Discussion in '2000's Missing' started by arielilane, Nov 10, 2011.
Please continue Ray Gricar discussion here. Thank you
This article includes RG's nephew in a video reenactment.
This has brought a whole new dimension to Ray's case. It is obvious some at PS would go to any lengths to protect their coaches. As sickening as they all are, if they could sleep at night knowing children were being raped, then they are capable of anything.
Ray's computers were destroyed in water. Why? Was there something incriminating on them about the evil that was going on.
A football fanatic at my office today, who hasn't followed the case of Gricar at all until the last couple of days, asked me, why was the computer and subsequently the hard drive found where it was?
--If Ray comitted suicideand he wanted the hard drive erased..he couldn't be sure his toss in the water was successful. Why not dispose of it elsewhere?
--If he was killed, wouldn't the murderer want to look at the computer? And how would he know the files weren't copies off somewhere. Then dispose of it elsewhere.
--If Ray decided to disappear, it's obvious the car would be found...how could he be sure the toss in the water, would make the data on the hard drive irretrievable.....
I didn't have an answer....thoughts?
Maybe s/he did look at the computer first.
According to RG's asst, he didn't allow anyone to help with the investigation. If I were being secretive, i wouldnt allow copies of files to proliferate.
This is one of the articles on how he researched destroying the computer.
First, I should note that RFG (Mr. Gricar) did not have the laptop in 1998.
Second, RFG had ask around about how to destroy the hard drive and had purchased erasure software. The Bellefonte police chief thought that RFG had first erased the drive, though I don't know if analysis determined that.
Because RFG had both a home computer (where he did the computer searches), no murderer could have known if there were additional copies of data.
The drive was tossed prior to the laptop going into the river.
Some site photos are here: https://picasaweb.google.com/LookingforRay I think the description will probably answer your questions.
Normally I wouldn't put too much stock in a rumor such as the "rich donors" story that is making the rounds on the internet http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/10/penn-state-scandal-rumors-sandusky-pimping_n_1086099.html
But, it is concerning that the "rich donors" story was reported by the same sports writer who had the Sandusky story nailed way back in April
Three Reasons To Be Skeptical Of The Sandusky Kiddie-Sex-Ring Rumor, And One Reason Not To Be (Deadspin)
An Interview With The Radio Host Who Dropped That Jerry Sandusky Kiddie-Sex-Ring Rumor On Everybody (Deadspin)
I posted these earlier on the Sandusky/Paterno/PSU thread.
I still think he left on his own. Even with all the hoopla going on right now, I still think he planned his exit - and had been planning it for quite some time, at least as far back as announcing that he was not running for re-election in 2005.
What is the significance of photo #2 in parking lot photos where it says " the house porch borders the lot." Thanks
So, J. J. you think Ray tossed the drive and then the computer in. How does one know the drive went in first?
I know he didn't have it 1998...but he could have transferred his 1998 notes to it or even created them, or had new information.
Now, I'm thinking someone else tossed it....maybe even at a later date from the disappearance to add credence to the "he drowned in the river/suicide theory. "
Has Patty Fornicola commented on any of this? She is another one I'm wondering what did she know and if she did when did she know it. It has just always seemed strange to me for one adult to report another adult missing after 12 hours....something drove that.
Thanks, I missed the other thread so I appreciate you bringing them over.
I sure hope there is nothing to the donor story but, if there is, it would definitely introduce a new potential angle with individuals powerful and wealthy enough to make Mr. Gricar disappear permanently or scare him into disappearing voluntarily.
I never said who, just that the drive went in first. I think RFG tossed the drive, but I'm not sure about the laptop itself. That is actually one of the reasons I think murder is possible.
No, and I suspect she won't.
She, like everyone else was thinking accident. RFG was known to be an "adventurous" driver. He was once pulled over for driving 90 on a back road.
Have followed one DA to Lewisburg once, I think it is an occupational hazard.
I'm going to stick to my initial opinion; even with the latest groundbreaking news and that is that RG left on his on his accord with a sizable savings. Since the "news" broke it is evident to me that there were too many people that knew about the child molestation at PS, that would have to be killed. So why kill RG? He wasn't prosecuting.
May be he was tired of his life and that was the final straw. As such, not being about to prosecute a case that he wanted to might have sent him... literally packing. jmo>>
Recent events push me more into the foul play camp...(maybe 60% vs. 40% for walkaway, whereas a week ago, I would have said the reverse.) Yes, he did not prosecute the 1998 crime, but I agree with Tony Gricar and Ray's associate that the reason was likely evidence based rather than Ray being involved in a conspiracy to cover up this crime. Ray was cautious and careful....possibly over cautious regarding 1998 charges. I don't like that the first crime didn't go to trial, but I'm not willing to put Ray in the same camp as the Penn State athletic officials with what we know now.
The 1998 case was not dismissed with prejudice...That case could be reopened up to the statute of limitations of 2005 for that crime.
There was a 2002 crime. It strains at credibility that rumors wouldn't be out there in the Penn State community regarding the 2002 event, given that there was a witness who reported it to others....people talk. I feel strongly that if Ray had gotten wind of the 2002 crime, he would have been investigating Sandusky a second time....He could have been investigating the whole athletic department for all we know or Sandusky's charity or its wealthy donors.
Murder for hire is not that far of a stretch given what we know now about the extent of the conspiracy. Murder for hire would explain the dumped computer in the river planted to make it look like a suicide. The computer searches for hard disk destruction could also have been planted.
Ray walking away does not explain the laptop in the river...he would not have wanted his precious daughter to think he had jumped from the bridge...The laptop could have gone with him and disposed elsewhere (privately). Given where the car was left the river search was predictable.
The only one gaining from the suicide suspicion is someone who did away with Ray and wanted to make it look like something else.
Could the conflict of interest of Ray's successor be related to some connection to Penn State (and said prosecutor wanting to make sure Ray's disappearance was investigated independently of this Sandusky mess)?
The buildings are quite close. It would be hard for someone to grab RFG or shoot him, and not be heard by a number of people in the area. If he screamed for help, he'd likely be heard.
That is my laptop "problem." One possibility, however, is that RFG would realize everyone would be looking for drive if the found the laptop minus drive. If the drive was in the water for 1-2 weeks, it would be almost impossible to recover the data.
MTM is not talking.
If it was he knew Sandusky or one of the victims, he could have just said that; a lot of people knew him.
I think he tossed the laptop/hard-drive for two reasons:
1) to bolster the suicide theory (e.g., work drove him crazy, etc) so that he could be declared legally dead, no one would keep hunting for him alive, and his daughter could get her inheritance or whatever.
2) to send a message to someone (if there was anyone to convince) that he destroyed any evidence that might have been incriminating, so that whoever that was would lose interest in him and like LE would stop looking for him.
That's the best I can come up with...
I do think murder is possible, but it just doesn't seem likely with his advanced decision not to seek re-election and the comment about not being there in April for some trial. Perhaps he planned an escape and didn't exit soon enough? I'm still betting on him leaving on his own, though.
Anyone know what department Ray's first wife worked in at Penn State?
In 1980, Mrs. Gricar took an administrative position at Penn State; the family moved to State College.*
His first wife Barbara Gricar, was employed by Penn State.
She is a professor at Smeal business.
Separate names with a comma.