Rebecca Zahau Wrongful death trial begins. Trial coverage and discussion #3

[Betty P]

Exactly. He is either a criminal mastermind, able to foresee all of the potential ways he could be caught so he can cover all his tracks, or he is an innocent victim who had the very bad fortune to step out and see Rebecca first thing in the morning [before he had even had a cup of coffee..

I know I have a hard time talking before my cup o’ joe, and here he is dealing with his dead brother’s girlfriend who is hanging in the courtyard. I can only imagine how freaked out and frantic he must have been, IMO.

There is no way that Rebecca managed to get her DNA exactly in the areas she would have to have handled to tie the knots, if she was just rearranging the garage. No way that would ever happen, IMO.

Those that think Adam could have worn gloves and not gotten his DNA anywhere are not thinking about fibers, hair, sweat, saliva, etc. How did he manage that? Did he wear a hazmat suit?

How did he not leave footprint marks in the carpet?

How did he get Rebecca’s fingerprints on all those places? Did he cart her around like a rag doll, touching her fingers to the door, the bed leg, etc.? If he did, why are there no bruises on Rebecca that should show that?

Why did he not just dump her body somewhere? He could have taken her car, taken her somewhere far, far, away from the mansion. The car would be so much easier to clean that that entire room and balcony. He could have said Rebecca said she was going to take a walk to clear her head, and he went to bed. SO much easier!

Why would anyone EVER murder someone but make it look like a suicide that looks like murder? THEN call and cooperate all day long with police? IMO, it is not likely one bit.

IMO, what is most likely and what the evidence shows is that Rebecca took her life and it was not difficult for her to do what she did.

IMO.

Adam had help. The SDSO conducted a selective investigation by either bungling the processing of evidence (the latex glove, the alleged phone message from JS, etc.) or selecting only certain places to check for evidence.

Apparently, they didn't check for hair or fibers anywhere. None of those materials were submitted into evidence.

They didn't check for footprints on the carpeting, only on the balcony

They didn't check the rope in places where the killer might have handled it

They never mentioned publicly the evidence showing the room and certain items had been wiped clean

Adam might have left evidence all over the room and house, but most of it was never gathered or tested

But he did leave evidence that he cleaned up certain areas.

Rebecca's DNA was expected to be at the crime scene. She lived in the mansion, used the rooms, cleaned up and worked in certain areas.

 

[Betty P]

I don't see that as odd. A call to tell Mary what had happened. A call to let her know things were serious and Little Sister needed to come home. A call to let Mary know Little Sister's flight arrangements. A call to update on Max. A call to let her know Little Sister was on the plane. That's 5 right there.

And it said 20 contacts with Mary, so some were probably Mary calling her and some texts.

I can have 20 contacts with some of my friends in just a few hours lol.

Not to mention calls and texts to discuss Little Sister's injury (she cut herself rather seriously while cleaning up the broken chandelier). Rebecca would have been advising her sister of the injury, then following up to see how she was healing once she got home.

 

[MyBelle]

Adam had help. The SDSO conducted a selective investigation by either bungling the processing of evidence (the latex glove, the alleged phone message from JS, etc.) or selecting only certain places to check for evidence.

Apparently, they didn't check for hair or fibers anywhere. None of those materials were submitted into evidence.

They didn't check for footprints on the carpeting, only on the balcony

They didn't check the rope in places where the killer might have handled it

They never mentioned publicly the evidence showing the room and certain items had been wiped clean

Adam might have left evidence all over the room and house, but most of it was never gathered or tested

But he did leave evidence that he cleaned up certain areas.

Rebecca's DNA was expected to be at the crime scene. She lived in the mansion, used the rooms, cleaned up and worked in certain areas.

How does LE PROVE something has been wiped clean? And more importantly, how do they also prove the identity of the person who allegedly did the wiping? The jury will posses some degree of intelligence to see right through such an illogical fallacy. JMO.

 

[questfortrue]

For me, it is the totality of the forensics which indicate she was strangled first before she was lowered or tossed over the balcony. It’s my hope the jury is thoughtful and has a grasp of the indicators for an asphyxiation before hanging. In opposition to the material in the ME’s report, it is uncommon for the SCM muscles and strap muscles to be torn in a hanging. Further, as Dr. Wecht has covered, the fractured cricoid is almost always an indicator of a strangulation. (In one research report, there was only one incidence in 2700 suicidal hangings of a fracture of the cricoid.) Her 4 head injuries can’t even be explained adequately except by someone striking her to daze her or place her in an unconscious state. Even had her skull struck the balcony on her way over, as the ME once alleged in an interview, the human skull is not like a polybutadiene rubber ball. IOW, it would not strike a balcony and continue to bounce back to strike the balcony another 3 times. Again Dr. Wecht nailed this.

I also hope the jury thinks carefully about the incongruities in the testimony of AS and gives due thought to the paint message on the door. The message was personal; only a small group of people knew that RZ had done CPR on MS to save him. Moreover, in her diary writings RZ never referred to herself in the 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] person. That message was not written by RZ, and it was the perp's biggest mistake, imo.

 

[kittychi]

BBM

I have to admit I'm still sitting on the fence in this case and on most days I have a hard time wrapping my head around suicide. You point out two things ^^ that keep me on the fence to thinking it could have been suicide.

I do often wonder *if* Adam did kill Rebecca could he not see the way it was carried through ... suicide may not be believed. When I think about that for too long I can't wrap my head around him killing her the way it was done and being sure that suicide would be believed. I'm having a hard time trying to convey what I mean. sorry!

I don't know. *sigh* I wish I did because clearly it keeps me up at night.

JMO, MOO, IMO, Etc

BBM: IMHO initially he was just wanting to conceal that he, himself, was the perpetrator. I think the idea of suicide came a bit later, i.e. "Ah!!! I will just say that she hung herself. I just have to remove the hogties." He was waiting for morning so he would have enough light to remove the hogties, not realizing that her legs would stay bent after removing the rope.

 

[kittychi]

<modsnip>

And notice that those who do not support the suicide narrative also believe that Max&#8217;s case was not properly investigated. They don&#8217;t have a problem with SDSO&#8217;s handling of Rebecca&#8217;s bizarre death, but they do have a problem with SDSO&#8217;s handling of Max&#8217;s death (or was it Coronado police that handled Max&#8217;s death? Either way, it is bewildering.)

BBM: I just realized that I made a mis-statement above, but I wasn't able to edit my original post for some reason.

I meant to write this: "And notice that those who DO support the suicide narrative also believe that Max&#8217;s case was not properly investigated."

 

[justice be served]

The single issue that the suicide believers never seem to address is the 13 hour delay by the medical examiner to come to the scene or how that delay allowed the ME to state that the body position is in keeping with how she was found. Well all that does is confirm the last 13 hours of her position. It completely negates what the 6:45 status was.

Apparently this single FACT has no defense.<modsnip>. You can&#8217;t get around that at all.

 

[justice be served]

BBM: I just realized that I made a mis-statement above, but I wasn't able to edit my original post for some reason.

I meant to write this: "And notice that those who DO support the suicide narrative also believe that Max&#8217;s case was not properly investigated."

Yes that is true but it is done very quietly. After all intimating that Max&#8217;s death is suspicious only provides motive for Rebecca&#8217;s murder,

Along that same theme, there were articles planted in the press and written by an author that also wrote Medicis related pieces extolling how wonderful JS&#8217;s life was with Rebecca. They even quoted a close friend to JS that he was planning on proposing to Rebecca. It came across at the time as very thinly veiled propaganda. Now that we know per testimony that JS was seeing his future wife at that time this just points to the reputation management firms doublng up their efforts to create a false narrative.

Didn&#8217;t JS also say on the stand that Rebecca didn&#8217;t save Max? Guess his true feelings were spoken then.

 

[Imp]

Speaking of the veracity of AS' testimony, is there any question about how close he and JS actually were prior to July, 2011?

In 2011, I was an avid participant on another true crime forum called The Hinky Meter, whose owner, Val, shut it down not long after RZ died (unrelated timing).

Whether it was media reports or what our group considered reliable sleuthing, most of us believed there wasn't a strong relationship between AS and JS. I distinctly recall it being highlighted that AS was notably absent in multiple family reunion portraits, even before JS met RZ. Beyond that, it was entirely speculation, based on the diverse career choices between and lifestyles of the two brothers, that AS may have been presented an opportunity to receive money for coming to California on short notice.

I'm surprised, therefore, to hear AS testified to being a supportive brother and involved uncle. Can we be sure about how he depicted their relationship?

Does anyone else find it odd that AS appears much older and weathered than JS, though JS is the one who is older across an age gap? Has there ever been any question of AS having a drug history or receiving any psychological assessment?

Just things I've wondered about since he comes across oddly, imo.

I can't answer with regard to their relationship, however, I sense that everyone in JS's life serves a purpose of some kind, and if AS didn't, then it would make sense they weren't close. They also seem to have very different approaches to relationships with women. JS appears to have a revolving door, while AS presents as basically a monk with his 72-year-old non-live-in "girlfriend" of 20 years.

With regard to the difference in their looks, I'm thinking JS partakes regularly in the cosmetic pharmaceuticals his (ex) company sells, namely facial fillers. Also, if AS really is a tugboat captain, I would expect him to have a more weathered face than JS, whose career would seem to keep in indoors.

My 2 cents.

 

[justice be served]

Why do the suiciders keep repeatedly bringing up the subject of appeals? And independently too? Interesting.

 

[kittychi]

Yes that is true but it is done very quietly. After all intimating that Max&#8217;s death is suspicious only provides motive for Rebecca&#8217;s murder,

Along that same theme, there were articles planted in the press and written by an author that also wrote Medicis related pieces extolling how wonderful JS&#8217;s life was with Rebecca. They even quoted a close friend to JS that he was planning on proposing to Rebecca. It came across at the time as very thinly veiled propaganda. Now that we know per testimony that JS was seeing his future wife at that time this just points to the reputation management firms doublng up their efforts to create a false narrative.

Didn&#8217;t JS also say on the stand that Rebecca didn&#8217;t save Max? Guess his true feelings were spoken then.

IMO, *some* suicide supporters still suspect that Rebecca had something to do with Max's death...remember the suspicions floated a few years ago that she pushed him or somehow intentionally hurt him? IMO that belief is still out there. IMO there is also still a belief out there that she deserved the treatment she got...including her dead body out in the sun for 13 hours.

 

[Imp]

The single issue that the suicide believers never seem to address is the 13 hour delay by the medical examiner to come to the scene or how that delay allowed the ME to state that the body position is in keeping with how she was found. Well all that does is confirm the last 13 hours of her position. It completely negates what the 6:45 status was.

Apparently this single FACT has no defense. <modsnip>. You can&#8217;t get around that at all.

Thank you! You stated this so much more succinctly than I did yesterday (so much for typing while thinking!).

 

[Imp]

Seattle1 ~ I brought this post of yours over from the WD Lawsuit Overview thread:

I previously reported (ROA 1073) the initial Jury Instructions filed with court on 2/26/18 were withdrawn on 3/22/18. Take note that Plaintiffs have objected to new Jury Instructions filed by Defense:

ROA 1078 03/26/2018 Objections (To Defenants Special Jury Instruction Re Evidentiary Value of Death Certificate and Autopsy Report) filed by Pari Z. Zahau, on her own behalf, and on behalf of Rebecca Zahau, Deceased.

Pari Z. Zahau, on her own behalf, and on behalf of Rebecca Zahau, Deceased (Plaintiff)

Objection to Special Jury Instruction​

Can you or anyone clarify what this means? My interpretation is the defense wants the jury instructed with regard to the evidentiary value of RZ's AR and death certificate ... but instructed to do what? ... and Mr. Greer has filed an objection to their request for new jury instructions on behalf of the Zahaus.

Anyone have a clue what the defense is up to here?

 

[Harmony 2]

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[justice be served]

My question simply is to what do you attribute the 13 hour delay and what do you think the impact of that was? Simply put.

 

[Lezah]

Contrary to some recent suggestions, in my opinion, the scene is very far removed from that which I would expect to be left by a superlative, criminal ‘genius’.

IMO the death scene could be more accurately described as ‘a completely disorganized mess’ - replete with ‘hanging overkill’, purposefully staged in a desperate attempt to mask a manual strangulation.

The ropes having to be left in place on the body, with those incriminating knots - probably because they were left in place too long during the effort at staging, having already left their ‘mark’ ...the apparent need for a three foot high table to cut down a woman suspended a mere 20 inches off the ground...the fastidiously cleaning a knife handle...but the omission of the blade...the evidence of over-zealous wiping down...the ‘in the third person’ bizarre painted message...

No, I think the scene would be much better characterized as an attempted manifestation of deception, a deliberate and desperate alteration of the physical evidence for the purpose of misleading and or misdirecting the investigation away from strangulation and toward suicide by hanging.

Or, as I suggested prior...’a mess’.

Certainly not the work of a ‘criminal genius’.

( This is my opinion and supposition based on the facts as I view them)



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[Harmony 2]

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