Patsy Drunk? and Nine Other Qs...

[OldBackstop]

I am new here, but I have read extensively on Reddit and many of the books. I have been an IDI, but I am open to persuasion. I'm old....lol....possibly these answers are in something I read and I forget.

I am rewatching the Larry King Thomas vs. Ramseys heavyweight interview.

1. Does anyone have a bio on Steve Thomas? How old he was at the time of the murder, experience, education, other homicides? I can't find any of that. Also what he is doing now?

2. Has there been any testimony given by Patsy or about her as to whether she had been drinking and, if so, how much? She had been at a number of parties. Did she drink at all? I could picture being a little or more drunk, exhausted, having an early plane, and snapping at my kid over bedwetting and her falling into the corner of a sink or whatever. (and I had twins, lol, high snap potential)

3. I have read that the head wound had a low amount of bleeding inside and none outside. I have also read and seen photos (finger scrapes around the ligature, that indicate the garroting was the cause of death, or l guess I should say the first assault. Any insights?

4. Was it ever established where the ligature and duct tape roll went to?

5. were there any phone records by the Ramseys made public? I heard the 911 call, of course, and that there was a call with the pilot and to friends and a banker or something to gather that money. In 1996 they both surely had cell phones in addition to the landline.

6. Burke was interviewed by a psychologist a swift 13 days after the murder, correct? What led to the Ramseys allowing that when they went dark on almost everything? I have read the psychologist was with the Health and Human Resources, or the like. Since Burke's birthday was the 27th, and 13 days after the murder was @Jan. 8......well, could it be that Team Ramsey wanted Burke and any incriminating or criminally liable statements as to cover up be made prior to his 10th birthday, when he would be liable to legal authority under the minor legal steps.

7. lol...that was a long question, but my point is that a 9 year old who commits a crime is sent to the Colorado Health and Human Resources department for analysis and diagnosis and treatment. (I have that department name wrong, but it is in the statute.)

8. I may be disremembering, but I believe there was a second psychological interview with Burke? If so, does anyone know where this fell, datewise, in the GJ process? (i.e.: if the second interview happened right after the GJ concluded, it would indicate that possibly the GJ had decided it was Burke and it was referred to the appropriate child agency for assessment.)

9. Any insight as to the nature of the Steve Thomas lawsuit settlement? The terms are often sealed, but what can be insightful is whether he continued to publicly put forth his opinion of Patsy's guilt. Also, was the book either pulled or banned from future reprints or sales?

10. I have read that Fleet White had a falling out with the Ramseys, but, narrowly, did Fleet ever corroborate JB's story of seeing the basement window open, closing it, and looking for glass?

Well....that is a start. Sorry for my ignorance or budding dementia, lol...

 

[OldBackstop]

I am new here, but I have read extensively on Reddit and many of the books. I have been an IDI, but I am open to persuasion. I'm old....lol....possibly these answers are in something I read and I forget.

I am rewatching the Larry King Thomas vs. Ramseys heavyweight interview.

1. Does anyone have a bio on Steve Thomas? How old he was at the time of the murder, experience, education, other homicides? I can't find any of that. Also what he is doing now?

2. Has there been any testimony given by Patsy or about her as to whether she had been drinking and, if so, how much? She had been at a number of parties. Did she drink at all? I could picture being a little or more drunk, exhausted, having an early plane, and snapping at my kid over bedwetting and her falling into the corner of a sink or whatever. (and I had twins, lol, high snap potential)

3. I have read that the head wound had a low amount of bleeding inside and none outside. I have also read and seen photos (finger scrapes around the ligature, that indicate the garroting was the cause of death, or l guess I should say the first assault. Any insights?

4. Was it ever established where the ligature and duct tape roll went to?

5. were there any phone records by the Ramseys made public? I heard the 911 call, of course, and that there was a call with the pilot and to friends and a banker or something to gather that money. In 1996 they both surely had cell phones in addition to the landline.

6. Burke was interviewed by a psychologist a swift 13 days after the murder, correct? What led to the Ramseys allowing that when they went dark on almost everything? I have read the psychologist was with the Health and Human Resources, or the like. Since Burke's birthday was the 27th, and 13 days after the murder was @Jan. 8......well, could it be that Team Ramsey wanted Burke and any incriminating or criminally liable statements as to cover up be made prior to his 10th birthday, when he would be liable to legal authority under the minor legal steps.

7. lol...that was a long question, but my point is that a 9 year old who commits a crime is sent to the Colorado Health and Human Resources department for analysis and diagnosis and treatment. (I have that department name wrong, but it is in the statute.)

8. I may be disremembering, but I believe there was a second psychological interview with Burke? If so, does anyone know where this fell, datewise, in the GJ process? (i.e.: if the second interview happened right after the GJ concluded, it would indicate that possibly the GJ had decided it was Burke and it was referred to the appropriate child agency for assessment.)

9. Any insight as to the nature of the Steve Thomas lawsuit settlement? The terms are often sealed, but what can be insightful is whether he continued to publicly put forth his opinion of Patsy's guilt. Also, was the book either pulled or banned from future reprints or sales?

10. I have read that Fleet White had a falling out with the Ramseys, but, narrowly, did Fleet ever corroborate JB's story of seeing the basement window open, closing it, and looking for glass?

Well....that is a start. Sorry for my ignorance or budding dementia, lol...

Note on #9.....I just watched a 2006 interview with Steve Thomas (KHOW on YT) and he said that he has elected to stop commenting in the case although he doesn't have to stop.

 

[sgrump]

4. Was it ever established where the ligature and duct tape roll went to?

It was never publically declared where they came from let alone where they went. There did not have to be a spool with matching cord in the house just that piece. There did not have to be a roll of duct tape in the house, just that piece. Both items appeared to have been used before the crime.

It's possible the cord was removed from a big painting Patsy had in basement. Look at pictures of the garrotte and the cord has plenty of stains and an aged appearance. Why in the world would they remove the painting from the crime scene? Makes no sense unless they feared hardware on the back could be matched up to the placement of stains on the cord.

It's likely the tape came off a doll. Why in the world would they remove dolls from the crime scene, dead children don't play with toys. It's possible what Steve Thomas referred to as lip prints on the tape were the impressions from the back of the doll and the Ramseys feared other associations between the tape and doll could be made.

 

[OldBackstop]

sgrump-- thank you so much for your reply! I remember some time back reading that there was a hardware store or somewhere with the exact dollar amount of the duct tape, but it could be tied specifically.

On the one had, it seems remarkable that there would be a piece of duct tape and a piece of rope the exact length needed. But....well, the paintbrush was there, so who knows.

sigh....I dunno. I have always been an IDI. John, big time corporate guy,, maybe could keep a cover up going if it was just him. I find it impossible to believe that Patsy could choke out JB and not be a blathering mess the rest of her life, on a sleighride to hell, in her mind. She behaved in the interviews, I think, very convincingly, given the line her counselors, PR and legal, would have advised her, and that is in my line of work. Your natural reaction, and the reaction we all would suspect, is a Steve Thomas on Larry King getting coldcocked by John for accusing him to his face. Feels good, feels genuine. But what does that read in the two minutes after the dust settles? Volatile, violent people capable of assault, or maybe murder.

People say they would have been at the Boulder Police day and night. But once it is clear they make you for the crime, all they will try to do is trip you up with small inconsistencies they gin up until it sounds like a confession. Pineapple? Clothing same as the day before. If you were interviewed about anything, cops could trip you up. If they had your husband two doors down....forget it. They would be leaking to the press that you can't keep your story straight.

And Burke? Weird kid, weird man. But, at 9, he couldn't write the note or execute the garrote or do a one-on-one with a psychologist two weeks later, who wrote a report saying she didn't think he knew anything.

The criticisms of the Ramseys behavior....well....listen to Arndt's story about looking into John's eyes. He had to know that the Boulder Keystone cops were immediately thinking it was him. And any CEO that just sold his company to Northrup deals with enough lawyers to know the basic law -- shaddup and get a lawyer. The leaks and unprofessional behavior of the Boulder PD just justified that, or solidified it as the situation blew up. And, I have known innocent people in the situation of a high profile crime. The cops are under TREMENDOUS pressure to close that case, rather than have a town thinking a lunatic child rapist was in their midst.

 

[fr brown]

....1. Does anyone have a bio on Steve Thomas? How old he was at the time of the murder, experience, education, other homicides? I can't find any of that. Also what he is doing now?

2. Has there been any testimony given by Patsy or about her as to whether she had been drinking and, if so, how much? She had been at a number of parties. Did she drink at all? I could picture being a little or more drunk, exhausted, having an early plane, and snapping at my kid over bedwetting and her falling into the corner of a sink or whatever. (and I had twins, lol, high snap potential)

3. I have read that the head wound had a low amount of bleeding inside and none outside. I have also read and seen photos (finger scrapes around the ligature, that indicate the garroting was the cause of death, or l guess I should say the first assault. Any insights?

4. Was it ever established where the ligature and duct tape roll went to?

5. were there any phone records by the Ramseys made public? I heard the 911 call, of course, and that there was a call with the pilot and to friends and a banker or something to gather that money. In 1996 they both surely had cell phones in addition to the landline.

6. Burke was interviewed by a psychologist a swift 13 days after the murder, correct? What led to the Ramseys allowing that when they went dark on almost everything? I have read the psychologist was with the Health and Human Resources, or the like. Since Burke's birthday was the 27th, and 13 days after the murder was @Jan. 8......well, could it be that Team Ramsey wanted Burke and any incriminating or criminally liable statements as to cover up be made prior to his 10th birthday, when he would be liable to legal authority under the minor legal steps.

7. lol...that was a long question, but my point is that a 9 year old who commits a crime is sent to the Colorado Health and Human Resources department for analysis and diagnosis and treatment. (I have that department name wrong, but it is in the statute.)

8. I may be disremembering, but I believe there was a second psychological interview with Burke? If so, does anyone know where this fell, datewise, in the GJ process? (i.e.: if the second interview happened right after the GJ concluded, it would indicate that possibly the GJ had decided it was Burke and it was referred to the appropriate child agency for assessment.)

9. Any insight as to the nature of the Steve Thomas lawsuit settlement? The terms are often sealed, but what can be insightful is whether he continued to publicly put forth his opinion of Patsy's guilt. Also, was the book either pulled or banned from future reprints or sales?

10. I have read that Fleet White had a falling out with the Ramseys, but, narrowly, did Fleet ever corroborate JB's story of seeing the basement window open, closing it, and looking for glass?

Well....that is a start. Sorry for my ignorance or budding dementia, lol...

Why wouldn't you start by reading Steve Thomas' book? The kindle version came out in 2011.