GUILTY OR - Whitney Heichel, 21, Gresham, 16 Oct 2012 #3

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Can someone please answer this question: The man who stated that he saw Whitney and an unidentified Man at the gas station together; Was she dead in the car? Did he actually see her? I would think that you would notice something like that... I am still not understanding the timeline. If he took her up to Rosalyn lake and killed her there, then that would mean he was driving around with her dead body propped up in the car? And then there was that statement on Facebook from a girl who said she and her boyfriend saw a girl curled up on a rock on larch mountain... Would this mean that they might have seen Whitney appearing to be alive but in reality already murdered? How can you drive around town with a murdered girl with gunshot wounds In your passenger seat? Please can someone explain the timeline and what really occurred I would really really appreciate it!!!!!!
 
I don't believe the gas station sighting was ever confirmed....
 
Can someone please answer this question: The man who stated that he saw Whitney and an unidentified Man at the gas station together; Was she dead in the car? Did he actually see her? I would think that you would notice something like that... I am still not understanding the timeline. If he took her up to Rosalyn lake and killed her there, then that would mean he was driving around with her dead body propped up in the car? And then there was that statement on Facebook from a girl who said she and her boyfriend saw a girl curled up on a rock on larch mountain... Would this mean that they might have seen Whitney appearing to be alive but in reality already murdered? How can you drive around town with a murdered girl with gunshot wounds In your passenger seat? Please can someone explain the timeline and what really occurred I would really really appreciate it!!!!!!

I think that because ( and correct me if I am wrong) some of that wasnt reported by MSM and LE didnt confirm the sightings it wasnt actually discussed in detail. I am still new to the site so I might be a bit fuzzy on things I just assumed that was the reason we didnt get into it to much
 
Ok. I thought I had read that it was confirmed that a gas attendant had seen Whitney with an unidentified male and that he looked nervous. Maybe you are right and it was not confirmed by LE
 
I wondered the same and decided the parents must have been at work... no one home , so he went to make sure she was not at her parents?

Not sure why...


:moo: I'm reallly not picking on CH! I have questions/concerns that I am trying to resolve with a little "help from my friends" ~ :twocents:

What does it matter what Clint says or how he behaves or what he did during his wife's disappearance since someone else has confessed and been charged with murder?
 
If JH shot WH after the sexual abuse, it is not clear how the police have not found a single drop of blood either in the vehicle or at the location JH told LE he committed the murder. Not only that, but how could he transport her bleeding body after 4 gunshot wounds all the way to the mountain without any blood getting anywhere in the car? He brought plastic bags or a blanket or cover or something with him? If so, how would that not have seemed very suspicious to WH when he asked for a ride?

What makes you think LE never found any blood? Do you have a source for this, or are you making assumptions based on the fact that the media has not talked about blood?

Can someone please answer this question: The man who stated that he saw Whitney and an unidentified Man at the gas station together; Was she dead in the car? Did he actually see her?

Her car is not an uncommon car around here, particularly out in the 'burbs. So many cars drive through gas stations and station attendants are busy. He could have seen her car, or he could have seen any number of SUVs passing through there in that time period. There could have been two similar SUVs there at the same time. Eyewitnesses are known to be unreliable, at best, and a gas station attendant at a busy gas station who thinks they saw a girl in a commonly seen car -- without verification that she was in the car based on surveillance video, it could have literally been anyone.

ATM records showed her card was used at a local gas station at 9:14 a.m., and grainy surveillance tape showed her black 1999 Ford Explorer at that location, cops confirmed.
[/B]

Exactly that. However, we cannot possibly conclude with utter certainty that what the attendant thought he saw was her, in her car. We simply do not have that information.
 
As a few others have said, there are just a few things that do not add up here.

1.) If WH left at 6:45am to get to work before 7:00am, where did he supposedly ask her to give him a ride to exactly that would take so little time, she could still arrive to work before 7 and if it was that short of a distance, why would he need a ride in the first place?

2.) If JH waited 5 minutes after 6:45am to pull the gun on her and forced her to go straight to Roslyn Lake to force her to perform oral sex on him, how is it possible that he killed her then showed up at gas stations NORTH of where the lake was at a later time in the morning? It is only 14 miles from their apartment complex (Heatherwood Apartments) to the address listed on the probable cause document. Here is a map showing the driving directions from the apartments to the lake where he supposedly did the deed: http://goo.gl/maps/a9ZB2

And here is another map showing where the items were located throughout the areas north of the apartments:
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/10/22/article-2221422-1594F5E7000005DC-644_634x416.jpg

Based on where they found her cell phone and her vehicle north of Gresham, and he really did force her to drive them to the lake right around 7:00-7:15am that morning, it would seem that he committed the crimes at the lake, dumps his cell phone there, goes back north and stops at the gas station at 9:14am when her card was used (was WH still in the vehicle at that time, after he shot her?), drove to the mountain to dump the body (while also dumping the license plate), then on his way back, threw her cell phone out into some bushes while driving the SUV shortly before finally stopping at the WalMart to dump the vehicle.

3.) If JH shot WH after the sexual abuse, it is not clear how the police have not found a single drop of blood either in the vehicle or at the location JH told LE he committed the murder. Not only that, but how could he transport her bleeding body after 4 gunshot wounds all the way to the mountain without any blood getting anywhere in the car? He brought plastic bags or a blanket or cover or something with him? If so, how would that not have seemed very suspicious to WH when he asked for a ride?

None of this is adding up to what JH told LE. It seems there are just too many details missing right now for any sort of conclusive findings.

I think the answers to 1). and 3). lie in the fact that JH lied (i said "lie" twice, I know) about the approach that morning.

IMH hunch, I believe he took Whitney by force from the first second. He likely came up behind her as she was unlocking her vehicle, pressed his gun to her back or head and forced her into the passenger side. He knew he would have to end up killing her and perhaps he did bring a plastic tarp or bags to cover the seats. And possibly a change of clothes. :(

Since he used force from the get-go there was no need for pretense or hiding of any suspicious items such as rope or bags, tarps, etc.

I really have no clue about the seemingly random path he took after he killed Whitney and before (or was it after) he dumped her body. I do think the attendant who claims he saw Whitney was mistaken. Honestly mistaken. It happens all of the time.

I will also add that the report of AH reporting JH missing (was that right?) last year has me suspecting he might suffer from schizophrenia. I am not a professional and have no background in mental health but I have a relative who suffers from schizophrenia and has been known to turn up missing on occasion.

She usually came back on her own mostly unharmed but there were a few occasions where her behavior during an episode put her at risk although to my knowledge she posed no threat to others.

Anyway, my gut on JH is that there were no drugs or alcohol involved but he is possibly schizophrenic. I would like to know if there are more "missing" stories than just the one reported. I do get a feeling he hasn't ever killed anyone until Whitney. :(

MOO and all....
 
ATM records showed her card was used at a local gas station at 9:14 a.m., and grainy surveillance tape showed her black 1999 Ford Explorer at that location, cops confirmed.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...l-phone-found-article-1.1187659#ixzz2A9KBE4XH

Atm purchase and
Her vehicle WAS confirmed too...

She was NOT seen is how I read that.
moo

Another couple of interesting points from your link:

"She had a little dangling bead thing from the rear view mirror that had been ripped off; the back seats were down, which was odd; there were rubber mats and carpet that were in the back and those were on top of the seats," he told ABC News.


Does this mean he used the rubber/carpet mat from the back of the SUV to put on top of the folded down seats to transport the body?

"Friends and family claimed that "several" transactions were made on Heichel's ATM card at three different gas stations."

How could he stop at not one, not two but THREE gas stations and not be noticed if her body was still in the SUV. If he had already dumped it, why would he stop 3 times for gas after getting rid of the body??
The timeline just doesn't add up here. I sincerely doubt WH was ever actually seen by any person or on surveillance at all. I'm just trying to figure out why he would've stopped at 3 different gas stations risking being seen on camera while using her card 3 separate times regardless of whether she was still in the vehicle or already dumped.
 
Maybe he left the body, got gas those 3 times then went back, loaded her body as you described and proceeded to larch mountain?! Just a guess
 
Another couple of interesting points from your link:

"She had a little dangling bead thing from the rear view mirror that had been ripped off; the back seats were down, which was odd; there were rubber mats and carpet that were in the back and those were on top of the seats," he told ABC News.

Does this mean he used the rubber/carpet mat from the back of the SUV to put on top of the folded down seats to transport the body?
"Friends and family claimed that "several" transactions were made on Heichel's ATM card at three different gas stations."
How could he stop at not one, not two but THREE gas stations and not be noticed if her body was still in the SUV. If he had already dumped it, why would he stop 3 times for gas after getting rid of the body??
The timeline just doesn't add up here.
Obviously the body was transported. Unless she was already dead when shot there would be a LOT of blood in the suv. I believe that would have been reported if we heard about his prints and DNA on steering wheel. ~jmo

What the family and friends said was not confirmed by LE we do not know why.
I suspect because after thinking about it the attendant can't say it was her. BUT he did say a woman was in the front seat. I wonder if that was seen on tape as well? I am thinking no.

moo
 
I won't be surprised if Holt works out a plea deal.

As to all the discussion regarding two people being alone together and whether that is appropriate. None of that is unique to the JW faith. Our Pastor has preached on this subject too. Without getting into a lot of details, it boils down to this; the flesh is weak, don't put yourself in situations where something can happen. Sound advice :moo:

I think, too, it is a matter of respecting your partner. IOW, even if the situation is not one in which you feel even remotely in danger of being tempted, it is still important to consider whether your spouse would feel equally "okay" with the situation or relationship.

People often joke about "work wives/husbands" but depending on how far the joke goes, it can go from funny to suspect.

MOO
 
Now that I have vented----this young sweet lady has affected me more than anyone since Natalie H----I have literally cried all weekend......I just want her husband and family to know what a profound effect she has had---her smile just lights up everyone and everything around her. I would have loved to know her. God bless you all!!!

This is beautiful, made me cry and expresses my feelings (and I believe countless others worldwide) so completely accurately!!!
 
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