Tom Miller letter

[Imon128]

The handwriting examiners based their conclusions on character formation, not content.

Are you sure, and to what examiners do you refer?

 

[Blazeboy3]

Not true. I grew up around lawyers. Even my ambulance chasing cousin who is a tort attorney (She literally chases the ambulance, not joking)thinks that Lin Wood is unethical.

Wood is the only lawyer I know of that spouts off how much money he makes off of a murdered child. Sickening, isn't it?

Wonder if it's a Wood's CHILDHOOD THING:His dad killing his mom!?

 

[Blazeboy3]

I do believe the jury acquitted him, therefore he is innocent right? Isn't that what you guys are always reminding us about the Ramseys? They are innocent until proven guilty.

Tom Miller went in a courtroom and was acquitted. He is therefore innocent.

As far as your opinion of him, you are basing your judgement of him on his BEHAVIOR? Isn't that taboo?

Besides, a "crime" such as the one Miller is accused of, nowhere compares to the crime committed on JonBenet Ramsey. Everything is relative.

HELP!;Everything is relative(?)...what's that mean? I believe/ thought "Everything was/is ENERGY"... ... :waitasec:

 

[Barbara]

I wish people would let the handwriting theory go. It has been cleared up by the handwriting experts that their system is different to others used out there. A 4.5 out of 5 is nearly a no match. The ONLY reason Pasty got a .5 is because of the word 'hence" in the letter which she also used occasionally. It's not a very common word but more people than Patsy use the word. So, thumbsdown to Tom. There is NEARLY NO MATCH. Please, in order to look at this case clearly, we NEED TO REPORT accurate information, not misinformation.

There are as many handwriting analysts willing to state the handwriting matches as there are that it doesn't match. As far as the scale of numbers, nobody has shown where that comes from. ONLY the analyst claiming that Patsy didn't write that note claimed to have this "scale". Anybody can make up a scale and use it to sound really influential, impressive and scientific, when it is just a matter of semantics. THAT analyst didn't think it matched, but there are others who do. So now what?

The handwriting analysis will likely not play a key role in prosecuting this case, as the "experts" will likely cancel each other. It's one of those sciences that can have differing opinions depending on who one asks.

 

[Barbara]

Are you sure, and to what examiners do you refer?

Handwriting analysis is the study of formation of the characters (letters, the connection to other letters, height and width of letters, curvatures of certain letters, endings of certain letters, etc.. The content is where linguistics come into play.

I used to work with a woman who is a graphologist and it was really very interesting. I often wish I knew where she was so I could ask her opinion on the RN, but she has moved and I don't know where. It was a while ago. But she taught me a great deal and I really enjoyed learning from her.

 

[Shylock]

I wish people would let the handwriting theory go. It has been cleared up by the handwriting experts that their system is different to others used out there. A 4.5 out of 5 is nearly a no match. The ONLY reason Pasty got a .5 is because of the word 'hence" in the letter which she also used occasionally. It's not a very common word but more people than Patsy use the word. So, thumbsdown to Tom. There is NEARLY NO MATCH. Please, in order to look at this case clearly, we NEED TO REPORT accurate information, not misinformation.

First, there is no 1-5 scale in handwriting analysis. Anyone familiar with it can tell you that.

Second, the people who came up with that "4.5 on scale of 1-5" nonsense were hired by the Ramseys. It should tell you something that even all that Ramsey money couldn't buy a clean bill of health from the "experts" hired by the Ramseys.

And third, all of the experts compared Patsy's normal writing to the ransom note. That was their mistake. Only one, Gideon Epstein approached his analysis by assuming the note was DISGUISED writing and found way too many matching traits between Patsy's writing for it to be any type of coincidence. Gideon Epstein is 100% positive Patsy wrote the note.

But more importantly, if any normal person with good eyesight looks at the exemplars submitted by Hoffman in the Wolfe case, there is only one conclusiion they can come to--Patsy wrote that ransom note.

OPINION
There are far too many similarities and consistencies revealed in the handwriting of Patsy Ramsey and
the ransom note for it to be coincidence.

Although many writers share some of the same traits found among other authors, as the number of
identifiable traits increases,- the likelihood of two people sharing the same handwriting decreases
dramatically.

In light of the number of comparisons and similarities between Patsy Ramsey and the ransom note
writer (51), the chances of a third party also sharing the same characteristics is astronomical.

Taken individually, the similarities are not nearly as compelling as the sheer numbers and combinations
found in both the writing of Patsy Ramsey and the ransom note.

In my professional opinion Patsy Ramsey is the ransom note writer.

David S. Liebman, C.D.E.

 

[blueclouds]

where are the sample comparisons, I'd like to see that Shylock. Do you have a link I could go to? Thanks

 

[BlueCrab]

where are the sample comparisons, I'd like to see that Shylock. Do you have a link I could go to? Thanks

blueclouds,

Just type "acandyrose" into google or any search engine and almost any information about the JonBenet Ramsey case can be found there, including the Patsy Ramsey exemplars.

The main problem with all of Darnay Hoffman's handwriting experts is they didn't have the original ransom note to analyze. They used copies. Nor did they have the test exemplars taken from the various suspects prior to submitting their first reports.

All of the CBI's experts had the original note to analyze plus they had the test exemplars taken from the 72 suspects who took the tests administered by the CBI.

The six CBI examiners determined that Patsy rated a 4.5 score, which almost eliminated her as the writer. A score of 5.0 eliminates. They said it was a very low probability that Patsy Ramsey wrote the ransom note. Numerous others who were tested scored lower than Patsy, meaning they were more apt to be the writer than was Patsy.

JMO

 

[blueclouds]

That's what I've always known, the 4.5 out of 5.0 scale. I spoke of it in the "I support the intruder theory, but..."

I am going to the acandyrose site to see as I would like to see them. BUT, a handwriting expert takes a lot of training. EVEN in my work, I've seen forms which I thought at first, were mine. They weren't. Seeing similarities takes a lot of education.

 

[Shylock]

I am going to the acandyrose site to see as I would like to see them. BUT, a handwriting expert takes a lot of training. They weren't. Seeing similarities takes a lot of education.

I checked the AcandyRose site and the handwriting comparisons are part of the "2003 911 Motion" file. It's a PDF file that you have to download and have Acrobat Reader to view. Scroll down the file until you come to the Handwriting Evidence exemplars. Here's a link to the file:

http://www.acandyrose.com/02182003dh911motion.pdf

This doesn't take a lot of training as a handwriting expert like you think. When you see 25 examples taken from the ransom note next to matching examples of Patsy's writing, it doesn't take a lot of brains to realize that it would be impossible for some unknown intruder to ever duplicate those same similarities just by chance.

BlueClouds, do you actually think a total stranger could walk into YOUR home and write something that would have characters that would in some way match many of your previous writings?--Not a chance. And if you actually DID find the one-in-a-million stranger whose writings matched yours, what are the odds that person would be a child killer?--Forget it, never happen. Patsy wrote the note.

(Edited to add the link after I found it.)

IMO

 

[BlueCrab]

In one of my BDI theories I suggest the note, because of its naive content, was dictated to Burke Ramsey by a teenage boy. IOW Burke was the writer but not the author.

In support of this hypothesis, according to the handwriting experts early in the investigation, it was established that Burke Ramsey could NOT be ruled out as the writer of the ransom note.

The Daily Camera, November 22, 1997:

"Handwriting analyses conducted prior to the March search revealed John Ramsey did not write the ransom note, that it was "probable" Burke did not write the note and possible that Patsy wrote it, according to documents released Friday."

So:

JOHN did not write it;

BURKE "probably" didn't write it; and

PATSY possibly could have written it.


JMO

 

[TLynn]

Patsy had to give sample handwriting numerous times because of her drug medication. Is that all they used for comparison?

I remember seeing the photo album writing - it was soooo similar. Patsy couldn't remember who wrote the album titles.

Also, those manuscript "a"s are unusual - are we to believe ST that he saw a note given to him by Nedra that had Patsy's handwriting - with manuscript "a"s crossed out...?

And, technically the phrase was "and hence" which is a lot more unusual than "hence." Same phrase "and hence" used in a Christmas card - which the Ramseys claim was written by someone else...

 

[BlueCrab]

I remember seeing the photo album writing - it was soooo similar. Patsy couldn't remember who wrote the album titles.

I'm fairly confident that Patsy did NOT write the captions on the pictures in Burke's personal photo album. I think Burke wrote them. The captions are not written neatly, they contain mistakes, and they are written in the first person. Patsy would have written neater than that.

Darnay Hoffman's handwriting analysts worked from a very limited number of exemplars, and in 1997 were told the captions in the photo album were in the hand of Patsy Ramsey. After analyzing the exemplars and comparing the writing to the writing in the ransom note they all concluded, in separate affidavits, the person who wrote the captions likely wrote the ransom note.

Hoffman's experts -- Tom Miller, Cina Wong, and David Leibman used the captions from Burke's photo album thinking they were Patsy Ramsey's exemplars. I don't think they were -- I think Burke wrote the captions himself and therefore Burke likely wrote the ransom note.


JMO

 

[Toltec]

The word "hence" is not uncommon but the "and hence" is.

Patsy used "and hence" in her Christmas letter. She used "1997" in her Christmas letter.

"Burke will be seeing the orthodontist in 1997"...instead of "Burke will be seeing the orthodontist next year."

There is no doubt in my mind that Patsy wrote the note. There is also no doubt in my mind that Patsy killed JonBenet.

The following is my opinion which cannot be copied.

 

[Shylock]

Hoffman's experts -- Tom Miller, Cina Wong, and David Leibman used the captions from Burke's photo album thinking they were Patsy Ramsey's exemplars. I don't think they were -- I think Burke wrote the captions himself and therefore Burke likely wrote the ransom note.

Unfortunately BlueCrab the writing on the photos in the album matches other known writing by Patsy. One example being the Marilyn Monrow writing for JonBenet, another being the small pageant application.. Patsy said she wasn't sure if the writing on the photo album was hers because Patsy isn't sure about anything, even the address of the house they lived in, if it can be used against her that is...

imo

 

[BlueCrab]

Patsy said she wasn't sure if the writing on the photo album was hers because Patsy isn't sure about anything, even the address of the house they lived in, if it can be used against her that is...

OR if the handwriting can be used against BURKE.

Patsy obviously would remember if she wrote the captions on Burke's photo album. So if she says she doesn't remember then she's covering up for someone, and that someone has to be Burke.

Patsy knows that if the captions on the photo album can be proven to be in Burke's handwriting then Burke wrote the ransom note and killed JonBenet. Patsy is covering for Burke by "not remembering" who wrote the captions.

JMO

 

[Shylock]

Patsy obviously would remember if she wrote the captions on Burke's photo album.

Sure Patsy would remember, what mother wouldn't remember who wrote the captions in her child's photo album. But Patsy is an expert at playing "stupid". Remember how Thomas said questioning her was so frustrating because she wouldn't remember or admit to anything. She even answered "it did?" when asked about the ransom note coming from her own personal note pad when the world knew it did.

So there is just as much chance that Patsy is hiding the truth to protect herself as there is that she's lying to protect Burke.

Furthermore, the wording of the ransom note isn't at all what you would expect from a kid about to turn 10 years old. I think the police determined that early on, which is why they made a huge mistake and completely overlooked Burke as a suspect.

imo

 

[twilight]

~sigh~ One more time. ST says Patsy was good on 24 of the 26 letters of the alphabet. I checked with an expert locally, and she told me that 'a's' and 't's' are the easiest to try to disguise. Now follow closely.

24 divided by 26 = 0.92307692307 everybody get a calculator and do this.

Blue Crab - listen up!

Now take a random number such as 5.

5 = 100% match.

multiply 5 by 0.92307692307 = 4.61538461535

Now, get up in front of a room full of detectives and babble all these number into a report on the probability that Patsy Ramsey wrote the ransom note.

Collect fee from Ramseys.

Let detectives explain to the Ramsey supporters why Patsy is quilty and how she did on the test. uh-huh.

 

[twilight]

Did Burke, or a house full of crazed babysitters write the ransom note - in fact (holding the pen and pushing on the paper) or in abstract (composing the words and their structure) - NO. Why? Because Patsy Ramsey wrote the ransom note. How do I know this? Becaue I am trained to compare written texts and uncover similarities between documents. Others are trained to look at formation of letters and determine if there is a match. This has been done and all agree - Patsy wrote the ransom note.

 

[BlueCrab]

~sigh~ One more time. ST says Patsy was good on 24 of the 26 letters of the alphabet. I checked with an expert locally, and she told me that 'a's' and 't's' are the easiest to try to disguise. Now follow closely.

24 divided by 26 = 0.92307692307 everybody get a calculator and do this.

Blue Crab - listen up!

Now take a random number such as 5.

5 = 100% match.

multiply 5 by 0.92307692307 = 4.61538461535

Now, get up in front of a room full of detectives and babble all these number into a report on the probability that Patsy Ramsey wrote the ransom note.

Collect fee from Ramseys.

Let detectives explain to the Ramsey supporters why Patsy is quilty and how she did on the test. uh-huh.

Please spare us. Steve Thomas' 24 out of 26 letters matching doesn't even make any sense. No one in the CBI corroborated that babble.

We were all taught in elementary school using the same 26 letters to copy from and therefore in the U.S. we all write similarly. In what country did Patsy learn to write the two letters that didn't match? China? Afghanistan?

JMO