutory delusions, it makes it more likely they had the other classic form of delusion or hallucination seen in a “full blown” case: hortatory delusions/hallucinations. A person experiencing them will feel commanded to do something. This is often homicide or suicide. So I suspect that is possible.

I heard that Sharilyn had stopped taking meds. Even if she were medicated, if she were taking lithium or a mood stabilizer, those wouldn’t stop a psychotic episode. That requires antipsychotics, and many people with bipolar disorder are not prescribed them. If Bobby were only on treatment for usual depression, SSRIs or something similar, that would do nothing for a psychotic episode.

Sharilyn had been hospitalized for a suicide attempt somewhat earlier, not so much earlier, either. But the timing is under dispute.

But yes, I agree that it’s not possible to conclusively ascribe it to one thing or another without further information.

 

[watcher9]

Just to be clear, I never believed they succumbed to the weather myself.
I also did not believe it was a murder-suicide.

 

[Plumber101010]

I do definitely agree that every single time somebody goes missing or there is an unexplained death or there is no known cause of death, that speculation runs rampant and they try to make it more of a mystery than it really is! That said I don’t think this case is that much of a mystery to me. However my theory is totally different from yours. Here are my thoughts.

1) Video indicates nothing more whatsoever except the obvious, the family is packing up their truck, probably with the intention to leave forever. The other stuff like making multiple trips (which is what you DO when you’re packing to leave) not talking to each other (who stops between the house and the truck to chat with their wife?) and being in a trance like state (highly speculative, video is very grainy and not high-quality, they could be just stopping to rest) is all ridiculously absurd to me.

It’s individuals on the web (not necessarily here) trying to go out of their way to make a video fit a scenario that doesn’t exist. The most important part of the video and the biggest clue is the briefcase.

The exact same goes for the photograph. It’s just a random picture of a kid for goodness sake‘s!!! It’s amazing how big of a deal some people try to make out of this photograph that shows nothing but a kid on a rock! Reading some of these posts on YouTube about how much fear they see in the child’s eyes and how the child is scared and being controlled and all this other crap is just that, a big load of crap! I got hundreds of pictures on my iPhone that can make my kids look MUCH worse than that! LOL

2) Dog left in car indicates a fast return to car, not gone long term, indicates drug deal.

3) Briefcase missing indicates drug deal.

4) Isolated but familiar location which means an ideal meeting place for a drug deal.

5) Brought kid along thinking ahead of time the buyers would take the drugs and kill them. Who would kill a kid they’re thinking?

6) Money in car indicates it was get away cash and disappear money and this was their last big deal to get more money to help disappear with.

7) Bodies laid out and shot execution style.

8) The gun missing dispels a murder / suicide which I never believed anyway.

So to me? Basically they met with someone or many to sell drugs and they were shot and the drugs were stolen! Open and shut case to me.

 

[LietKynes]

I do definitely agree that every single time somebody goes missing or there is an unexplained death or there is no known cause of death, that speculation runs rampant and they try to make it more of a mystery than it really is! That said I don’t think this case is that much of a mystery to me. However my theory is totally different from yours. Here are my thoughts.

1) Video indicates nothing more whatsoever except the obvious, the family is packing up their truck, probably with the intention to leave forever. The other stuff like making multiple trips (which is what you DO when you’re packing to leave) not talking to each other (who stops between the house and the truck to chat with their wife?) and being in a trance like state (highly speculative, video is very grainy and not high-quality, they could be just stopping to rest) is all ridiculously absurd to me.

It’s individuals on the web (not necessarily here) trying to go out of their way to make a video fit a scenario that doesn’t exist. The most important part of the video and the biggest clue is the briefcase.

The exact same goes for the photograph. It’s just a random picture of a kid for goodness sake‘s!!! It’s amazing how big of a deal some people try to make out of this photograph that shows nothing but a kid on a rock! Reading some of these posts on YouTube about how much fear they see in the child’s eyes and how the child is scared and being controlled and all this other crap is just that, a big load of crap! I got hundreds of pictures on my iPhone that can make my kids look MUCH worse than that! LOL

2) Dog left in car indicates a fast return to car, not gone long term, indicates drug deal.

3) Briefcase missing indicates drug deal.

4) Isolated but familiar location which means an ideal meeting place for a drug deal.

5) Brought kid along thinking ahead of time the buyers would take the drugs and kill them. Who would kill a kid they’re thinking?

6) Money in car indicates it was get away cash and disappear money and this was their last big deal to get more money to help disappear with.

7) Bodies laid out and shot execution style.

8) The gun missing dispels a murder / suicide which I never believed anyway.

So to me? Basically they met with someone or many to sell drugs and they were shot and the drugs were stolen! Open and shut case to me.

I think your post makes sense the more I read it.
Few people want to consider this possibility but in reality if they were killed by someone else that makes them innocent victims and is a far better option for the family to deal with, then a planned suicide.
Hoping their families have answers some time.
Can't imagine living without knowing what really happened !
Imo.

 

[Dnp2be]

I do definitely agree that every single time somebody goes missing or there is an unexplained death or there is no known cause of death, that speculation runs rampant and they try to make it more of a mystery than it really is! That said I don’t think this case is that much of a mystery to me. However my theory is totally different from yours. Here are my thoughts.

1) Video indicates nothing more whatsoever except the obvious, the family is packing up their truck, probably with the intention to leave forever. The other stuff like making multiple trips (which is what you DO when you’re packing to leave) not talking to each other (who stops between the house and the truck to chat with their wife?) and being in a trance like state (highly speculative, video is very grainy and not high-quality, they could be just stopping to rest) is all ridiculously absurd to me.

It’s individuals on the web (not necessarily here) trying to go out of their way to make a video fit a scenario that doesn’t exist. The most important part of the video and the biggest clue is the briefcase.

The exact same goes for the photograph. It’s just a random picture of a kid for goodness sake‘s!!! It’s amazing how big of a deal some people try to make out of this photograph that shows nothing but a kid on a rock! Reading some of these posts on YouTube about how much fear they see in the child’s eyes and how the child is scared and being controlled and all this other crap is just that, a big load of crap! I got hundreds of pictures on my iPhone that can make my kids look MUCH worse than that! LOL

2) Dog left in car indicates a fast return to car, not gone long term, indicates drug deal.

3) Briefcase missing indicates drug deal.

4) Isolated but familiar location which means an ideal meeting place for a drug deal.

5) Brought kid along thinking ahead of time the buyers would take the drugs and kill them. Who would kill a kid they’re thinking?

6) Money in car indicates it was get away cash and disappear money and this was their last big deal to get more money to help disappear with.

7) Bodies laid out and shot execution style.

8) The gun missing dispels a murder / suicide which I never believed anyway.

So to me? Basically they met with someone or many to sell drugs and they were shot and the drugs were stolen! Open and shut case to me.

Exactly! Have always believed it was simply a bad drug deal. Things of this sort happen all the time but usually with less mystery around it because the bodies are found and the people are known to the life.

 

[watcher9]

I never thought they packed up the truck, etc to go up on the mountain to make a drug deal. I really thought they were up there to buy some land. Did we ever hear anything from the landowner?

 

[Plumber101010]

I never thought they packed up the truck, etc to go up on the mountain to make a drug deal. I really thought they were up there to buy some land. Did we ever hear anything from the landowner?

From what I read, I “think” they had already scouted it once before so were familiar with it. But even if not, what better excuse could one possibly have to be there, then to say we’re here looking to purchase the property if anyone were to ask?

And I don’t think they packed up the truck to make a drug deal I think they packed up the truck because they were planning on leaving town and that was their last stop before doing so.

I forget where I came up with this assumption from as it’s been many years since I first did a little digging on the subject, but I was under the impression he knew how to make meth and it was a very large quantity or in other words, an amount large enough worthy of being killed over.

 

[Purrplejasmin]

Hello everyone! The last few weeks I have been trying to read through all the posts over the years... So hard to keep track of what is what. Is there a site anywhere that shows all of the diary enteries and the "hate" letter? I'm seeing and getting bits and pieces here and there... I'm ADHD and tend to have my thoughts all over the place, so I end up vying off on everything shiny.... And the majority of the links that had been posted, no longer work.

There was a letter that had what seemed to reference scriptures. The pic that I have is blurry and cut, but it talked of "legs of Iron" in one of them. 2:39 depending on Samuel, Daniel.. One talks about being found in 4 years. Interesting that they were found in 4 years. The scripture in general is confusing. One article saying SJ was into "witchcraft", another that they went to church. Did they find a "Witches Bible" or a "Satanist" one? As a Pagan they are not one in the same, nor are Satanist what you think they are. Even "True" Satanist, ironically enough don't believe in Satan, and are disgusted with Cults claiming to Satanists (Sorry, just very well versed in different religions and misconceptions about those misunderstood really erk me).

I bring that up because it's important. Misconceptions of religions, beliefs, and cults are then misconceptions that are placed on the people. Finding the Satanic Bible by Anton LeVey to me is not a sign of someone's decent into madness. That is someone trying anything and everything to rid your house of a haunting. Nor was her belief that she could exorcise demons. If you know what's haunting your house, it makes it easier to remove them. Even angry Native Americans haunting houses have been mistaken as demonic. They don't reconginize a Christian God. SJ began looking into the property. I bet she was as confused as I was, or anyone, that looks into the history of that property.

BDJ receives the property in 2004 in a Warrenty Deed. I'm confused as to who actually bought the house. Between 2005 and 2008 the property seems to be a hot potato between BDJ, BJ, and SJ. I thought that I read that BJ father gave them the house in June 2008. If that is when BDJ gave them the house, it coincides with BJD getting sued for a prior accident, not BJ. Those court cases, between the two, were a pain to figure out who was who, too. In May 2008, JBD is sued for a car accident he caused in 2006, JBD WD's the house to JD and SJ in June 2008, then files for divorce in Aug 2008.

There also seems to be property that appears to still be in BDJ or BJ name. With multiple properties within this family, who is to say that the briefcase was even brought with them on the mountain? What if SJ found something she wasn't supposed to while searching the property? A Jamison family has OGL properties in Latimer county. One of the coordinates in the notebook inside the truck, I believe, coincide with one of these properties. I'm not sure if they're from the same Jamison line. Geneology is tedious work.

I find it interesting that SH owned all the property he did back then, but had never seen it. SH owns the plots the Jamison's truck and remains were found. Are the coordinates that were written in the journal close to where the truck AND remains were found? It seemed like it. GPS shows them going up the mountain and back down to where the truck was found? They never made it down the moutain.

The truck was parked by someone else. It was over a week before the truck was found. During that week, the weather shows a few rainy days between the truck being parked and discovered, yet there were footprints... Of Madyson? I call BS. At first, I was thinking that whomever disposed of the truck, didn't know about the money. I don't think that any more. I'm being to wonder if it's even the Jamison's money. I know that BJ was taking his father to court for money and I read something along the lines of the profit being $64,000 to be split between them. Seeing how the case was dismissed after the disappearance, I'm not sure where that info in the article I read came from.

If $32,000 came from a bank, there would be a CTR. Banks are federally mandated to report any cash entering or leaving the bank that is over $10,000. Banks also normally don't just carry that much cash in their branch and most have a withdrawl limit. They would have had to request the money a week prior to picking it up. Branches are only allowed to have so much cash at a time. It would have been ordered seperate from their normal branch order. The bank would call them once they received it. If they had a check written on a bank that was not their bank, the bank would be obligated to verify the check with whomever wrote it. After verfying the account and funds associated with the check, they would tell the person cashing it to hold onto it, and they would recieve a call once the money came in.

The numbering on the bag is busniess related. That was a night deposit bag given to a business, so at the end of the day, they can drop it in the night deposit box, at the bank, to be processed the next day. That way they don't have to wait in the bank. The number was placed there by a business to keep track of their night deposit bags. Banks cash checks and makes withdrawls once the person is in front of them. They can not anticipate a large withdrawal and put it in a numbered bag. Banks also don't use ziplock bags. EVER! Plastic bags used by banks have an adhesive strip. They do have loose bags with trash ties that are used when businesses come in and get coin for their store.

The picture of Madyson... She has a welt on her cheek. Maybe a bug bite. Yes, her face is puffy from crying, but I don't think SHE knew they were in danger. She isn't even the focus of the picture. The space to left of her is. In between the trees, there looks as though there is somone there. I know it's a camera phone, pixels, blah blah blah. There's someone there. She's standing and mom or dad is knelt down, attempting to hide a picture being taken. Did they have photoshop apps for cell phones back in 2009? The rocks beside her look odd as well. Like someone was sitting on them in a straddle position, but someone tried to remove them and left some strange ghost outline.

KB was supposedly cleared as being in jail at the time. No, he was not. He was out of jail and wanted for failure to appear. Multiple of them. His most recent was possession of a firearm as a felon. I couldn't help but to wonder if it was SJ. I'm curious to know where the story of SJ removing him from their property by gunpoint came from. KB? Curious that his exwife worked for the County and all the cases of his that had been dismissed. Was it ever established how they even knew each other?

Good ol Uncle Jack's interview he gave proclaiming closure after the bodies were found, but not confirmed, sounded like he knew EXACTLY what happened. I bet SJ found more than she bargined for when she was searching the proprerty. There is property in Latimer tied to a Jamison family in gas and oil, I'm just not sure if they come from the same Jamison Tree.

SJ referred to BJ as a "hermit" there's a meaning there that's not meant as an insult, but as a clue. You don't write hate letters planning a divorce, then go up with them into the mountains.

 

[watcher9]

Hello everyone! The last few weeks I have been trying to read through all the posts over the years... So hard to keep track of what is what. Is there a site anywhere that shows all of the diary enteries and the "hate" letter? I'm seeing and getting bits and pieces here and there... I'm ADHD and tend to have my thoughts all over the place, so I end up vying off on everything shiny.... And the majority of the links that had been posted, no longer work.

There was a letter that had what seemed to reference scriptures. The pic that I have is blurry and cut, but it talked of "legs of Iron" in one of them. 2:39 depending on Samuel, Daniel.. One talks about being found in 4 years. Interesting that they were found in 4 years. The scripture in general is confusing. One article saying SJ was into "witchcraft", another that they went to church. Did they find a "Witches Bible" or a "Satanist" one? As a Pagan they are not one in the same, nor are Satanist what you think they are. Even "True" Satanist, ironically enough don't believe in Satan, and are disgusted with Cults claiming to Satanists (Sorry, just very well versed in different religions and misconceptions about those misunderstood really erk me).

I bring that up because it's important. Misconceptions of religions, beliefs, and cults are then misconceptions that are placed on the people. Finding the Satanic Bible by Anton LeVey to me is not a sign of someone's decent into madness. That is someone trying anything and everything to rid your house of a haunting. Nor was her belief that she could exorcise demons. If you know what's haunting your house, it makes it easier to remove them. Even angry Native Americans haunting houses have been mistaken as demonic. They don't reconginize a Christian God. SJ began looking into the property. I bet she was as confused as I was, or anyone, that looks into the history of that property.

BDJ receives the property in 2004 in a Warrenty Deed. I'm confused as to who actually bought the house. Between 2005 and 2008 the property seems to be a hot potato between BDJ, BJ, and SJ. I thought that I read that BJ father gave them the house in June 2008. If that is when BDJ gave them the house, it coincides with BJD getting sued for a prior accident, not BJ. Those court cases, between the two, were a pain to figure out who was who, too. In May 2008, JBD is sued for a car accident he caused in 2006, JBD WD's the house to JD and SJ in June 2008, then files for divorce in Aug 2008.

There also seems to be property that appears to still be in BDJ or BJ name. With multiple properties within this family, who is to say that the briefcase was even brought with them on the mountain? What if SJ found something she wasn't supposed to while searching the property? A Jamison family has OGL properties in Latimer county. One of the coordinates in the notebook inside the truck, I believe, coincide with one of these properties. I'm not sure if they're from the same Jamison line. Geneology is tedious work.

I find it interesting that SH owned all the property he did back then, but had never seen it. SH owns the plots the Jamison's truck and remains were found. Are the coordinates that were written in the journal close to where the truck AND remains were found? It seemed like it. GPS shows them going up the mountain and back down to where the truck was found? They never made it down the moutain.

The truck was parked by someone else. It was over a week before the truck was found. During that week, the weather shows a few rainy days between the truck being parked and discovered, yet there were footprints... Of Madyson? I call BS. At first, I was thinking that whomever disposed of the truck, didn't know about the money. I don't think that any more. I'm being to wonder if it's even the Jamison's money. I know that BJ was taking his father to court for money and I read something along the lines of the profit being $64,000 to be split between them. Seeing how the case was dismissed after the disappearance, I'm not sure where that info in the article I read came from.

If $32,000 came from a bank, there would be a CTR. Banks are federally mandated to report any cash entering or leaving the bank that is over $10,000. Banks also normally don't just carry that much cash in their branch and most have a withdrawl limit. They would have had to request the money a week prior to picking it up. Branches are only allowed to have so much cash at a time. It would have been ordered seperate from their normal branch order. The bank would call them once they received it. If they had a check written on a bank that was not their bank, the bank would be obligated to verify the check with whomever wrote it. After verfying the account and funds associated with the check, they would tell the person cashing it to hold onto it, and they would recieve a call once the money came in.

The numbering on the bag is busniess related. That was a night deposit bag given to a business, so at the end of the day, they can drop it in the night deposit box, at the bank, to be processed the next day. That way they don't have to wait in the bank. The number was placed there by a business to keep track of their night deposit bags. Banks cash checks and makes withdrawls once the person is in front of them. They can not anticipate a large withdrawal and put it in a numbered bag. Banks also don't use ziplock bags. EVER! Plastic bags used by banks have an adhesive strip. They do have loose bags with trash ties that are used when businesses come in and get coin for their store.

The picture of Madyson... She has a welt on her cheek. Maybe a bug bite. Yes, her face is puffy from crying, but I don't think SHE knew they were in danger. She isn't even the focus of the picture. The space to left of her is. In between the trees, there looks as though there is somone there. I know it's a camera phone, pixels, blah blah blah. There's someone there. She's standing and mom or dad is knelt down, attempting to hide a picture being taken. Did they have photoshop apps for cell phones back in 2009? The rocks beside her look odd as well. Like someone was sitting on them in a straddle position, but someone tried to remove them and left some strange ghost outline.

KB was supposedly cleared as being in jail at the time. No, he was not. He was out of jail and wanted for failure to appear. Multiple of them. His most recent was possession of a firearm as a felon. I couldn't help but to wonder if it was SJ. I'm curious to know where the story of SJ removing him from their property by gunpoint came from. KB? Curious that his exwife worked for the County and all the cases of his that had been dismissed. Was it ever established how they even knew each other?

Good ol Uncle Jack's interview he gave proclaiming closure after the bodies were found, but not confirmed, sounded like he knew EXACTLY what happened. I bet SJ found more than she bargined for when she was searching the proprerty. There is property in Latimer tied to a Jamison family in gas and oil, I'm just not sure if they come from the same Jamison Tree.

SJ referred to BJ as a "hermit" there's a meaning there that's not meant as an insult, but as a clue. You don't write hate letters planning a divorce, then go up with them into the mountains.

purrplejasmin
You have posted some interesting thoughts!
Welcome to WS and this thread.

 

[Plumber101010]

This thing about the kids picture, in my humble opinion, is just a classic example how some people will try to force fit a square picture into a round theory (please take no offense I am not speaking directly about your post)

But with this particular story, in this particular instance, it has grown into such absurdities with people claiming what they see in that child’s face, I just can’t stomach it anymore! LOL

The vast majority of commenters, I mean a HUGE majority slice of anyone taking an interest in this case and trying to solve it are absolutely 100% convinced that child is in danger and/or fear! I as well am absolutely 100% convinced they do not “want” to acknowledge other possibilities! They are just not open to any other concept!!!

Now I do NOT think they are doing it purposely, to say consciously making statements about the picture that they do not personally believe, absolutely not. I believe in their heart of hearts they genuinely believe they see what they claim to see in that child’s face and it’s done subconsciously. Still, it’s a seed they planted that does not need to grow!!!

Having raised three girls you can bet that I’ve had just as much experience hanging around children as the next person. And I have a very VERY simple explanation ( if one HAS to be given which I do not think it does to begin with) as to why she is looking like that.

I knew LOTS of kids, including yours truly, that absolutely HATED having their picture taken and when you tried to take one of them, they will fold their arms, try to hide / turn their face and POUT!

Heck, even kids that don’t mind that much are always trying to do something silly and goofy and act like they don’t want you to take it, even when they really do LOL.

Truth is that’s exactly what that picture looks like to me. She didn’t want to have her picture taken.

 

[acehard]

Is there a site anywhere that shows all of the diary enteries and the "hate" letter?

I was looking for this as well

 

[CastlesBurning]

BEWARE: These 50 Strangest Unsolved Mysteries of All Time Are Seriously Spooky!

28. The Jamison Family Disappearance

On October 8, 2009, the Jamison family, 44-year-old Bobby Dale, 40-year-old Sherilyn Leighann, and their 6-year-old daughter, Madyson Stormy Star were seen for the last time before vanishing without a trace. The family who lived in Eufaula, Oklahoma was last seen by a man who lived in the mountains in southeastern Oklahoma. However, the witness claimed that he only saw the family and no one else in that area during the time. The Jamisons were there to view a 40-acre plot of land that they were looking to purchase. They were looking to live in a shipping container that they had already been living in on their plot of land in Eufaula.

On October 16, eight days after the Jamisons were last seen alive, the first major discovery in the case occurred. Hunters in a remote location in the woods, about a quarter-mile away from the last spot the Jamisons were seen, discovered the Jamison’s abandoned truck which was still locked. Inside the truck, investigators found Bobby’s wallet, Sherilyn’s purse, jackets, a GPS, Bobby’s cell phone, $32,000 cash in a bank bag, and the Jamison’s pet dog, Maisy, who was incredibly malnourished but still alive. Bobby’s cell phone had a picture of Madyson and it is believed to have been taken the day before they disappeared. The truck showed no evidence of any kind of struggle. Former Sheriff Beauchamp remarked “I think they were forced to stop and got out of the truck to meet with someone they recognized. And I think they either left willingly or by force.”

The GPS unit in the truck indicated that the family had been farther up a nearby hill, prior to the location where the truck and belongings were found. Investigators followed the coordinates and found footprints. One day later, on October 17, 300 people including authorities and volunteers staged a large-scale air and ground search party but unfortunately, any leads went cold and the search for the Jamisons was called off.

On November 16, 2013, hunters were scouting for deer hunting locations when they found partial skeletal remains of three bodies, two adults and one child. The remains were found less than 3 miles from where the Jamison family had parked their truck 4 years earlier. The search uncovered shoes, bits of clothing, adult teeth, an adult arm and leg bone, and bone fragments. The bones would eventually be confirmed as the missing Jamison family. However, no cause of death was determined, and the circumstances surrounding their disappearance remain unknown.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

I don’t think the Jamison family is difficult to explain at all, just weird. The husband and wife showed all the classic signs of a psychotic episode. They appeared to have delusions, possibly hallucinations. The slow movement with long pauses and blank facial expressions is a characteristic of this kind of episode. The willful isolation is, too.


There’s two ways this happens. Either it’s drug-induced or it’s a mental illness.


Amphetamine psychosis is a possible explanation people have. People keep talking about meth, because their area is notorious for meth. Police say they didn’t find anything drug related in the house, so some people say this isn’t possible. But I don’t know that this means too much. Not every drug abuser leaves bags and paraphernalia laying on the living room table. Meth paraphernalia can be quickly improvised and disposed. It could also be prescription amphetamines they might have gotten off the street.


What’s probably more likely is mental illness. Sherilyn is known to have bipolar disorder. Both hypo/manic and depressive episodes can involve psychotic symptoms. Bobby was diagnosed with major depression disorder. Depression can also develop psychotic features, particularly when under chronic stress. Their family was under constant stress leading up to this. They had their house burn down. Bobby’s parents had a weird divorce and probate issues they had to fight in order to secure their daughter’s inheritance for her. His father was stalking, threatening, and harassing them. Sherily had also stopped taking meds. There was a child abuse investigation, probably instigated as a revenge tactic by Bobby’s father. Sherilyn also depended on child support that some ******* refused to pay. Under-treated disorders amplified by stress make it not unlikely to develop psychotic symptoms.


This becomes a classic *Folie à deux*. The disease supplies the form of delusion or hallucination, but patients take the content from their surroundings and circumstances. It does happen for two closely-connected people to create a common, mutually-reinforcing psychotic episode. The reinforcement between two people isolated together, creating an us-against-the-world mentality, makes these situations particularly dangerous.


People in a psychotic episode usually have delusions of persecution, which makes them feel they have to escape. These people tend to act impulsively in response to the delusions. This often does involve suicide. I don’t think there’s any difficulty in explaining this as I murder-suicide.


Things like the dog being left in the car, or the cash, are possible signs of irrational thinking that usually occurs. Many responses to the murder-suicide hypothesis point out behaviors that would be irrational if a person just wanted to die. There is a difference between suicide based on life situation or depression: these are planned and rational, in the sense that they’re calculated means to an end. But suicide in psychosis tends to be more impulsive.



The statistics for suicide in these groups are tragically high. About 1 in 3 persons with bipolar disorder will attempt suicide, and 1 out of 5 completes it. The 11-page, incoherent rant letter is almost stereotypical. From experience, writing long, incoherent rants is one of the uniting features of anyone in a hypo/manic state.


Psychotic features during depression also increases the risk of suicide, although the statistics aren’t so clear. These are an episodic part of the disorder and tend to strike people at certain times and then remit.


The facts of this case are strange. But none of this is unprecedented. There are numerous cases of parents with psychosis murdering their child. We hear almost every two years about a parent drowning their child because they think he’s possessed, etc.

I'm a mental health professional and feel the need to clear up some of what you said. My disclaimer: I have not fully researched this case and I obviously have never met these people. I'm only clearing up what has been said in the post above and the subsequent post after it.

1. Bipolar disorder is a thing, but you keep saying hypomanic episode. If she had a history of hypomania (not mania) and depression, then that's criteria for Bipolar II disorder, NOT Bipolar I disorder. The reason this is important is because psychosis is NOT part of Bipolar II disorder. If a person is psychotic, they, by definition, do not have Bipolar II disorder. They have some other disorder OR they may have a co-morbid substance-induced psychosis.

2. Most people with Bipolar I disorder (the one that can have psychotic features), ARE prescribed antipsychotics. Very few people are maintained on a mood stabilizer alone, though it does happen. Also, antipsychotics ARE mood stabilizers as well. They're prescribed often for monotherapy and are more likely to be used first line instead of lithium or Depakote.

3. While Major Depressive Disorder can present with psychotic features, it would be very unusual for it to present in a case of folie a deux. For one, FAD is very rare. But also, the psychosis seen in MDD is not your standard psychosis you'd see in, say schizophrenia or other psychotic spectrum disorder. Rather, the psychosis would be centered around the depression, usually with delusions.

4. Hortatory hallucinations are so, so, so, so very rare that they're not even mentioned in the DSM, the very textbook that lists all psychiatric diagnoses. You may be thinking of command auditory hallucinations, which are more common and are NOT hortatory. CAH typically accompany a psychotic spectrum illness, like schizophrenia or schizoaffective disorder.

5. When we think about a psychotic individual killing others, especially their child, there is typically a trigger. It doesn't just happen because the person is psychotic. Usually, when these stories come to light, the women were suffering from postpartum psychosis (Andrea Yates). In postpartum psychosis, the hormonal fluctuations is what tends to trigger the onset of psychosis and can result in infanticide or murder of one's other children. In many other cases where someone murders their child, they try to claim psychosis but actually that wasn't the cause at all. Some individuals who use it to plead insanity are clearly not psychotic (and don't succeed with the plea). You don't just become psychotic and if you do, you don't just up and kill people.