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The Phone Calls in the early morning of Dec.18, 2013 (both PayPhone & cells)

Discussion in 'Heather Elvis' started by Salem, Mar 20, 2014.

  1. Salem

    Salem Former Member

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    ~Respectfully Snipped
    Actually, iirc LE has always said last known activity of Heather was the 3:41 call and with continued activity between Heather's phone and SM's phone until about 6:00 a.m.

    It's always been one of the big questions. TE uses the last call time as 3:17 a.m. I believe. So there have been numerous questions about what her phone was doing between 3:17 a.m. and 6:00 a.m.

    Just point that out because it has been an important topic of discussion since the case started.

    Salem
     
  2. momof7

    momof7 New Member

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    Yes, the phone is one confusing part of the time line!

    Kelly
     
  3. paris_paris

    paris_paris Well-Known Member

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    3:17 was the last call Heather made that was answered. The calls she made after that went unanswered, so would not show up on the cell info TE was logging into.
     
  4. jillycat

    jillycat Well-Known Member

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    Terry Elvis got it right from Day 1. The phone records do not lie. He went online and looked at the activity log and reported it to police.

    If the 6 a.m. time is truly a "roundabout" communications time, then there should be calls on the log closer to that time.

    We've also heard that the 6 a.m. time was a last ping time, then we heard that the police did not want to discuss pings. My feeling is that if you don't want pings entering the picture, don't add a last known ping to the mix, and then call it part of the "back and forth" communications between the victim and suspect.

    So Terry Elvis saw what he saw, there was nothing complicated about it, and if I go on my carrier website right now, I can see the text I just sent two minutes ago acknowledging my friend's text that she's running late. Should I disappear between now and the time she arrives, and my phone is destroyed, or my Mac is nuked, it will be clear enough to anyone checking my logs as to when I stopped communicating.

    In that event, please tell the public my time stamp on this post is the right time, should there be other claims. :)
     
  5. paris_paris

    paris_paris Well-Known Member

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    I snipped a bunch. TM listed all of the times of the phone calls. She said the 2nd phone call was answered. That phone call was at 3:17.
     
  6. Goober

    Goober New Member

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    My theory on LE saying that phone data ended at 3:41 and HE's father saying he saw activity up until 6:00 am is that since no phone was not found at PTL, it went with HE in the truck. Most likely turned off to prohibit GPS pinging. But do you really think that when they were done cleaning up whatever they had done, TM could have that phone in her possession and not turn it on to see what photo's, texts, etc were on it?
     
  7. Lovejac

    Lovejac Well-Known Member

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    As obsessed as TM was about Heather? Heck yeah, I can totally see her doing that if given the chance!
     
  8. jash

    jash Well-Known Member

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    I just wanted to comment on all the times that have been stated. I wonder just how precise they are. Like the security footage... I assume each business/residence sets the time on their own systems. I'm sure LE cross checked the time on the system with actual time when they obtained the evidence, but I can see it still being off a bit (whether by 30 seconds or 1 minute).

    For those of you saying 3 minutes isn't much time for everything to have gone down at PTL, would you feel differently if it was actually 4 or 5 minutes?

    Similarly with the phone calls, those times could be slightly off. In my previous job, I had to subpoena cell phone records and even from the same telephone company, for the same account, there could be a slight difference in the timestamps depending on whether the records provided came from their "raw data" or were just copies of the monthly statement.

    In a case like this where the timeline is so tight, I think these variances could be very important.
     
  9. hambirg

    hambirg New Member

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    I agree, but we don't know if she was texting or sending other types of pm's during this time. I'm very curious to find out how that all plays out.

    I think I have a theory with the phone data timeline issue. We know Heather was trying to call SM's phone from PTL and it went unanswered. I think TM and SM were savvy enough to disable their phone during their trip to PTL. IF Heather was also trying to text. . .an SMS message can be stored in the network and delivered later when the recipient phone becomes available again. My theory is that SM didn't turn his phone back on till around 6am. . .and a SMS (text) sent from before 3:41am from Heather's phone, finally went through near 6am.

    http://www.androidauthority.com/what-is-sms-280988/

    Idk if this is what happened, but it's a possibility.
     
  10. DR006

    DR006 Member

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    I'm worried that they are too ashamed to say how she was killed..I mean if what we have heard already is any indicator of how unbelievable these two are, I'm seriously nervous about what else will be revealed.

    I don't think she was hit by their truck. That would be easy enough for TM/SM to cry accident/confrontation gone bad.

    It seems most likely they brought her back with them. Then what? How could SM not be totally and completely freaking out?! They were close enough that he knew her number if he called without a cell phone - so how would he handle her being gone?? Most oeople would mourn that kind of loss. Maybe TM subdued him. Maybe TM was drunk - what would she have been doing all night up until 330ish? Looking for SM while he made his payphone call? I don't buy for a second he didn't have feelings for heather. There's a glimmer of hope in me that SM did want to leave TM, decided he couldn't hang with her craziness, heather accidentally called the cell and the rest is a result of that. But if that's the case, I can't wrap my mind around her body hanging out in their car while they figure out the rest. I don't know why my mind always goes to this train of thought where SM is just a bystander in this. I know they are equal contributors in this tragedy but I hope this wasn't at the hands of someone she trusted.
     
  11. NewYork625

    NewYork625 Well-Known Member

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    From the myrtlebeachonline article above: "At 2:29 a.m. , she called the payphone back, but no one answered. Elvis, who was still at her home, then called Sidney Moorer’s cell phone at 3:16 a.m. and again a minute later. During that call, someone answered the phone and there was a 4:15 minute conversation.

    Both Tammy and Sidney Moorer were at their home with the cell phone and Elvis was at her home, Elder said. But based on that conversation, Elvis got in her car and drove to the boat landing, Elder told the court.

    At 3:38 a.m. , Elvis’ phone records show her phone was at the boat landing. From there, she called Sidney Moorer’s phone. She called it three more times a minute later, no answer.

    At 3:41 a.m. Elvis’ phone stops sending data signals to cell phone towers or to a GPS backup connected to a Google account, Elder said."

    I wonder if there's any chance Heather drove to the gas station looking for SM, and TM having done the same, met up with Heather and seeing her with SM, killed her there. Maybe it was only after that that Heather's car was driven to PTL and left there? Perhaps TM used Heather's phone at PTL, calling SM's phone and trying to make it look like either Heather ran away, or intentionally to implicate SM in Heather's murder?
    Maybe the reason SM didn't answer the pay phone when Heather called him back was because he was parked in his truck away from the phone trying to figure out what to do next after Heather didn't seem receptive to getting back together.
    Maybe the long conversation between his cell phone (at his house) and Heather was actually Heather and TM speaking with each other? Maybe Heather told TM about the phone call she received that night from SM, making TM furious?
     
  12. Salem

    Salem Former Member

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    Discuss the phone calls here, please. Both the pay phone/phone booth and the cell calls & texts.

    Salem
     
  13. Softail

    Softail Active Member

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    Phone call refresher:

    Here is the timeline that the prosecution presented of Dec. 18:

    1:35 am.. phone call from pay phone by Sidney to Heather.. call is 4:53 minutes

    1:44 Heather calls (person unidentified) who is in Florida at the time. And says Sidney just called and is leaving Tammy. Heather appears upset because she had been trying to get her life back on track after the affair and the harassment by Tammy. Heather is still at her home when she makes this call. The call lasts 2:20 minutes.

    2:29 Heather attempts to call the number Sidney called from which is a pay phone. Several times it does not appear anyone answered.

    3:16 am Heather attempts to call Sidney's phone with no response.

    3:17 am .. Heather calls Sidney's phone and has a 4:15 minutes conversation with Sidney. Heather is at her home at this point. Sidney is at his home which is approx. 3 miles from the boat landing. After this conversation, Heather gets into her car and drives directly to Peachtree Boat Landing. Sidney also denies this conversation until police confront him with Heather's phone record and then he says he did talk to her but it was just to tell her to quit calling and leave them alone.


    3:38 am.. Heather attempts to call Sidney's phone. She has arrived at the boat landing at the time of this call. She attempts to call at 3:39, 3:39:46 and 3:41..

    Her phone data ends at that point. 3:41 am.


    3:36 am.. A private residence video surveillance captures a vehicle coming from the direction of Sidney's headed towards the boat landing. This camera is 1.7 miles from the Moorer's residence.

    3:39 am ... a business video surveillance a mile from the first camera closer to the landing captures this vehicle still proceeding in the direction of the boat landing.

    3:45 am.. same business video surveillance captures the vehicle coming from the boat landing headed towards the Moorer residence. The camera is approximately 1.2 miles from the landing.

    3:46 am the private residence video surveillance captures the vehicle headed from the boat landing to the Moorer residence.

    http://www.wbtw.com/story/24992456/...-accused-of-killing-20-year-old-missing-woman
     
  14. Dee10

    Dee10 Well-Known Member

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    There is a 2 min. lapse from HRE's last attempt to call SM at 3:41 - SM is 1.2 miles from the landing.

    How long would it take to go 1.2 miles? At what point would Heather see the headlights given it's a dark area?

    The truck arrived at the last camera by PTL at 3:39 and was back on that camera at 3:45 leaving, which is a difference of 6 mins.

    How many minutes would you subtract for a round trip?


    EDT - to correct times - I think it is now right (ugggh)
     
  15. CHERIE.T

    CHERIE.T Former Member

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    The cell phone time line is almost unbelievable to me.
    Did things really happen so fast?
     
  16. hockeymom4

    hockeymom4 New Member

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    For me, it opens up the possibilities of so many other things happening. What I mean is, if I was a jury member and this is the timeline and I was still told that during those few minutes she was kidnapped and murdered AT PTL, I would have a very, very hard time believing that. Also, being then told that the car was found and that the police let her father drive it home which suggests there was no crime scene at the time of arrival. I am really struggling to see things. I know murder can happen in one second. But, with this timeline, there is no time to clean up anything.

    Also, heather would have most likely got in the front seat. The theory is that she was strangled from behind. They would not have continued to drive with her down the road for fear someone would see her. So, I question how they were able to kidnap her, murder her get her wherever (backseat) and get past that video camera so quickly. My guess is they are not on camera and that will hurt the case because there is no proof which one if any did it.

    I still go back to one of them or both showing up at her house after the pay phone calls. Him, not to hurt her and Tammy because she was pissed.
     
  17. NewYork625

    NewYork625 Well-Known Member

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    Let me try this again... :)
    Suppose TM and SM had been fighting that night. SM either drove his truck to the station, or got out of the truck nearby and walked to the station. Once there he called Heather and told her he was leaving his wife. He tried for over 4 minutes to convince her to come to him, but she told him no. Some time passed while Heather was reading poetry and getting sentimental, and then she tried to call SM back. There is no answer (maybe he is away from the phone since Heather didn't seem receptive to him, sitting in his truck listening to music and doesn't hear the phone ringing) so she tries his cell phone, which is in TM's possession.
    Maybe the long conversation between his cell phone (at his house) and Heather was actually Heather and TM speaking with each other? Maybe Heather told TM about the phone call she received that night from SM, making TM furious?
    Maybe Heather drove to the gas station to "rescue" SM from TM's wrath, or because she just wanted to give him a ride someplace (if he didn't have his truck), or because she truly loved him...
    So suppose she drove to the gas station around the same time TM has decided to go out and find SM. TM arrives to find SM and Heather together, and seeing her with SM, in a jealous rage kills her (runs into her? shoots her?) there.
    Maybe it was only after that that Heather's car was driven to PTL and left there? Maybe TM used Heather's phone at PTL, calling SM's phone and trying to make it look like either Heather ran away, or intentionally to implicate SM in Heather's murder?

    ETA Suppose SM is the one who drives Heather's car to PTL and TM drives the truck with Heather's body in it. She then uses Heather's phone to communicate with SM, who now has his phone. Later she looks through the messages/texts/phone calls on Heather's phone to see what communication had occurred between Heather and SM before finally destroying the phone at around 6am.
     
  18. hockeymom4

    hockeymom4 New Member

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    That sounds logical to me.
     
  19. CHERIE.T

    CHERIE.T Former Member

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    Great points Hockeymom4. Man o man if the M's vehicle was not found on camera, the prosecution needs to work on another angle when presenting their case. A timeline imo is instrumental to a case.
     
  20. cluciano63

    cluciano63 Well-Known Member

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    If they had gone to her apartment, IMO, there should have been some signs of a struggle or something. Doubtful she would have gone quietly with SM/TM. I suppose TM could have been hiding...but my instincts say LE knows Heather left her apartment alone. They have said so, more or less, from the start. Someone posted today that there are cameras at the complex...maybe they have had video for a while.

    The timeline makes sense to me, overall. Heather was waiting to hear back from SM. Played on tumblr, maybe sent some messages. Finally calls him back. Eventually gets him on phone and leaves at once to meet him. Even the six minutes could work for me, for the murder. Time six minutes out...it is a while. But I also have a feeling that the state will not try to convince the jury it took place there. Since she has not been found, the crime scene may be with her body.

    All they had to do was hit her on the head to subdue her for a few seconds, throw her in the truck and go. Six minutes is way long, for that, iMO. Same amount of time as shooting her, probably. Either could be done in less than one minute. The state may even set an alarm for six minutes in the courtroom, if they believe it happened at PTL. That is what I would do. Then the jury could feel how long it really is.

    JMO
     

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