PA PA - White Haven, 'Beth Doe' & Unborn Baby 169UFPA, 16-22, Dec'76 - #2

Discussion in 'The Unidentified' started by Cubby, Dec 16, 2010.

  1. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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  2. apearn

    apearn Active Member

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    I'm just googling the initials and looking for anything that pops up and looks like an address:

    2990 W. S.R.44. DeLand, Florida
     
  3. apearn

    apearn Active Member

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    I saw a TV show about a missing girl the other night. It took several months for her to be identified because the missing report listed the date (for last known alive) as the date the report was taken. The person who entered it never entered the last seen date.

    So the body was found in Sept. but the report had January on it so the connection was never made until the mother insisted on a dental records check in about March.

    I'm just wondering how many times that blunder may have been made in the past and how it may effect cases such as this.
     
  4. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    You are referring to Samantha Bonnell. Her thread is right here:

    Identified! CA-(Update: Identified) Traffic Accident: San Bernardino White Female - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community


    Paula Beverly Davis (AKA the Blue Bandanna Girl) was another case that went 22 years without an identification for the same reason. The Missing Persons Report Date was entered in the DLC (Date of Last Contact) field in the NCIC record.

    Identified! OH-Paula Beverly Davis (28ufoh-WarningMorguePhoto-MATCH??) - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
     
  5. apearn

    apearn Active Member

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    Yes. That sounds like her case.

    I made a facebook page for Beth Doe. Maybe if it gets around someone's memory will get jogged.
     
  6. apearn

    apearn Active Member

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    Has anyone ever considered Valarie Lorraine Cuccia ?

    http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/138dfny.html



    Date Of Birth: October 16, 1953
    Age at Time of Disappearance: 20 years old
    Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 5'6; 120 pounds
    Distinguishing Characteristics: White female. Black hair; brown eyes.
    Dentals: Available.
    Marks, Scars: Cuccia has a scar on her left calf.
     
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  7. Snufamonbobball

    Snufamonbobball But O for the touch of the vanished hand & the sou

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  8. CCJD

    CCJD Well-Known Member

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  9. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    They've always been Beth and Baby Doe.
     
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  10. apearn

    apearn Active Member

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    This guy was found a little over 3 weeks later than her - about 60 miles away on a pretty straight run south from White Haven - dead of a suicide.

    I'd bet - if they could find his body and match the baby's DNA, he'd be the father.


    http://doenetwork.org/cases/1299umpa.html

    Unidentified White Male


    •The victim was discovered on January 16, 1977 in Albany Township, Berks County, Pennsylvania
    •Probable Year of Death: 1977
    •Cause of Death: Suicide by drug overdose
    •State of Remains: Recognizable Face


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Vital Statistics

    •Estimated age: 25-35 years old
    •Approximate Height and Weight: 5'10"-5'11; 155 lbs.
    •Distinguishing Characteristics: Reddish brown, long and curly hair; blue eyes. Full beard. T-shaped scar on left side of chin.
    •Clothing: Dark brown suede/buckskin jacket with tassels on the sleeves and torso (size 38); faded blue jeans (Wrangler brand, size 30x34); brown leather belt; brown, knit turtleneck sweater (labeled Jules Pilch-Doylestown/Hatboro, size "M"); long winter undershirt and pants (size "S"), military issue with laundry mark B-0654; two pair of socks (one pair black, the other wool); brown leather hiking boots, ankle length with black Vibran soles (size 10-10 1/2); leather gloves; sunglasses.
    •Personal Effects: He was wearing a 14K white gold ring with a blue stone; his pockets contained a comb, pen, pencil, matches and $1.78.
    •Fingerprints: Not Available
    •Dentals: Not Available


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Case History
    The frozen body of the victim was found by two hikers in a cave below an area called The Pinnacle along the Appalachian Trail, in Albany Township, Pennsylvania on January 16, 1977. The cave where he was found is only accessible by foot.
    There is little documentation available for this unidentified man. Any photos, autopsy reports, possible fingerprints or dental records have been lost. He was buried in the Berks County Potters Field, however, there are no burial plot records available and his exact location in the cemetery is unknown at this time.
     
  11. Carolyn H.

    Carolyn H. New Member

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    I'm familiar with this area. The Pinnacle is a pretty popular hiking area, especially in the fall when you get great views. It's well known, anyway, and it's a bit of a stretch, I think, to assume this unknown man was involved with Beth and baby Doe. It's possible, of course, but I don't think there's any reason to connect the two.
     
  12. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    This article was posted in the thread for the bodies found recently on Long Island, but it includes information about many other LI murders. http://www.longislandpress.com/2011/03/24/long-islands-other-serial-killer/5/

    At least two of the dumped bodies are dismembered and in luggage, which I thought was an interesting connection. It's certainly within the realm of possibility that Beth's murderer started looking for a dump site closer to home, if he came from NYC.
     
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  13. apearn

    apearn Active Member

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    I'm wondering what the population of that area was in 1976. It seems a pretty tight distance and timeframe to have an unidentified homicide victim & an unidentified suicide victim that are unrelated - and both never identified.

    There is a resovoir right by there. Do you know if a car was ever found in it?

    I'm thinking he could have been there a week or so longer than they think since it was a cold time of year. Richard Kluklinski used to freeze his victims to mess up the time of death.

    I keep looking at this girl as well: http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1290dfmd.html

    and wondering if she was pregnant and that was the 'family problems'.

    She seems more likely to have gone in the bay than a river 3 hours north - unless there was some connection to PA.
     
  14. Ambercat

    Ambercat New Member

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    I know that this is probably a coincidence, but besides Doe Network Case File 598UFCA and Doe Network Case File 147UFPA, I remembered another case of a dark haired possibly foreign women dismembered in suitcases -- Doe Network Case File 338UFNV.

    http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/338ufnv.html
     
  15. apearn

    apearn Active Member

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    The other day I was watching a show...I think it was called Runaways. It had 2 young females who had run away. I was astonished about the time that had lapsed - one had been away from her family 11 years or so and the other one 5 years. Both were out on the streets.

    Basically ,it made me think to go back further in time for possible matches.

    This one caught my eye.

    [​IMG]


    Rose Lena Cole
    Missing since the July 1, 1973 from Oakland, Alameda County, California
    Classification: Endangered Runaway


    Vital Statistics
    •Date Of Birth: December 23, 1956
    •Age at Time of Disappearance: 16 years old
    •Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 5'3"-5'6"; 120 -130 lbs.
    •Distinguishing Characteristics: White female. Brown hair; green/hazel eyes.
    •Dentals: Not available
    •DNA: Available


    Circumstances of Disappearance
    Cole was last seen in Oakland, California in the summer of 1973. Cole was last seen in Oakland, California. She could be missing from California, Michigan, or in between.

    After an incident of running away from home and apparent participation with drugs, Cole was sent by the court in Flint, Michigan, to reside at Synanon drug rehabilitation program in the summer of 1972. Synanon was initially a drug rehabilitation program founded by Charles Dederich Sr. in 1958 in Santa Monica, California. Her date of disappearance can not quite be pinned down. The last letter her family received was dated December 1972, but was not mailed for over a month. According to her letters, her family situation was difficult for her. In them she begged to come home and to be loved.



    Thoughts?
     

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  16. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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  17. rlc

    rlc New Member

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    Does anyone know if this person has been ruled out for Beth Doe?

    http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/31dfvic.html

    She has a mole in the same location, brown hair, brown eyes, and olive complexion. She took pictures from the family album before she left, and her family believes she was going somewhere with a boyfriend. PA is a long way from Australia, but if New York City was her actual destination/home for two years, and then said boyfriend dumped her in PA, I suppose it's possible.

    Thoughts?
     
  18. webrocket

    webrocket New Member

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  19. Ambercat

    Ambercat New Member

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    The NamUs listing doesn't list any rule outs. I was wondering if there were any and who they were?

    I also wanted to know how they came up with the nickname "Beth." Was there something with the body to indicate this was her name in life (like Valerie Doe from Northern Nevada) or someone thought that she looked like a Beth, or ???
     
  20. tragco

    tragco Member

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    This is a really sad case and I have been thinking about it for quite a while.

    I was thinking that the gunshot wound is odd. That's a strange place to shoot someone- in the neck. Why not shoot her in the head? In fact, why shoot her at all? The killer was obviously strong to cut her up like that with a fine serrated blade (likely a hacksaw). She was strangled first, and he knew he killed her that way. Why then shoot her in the neck afterward? That's pure risk: risk of someone hearing the shot, risk of someone finding the bullet. Since it was unnecessary and risky it's something he just wanted to do.

    He definitely planned this murder. I just don't think a full term pregnant woman would be travelling with three suitcases of identical size. Those suitcases were obtained with their purpose already known. He cut off the handles and painted the zippers black- he prepared them beforehand.

    He had a place where he felt completely safe too. It takes a while to cut up a body like that. I figure he was not worried about the length of time, the huge amounts of blood, or the gunshot sound. I bet he had access to a locked room/shed/basement to store hacksaws, tools, paint, and three big prepared suitcases. Was it a safe room in a crowded area? I don't think so. I think it was a remote setting, maybe farmland. There's the straw in the suitcase.

    Here's a wierd thing: Why go to all the trouble to dismember the body and place it in suitcases? It's easier, less messy, and less dangerous to simply bag a body and put it in the trunk. He wasn't doing it to try to separate the body parts because he threw all three suitcases in the same place. He did that because he was afraid he might be seen putting her in the vehicle and he had to make sure that it looked like suitcases and not a body.

    So he has a remote place somewhere with a room/shed yet is afraid of being seen putting something in the trunk. Why? Because he lives with someone else who might see him, someone other than Beth Doe. Someone who is used to the sound of a gun around the place because he is a hunter, which is why the police said he "knew what he was doing" when he dismembered her poor body. Someone who'd had a flowered chenille bedspread for a long time. A woman. I figure his only means of transportation was a pickup truck and he had to use suitcases to disguise the body when he went to dump it.

    Beth Doe depended on her killer for food, clothing, and shelter. She was found so very soon after her death. Surely the police were looking out and asking around for a missing full term pregnant woman. Yet she was not reported missing. She wasn't reported missing because the killer was her family and didn't report it on purpose. Also poor Beth Doe would have been missed if she had a job or close neighbors. It is no coincidence that she was killed near full term. There was something about that pregnancy that put her killer in danger and yet he kept her around as long as he possibly could, until the baby was about to be born. The killer wasn't her husband because then there would be no stigma to the pregnancy.

    She had gold fillings but missing teeth at a young age. This speaks of a good beginning but a financial hardship in the last several years of her life. She was around 20. I don't think the man was her natural father because- sorry to be graphic- she would have been pregnant sooner. I think her natural father left or died, leaving her mother much poorer. Her mother later took up with this other sadist who kept to himself and made sure his womenfolk kept to themselves. He got Beth Doe pregnant and became afraid his secret would be known. He blamed it on her, was furious with her, thought of her as a slut and therefore the cutting off of the nose and ears. He told Beth's mother some story about taking her off somewhere else to live. Beth Doe's mother was weak, abused, and had no means to support herself so she accepted this.

    That's my crazy theory anyway. The killer was her stepfather, a guy who lived in a rural area and kept him and his family to himself, a guy who was pretty strong and mean. He didn't like anybody and nobody liked him. There was a run down house (a remnant of the earlier, more financially stable times) with a locked shed on the premises. He didn't have much money and was driving an old vehicle, probably a pickup truck, when he disposed of her body. He didn't live all that far away from the disposal site. He liked to hunt and liked guns. He was probably in the military at some point because of the suitcase preparation.

    I'm still thinking about how the newspaper and writing on Beth Doe's hand fits into all this.
     
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