The Verdict Waiting Room

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Fluffykins

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damn , but if we are sweating it wont be anything like big g and the bcs , I can sweat it out while bib g shivers in his boots for the weekend justice

The weekend will go too fast for us like they always do, but for GBC it's going to be the longest weekend of his life.
 

FigTree

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Is there a document that says what model and year Allisons car "Sparky" was?

Thanks sleuthers :)
 

canarybird

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Hi, is someone able to link me to the closing arguments from each side? Searching for anything here is needle-in-a-haystack stuff! Thank you and thanks to all the retweeters. I appreciate your dedication.
 

squizzey1

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Is there a document that says what model and year Allisons car "Sparky" was?

Thanks sleuthers :)

from memory Todd baby said it was 25th February 2012 not positive but that is my recalling of it
 

Venus13

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Safe journey everyone tonight on way home from court! Thank you again for the tweets & humour everyone! Catch up with all your jobs, baking most of all rest those eyes & fingers ready for Monday & the positive result!
 

UnfoldingTruth

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:waiting: well, I guess we wait some more. Hoping Monday will be the day. I believe they WILL convict him. But whether its Murder or Manslaughter, I'm not sure, I have a feeling with their question to the Judge today that they are trying to decide between the two (rather than an aquittal)

Well as there is no more chance of verdict today, I really need to go look after my pies:laughing:... take care people, deep breaths for Monday. Big Weekend here, Will check in for Monday- if not before :)

Thoughts again to Allison's family. What a LONG weekend they are going to have. I find it emotionally draining and exhausting myself, sitting watching from the outside. What a toll this must be for them and those close to them.
 

marlywings

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Hi, is someone able to link me to the closing arguments from each side? Searching for anything here is needle-in-a-haystack stuff! Thank you and thanks to all the retweeters. I appreciate your dedication.

Link to front page of the entire forum for Allison...

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?494-Allison-Baden-Clay-of-Australia

Closing remarks are further down on this page...

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...012-MEDIA-TIMELINE-LINKS-NO-DISCUSSION/page12
 

AAAA

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I know actually it was to be 6 of us!

It was very nice to meet Alioop, Liadan and the nameless man(sorry can't give anymore info than that he is to remain nameless).

So annoyed I couldn't be there. Did you solve the problems of the world?
 

FigTree

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For those catching up on todays MSM...

Here are today's Tweet and MSM list which has been posted on the thread by the Webbsleuths Re-Tweet Team up to now...
Thanks to the Re-Tweet Team :tyou:

-----------------------

DAY 19 BADEN-CLAY TRIAL – AWAITING A VERDICT - WEBSLEUTHS THREAD COLLECTION – TWEETS
In order of postings on WS by the Websleuth Re-Tweet Team
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...0th-July-Trial-Day-18&p=10732697#post10732697

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?249643-The-Verdict-Waiting-Room


MSM TWEETS
David Murray ‏@TheMurrayD
Kate Kyriacou @KateKyriacou
Tessa Scott ‏@TessaScott9
Marissa Calligeros ‏@marissa_sc
Elizabeth Tilley ‏@liztilley84
Sarah Elks ‏@sarahelks
Emmy Kubainski ‏@emmykubainski
Sandra Sully ‏@Sandra_Sully
Katrina Blowers ‏@katrinablowers



DAY 19 COMMENCES

• Waiting outside the courtroom today in case the jury comes back with a verdict. #badenclay @couriermail
• Gerard Baden-Clay's solicitor Peter Shields has arrived at the court complex. #badenclay
• Gerard Baden-Clay's solicitor Peter Shields has arrived at the court complex. #badenclay
• Allison's friends and family are gathered here waiting for the jury to make a decision. #badenclay
• Prosecutors Danny Boyle and Todd Fuller are in the building. #badenclay
• Lawyers and family from both sides are the court precinct as we await a verdict. @9NewsBrisbane #badenclay
• Day 19 of the #badenclay murder trial begins. The jury resumed deliberations at 9.30am @brisbanetimes
• The jury has been asked to return to the courtroom again for another direction - 4th time since deliberations began yesterday #badenclay
• The jury has been called back into court. NOT for a verdict. #badenclay
• Justice Byrne has confirmed with the jury they will not be sitting over the weekend. #badenclay
• The jury is in court, judge says he has received two notes from them #badenclay
• Justice Byrne is discussing with the jury paragraphs they have asked for from his summation. #badenclay
• Justice Byrne says the jury has requested information, and he wants to make sure he gives them the right material #badenclay
• Jurors are trying to pinpoint the relevant paragraphs for the judge. #badenclay
• One of the jurors stands in court, refers to a statement the judge made earlier about manslaughter #badenclay
• The judge had asked the jury who their speaker was #badenclay
• One of the jurors answered, they were the speaker, but that the request had come from another juror #badenclay
• The juror says they would like a paragraph referring to manslaughter and another where Gerard said "I did not kill my wife". #badenclay
• Judge asks whether the juror is looking for the passage where he began to summarise the evidence of the accused. #badenclay
• The juror is now clarifying that she's interested in a paragraph regarding the accused allegedly lying under oath. #badenclay
• Elizabeth Tilley ‏@liztilley84 1m
• Jury called back into court to discuss 2 notes given to judge. Confirmed they won't sit on weekends
• The #badenclay jury has also confirmed with Justice Byrne that they will not be sitting this weekend, if it comes to that. @7NewsBrisbane
• A juror says she wants more information about paragraphs in which the accused said: "I did not kill my wife". #badenclay
• The jury has requested copies of more pages from Justice Byrne's summing up #badenclay
• Day 2 of jury deliberations. Jury are back in the court with a question for the judge.
• The juror also tells Justice Byrne she's interested in a paragraph referring to manslaughter. #badenclay
• The juror says it related to the judge's instructions about considering whether the accused was "lying under oath". #badenclay
• The juror clarifies she is referring to a paragraph about lying under oath #badenclay
• Solicitor Peter Shields has a quick, quiet chat to Gerard #badenclay
• #badenclay jury back in. Justice Byrne trying to clarify which bits of his summing up they want for their deliberations. @abcnews
• Justice Byrne's summation is being displayed to the courtroom #badenclay @brisbanetimes
• The juror is now clarifying that she's interested in a paragraph regarding the accused allegedly lying under oath. #badenclay
• One juror has told the court they would like to see part of the summation relating to Baden-Clay's alleged lies #badenclay @brisbanetimes
• Justice Byrne is going to re-read parts of his summing up. #badenclay @abcnews
• The judge is reading a passage from his summation on whether lies prove guilt of murder. #badenclay
• The judge is reading again comments from his summing up #badenclay
• The judge has told the jury to return to their deliberations. #badenclay
• The comments related to Gerard's facial injuries, and what it means if the jury concludes he lied about them #badenclay
• The jury has left the court to continue deliberations #badenclay
• Jurors want to see parts of judge's summary regarding accused allegedly lying under oath & manslaughter @SkyNewsAust #badenclay
• Justice Byrne re-read sections of his summing up regarding lies. Jury now returns to deliberations. #badenclay @abcnews
• ----------
• Justice Byrne is re-reading directions to jury about alleged lies #badenclay told about marks on his face and the implications of those.
• The former real estate agent remained calm, with a measured voice, with his hands folded in front of him, and reiterated his denials to Mr Fuller’s minute-by-minute scenario.
• Mr Fuller: “You killed your wife, Mr Baden-Clay.”
• Mr Baden-Clay: “No, I did not.”
• The prosecutor put to him that he’d attacked her and the “only way” she could respond was to lash out and claw his face, leaving angry red slashes on his right cheek.
• “That is not true,” Mr Baden-Clay answered.
• Mr Fuller: “Probably as you smothered her and took her life from her?”
• Mr Baden-Clay: “That is not true.”
• “I never did anything to physically harm my wife in any way, ever.”
• http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news...-1226974910462
• ----------
• Justice Byrne reads a passage from his summing up about alleged lies by #badenclay about his cheek injuries.
• The jury has been asked to continue to deliberate. #badenclay
• Justice Byrne has re-read the part of his summation relating to allegations Mr Baden-Clay lied under oath #badenclay @brisbanetimes
• The juror has clarified they are interested in a paragraph regarding Mr Baden-Clay allegedly lying under oath #badenclay @brisbanetimes
• ----------
• Baden-Clay extended transcript of final cross-examination exchange
• http://resources.news.com.au/files/2...transcript.pdf
• ----------
• Murder And Manslaughter
• Chapter 28 Of The Criminal Code (Qld) Sets Out The Offences Relating To Homicide.
• Unlawful Homicide is set out under section 300, which makes any person who unlawfully kills another guilty of a crime, which is either murder or manslaughter, according to the circumstances of the case. Section 291 and 293 set out what constitutes an unlawful killing. Once it is established that the killing is unlawful it can then either be classified as murder (defined in s302 and punished in s305) or manslaughter (defined in s303 and punished in s310).

• Unlawful Killing
• Section 291 makes it unlawful to kill any person, unless the killing is authorised or justified by law. Section 293 defines killing as ‘causing the death of another, directly or indirectly, by any means whatever’.

• There must be a causal connection between the act by the accused and the death. In R v Pagett (1983) 76 Cr App R 279 it was held that the accused person’s act need not be the sole cause of the victim’s death, so long as it contributed significantly. An example of this is in Royall v R (1991) 172 CLR 378. Here the crown argued that the deceased died in one of three ways; the third was by jumping from the window to escape a well founded apprehension that she would be subjected to further violence from the accused. The High Court held that an act of self preservation, which caused the death, does not break this causal connection.
• In R v Blaue 60 Cr App R 271 it was held that the death of the victim was caused by loss of blood as a result of the stab wounds inflicted by the defendant. The victim, due to her religion had refused a blood transfusion. The defendant was found to have killed the victim.

• Murder
• Section 302 sets out the circumstances which a person who unlawfully kills will be guilty of murder.
• If the offender intends to kill or cause grievous bodily harm to the person killed or some other person;
• If the death is caused by means of an act done in the prosecution of an unlawful purpose and the act is of a nature likely to endanger human life;
• If the offender intends to do grievous bodily harm to some person for the purpose of facilitating the commission of a crime or for the purpose of facilitating the flight of an offender who has committed or attempted to commit such a crime. The crime must be such that the offender may be arrested without warrant;
• If death is caused by administering any stupefying or overpowering thing for either of the purposes mentioned in paragraph (3);
• If death is caused by wilfully stopping the breath of any person for either of the listed purposes.
• In R v Moloney (1985) 81 Cr App R 93 it was held that the mental element in murder consists of an intention to kill or cause serious injury and not merely of foresight that death or serious injury will be a probable consequence of their act.
• A person who is found guilty of murder, under section 305, is liable to life imprisonment or an indefinite sentence (Part 10 Penalties and Sentences Act 1992). Further, if the defendant is being sentenced on more than one conviction of murder, or another offence of murder is being taken into account the person may not be released from imprisonment until a minimum of 20 years has been served.
• Manslaughter
• Section 303 provides that a person who unlawfully kills another under such circumstances as not to constitute murder is guilty of manslaughter. A person who is guilty of Manslaughter under section 310 is liable to a maximum sentence of imprisonment for life.
• http://www.awbrisbanelawyers.com.au/...-brisbane.html
• ----------
• "If you conclude that the accused lied because he realised that the truth would implicate him in the killing of his wife ... #badenclay
• Cont ... "you would need carefully also to consider whether the lie reveals a consciousness of guilt ..." #badenclay
• "merely with respect to manslaughter as distinct from also revealing an intention to kill or cause grievous bodily harm." #badenclay
• Everytime there's movement of lawyers, detectives & family members the nervous anxiety of the crowd is felt outside court room #badenclay
• ----------
• IT is day 19 of the trial of former Brookfield real estate agent Gerard Baden-Clay, 43, who stands accused of murdering his wife Allison Baden-Clay, 43, on April 19, 2012.
• Baden-Clay has pleaded not guilty in the Supreme Court in Brisbane.
• A jury of seven men and five women yesterday retired to consider a verdict at 11.10am.
• It deliberated for five hours before returning to the jury room again today at 9.30am.
• Justice John Byrne asked the jury to re-enter the court room at 10.10am.
• In response to a note from the jury, Justice Byrne took them through sections of his summing up.
• The jury speaker said he was not able to identify the passage the jury wanted more information on, instead referring a question from Justice Byrne to another panel member.
• The juror identified the section as being to do with the evidence of Baden-Clay and whether he told lies.
• Justice Byrne reread the passage to the jury.
• “If you conclude that the accused lied because he realised that the truth would implicate him in killing his wife, you would need carefully also to consider whether the lie reveals a consciousness of guilt merely with respect to manslaughter as distinct from also revealing an intention to kill or to cause grievous bodily harm,” he said.
• “You may only use the lie about cutting himself shaving – if it is a lie – as tending to prove the element of murder of an intention to kill or to cause grievous bodily harm if, on the whole of the evidence, the accused lied because he realised that the truth of the matter in that respect would show that, in killing his wife, he had intended to kill her or to cause her grievous bodily harm.
• “It may be that, even if you were to find that the accused lied about his facial injuries because he realised that the truth would show him to be the killer, still you would not conclude that the lie shows that he realised that her death after scratching him with her fingernails would show that he had killed her intentionally.”
• The jury retired again to consider its verdict.
• http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/q...-1226984982501
• ---------
• Jury asks for more information about Gerard Baden-Clay allegedly lying under oath about his cheek injuries http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news...-1226985411236
• ----------
• Justice Byrne just re-read to jury paragraphs of his summary relating to the question of whether #badenclay lied @tennewsqld
• “It may be that, even if you were to find that the accused lied about his facial injuries because he realised that the truth would show him to be the killer, still you would not conclude that the lie shows that he realised that her death after scratching him with her fingernails would show that he had killed her intentionally.” Judge Byrne
• http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/q...-1226984982501
• ----------
• The jury considering the fate of Gerard Baden-Clay has requested clarification about how it should interpret allegations the accused wife killer lied under oath.
• The jury returned to the courtroom on Friday morning, for the fourth time since it began its deliberations, after sending a note to Justice John Byrne requesting he re-read part of his summing up of the case.
• Justice Byrne first asked the jury’s speaker to identify which part of his summing up the group wanted to hear again.
• http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/quee...711-zt3yv.html
• ----------
• IS GERARD Baden-Clay a man so determined on “wiping the slate clean” he killed his wife Allison? Or is he a man who had no temper and no reason to murder the mother of his children?
• http://www.news.com.au/national/guil...-1226985488956
• ----------
• Waiting crowd getting restless. 10 mins till lunch break... Enough time for a verdict? Anyone's guess #badenclay
• Lunch break for the court. Judge won't take a verdict before 2.15pm #badenclay
• The court is breaking for lunch. Justice Byrne has said he will not take a verdict before 2.15pm. #badenclay
• @marissa_sc: Jury deliberations are approaching the 9 hour mark #badenclay @brisbanetimes
• Baden Clay update: no verdict yet, jury has now been deliberating for more than 10 hours. @9NewsBrisbane #badenclay
• Parents and lawyers in the #badenclay trial have arrived at the Supreme Court. Jury have been deliberating for 11 hours. #newsfeed #live
• #badenclay jury has finished for the day. Will resume on Monday morning.
• Court has adjourned. There will be no verdict this week
• Judge says jury has ceased deliberations for the day. Will return Monday morning. @9NewsBrisbane #badenclay
• Court has adjourned for the day. There will be no verdict today. #badenclay @couriermail
• The jury will not deliberate over the weekend. We will continue on Monday. #badenclay
• Jury in #badenclay has "ceased its deliberations for the day" and will return on Monday morning. See you all then. @abcnews
• Jury in trial of Gerard #badenclay has been sent home until Monday after more than 11 hours of deliberations. No verdict yet (@liztilley84)
• Jury in trial of Gerard #badenclay has been sent home until Monday after more than 11 hours of deliberations. No verdict yet @skynewsaust
• The #badenclay jury has finished deliberating for today and will go home. Deliberations resume Monday. @7NewsBrisbane
• Deliberations in the #badenclay murder trial will continue on Monday. The jury has stood down for the day. #newsroom
• That takes the trial into its sixth week. Almost 12 hours of deliberations so far


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Lu-Lu

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I always only get the photo once too...? (wow, that grammar sounds really bad. I can't think of another way to say it!)
Okay! That's weird! It's only on kimsters pics. Every thread. [emoji15]
 

BrissyLass

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my day in the office is almost done, time to escape!!
Thanks everyone for the updates and the giggles during a very long day
:seeya:
 

alioop

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So annoyed I couldn't be there. Did you solve the problems of the world?
Sad you couldn't make it. Of course we solved the world problems except when there is going to be a verdict.

Is there a document that says what model and year Allisons car "Sparky" was?

Thanks sleuthers :)

It was a 2011 7 seater series 2 captiva, model either SX or CX.
 

Honey-Bee

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Someone earlier today mentioned they couldnt view certain articles etc and someone else said they have to reach a certain amount of posts to do this?Sorry Im very vague!Could someone please explain again TIA:loveyou:
 
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