TRIAL OF CHAD DAYBELL CHARGED WITH MURDER OF JJ VALLOW, TYLEE RYAN AND TAMMY DAYBELL #4

[aafromaa]

Is it the prosecution or defense that has J Rowe listed as a possible witness? Does anyone think either side will actually call her??

No. I think both sides know she has mental issues by now and even if they had originally thought they might call her must realize by now that she is a loose cannon and there is no telling what she might spew out on the stand. I think the only reason we know she was on a witness list at all is that someone must have heard a court officer tell her that’s why she couldn’t go in the court the other day. I don’t know who heard it but I’m guessing the bailiff or deputy didn’t specify what side had her on their list when he denied her entry. It’s also possible that one side or the other put her on a witness list simply so she could not be present in the courtroom in the first place.

After the last few video clips I’ve seen of her, I really do think she has had a psychotic break and someone needs to intervene and get her some help.

 

[Love Never Fails]

Didn’t watch much of it so I can’t really say - I just couldn’t take it

It will come up next week, likely Monday orTuesday.

 

[fred&edna]

I've witnessed the embalming process many times (I'm a funeral director in the UK) and, while it's the case that fluids and gasses are removed from the abdomen and abdominal organs (stomach, intestines), the lungs aren't part of that process.

I doubt (MOO of course) that embalming itself would account for any additional fluid in the lungs/heaviness. After reading Ruminations' post though, I did a bit of reading and found that "heavy lung edema" is associated with suffocation. The forensic pathology paper here is heavy going, but the heavy lung observation is about halfway through.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0379073818308442

Thank you for the clarification! I thought the chest cavity was involved, too... but I see that doesn't include the lungs. (I've got a rather yucky funeral home embalming story but I won't share that now).

 

[fred&edna]

No. I think both sides know she has mental issues by now and even if they had originally thought they might call her must realize by now that she is a loose cannon and there is no telling what she might spew out on the stand. I think the only reason we know she was on a witness list at all is that someone must have heard a court officer tell her that’s why she couldn’t go in the court the other day. I don’t know who heard it but I’m guessing the bailiff or deputy didn’t specify what side had her on their list when he denied her entry. It’s also possible that one side or the other put her on a witness list simply so she could not be present in the courtroom in the first place.

After the last few video clips I’ve seen of her, I really do think she has had a psychotic break and someone needs to intervene and get her some help.

I T A! Good to know I'm not alone in these thoughts.

 

[Artis]

I'm less than half way through the playing of the secret recordings and am floored at Melani's almost reverting to a child like mentality with Chad and Lori, a.k.a., "mommy and daddy" . Then the idiotic conversation with Chad telling her she had to move - after moving up there from Arizona and believing it was a "safe place" for when TSHTF apocalypse happened - and you could tell she was experiencing some cognitive dissonance but was so vulnerable to being controlled and unable to think for herself. I cannot imagine what kind of man would want to be married to that mess but I'd say she's lucky Ian came along. It's quite stunning to think she's a twice married woman with children because her level of maturity sounds like a little kid. After not being into this for such a long, it also all comes back to me how all of these people moved around so much. I always found that so weird. It's not only a huge hassle to move but it's expensive and I often wondered where all of them were getting the money to do it so often.

 

[longtimereader]

Has anyone in court managed to see what Chad is looking at on his laptop? Is he playing solitaire? Do you know if it has the same limitations that prisoners have or do think he can surf or email during court? Just curious.

 

[lightofmine99]

Has anyone in court managed to see what Chad is looking at on his laptop? Is he playing solitaire? Do you know if it has the same limitations that prisoners have or do think he can surf or email during court? Just curious.

This has been brought up on Courtroom Insider. I think Nate said that he only has access to court files and note-taking programs. Nate guessed it is probably locked down and the internet will only allow access to trial-related content. I can't imagine he could just have free reign of the internet during court.

Lori had a notebook that she doodled in. I'm sure Chad has a notebook too or, maybe they're given the option of a laptop or notebook and he chose a laptop.

 

[iamshadow21]

Is it common in the LDS faith for the spouse’s name to be added to a headstone?

I can only speak for my own family, but my stepfather's name was already on the headstone of his first wife when we were discussing arrangements for him. 'Eternal companion to...' then his name. So only dates needed adding, when he was buried there.

Other family members who have passed we didn't have to consider it. My grandmother was cremated, which I know isn't generally done for LDS, but she always did what she wanted and hang the rest, so she was cremated as she wished and her ashes scattered where she loved best, so no headstone.

MOO

 

[nodamselindistress]

As far as the headstone issue goes, my thoughts are that Chad could have at the very least appeared to show sadness or some form of grieving for the sake of his children. However, it is obvious that he JUST DIDN'T CARE. He and Tammy were sealed at marriage and had 5 children together and his name should have been on her headstone, whether he wanted to end up buried there or not.

I think he sat those kids down and explained something to them along the lines of "I loved your Mom but we had grown apart and because I knew she would die young I had already been working on my new life." He moved in with Lori the night of the 2nd service!! That can't be lost on those kids yet they still defend him. I just don't see how that could be unless he explained something to them at the time. EVERYONE ELSE at the service and after Tammy's death questioned whether Chad was sorrowful or grieving, nobody thought he acted "normal" or whatever normal is supposed to be for someone married closed to 30 years.

 

[lightofmine99]

I would like to wish Tammy Douglas a happy Heavenly Mother's Day. I of course never knew her but I can't help but think that strangers on the internet wishing her a happy day will be the only wishes she gets from earthly people today. I do hope I'm wrong.

And if I am wrong, I also can't help but feel the Mother's Day wishes will be hollow, since I think we have long since passed the point of "being in denial because I love my dad" being a viable excuse.

 

[Love Never Fails]

Has anyone in court managed to see what Chad is looking at on his laptop? Is he playing solitaire? Do you know if it has the same limitations that prisoners have or do think he can surf or email during court? Just curious.

Nate Eaton said he can only see evidence on his laptop and he spends time in court just scrolling. Nate said he can see Chads laptop clearly and pictures don’t show up but evidence against him does. He said he isn’t taking time to read it. He just scrolls back and forth all day. He also rearranges his desk and plays with his hands during the day.

 

[Ruminations]

I would like to wish Tammy Douglas a happy Heavenly Mother's Day. I of course never knew her but I can't help but think that strangers on the internet wishing her a happy day will be the only wishes she gets from earthly people today. I do hope I'm wrong.

And if I am wrong, I also can't help but feel the Mother's Day wishes will be hollow, since I think we have long since passed the point of "being in denial because I love my dad" being a viable excuse.

I believe Tammy has enormous well-wishes from her family. I also believe that it is possible some of her children are too damaged by their father to feel their real feelings about their mother at this time. However, I believe Tammy's family will be patient and support them, and help them make good on a few "rain checks" for mothers days past- when they are ready.

MOO

HAPPY MOTHERS DAY to everyone who has mothered or been mothered- biologically or otherwise!

MOO

 

[indicolite22]

I'm less than half way through the playing of the secret recordings and am floored at Melani's almost reverting to a child like mentality with Chad and Lori, a.k.a., "mommy and daddy" . Then the idiotic conversation with Chad telling her she had to move - after moving up there from Arizona and believing it was a "safe place" for when TSHTF apocalypse happened - and you could tell she was experiencing some cognitive dissonance but was so vulnerable to being controlled and unable to think for herself. I cannot imagine what kind of man would want to be married to that mess but I'd say she's lucky Ian came along. It's quite stunning to think she's a twice married woman with children because her level of maturity sounds like a little kid. After not being into this for such a long, it also all comes back to me how all of these people moved around so much. I always found that so weird. It's not only a huge hassle to move but it's expensive and I often wondered where all of them were getting the money to do it so often.

Even before meeting Chad, Lori was a maternal figure to MBP, whose mother (Lori's sister) died when she was young. When Chad came along, he revealed that MBP was his and Lori's daughter in a past life. MBP was not the only one that called Lori mom. MG, who is Lori's age, was also told by C&L that Lori was once her mother. IIRC, ZP was related to Chad or Lori in a past life as well. It's all bonkers to us, but those people bought it. Not only were they followers, they were family.

 

[mickey2942]

I still worry about this, as automatic appeal grounds.

Attorney's request to withdraw from Chad Daybell murder case denied by judge

John Prior said his motion to withdraw is not just about money, but resources. If he withdraws, Chad Daybell could be appointed two new attorneys, he said.

www.12news.com

 

[aafromaa]

I still worry about this, as automatic appeal grounds.

Attorney's request to withdraw from Chad Daybell murder case denied by judge

John Prior said his motion to withdraw is not just about money, but resources. If he withdraws, Chad Daybell could be appointed two new attorneys, he said.

www.12news.com

I have some concerns about it too but I think the fact that JP stated CD did not want a new attorney & CD said himself that it reduces the likelihood of an appeal being successful on these grounds. I think that’s the very reason the judge asked CD about it in open court. I also think if JP had filed this motion a year earlier that the judge would have granted the motion. To wait until it was so close to the start of trial was just plain wrong and I don’t think JP ever thought it would be granted but I do think he thought the judge might give him more time to get a death qualified public defender on board. Unfortunately for him, there is no legal obligation for the defendant to have a death qualified attorney on his team if defendant has chosen his own counsel so the judge wasn’t willing to delay the start of the trial for him to find someone since he waited til the last minute.

 

[grannygates]

Apologies if this has been discussed. I haven’t been following the thread closely but have been watching the trial.

I’m curious what everyone makes of the “second story bedroom”. Pryor seemed to use this as a way to discredit the niece re:chad changing his story at Tammy’s wake. But the niece agreed she had never been tothe house, was just repeating the story she heard.

Then LE agent states there WAS a second story bedroom and he actually attended the house, saw it first hand. Pryor wanted it known that the second story was off the garage, not accessible from inside the house.

Does any of this actually mean anything to the jury or in any legal aspect? Or is it just to muddy the waters? Seems like a nonissue to me but I’m not on the jury of course. Thoughts?

 

[Artis]

Even before meeting Chad, Lori was a maternal figure to MBP, whose mother (Lori's sister) died when she was young. When Chad came along, he revealed that MBP was his and Lori's daughter in a past life. MBP was not the only one that called Lori mom. MG, who is Lori's age, was also told by C&L that Lori was once her mother. IIRC, ZP was related to Chad or Lori in a past life as well. It's all bonkers to us, but those people bought it. Not only were they followers, they were family.

And in Melani's case, she was both cult family and biological family. I do remember that her mother died from what sounded like anorexia, but do you remember what the deal was with her bio father and is he dead or alive? Obviously, she was very damaged by the loss of her mother and whatever happened with her father.

 

[Artis]

Apologies if this has been discussed. I haven’t been following the thread closely but have been watching the trial.

I’m curious what everyone makes of the “second story bedroom”. Pryor seemed to use this as a way to discredit the niece re:chad changing his story at Tammy’s wake. But the niece agreed she had never been tothe house, was just repeating the story she heard.

Then LE agent states there WAS a second story bedroom and he actually attended the house, saw it first hand. Pryor wanted it known that the second story was off the garage, not accessible from inside the house.

Does any of this actually mean anything to the jury or in any legal aspect? Or is it just to muddy the waters? Seems like a nonissue to me but I’m not on the jury of course. Thoughts?

I've only watched some of the testimonies on YT but how did Chad change his story at Tammy's wake? I was also not clear on why that upstairs bedroom is significant. Also, did one or more of Chad's kids live at home when Tammy died?

 

[Artis]

As far as the headstone issue goes, my thoughts are that Chad could have at the very least appeared to show sadness or some form of grieving for the sake of his children. However, it is obvious that he JUST DIDN'T CARE. He and Tammy were sealed at marriage and had 5 children together and his name should have been on her headstone, whether he wanted to end up buried there or not.

I think he sat those kids down and explained something to them along the lines of "I loved your Mom but we had grown apart and because I knew she would die young I had already been working on my new life." He moved in with Lori the night of the 2nd service!! That can't be lost on those kids yet they still defend him. I just don't see how that could be unless he explained something to them at the time. EVERYONE ELSE at the service and after Tammy's death questioned whether Chad was sorrowful or grieving, nobody thought he acted "normal" or whatever normal is supposed to be for someone married closed to 30 years.

Are all five of his kids still defending him? I don't know much about them other than seeing that interview with them a few years ago. I can understand being traumatized at the loss of both parents but, man, with two dead kids buried in the yard I'd like to know what kind of story they're telling themselves to convince themselves he's innocent.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

I'm less than half way through the playing of the secret recordings and am floored at Melani's almost reverting to a child like mentality with Chad and Lori, a.k.a., "mommy and daddy" . Then the idiotic conversation with Chad telling her she had to move - after moving up there from Arizona and believing it was a "safe place" for when TSHTF apocalypse happened - and you could tell she was experiencing some cognitive dissonance but was so vulnerable to being controlled and unable to think for herself. I cannot imagine what kind of man would want to be married to that mess but I'd say she's lucky Ian came along. It's quite stunning to think she's a twice married woman with children because her level of maturity sounds like a little kid. After not being into this for such a long, it also all comes back to me how all of these people moved around so much. I always found that so weird. It's not only a huge hassle to move but it's expensive and I often wondered where all of them were getting the money to do it so often.

The moving was always strange to me. I think they usually rented, but still the $$$ sent!?? AND all the trips to Hawaii . And all the thieving to get SS and insurance money.
I think, sometimes, the we grossly underestimate the motive of pure MONEY in all their madness.