OXYGEN TONIGHT THE REBECCA ZAHAU CASE

Rebecca's murder is what brought me to WS in July 2011. Since then, I've posted several good articles on 911 calls and more specifically -- "when the murder is the caller." Sorry I don't have time to search/link them at the moment.

However, here's one that is provides some ideas to consider when listening to AS call;

Lying, Murder and Deceptive 911 Calls

ETA: Just Google "Is the killer the Caller?" John Cavern's blog has great info and actual 911 calls as examples. MOO
 
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The biggest fallacy of this case is the message left by Jonah at 12:50am on Rebecca’s phone. It’s a lie that’s needed to establish motive for why Rebecca would commit suicide. Dina Shacknai has said numerous times that there was no “bad news” that night concerning Max’s condition. Isn’t it ironic that the message was never heard by law enforcement, and somehow just disappeared from the phone. The absence of evidence, is evidence. The same person who wrote the message in paint on the door is probably the same person who erased the message on Rebecca Zahau’s phone. The killer was slick and wiped his DNA from the scene, but over did it. The 911 caller gives himself away immediately and he should have noticed that the table that he supposedly stood on to cut down Rebecca was missing a leg. Oops.

Opinion crafted from evidence.
CS
I am amazed at how many people who have been interviewed for this special seem to believe that Rebecca printed that message on the wall-- it is almost laughable how gullible some people can be: it is so clear that anybody could have printed that stupid message on the wall- just because it was her paint brushes they seem to assume she did that. To my way of thinking those words were meant to make it look like she wrote that as an indication of her depression. those words are gibberish. I am also shocked at how many of those people actually believe she committed suicide. But even those people who believe she killed herself must question why a woman would take her clothes off and hang herself nude--- it is absurd to believe that- and oh, stuff a rag in her mouth too--- aside from binding her hands and feet. As absurd as it is to believe it was suicide, I really fear that there will never be a legal conclusion to this case and that nobody will be charged with her murder.
 
Rebecca's murder is what brought me to WS in July 2011. Since then, I've posted several good articles on 911 calls and more specifically -- "when the murder is the caller." Sorry I don't have time to search/link them at the moment.

However, here's one that is provides some ideas to consider when listening to AS call;

Lying, Murder and Deceptive 911 Calls

ETA: Just Google "Is the killer the Caller?" John Cavern's blog has great info and actual 911 calls as examples. MOO

Didn't Adam say "the girl" hung herself when describing finding Rebecca? talk about distancing oneself from the victim!!!
 
None of the "reenactments" show the actress binding her feet, then her neck, then gagging herself, THEN binding her hands behind her and maneuvering to a balcony ledge. All of their rope experts have practiced and still only show that it's technically possible to bind your own hands and get them behind you. They ignore the rest of what they claim were the circumstances: extremely distraught, figuring it out as she went, getting rope lengths exactly right, stuffing shirt sleeves in your mouth and still having to complete the binding. etc.

I liked Episode 2 of the Oxygen series. The comments about the handwriting being bold and blocky and angry - not flowy and contrite - made perfect sense. A victim disrobing as a sign of contrition but leaving a snarky, angry message? You can't have it both ways, IMO. I appreciated the insight into Asian culture and the guy's opinion that nudity doesn't fit with "honor". And the psychologist (?) who said that bad news - even extremely bad news - doesn't push a stable person to immediate suicide. If there was a voicemail with the info JS claims, and if RZ listened to it, it seems her immediate reaction would have been to try to comfort him in any way possible - reaching out to him or maybe deciding to return to the hospital to be with him.
 
None of the "reenactments" show the actress binding her feet, then her neck, then gagging herself, THEN binding her hands behind her and maneuvering to a balcony ledge. All of their rope experts have practiced and still only show that it's technically possible to bind your own hands and get them behind you. They ignore the rest of what they claim were the circumstances: extremely distraught, figuring it out as she went, getting rope lengths exactly right, stuffing shirt sleeves in your mouth and still having to complete the binding. etc.

I liked Episode 2 of the Oxygen series. The comments about the handwriting being bold and blocky and angry - not flowy and contrite - made perfect sense. A victim disrobing as a sign of contrition but leaving a snarky, angry message? You can't have it both ways, IMO. I appreciated the insight into Asian culture and the guy's opinion that nudity doesn't fit with "honor". And the psychologist (?) who said that bad news - even extremely bad news - doesn't push a stable person to immediate suicide. If there was a voicemail with the info JS claims, and if RZ listened to it, it seems her immediate reaction would have been to try to comfort him in any way possible - reaching out to him or maybe deciding to return to the hospital to be with him.


I not only like your post, I LOVE IT!!!!!
 
None of the "reenactments" show the actress binding her feet, then her neck, then gagging herself, THEN binding her hands behind her and maneuvering to a balcony ledge. All of their rope experts have practiced and still only show that it's technically possible to bind your own hands and get them behind you. They ignore the rest of what they claim were the circumstances: extremely distraught, figuring it out as she went, getting rope lengths exactly right, stuffing shirt sleeves in your mouth and still having to complete the binding. etc.

I liked Episode 2 of the Oxygen series. The comments about the handwriting being bold and blocky and angry - not flowy and contrite - made perfect sense. A victim disrobing as a sign of contrition but leaving a snarky, angry message? You can't have it both ways, IMO. I appreciated the insight into Asian culture and the guy's opinion that nudity doesn't fit with "honor". And the psychologist (?) who said that bad news - even extremely bad news - doesn't push a stable person to immediate suicide. If there was a voicemail with the info JS claims, and if RZ listened to it, it seems her immediate reaction would have been to try to comfort him in any way possible - reaching out to him or maybe deciding to return to the hospital to be with him.
Well, exactly. The reality is if she did receive a message like that, we would have seen her calling/texting Jonah back for information. The fact that she didn’t is proof that she couldn’t.
 
It is interesting. On May 27 there was a story about Rebecca Zahau on ID; then I saw the episode yesterday on Oxygen: I thought the story on ID was good, but not nearly as detail oriented as the episode on Oxygen last night. I like the different opinions from different expert points of view and how and why these people arrived at their opinions as to what they believe really happened in this case. It was interesting that those two ladies who were bondage experts showed it was not as difficult as one might think to bind one's hands in the manner in which Rebecca was bound. But for me, that fact did not change my opinion that this was murder. There is so much more than just the bindings of the hands that leads me to believe it was murder. One thing I guess I was not aware of was the bloody knife found on the floor. It was suggested this knife was used as part of a sexual assault. How would one explain that as part of a suicide? Why would she bind her feet and stuff a rag into her mouth before killing herself? why would she strip naked (with her period no less) so she would be found in a humiliating position hanging from the balcony? why would she bind her feet
so that she would have had to hop to get to the balcony in order to hang herself.
There are a myriad of ways to kill oneself, and to think a woman would strip naked and go through all of these absurd actions in order to kill herself, defies rational thought and any type of common sense. I think the writing on the wall was, as Rebecca's sister suggested, just done to throw the police off, and it worked pretty well.

It is clear to me from what the medical examiner and police stated in their initial press conference, in coming to the conclusion that she committed suicide, that they relied much more on what they perceived was her state of mind prior to her death, than what was found at the crime scene. I think they made an assumption that she was so distraught she killed herself and they put more weight on that than the findings surrounding her death. They mentioned the last phone call she got was letting her know that Max was in a coma. I think their preconceived ideas caused them to ignore a lot of the physical findings at the crime scene. That is what I got out of watching the episode on Oxygen last night. The police and ME will never ever change their minds because they have tunnel vision and are absolutely stuck on their beliefs.

Since Adam Shaknai was on the grounds of the mansion and had a key, it is most likely that he killed her and staged the scene in an attempt to make it look a suicide and it worked. If I recall from the special on ID, Adam Shaknai admitted he was looking at *advertiser censored* prior to finding Rebecca. Hmmmm. If you think about it, the way she was found, looked a *advertiser censored* scene: hanging nude from a balcony, bound with a rag stuffed in her mouth. Hmmm
 
Over the years, most who believe this was a suicide cite Rebecca's finger prints as evidence.

Oxygen episode #2 provides very good examples of confirmation bias-- and how the investigators only collected Rebecca's finger prints, and partial prints were not investigated [24:00 min mark]. Investigators did not bother to match these to anyone.

Lack of prints also showed pretty focused processing. Comprehensive processing as if this was a "who dunnit" investigation may have revealed other prints/dna. Again, investigators targeted only select objects that would naturally have Rebecca's dna on them. Where were the "blind swabs?"

I don't believe it can ever be concluded that an offender was not inside the house where Rebecca was killed. MOO
 
Over the years, most who believe this was a suicide cite Rebecca's finger prints as evidence.

Oxygen episode #2 provides very good examples of confirmation bias-- and how the investigators only collected Rebecca's finger prints, and partial prints were not investigated [24:00 min mark]. Investigators did not bother to match these to anyone.

Lack of prints also showed pretty focused processing. Comprehensive processing as if this was a "who dunnit" investigation may have revealed other prints/dna. Again, investigators targeted only select objects that would naturally have Rebecca's dna on them. Where were the "blind swabs?"

I don't believe it can ever be concluded that an offender was not inside the house where Rebecca was killed. MOO

I agree and further IMO there is no way this is not a murder and I remain gobsmacked by the San Diego Police who clearly have tunnel vision. I don't think Rebecca will ever get the justice she and her family so deserve--Whoever murdered this young woman wanted to humiliate her in death --- they may have committed the perfect murder because the murderer is being enabled by a lazy stupid police department.
 
When I first heard of Max/Rebecca, I paid attention because it was close to home. The day I saw the pictures of Rebecca and the noose, I was sure it had to be murder. As a woman with long hair, I never put something around my neck without pulling my hair out from under it. Just a natural reaction for me and, I think, most women. I know it is simplistic, but that hair caught under the noose and shirt was my first inkling that this was murder. So much is wrong with how this was investigated.
 
When I first heard of Max/Rebecca, I paid attention because it was close to home. The day I saw the pictures of Rebecca and the noose, I was sure it had to be murder. As a woman with long hair, I never put something around my neck without pulling my hair out from under it. Just a natural reaction for me and, I think, most women. I know it is simplistic, but that hair caught under the noose and shirt was my first inkling that this was murder. So much is wrong with how this was investigated.
Yes! Good point!
 
Long time reader here, who feels compelled to speak up. These are my thoughts after watching the OWN special.

The most plausible explanation for RZ’s nakedness, which the evidence backs up, is that she was attacked/killed after she got out of the shower wrapped in a towel. The perpetrator then decided to stage her death to make it look like either a kinky sex crime or a suicide. I believe re-clothing her would’ve been too risky, as it would be difficult to dress a dead body without transferring DNA.

In my opinion, this is also why the noose was found over RH hair, rather than under it. It was simply more convenient to stage the rope that way, and required less contact with the body.

There are two interesting acts though that in my opinion, bear the particular signature of the perpetrator. First off, the note.

Angry, black, dark and cryptic, it bears the “voice” of the killer—a macabre ironic riddle directly referring to the recent fate of MS. Implicit in the message I believe, is a comparison of the two acts—“she saved him (after he pitched over the 2nd floor railing to his death) can you save her? (now that she’s also been tossed over the 2nd floor railing), the irony being that although MS survived his fall, Rebecca did not die from a fall.

In my opinion, RZ was hung over the balcony as a copycat expression or display of rage— a humiliating “how do you like it now that it’s happened to you?” I feel this aspect of the case—9 foot drops in each instance, has significance and bears further analysis.

Whoever did this, imo, consciously copied MS’s manner of death into RZ. They had intimate knowledge of what had occurred at the mansion several days prior, knew where to find the staging materials, even that RZ’s background and upbringing could convince some that suicide may be a plausible act.

Just my thoughts...
 
Last night I caught a few minutes of Marcia Clark's program- can't recall the name of it: they explored this case. The part I caught was interesting- I did not know that Adam Shaknai took a lie detector test that was allegedly interpreted as "inconclusive". Marcia Clark's expert said the test was not inclusive, it showed clearly that Shaknai lied. I was surprised at AS demeanor: he comes across as totally cold and indifferent to the situation he was involved in. I could see why the civil case jury thought he was guilty.
 
Last night I caught a few minutes of Marcia Clark's program- can't recall the name of it: they explored this case. The part I caught was interesting- I did not know that Adam Shaknai took a lie detector test that was allegedly interpreted as "inconclusive". Marcia Clark's expert said the test was not inclusive, it showed clearly that Shaknai lied. I was surprised at AS demeanor: he comes across as totally cold and indifferent to the situation he was involved in. I could see why the civil case jury thought he was guilty.
 
To me, besides all of the other red flags in this case (and God, there are so many!), the thing that makes me scratch my head is the fact that Adam Shacknai sees Rebecca hanging from a balcony, naked, bound and gagged and he immediately assumes that she killed herself. How? Like, how does that whole scenario says "suicide"? He called 991 and said that she had killed herself. I don't think that many people would look at a woman hanging from a balcony, naked, bound and gagged and say "oh this is a suicide", I would think that I was looking at a murder for sure.
 
To me, besides all of the other red flags in this case (and God, there are so many!), the thing that makes me scratch my head is the fact that Adam Shacknai sees Rebecca hanging from a balcony, naked, bound and gagged and he immediately assumes that she killed herself. How? Like, how does that whole scenario says "suicide"? He called 991 and said that she had killed herself. I don't think that many people would look at a woman hanging from a balcony, naked, bound and gagged and say "oh this is a suicide", I would think that I was looking at a murder for sure.

Thanks for the video
Also in his 911 call, he describes her as "that girl " who hung herself
And as you suggested, why would he assume she hung herself?
 

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