PA PA - Kortne Ciera Stouffer, 21, Palmyra, 29 July 2012 - #6

[bpinkbinkie]

I am leaning heavily towards the belief that this "Scary Man", (who's dad is "second leading trainer") .. is telling her a bogus story just to get a rise out of her .. and he did .. She obviously believed him .. Now we just have to wonder why he would have done such a thing. I just wonder what make him a "Scary Man" to her .. he really doesn't *look* that scary to me .. but then again .. I don't know him personally. I couldn't find a link between him and the players .. but they obviously know Amanda in common.

I think the link is the racetrack, they all work and hang out there. Although none of the players are FB friends with him.

 

[Trackergd]

I guess I am a little stuck on Amanda's story. She names names and places. That puts her at risk for her personal safety. Either she is correct with some facts a little mixed up (like which lake)...or she is a special kind of crazy to risk life and limb with such casual disregard should the actors wish to retaliate.

 

[sleuthster1]

...Meaning passed out drunk or passed out tired?

This exactly -- I get how a passed out drunk person can sleep through some "events" (her leaving, someone else coming, etc)... but if he was sober and just asleep, it's not adding up.

 

[Trackergd]

Two Unrelated Diving Specialists Critique This Week's Memorial Lake Search

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/in...g_expert_critical_of_kort.html#incart_m-rpt-1

I Found Their Specific Suggestions Useful.

Thanks for posting that Richrd. Very interesting.

 

[bpinkbinkie]

I guess I am a little stuck on Amanda's story. She names names and places. That puts her at risk for her personal safety. Either she is correct with some facts a little mixed up (like which lake)...or she is a special kind of crazy to risk life and limb with such casual disregard should the actors wish to retaliate.

I was stuck on it for a few days too...you are not alone! I think it may be a little of both.

She seems to be a special kind of crazy, she has put no less than 8 people on blast on Facebook. From posting pics of the letter from the DA naming names of the person who she recorded talking about where Kortne's body was hidden to outright being a snitch on a post from Lebanon Daily News asking if anyone recognized the man in a composite sketch. Turns out she was wrong b/c the person she repeatedly accused does not have the identifying tattoo, but the guy, his friends and Amanda were all fighting back and forth. One woman said Amanda needs to be "taught a lesson." She usually ends up deleting some comments, but not all of them. I could go on and on about they crazy, but I won't.

I just don't know, I really can't figure her out as to whether she is telling the truth or just trying to involve herself in the case. She offered at one point to post the recorded conversation, but never went through with it.

 

[aszhsh]

I wish I was wrong but Amanda doesn't know any more than each and every one of us on this forum! It upsets me to know that she has brought false hope to Kortne's family and the community! It appears to the public that LE and the DA's office aren't doing what they are supposed to be doing but that is not the case. They have very valid reasons why they dont believe her!

I'm not sure how any of us truely knows what is fact. However, I would ask you to go back and review how this case has been handled (by LE and DA) from the very beginning and then state what you did above. If they had very valid reasons why they don't believe her then why did they change the volunteer diving search to have paid state police officers do the search.

Again I am not saying that what Amanda has said is the truth. But you can not say it is not either. And most would not agree with you on the statement "It appears that LE and DA are not doing what they are suppose to be doing but that is not the case".

They did not do their job when:

They broke up the underage party and did not charge KS or the underage kids (until later when it came out in the news that KS was missing) Remember KS was cited previously for supply alcohol to a minor in the same municipality. Now doing it again, she also should have been charged.

They did not make contact with either KS or the neighbor who made the final call to dispatch for the noise complaint. And I don't want to hear that they did not want to disturb anyone since it was now quiet and the lights were out. It was the 3rd call to LE in 24 hr period of time....they had an obligation to make contact with someone. To investigate.

When they did not get the survelience footage from that area that may have shed some light on what happened.

I could go on and on but that is enough.

 

[alliemay]

Yes! They charged Kortne the first time, but not the second time, for the SAME thing. They named the first two officers who went there that night, but not the third? WHY?

 

[aszhsh]

I think the link is the racetrack, they all work and hang out there. Although none of the players are FB friends with him.

Shortly after this all happened CP and MR started deleting friends quickly. They were tricky and had some of the friends change their names but I still found some of them. At this point twitter or instagram is how they communicate.

 

[SnoopJohnB]

They broke up the underage party and did not charge KS or the underage kids (until later when it came out in the news that KS was missing) Remember KS was cited previously for supply alcohol to a minor in the same municipality. Now doing it again, she also should have been charged.

Actually, KS was charged for this. The last I looked, the case was on hold for the obvious reason. The two that were charged were charged after test results came back that showed they had been drinking.

 

[SnoopJohnB]

Yes! They charged Kortne the first time, but not the second time, for the SAME thing. They named the first two officers who went there that night, but not the third? WHY?

They actually did not "name" the first officer, as in, they never responded to any questions asking them who the first officer was. The only reason we know who it was is because it was in the paperwork on that case that was filed against KS or one of the other two.

 

[aszhsh]

Actually, KS was charged for this. The last I looked, the case was on hold for the obvious reason. The two that were charged were charged after test results came back that showed they had been drinking.

I have never saw where they charged her....are you sure that was not the first case that was still pending? Either way, there was alcohol at the party and they did not need to confirm by blood test that the 2 individuals were drinking. It is the open beverage law and Palmyra did prior and still does enforce that law like most local LE does in this area. And it does not take that long to get the blood results. I also never even saw that they took blood samples. All it said was that they drove the boys home to their parents. It was started that the only individual there of age was KS....what more did they need to charge her.

Are you honestly suggesting that LE handled this situation properly? I am getting to the point of just not posting because I feel like if anything is said against LE it is a problem. I try to have an open mind....maybe we all should. This is about bringing Kortne home!!!

 

[aszhsh]

Just searched the data base and no cases found against KS. Where are you finding your info? Maybe I am looking at the wrong place. It use to show the old case but I never saw any other charges.

 

[bpinkbinkie]

Just searched the data base and no cases found against KS. Where are you finding your info? Maybe I am looking at the wrong place. It use to show the old case but I never saw any other charges.

I only see the old case too dated 4/26/12, she pled on 7/19 or 7/20 for that case, but there is nothing on the 7/28 incident, at least not in the court system.

 

[SnoopJohnB]

I have never saw where they charged her....are you sure that was not the first case that was still pending? Either way, there was alcohol at the party and they did not need to confirm by blood test that the 2 individuals were drinking. It is the open beverage law and Palmyra did prior and still does enforce that law like most local LE does in this area. And it does not take that long to get the blood results. I also never even saw that they took blood samples. All it said was that they drove the boys home to their parents. It was started that the only individual there of age was KS....what more did they need to charge her.

Are you honestly suggesting that LE handled this situation properly? I am getting to the point of just not posting because I feel like if anything is said against LE it is a problem. I try to have an open mind....maybe we all should. This is about bringing Kortne home!!!

I am just trying to keep some facts straight. Other than that, I offered no opinions on anything. Also, I see almost no defense of LE on this thread, so I'm not sure how you feel you are vastly outnumbered.

Regarding the incident, I'll see if I can find it again tomorrow. I'm pretty busy today, but I'll see if I can dig that up tomorrow and I'll post a link if I can find it again.

One more thing, we all would like to see this resolved, right? Otherwise, we wouldn't be here. We're all on the same side.

 

[alliemay]

Quote - SnoopJohnB - "They actually did not "name" the first officer, as in, they never responded to any questions asking them who the first officer was. The only reason we know who it was is because it was in the paperwork on that case that was filed against KS or one of the other two."

We may have gotten the name of the first officer by way of paperwork that was filed against Kortne, but they named the second office in the newspaper. They did not name the third stating the only way to get the information from the police log was to file under the freedom of information act.
http://www.ldnews.com/announcements...ice-among-last-see-stouffer?source=rss_viewed

"The first 911 call was made at 3:12 a.m. for a disturbance and indicates that Patrolman Timothy Lengle arrived on the scene 3 minutes later. The dispatch record provides no additional details other than the officer reported he was leaving the scene at 3:49 a.m. - about the time Stouffer was last seen, according to a borough police news release issued about 60 hours after her disappearance."

This should say the second call, not the first, the first call was to end the drinking party.
So....it was Timothy Lengle at 3:12 a.m.

"The EMA log states that borough police were called back to Stouffer's address for another disturbance at 4:12 a.m. and left at 4:36 a.m."

It took officer Lengle around 40 minutes to respond and talk to several people and calm things down. It took the last officer 22 minutes to knock on two doors that were not answered? My point is if they can mention the second officer, Lengle, in a news article, why does one need to file a freedom of information act to know who the third one was.

 

[SnoopJohnB]

Skeet, I'm not sure if you are directing that question to me specifically. But if you are, I do not know why they did not release the name of the officer that responded the third time.

 

[alliemay]

Skeet, I'm not sure if you are directing that question to me specifically. But if you are, I do not know why they did not release the name of the officer that responded the third time.

No sorry, the later part was more like an after thought. I used your quote to point out the fact that the only way we know the first officers name was because of court documents, the third officer is not revealed, but yet they print the name of the second officer. It just seems strange to me.

 

[SnoopJohnB]

I can only guess at the reason they didn't name the third officer.
Actually, I have two guesses.

1. Because of the unfortunate event, and because the police officer did not make contact, publishing his name would probably have led to a lynch mob ready to string him up, deservedly or undeservedly.

2. At the time, the police officer could have been a potential suspect. And because of that, and because they may not have wanted to tip their hand, they opted to not release it.

 

[alliemay]

Two good points to think about.

 

[Jmomma12]

I am sure there are valid reasons they don't believe Amanda, however I find it to be rather obvious that they don't wish to spend time and resources on her case, or at least they are giving that impression by their actions.

I have worked with LE most of my life. I respect them quite a bit and have a family member in LE and have been in LE myself. That said I can be very vocal taking them to task when I am getting the impression they are impeding or dismissing a case simply because they consider the individual not worth their time for any number of reasons.

All missing and lost persons deserve to be found, even when they bring their circumstances upon themselves.

Solving this case will require tenacity, turning over every rock and listening to every witness, regardless of their perceived mental state.

As much as I want this case to be solved, I know it is impractical due to expense to drain both lakes and pump out all the containment ponds. I'm sure this is a fact not lost on LE and a rural municipal government with limited funds.

I am just a little perplexed by the seeming dismissal of the volunteer divers. I wish they would move forward on their own by obtaining PADER permits to dive the lakes and property owners permission to dive the containment ponds. At least put that possibility to rest so we could move on to woodlands searches, flyers and national alerts to LE in case she pops up somewhere else.

This brings painful memories of my ongoing case for Lauren Jackson. I am sure that a lot more resources would be been invested in the case had Lauren been the daughter of a prominent family, rather than that of a known drug user, and had the police department been larger town rather than rural with internal issues.

Trackergd,

I am only stating a fact. I know Amanda personally and I know for a fact that she does not know anymore than anyone else. She personally shared various theories with me and discussed psychic contacts she has and what they were telling her. I can assure everyone, that if I would have believed she had legitimate info, I personally would have taken her to the police and supported her. That is NOT the case!! I find it disturbing that "just for a story" PennLive would allow someone with her state of mind to put themselves out there like she did. Yes, she spouts off her theories on FaceBook but, the PennLive story really caused attention to focus on her. And irregardless of anything, she has children and now her safety and her family's safety is in question and they could be in danger, expecially if the perp thinks she knows something. I am sure the search was done because of the people in the public, that don't know her and were grasping at the hope that she may know something. This has given false hope to Kortne's family, it just isn't right.

Additionally, I am not saying that LE did everything right and I agree that when the Palmyra police went there that night, everything that should have been done was not done! Unfortunately, based on previous calls to the house because of the partying and other complaints, they probably made an assumption that the people inside were hiding from them. Unless they had reason to beleive someone inside was in immediate danger, the can't just break the door down! The next day, when they realized she was missing, I can only imagine that those involed were saying alot of shoulda, coulda, woulda's but knowbody knew that that night!

I can't imagine what her family is going through and they are often in my thoughts and prayers!