Parents Fake Religion to Avoid Vaccines

Holy smokes this is a most frightening post .Question for all.. is this the prevailing belief or is this an aberration?Am I understanding you to say that these diseases we have generally eradicated are not deadly because there were survivors as well as people that did not get it?
Agree or disagree,I appreciate and admire all the research that many of you do, particularly those of you that are anti-vaccine. But if this is the prevailing thought process, it undermines the credibility of much of it.IMO.

Apparently you mis-read what I'm trying to say. Let me clarify.

the diseases themselves don't kill, the complications of the disease, many times---though not always--from improper treatment--do. If getting the disease itself was what was so deadly, NO ONE would be alive today because our forebearers would have all been wiped out)
THE COMPLICATIONS that arise from the disease are what makes the diseases deadly. My parents survived measles, mumps, rubella, pneumonia, and the flu, and I survived CP. My grandparents also survived measles and mumps, unsure if they got any others. THEY GOT THE DISEASES. GETTING THESE DISEASES DID NOT KILL US. If you do any research on say, mayoclinic.com, you will find exactly what I am talking about--that complications that can arise from these diseases are what kill. So the complications are what makes these diseases deadly and can kill, that dosn't mean that if someone gets measles they will die! That is the point I am making.

And no I am NOT afraid of the diseases! I have respect for them, and realize they need to be treated properly IF they should happen. If I had no respect for them and didn't realize their harmful potential, then I would just blindly go along and stick my head in a hole and think "oh because they are pretty much eradicated that means my child won't get them." Wrong, he (and any person, vaxed or unvaxed) can get them and one needs to know how to treat them properly so one dosn't get serious lasting consequences! Having respect for them means educating myself on how to recognize the signs and symptoms and how to have my child safely come through them. If things progress despite treatments, I also have a naturopath and an allopathic doctor who can help to make sure my child will come through safely.
 
I purposely have stayed off this thread after I posted because it is an emotionally charged issue. (I don't want to get banned. LOL)

However, I believe people failed to understand the reference to my generation vs. now. While I realize that the terminology of Autism wasn't diagnosed until much later, I have eyes. I have always been very aware of our disabled and cared very deeply about what they faced. In our small town, we had 3 out of 2,000 people who presented with disabilities. (I used to visit them on a regular basis growing up.) Only 1 of those had the signs of Autism, which I am now acutely aware of and can readily see in this man. The same small town today...with the new terminology (the town has lessened to 1000 people) several have been now diagnosed with Autism.

While I realize this is not a study of significance in any way...to me it is a clear sign things have changed.

I have used my town in other ways to study our environment and the effects. It is a good barometer for unscientific study, imo. (I tried to do an article on the incidence of unusual cancers which were much higher in that particular community, but people flatly refused to cooperate as it could have jeopordized their livelihoods by shutting down the town's only company.)

Another question I have is...have they changed the formulas in vaccinations of the very shots we were given as children? I know they have added to the list with tons of new ones, but are the same formulas still being used in the shots from 40 some years ago? Have they perfected those? Who really knows?

The only "hocus pocus" going on is with the drug manufacturers and the CDC. (They are talented at making studies disappear or appear to back their claims.) I understand they believe in the greater good and feel their choices are rationalized by avoiding epidemics. (They also believe in the billions of dollars being generated in their favor and have lobbyists to insure it will continue.) However, I will always contend they need to develop vaccines which will NOT harm any children in any way or find a way to test children to identify them before they are put at such risk. (I applaud Jenny McCarthy for her forward thinking and action.)
 
<We are weakening the immune systems of our entire race because we are supposed to pass on the antibodies and EVOLVE into stronger beings. The bugs are gonna win people.>

Exactly.. I almost said the same thing last night! THAT'S WHAT WE HAVE IMMUNE SYSTEMS FOR,, PEOPLE!!! Isn't it true that the fittest survive?? We are weakening our immune systems more and more by bcoming so dependent on vaccines, on antibiotics, anti-bacterial stuff.. but our humane view os that 'every person must be saved'. Well... by doing this.. we are weakening ourselves as a WHOLE... and making things harder for humanity down the line. But the typical way of thinking is,, 'Who cares about that? That's my great-grandchildrens' problem, not mine!'

I think parents who vaccinate are playing with fire. They assume everything's going to be fine, because everyone's doing it, everyone says it's OK.. and it usually is... except when it ISN'T. And just ask the parents of autistic and retarded children about that.
 
And just ask the parents of autistic and retarded children about that.
To be fair, ASDs aren't always caused by a vax....there's a lot of other factors out there as well. I see your point and I'm not criticizing you, I just wanted to make it clear to all reading that vaxes are not the only cause for ASDs or other illnesses. Enough people think we're nutjobs already and I just want to make sure there aren't misunderstandings.
 
I am having trouble posting my link to the above article for some reason. When I figure out how to post this pdf format article, I will post my link to the above article...

Anyone who would claim that because we MAY breathe more mercury in the air than we take in via vaccine absorption (I'd like to see the stats on that), MUST mean that the mercury, not to mention the other adjuvants contained in vaccines which can cause harm), doesn't harm these kids/adults, is woefully misinformed. Sounds to me like something coming from Paul Offit's rhetoric re: 'vaccines are as safe as candy' quote.

I have also been a member of the National Vaccine Information Center for over a decade. There is a wealth of information on that website as well. Barbara Loe Fisher started this organization after her son, too, suffered horrendous side effects from the whole cell DPT vaccine as an infant.

The list of known cause and effects of vaccines just goes on and on and on. Efforts to quell parental fears about vaccines is not working, as more and more infants become sick. Autism is usually diagnosed at around the age of 3. Our schools are buckling under the pressure with having to support with accommodations these kids...kids you didn't see when I was in school.

The time will come when medical science will have to face up to what they've done to so many of our children and adults because of the known harm vaccines have caused. I am currently researching the numbers of side effects and deaths regarding the new vaccine Gardasil. It's just appalling what is happening here, and the one researcher who actually worked for over 20 years on this vaccine, who has actually come out and stated quite vocally her misgivings about the PR being done on this vaccine, is, of course, blacked out by our media. You won't hear about her on ABC News Tonight.

Parents need to start thinking for themselves and do their own research BEFORE vaccinating. More and more researchers, scientists, physicians, etc., are now becoming much more vocal about the harmful effects vaccines can cause.

I in NO WAY said that. So you don't respect medical science? Well, I'm sorry. I most certainly don't respect Govt. influenced science, or the suppression of sound science, especially over the past 8 years, but we have some of the best researchers and scientists, and doctors in the world.

New research comes up, like about women taking hormones, and doctors adjust accordingly; yes they find that mistakes have been made.

But overall, we have all been healthier as a result of vaccines such as the polio vaccine, the diptheria/tetanus, now the pneumonia. To suggest otherwise is ludicrous. Yes, a small portion of the population may have a reaction to a vaccine.

Many of us, as well as our children, would be DEAD, without vaccines. Too many of us have forgotten those scary times, when polio was spreading across the nation; children were kept inside and could not go anywhere or out to play.

We had a bad flu pandemic in the '60s. The only reason we haven't had huge epidemics the past decades is because of the populace being vaccinated.

Small pox is another horrible disease we have just about erradicated, but even it is making a comeback.

You ARE right about educating ourselves,as I had mentioned in the prior posts, and asking about vaccines, what's in them, and what percentage might have a "reaction". Usually it is very small.
 
fragile... no i totally agree and thank you for making that clear. and it's not like mercury is ONLY found in vaccines.. it's in the air, the water, food, soil.... thanks to coal-fired powered plants, gold mining, and the industrial processes, medical applications (vaccinations and dentistry), the dumping of waste in landfills. but there is so much other junk in the environment now it's a wonder any of us are sane or healthy at all.
 
Apparently you mis-read what I'm trying to say. Let me clarify.

THE COMPLICATIONS that arise from the disease are what makes the diseases deadly. My parents survived measles, mumps, rubella, pneumonia, and the flu, and I survived CP. My grandparents also survived measles and mumps, unsure if they got any others. THEY GOT THE DISEASES. GETTING THESE DISEASES DID NOT KILL US. If you do any research on say, mayoclinic.com, you will find exactly what I am talking about--that complications that can arise from these diseases are what kill. So the complications are what makes these diseases deadly and can kill, that dosn't mean that if someone gets measles they will die! That is the point I am making.

And no I am NOT afraid of the diseases! I have respect for them, and realize they need to be treated properly IF they should happen. If I had no respect for them and didn't realize their harmful potential, then I would just blindly go along and stick my head in a hole and think "oh because they are pretty much eradicated that means my child won't get them." Wrong, he (and any person, vaxed or unvaxed) can get them and one needs to know how to treat them properly so one dosn't get serious lasting consequences! Having respect for them means educating myself on how to recognize the signs and symptoms and how to have my child safely come through them. If things progress despite treatments, I also have a naturopath and an allopathic doctor who can help to make sure my child will come through safely.

Excellent post, fragile, and thanks for the clarification.

My sister, a massage therapist and a person very into holistic health, will probably not vaccinate her kids. I did vaccinate mine (mainly b/c DH thought it was important and I didn't feel strongly one way or another).

It doesn't bother me when people choose not to vaccinate their kids - it doesn't make me worry about these diseases coming back. Maybe they will come back, but as you point out - that might not be the worst thing in the world as it is how we were built to survive from generation to generation.

I am still amazed at how strong the feelings are on this issue. This has been a very interesting thread.
 

Thanks for the link. Clearly deaths are astoundly down from these diseases. And now we can keep from getting hepatitis; a very serious and deadly disease. It is recommended college students get the meningitis shot; we all have read how that can kill in a matter of days.

Here is info about Coal Plants:

"coal-fired power plants are also the largest polluter of toxic mercury pollution...."

http://www.sierraclub.org/cleanair/factsheet/power.asp

Here in Texas we have alot of coal plants, and more that may be opened. I think we just voted some of them down.

Coal plants are dirty, dirty; and especially harmful to people who live anywhere near them. Alot of times people don't even realize they DO live near a coal plant.

Again, I certainly hope they can or have taken the mercury out of children's shots. Why risk it? But I know they have to preserve the vaccine in some way.
 
fragile... no i totally agree and thank you for making that clear. and it's not like mercury is ONLY found in vaccines.. it's in the air, the water, food, soil.... thanks to coal-fired powered plants, gold mining, and the industrial processes, medical applications (vaccinations and dentistry), the dumping of waste in landfills. but there is so much other junk in the environment now it's a wonder any of us are sane or healthy at all.

It is true....so very true. It's very hard to avoid any contaminants anymore. I try to avoid coming in contact with them as much as possible, but obviously I have to breathe and live. That does not mean I want my child injected with potential toxins...his immune system has enough to do battle with already. http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/appendices/B/excipient-table-2.pdf

Also with the above links, there is no denial that vaxes helped finish many of the diseases. However the rates were already dropping and things to help cut down on them, like improved knowledge of sanitation and clean water, did dramatically reduce death before the vax was introduced. My point, they did HELP, but they were not the sole item that helped put an end to polio and smallpox for instance.

Also, http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/safety.pdf, the quote underneath "Decreases in Disease Risks" is quite interesting.
 
fragile... no i totally agree and thank you for making that clear. and it's not like mercury is ONLY found in vaccines.. it's in the air, the water, food, soil.... thanks to coal-fired powered plants, gold mining, and the industrial processes, medical applications (vaccinations and dentistry), the dumping of waste in landfills. but there is so much other junk in the environment now it's a wonder any of us are sane or healthy at all.

Well, does anyone wonder about our huge cancer rate? They say the deaths are down, but the CASES are not down.

Half the people we know at our age are getting cancer.

I think we need to remember most vaccines are researched a long time before given out.

Would you really let your kids go without polio vaccines? Not me. I disagree that you die just from "complications". Well, you wouldn't get "complications" from pneumonia if you didn't get pneumonia to begin with.

Polio is a "complication" itself; whooping cough is deadly, period. Sure, some people have better immune systems than others; if we want to go back to the 1930's where alot of people died in their 30's and 40's, well......
 
Reb, Thimoseral (?sp) mercury preservative was banned in shots in 1999, but there is leftover stock still in use. You have to make sure your provider is not using those shots. The flu shot is recommended for pregnant women, as getting the flu during pregnancy is putting the fetus at high risk and the mother will feel even crappier than normal. I got one when I was pregnant. My child is not autistic.

OMG, how cold I have missed this thread!!!:eek:

I wasn't going to comment until I read it all, but there are SO MANY UNTRUTHS that I just have to start now.

NO, this is statement is NOT TRUE. in 1999 the FDA gently advised Big Pharma to possibly consider phasing out the preservative Thimerosal from childhood vaccines after it was discovered that a miscalculation had been made in the micrograms of mercury a tiny infant was receiving in ONE ROUND of vaccinations. With the added immunization in the schedule, an 8 pound baby was receiving MORE mercury that what the CDC was claiming safe in a 250 pound man.

There was no ban, and no one was forces, but the liability issues where becoming too awesome, and Big Pharma knew they HAD to or lose their A$$E$
 
You wanna vaccinate your child? Go ahead. If yours is "protected" then my non-vaccinated child should not be a threat.

My sister homeschooled her kids because of this. Screw the goverment MAKING you do something you think may harm your child. Vaccines IMO suck. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ is the driving force. We are weakening the immune systems of our entire race because we are supposed to pass on the antibodies and EVOLVE into stronger beings. The bugs are gonna win people.

If there is even a QUESTION that vaccines may be a link to causing autism, then you should be able to opt out until someone can prove that they don't. So far, many facts support the link. Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you :)

I LOve you!:blowkiss:
 
OMG, how cold I have missed this thread!!!:eek:

I wasn't going to comment until I read it all, but there are SO MANY UNTRUTHS that I just have to start now.

NO, this is statement is NOT TRUE. in 1999 the FDA gently advised Big Pharma to possibly consider phasing out the preservative Thimerosal from childhood vaccines after it was discovered that a miscalculation had been made in the micrograms of mercury a tiny infant was receiving in ONE ROUND of vaccinations. With the added immunization in the schedule, an 8 pound baby was receiving MORE mercury that what the CDC was claiming safe in a 250 pound man.

There was no ban, and no one was forces, but the liability issues where becoming too awesome, and Big Pharma knew they HAD to or lose their A$$E$

That may be true. But have they banned the mercury NOW? No one has answered my question.
 
The vaccines may be researched a long time but not the effects...they are monitored only for a short time, days to 1-2 weeks, where it can take a while for a bad effect to show up. Not always, but sometimes.

Would you really let your kids go without polio vaccines? Not me. I disagree that you die just from "complications". Well, you wouldn't get "complications" from pneumonia if you didn't get pneumonia to begin with.

Polio is a "complication" itself; whooping cough is deadly, period. Sure, some people have better immune systems than others; if we want to go back to the 1930's where alot of people died in their 30's and 40's, well......
Whooping cough, if you look at the links I provided above, is not always deadly. My neice came through it fully-vaxed. She also did not have the classic whoop, which led her to be misdiagnosed for a while, as well as denial that she could have it because she was fully vaxed on schedule. If you don't want to get sick, then do the basic things to not get sick. Learn about how polio came about and what was done to eradicate it by looking at the links above, it was more good water and sanitation than the vax. And if you disagree that you don't die of the complications, rather then the illnesses running through their course safely, then please don't tell any doctor that, they will think you're more of a nutjob than non-vaxers. ETA, obviously this doesn't necessarily include cancer for instance, but for the sake of simplicity, I'm limiting that assertion to the topic of this thread, which is the VPDs

And to answer your last question I AGAIN re-post these links
http://www.fda.gov/cber/vaccine/thimerosal.htm#thi
http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/appendices/B/excipient-table-2.pdf
scroll to the bottom where the * is.
 
The vaccines may be researched a long time but not the effects...they are monitored only for a short time, days to 1-2 weeks, where it can take a while for a bad effect to show up. Not always, but sometimes.

Whooping cough, if you look at the links I provided above, is not always deadly. My neice came through it fully-vaxed. She also did not have the classic whoop, which led her to be misdiagnosed for a while, as well as denial that she could have it because she was fully vaxed on schedule. If you don't want to get sick, then do the basic things to not get sick. Learn about how polio came about and what was done to eradicate it by looking at the links above, it was more good water and sanitation than the vax. And if you disagree that you don't die of the complications, rather then the illnesses running through their course safely, then please don't tell any doctor that, they will think you're more of a nutjob than non-vaxers.

And to answer your last question I AGAIN re-post these links
http://www.fda.gov/cber/vaccine/thimerosal.htm#thi
http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/downloads/appendices/B/excipient-table-2.pdf
scroll to the bottom where the * is.

I'm married to a physician, thanks. I protected my children from whooping cough;my mother used to tell me tales of people who got whooping cough and barely survived, or died.

About autism, more boys than girls get it. Why? Evidently you can ask now for shots without mercury. "do things not to get sick?" What are those? Sorry, if I teach thirty kindegartners with coughs and runny noses, that's pretty tough. Of course we know to wash our hands as much as possible; but that will not stop a rapid spread of airborne disease such as flu.

Most feel that the dangers of the diseases are worse than possible reactions from the shots these days.

http://www.shareyourstory.org/webx/.ef48dfb

This is a discussion that occurred after Jenny McCarthy was on Oprah; evidently the jury is still out on what causes Autism.
 
As a child, I had whooping cough and german measles. My brother had the mumps, my sister and brother had a lesser form of measles, but I never caught either of those nor did they catch whooping cough from me. They theorized I had a natural immunity at the time. When everyone else was walking around with a small pox vaccination scar...I was the only child without. I was given the vaccination, but it did not produce the scarring anticipated. Again, they theorized I must have a natural immunity.

Are some children born with a natural immunity and when given such vaccinations are subject to a reaction later in the immune system due to this? I think it is a possibility worth looking into.
 
I was married to an Engineer and they still won't take my advice when they build nuclear power plants or water treatment plants. : )
 
Well if you're married to a doctor then no doubt you're quite familiar with the answers to your questions already, obviously you know quite a bit about immunology, you know how to research such sites like the CDC's and FDA's and therefore appear looking more to argue here than to really try and understand.
 

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