The Crown v Gerard Baden-Clay, 24th June - Trial Day 9, Week 3

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Happygolucky

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I think the defence will say that the plant matter in the footwell was trampled in their earlier then April 19th, that it had nothing to do with what was in Allison's hair.

I agree, plant matter could have easily been on a passengers feet
 

Liadan

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What if she ran out of the house in frustration and went 500 metres closer to Flegg's house. GBC followed and they fought in some other locality where those plants prevailed (and they are very common plants). The children heard nothing but Flegg did?

I think Dr. Guymer struggled to find the same density of these plants anywhere in the neighbourhood - they were quite exclusive to that property. Not saying they aren't around everywhere but the fact that these were picked up means they were in high concentration around the source which indicates that she picked them up at 593 BF rd.
 

JK673

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I can't remember which high school they all went to, but if it was a private one, especially boys only, there will definitely be 'an old boys network' and no matter what, they will help each other out.

But how on earth can professional (?) men lend so much money without any paper work??? Oops, I answered my own question above. Old boyz and their handshakes.

:jail::jail::jail:

Sorry - just because they went to a private boys only high school does not make them "network". Brisbane private high schools are not like Britain's Eton or the US-types as depicted in movies like "SKULLS". The "old boys networks" you talk of are really just a way the fellas may keep in touch or support the schools through fundraising.
You may have some "Old Boys" who may try the "What happened on .... stays on...." but that would be more because of their own lack or morals.


<modsnip>
 

Amee

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The jury was shown a photo of the interior of the Holden Captiva.

He said there may have been botanical evidence taken from the car

Sen-Sgt Taylor said a vacuum device was used to search for scientific evidence in the car.

http://m.news.com.au/QLD/pg/2/fi11757133.htm
 

Froglady

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I think Allison has been dragged out through the back patio of the house, then down the slope and into the car. Which car and which carport was it in that the car was backed in. It makes sense to back the car in an put her body in, quite easy to conceal in the bewitching hours.

Could that explain why the sores on one side of her body? Being dragged down the stairs on her side?
 

possumheart

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I can't remember which high school they all went to, but if it was a private one, especially boys only, there will definitely be 'an old boys network' and no matter what, they will help each other out.

But how on earth can professional (?) men lend so much money without any paper work??? Oops, I answered my own question above. Old boyz and their handshakes.

:jail::jail::jail:

Toowoomba Grammar School.
 

Zorro

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I think Dr. Guymer struggled to find the same density of these plants anywhere in the neighbourhood - they were quite exclusive to that property. Not saying they aren't around everywhere but the fact that these were picked up means they were in high concentration around the source which indicates that she picked them up at 593 BF rd.

I can only go on what was reported so I didn't know he struggled to find the same density of these plants anywhere in the neighbourhood. Sorry, was that in his testimony.
 

KG1

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Mr Christ said Baden-Clay paid three interest payments over June, July and August.

He said by April, 2012, none of the principal $90,000 loan was repaid and no interest was repaid since July or August, 2011.

Mr Christ said the Baden-Clay business was in negative cashflow at the time and &#8220;basically worth nothing&#8221;.


and this is the business Gerard tells Toni he is going to sell. ... its worth nothing, in fact, its in negative, but Toni falls for it. These are not very bright people. ..

Christ, Cranna and Cheeseman all expected to get $90,000.00 profit on their invested $90,000.00.... that is, for their outlay of $90,000.00 they expected $180,000.00 back.

so that's all up, .. ah.. $180,000.00 for each, so that is x 3 = $540,000.00

I'm still laughing about this.. hard to figure out just who conned who in this little deal.. . one thing is for sure... they all lost $90,000.00

Marvellous how each of them veered right off from knowing why Alison was suddenly involved in the business... it was all over the Real Estate business from Currumbin to Noosa.

I'm still laughing about this.. hard to figure out just who conned who in this little deal.. . one thing is for sure... they all lost $90,000.00

Trooper it is $90,000 principal each, plus all the $000s in interest lost. BBM above.

GBC was obviously very, very desperate, otherwise he surely would not have agreed to this arrangement.

Questions:- Where did each loan come from - personal or business? If from each lender's business, then ought to have been in writing and interest rate at current commercial rates, entries in books of each entity and taken up in accounts. Also money loaned should have been paid into business account of Century 21, not joint a/c of GBC & ABC (unless that was a business partnership trust under the company franchise).

If personal loans to GBC, then all I can say is that I wish I had friends like that, (who have a spare $90,000 or so lying around), who did not even require a signed agreement before handing over money.
Curiouser and curiouser IMO.
 

Liadan

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OK Liaden now it up to you to explain the koppers logs theory.

See how we've done several full circles!
If in doubt please refer to thread 6, 12, 15, 34 & this one. :floorlaugh:

What are friends for. :)

. . . . :loveyou:
EEEEEE_ZEEEE! TGY !!!---Kimster came down with her ray gun and saw the Prado - she immediately spied Kopper logs on the other side of the St. She aimed her ray gun at the Kopper log and hurled it at the Prado denting it and forever and branding that 4WD forever with a WS emblem.
 

JK673

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IMO Dr Guymer's evidence can't throw light on where Allison (was) rolled on the ground.

The cat's claw, crepe myrtle, fishbone fern, chinese elm, lillypilly and greygum grow in or near most backyards in that suburb especially rented houses. Anyone owning a home and enjoying gardening will probably rip out the cat's claw, fishbone fern and chinese elm as they are weeds in the suburbs really.

I think what the prosecution is proving is that you don't get those plants in your hair by lolling around on the banks of Kholo Creek no matter how long you lie there, you get them from the suburbs.

These plants don't tie Allison to 593 Brookfield Rd.

By following her movements and interviewing people who last saw her - it MOST certainly DOES tie her to 593 Brookfield Road. if there was no other place she was in the time frame - then the tie is made.

The problem from GBC is that he had MOTIVE, MEANS AND OPPORTUNITY.......
 

Trooper

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I guess he'd have the arrears deducted from payout..I'm surprised the Insurance Company didn't find a way out of paying up..bet they're sad for allowing the extension..not

no doubt there was serious and detailed talk around the desk about this as soon as the police contacted them.

would be such bad publicity if they reneged... they had, after all, extended by 1 month the payment due... ..

but it must have been painful. .
 

ThaiBali

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I still believe those marks on GBC's body were kick marks. I think she kicked him off her. I've looked but can't find a photo a the sole of a Lynx jogger.

I agree..also the rash on Gerreds chest is self scratched. What are the chances of a rash perfectly covering a huge bruise?
 

they'll get you

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DNA me thinks. If he can grow plant tissue from the crepe myrtle flowers, seems to plant specific ID can be achieved. Can anyone provide any thoughts along this line?

Why not test the existing trees for the DNA?
 

JK673

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My second thought on this day of the trial is that the prosecution is eliminating possible causes of death so they can present their own (hopefully fact based) theory.

The prosecution calls experts whose opinion must be taken as evidence in the case unless the defence calls an equally qualified expert who contradicts the prosecutions expert. The defence in taking trivial swipes at expert opinion is only showmanship and doesn't damage the prosecution case.

Allison apparently didn't die, according to experts, from ill-health, trauma or injury, drowning or drug overdose. That eliminates the great majority of ways to die leaving probably IMO only lack of air as the cause of death. There are signs from the autopsy that she had a bang on the head.

Based on evidence so far I'm thinking she was knocked unconscious and suffocated. If GBC is the perpetrator then Allison apparently put up a fight.

Can anyone tell that I totally forgot about the trial today and I am taking ages to catch up on the day????

She can't have been knocked unconcious AND put up a fight. I would say she was smothered only thing that explains the scratches and bruises to GBC
 

KG1

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The main thing that stood out for me from the Christ, Cheeseman and Cranna testimonies today is that the money loaned to GBC was deposited into the joint business account of GBC AND Allison. They being the owners of the company. So if GBC is convicted and has no way of paying back those loans, they will sue Allison's estate to recoup their money, plus interest. Or have I got that wrong? I just felt that those three were saying 'nice' things about Allison on the one hand, but on the other they had this agenda, a subtle hint that they know there is money held in trust and one way or another they will get their hands on it.

Wonder if they declared the interest that GBC had paid them to the ATO.

It is likely that the ATO may now look at these lenders.
 

BJsleuth

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Under cross examination Mr Cheesman said Baden-Clay had a number of assets in his own name, including shares, and was personally financially secure.

Mr Cheesman agreed with defence barrister Michael Byrne that if the business had failed Baden-Clay could 'walk away from it'.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...on-Baden-Clay-went-missing.html#ixzz35XwxMiVY

Psychiatrist Tom George saw ABC & GBC in June 2009.

He said Mr Baden-Clay had been frustrated by his wife’s purchase of an expensive treadmill during the financially difficult period.


Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...arate-lives-20140619-zsfib.html#ixzz35Y5e47me
 

Mumma Bear

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Three cheers for Dr Guymer! Such a thorough investigation - and more to come! Hopefully tomorrow brings some plant DNA info. (

And for the insect guy who didn't even chase up the weather records - sorry, no cheers for you. Was he a defence witness?
 
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