TX TX - Jason Landry, 21, enroute from TSU to home, car found crashed at Luling, 14 Dec 2020 #4

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Then...I am legitimately at a loss to describe how such a scenario could have unfolded - that his digital trail stops at that intersection but his phone wasn't turned off or in airplane mode. Something is not right. Something at the scene was misinterpreted or one of the given statements is factually wrong.

The only thing I can think of, which sounds absolutely ridiculous, is that the area between the car seat and center console is some kind of faraday cage. JL fumbled the phone at the intersection and it dropped through and he couldn't recover it, so his digital trail ends. Then, the impact of the crash shakes the phone loose out of that area, and the digital trail "picks up" again. (As KL was making phone calls in that area at around 6 a.m. we can infer that the crash site area isn't a dead signal zone.)

I can't even think of a scenario where JL might have done this on purpose, because his phone was in the car and he was not there at 12:31. If his digital trail had ended and his phone was nowhere to be found, I could faintly believe that there was foul play or he was trying to disappear. Unless, again, we go into high fantasy scenarios like that JL's digital trail did intentionally end, JL met foul play, and then his phone was later planted in the car.

I’m just as confused.
At first I thought LE’s choice of wording was ‘off’ and they meant until they can get more info with what Jason was doing on Snapchat at that time, that his digital footprint “ended” there...
But if that were the case, there still should have been phone pings during that 67 min window correct?
 
Only want to add a couple thoughts, that I don’t believe have been mentioned.

RE: Waze - Has anyone confirmed he was using Waze for directions? I ask because years and years ago when Waze was first created, it really wasn’t quite used so much for directions. It was used as a ‘cop spotted’ for lack of better wording. I haven’t used it in well over 10 years but it was user submitted data, meaning I drive on highway 123 and in between exits 7&8 I see a cop hiding out to pull offenders over. So I can mark that spot so other drivers know he’s there to avoid getting pulled over (Ex. Slow back from speeding). I never used it for directions, I don’t even really remember that being an option. It just highlighted the route you were on and headed. If they did in fact verify it was giving directions, it obviously had an end destination that it was giving directions to - do they know this destination?

RE: Phone activity lost - maybe his phone battery died. I know I’ve used my phone myself till it died (crappy phone and could rarely get it to charge). Especially being younger this could be potential, my daughter is constantly saying “my batteries at 3%” ‍♀️ So it powers off. He plugs it in however, portable chargepack, USB to car part whichever way. When my phone died due to this and I plugged it in to charge it would automatically come back on once it had a certain amount charged, so died, plugs it in, and later turns back on once charged.

Lastly, whenever I use any mapping apps, I almost alway close them when I am close, or familiar to said area. If they know the destination and this makes no sense, then it’s irrelevant. However if they do not definitively know his end destination, his clicking off it may indicate he’s almost where he’s looking to go?

MOO
 
Only want to add a couple thoughts, that I don’t believe have been mentioned.

RE: Waze - Has anyone confirmed he was using Waze for directions? I ask because years and years ago when Waze was first created, it really wasn’t quite used so much for directions. It was used as a ‘cop spotted’ for lack of better wording. I haven’t used it in well over 10 years but it was user submitted data, meaning I drive on highway 123 and in between exits 7&8 I see a cop hiding out to pull offenders over. So I can mark that spot so other drivers know he’s there to avoid getting pulled over (Ex. Slow back from speeding). I never used it for directions, I don’t even really remember that being an option. It just highlighted the route you were on and headed. If they did in fact verify it was giving directions, it obviously had an end destination that it was giving directions to - do they know this destination?

RE: Phone activity lost - maybe his phone battery died. I know I’ve used my phone myself till it died (crappy phone and could rarely get it to charge). Especially being younger this could be potential, my daughter is constantly saying “my batteries at 3%” ‍♀️ So it powers off. He plugs it in however, portable chargepack, USB to car part whichever way. When my phone died due to this and I plugged it in to charge it would automatically come back on once it had a certain amount charged, so died, plugs it in, and later turns back on once charged.

Lastly, whenever I use any mapping apps, I almost alway close them when I am close, or familiar to said area. If they know the destination and this makes no sense, then it’s irrelevant. However if they do not definitively know his end destination, his clicking off it may indicate he’s almost where he’s looking to go?

MOO
When I use Waze, the address I enter is put in and kept on a list so that if I want to go there again I just click on it as a destination. Wouldn't LE be able to contact WAZE and get this information from them? They could see what his last destination was and where he had traveled before. Perhaps there was a pattern.


I am just seeing this. I just echoed the same thoughts. I feel like if they haven’t been able to tell themselves in looking at the phone, they would go to Waze. Idk how they couldn’t, it seems like it could contain a lot of relevant information.
 
When I use Waze, the address I enter is put in and kept on a list so that if I want to go there again I just click on it as a destination. Wouldn't LE be able to contact WAZE and get this information from them? They could see what his last destination was and where he had traveled before. Perhaps there was a pattern.

I presume that LE has already started the process of issuing warrants, but those take months. Waze probably has a TOS or other legal restrictions that prevent them from just telling LE about info on a certain user. According to KL, warrants for Snapchat can take 22 months.

^^rsbm

It was very early that JL's dad provided that he found his son's phone inside his vehicle using an app that their family shared to find phone/friends. Reportedly, the find phone app does not work if the instrument is in airplane mode. I think authorities are confident the phone was on and transmitting when JL walked away from the crash.

MOO

I am skeptical of LE's confidence, given that they released all this info six weeks after the crash, asking the public to help figure out that 67-minute window. But, again, speculation/my opinion only. I hope they know more than they are releasing.
 
I had another thought, and I'll be the first to admit it's pretty "out there".

What if he joined a cult/religion that requires a member to give up their worldly possessions? If that's the case, he literally ditched everything he had with him, including the car, his fish, and his clothing. Was it some sort of initiation or ritual, with someone in the cult/religion picking him up after he discarded all of his possessions? That could explain why his scent trail seemed to just end, too. (I think that's what I read. Please correct me if I'm mis-remembering.) Also, one of the articles in the first post of this thread says that his father is a pastor. Maybe Jason decided to explore alternatives to the religion he'd grown up with?

I had a couple of childhood friends with pastor/preacher parents, and they both changed religions after they became adults. One of the changes was pretty drastic. (I imagine there was a HUGE fall-out with his parents when they found out! :eek:) Anyway, that's what made me think of this as being a possibility, even though I freely admit it's far-fetched. :)
 
I had another thought, and I'll be the first to admit it's pretty "out there".

What if he joined a cult/religion that requires a member to give up their worldly possessions? If that's the case, he literally ditched everything he had with him, including the car, his fish, and his clothing. Was it some sort of initiation or ritual, with someone in the cult/religion picking him up after he discarded all of his possessions? That could explain why his scent trail seemed to just end, too. (I think that's what I read. Please correct me if I'm mis-remembering.) Also, one of the articles in the first post of this thread says that his father is a pastor. Maybe Jason decided to explore alternatives to the religion he'd grown up with?

I had a couple of childhood friends with pastor/preacher parents, and they both changed religions after they became adults. One of the changes was pretty drastic. (I imagine there was a HUGE fall-out with his parents when they found out! :eek:) Anyway, that's what made me think of this as being a possibility, even though I freely admit it's far-fetched. :)
Three schools in as many years, a back pack with only video games, no clothes other than what he was wearing as he was heading into several weeks at home over the holidays, all can be explained away when looked at as single events. Putting them together, a picture of a young man who seems rudderless and lost in his way. To me he would be someone who would be vulnerable to a cult like church or group. He has been raised in a religious family and could be looking for a group who is supportive and who gives him meaning.
He may not have felt he was living up to expectations and needed some time to get his head together. He may not have realized how isolating and controlling a group/church like that can be or it isn't a problem to him. MOO MOO MOO
 
Lastly, whenever I use any mapping apps, I almost alway close them when I am close, or familiar to said area. If they know the destination and this makes no sense, then it’s irrelevant. However if they do not definitively know his end destination, his clicking off it may indicate he’s almost where he’s looking to go?

MOO

That's what I believe. That he used Waze to get to that intersection, switched over to SnapChat waiting to be told 'what next'. I think he planned on meeting someone and that's what the private Waze interaction was about. The why is what I can't quite put my finger on. Keep in mind he never told his parents he was coming that night. Everyone (including them) assume that's where he was going. I'd like to know if he always told them when he was coming, or just arrived unannounced in the middle of the night. I'm more apt to think the former over the latter.

Then there's his pet betta.... I think he was planning on staying, wherever it is he was going, for a long time. Maybe it was only overnight at the first destination, THEN he was going to call home saying he's on his way the next day at a more reasonable hour. Driving that far in the middle of the night, when there's no need for him to be there in a few hours, doesn't make sense to me that that is where he was immediately headed. It might have been his end destination, but I don't think it was the first destination of the evening.
 
I had another thought, and I'll be the first to admit it's pretty "out there".

What if he joined a cult/religion that requires a member to give up their worldly possessions? If that's the case, he literally ditched everything he had with him, including the car, his fish, and his clothing. Was it some sort of initiation or ritual, with someone in the cult/religion picking him up after he discarded all of his possessions? That could explain why his scent trail seemed to just end, too. (I think that's what I read. Please correct me if I'm mis-remembering.) Also, one of the articles in the first post of this thread says that his father is a pastor. Maybe Jason decided to explore alternatives to the religion he'd grown up with?

I had a couple of childhood friends with pastor/preacher parents, and they both changed religions after they became adults. One of the changes was pretty drastic. (I imagine there was a HUGE fall-out with his parents when they found out! :eek:) Anyway, that's what made me think of this as being a possibility, even though I freely admit it's far-fetched. :)

I too have thought this. There is a cult status church ~4.5 hrs from San Marcos. Here are a few things I copied from the attached (loooooonnngggg) article about that church at the bottom of this post. BBM. Dr. Phil show did 2 airings about one of the guys that ended up getting away from the cult.
  • It recruits new members on the campuses of universities <snip>
  • Masao Gonthier, a street preacher the elders met in New York in 2009, helped recruit a cluster of members from California, his home state, including Brett and Suzie Stoughton, both Calvary Chapel Bible College graduates, who packed up their infant daughter, Lily, and left Suzie’s parents’ house in Riverside in the middle of the night.
  • (this one is from a different article) Catherine (Grove), 26, left her apartment in Arkansas in the middle of the night and took a bus to Lufkin, about 20 miles from Wells.
  • One of the most contentious regular practices of cults is the careful and unrelenting separation of new recruits from their families, a process known as shunning. Cult leaders derive their power from manipulating their followers’ environments <snip> Whether the Church of Wells is a cult or not, it follows this practice to a T.
And no, I can't explain his pet betta. Maybe he wasn't aware he wouldn't be allowed to bring it?

Sinners in the Hands
 
I think the key to JL's disappearance may lie in determining why he turned off his Waze app - and turned on his snapchat app - while traveling east on E Austin and going through the N Magnolia Ave intersection.

Turning off the Waze app would seem to indicate that he no longer felt he needed it for directions: that at that point, he knew his way back to 80, knew to then head south, and knew to then take Interstate 10 east to Houston. Either that, or he could always turn Waze back on.

As I understand it, turning on the snapchat app would typically be done to communicate with another person more anonymously - using texts, photos, and gifs - which all then disappear.

A more recent snap map feature on snapchat allows users to find and track others on a local map - but only if the users have first given permission to snapchat to allow the app to show and track their locations in real time. Of course the record of these movements also quickly disappears - just like the messages, photos and gifs.

JL may or may not have been using the snap map feature, and may or may not have been trying to communicate with somebody local. If he was though, I wonder who it could have been? I guess only when the subpoenaed snapchat records are available will we know the answer. Jmo
THIS!!!! Completely agree.
 
This could have been brought up previously and I missed it.

In talking to someone much more knowledgeable about Snapchat than I am I learned about a newer feature. Along with the snaps that can be sent directly to an individual, the app also allows you to post as a "story" similar to other social media apps. This would be open for all of that person's connections to see whenever they choose to open it. These stay up for 24 hours.

When he opened Snapchat at that intersection he could have been either creating or viewing someone's story post. They would have been able to see he had viewed it, if they had checked, but only from 24 hours from when it was originally posted.

To me, this could explain why no one has come forward to say that they were having a snapchat conversation with him at that time.
 
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Sorry if this has already been discussed...

Was he wearing a regular watch or a smart watch? I know he ditched it with his clothes, but if it was a smart watch they might get some clues from his heart rate while he did have it on. Just a thought.
 
I’m just as confused.
At first I thought LE’s choice of wording was ‘off’ and they meant until they can get more info with what Jason was doing on Snapchat at that time, that his digital footprint “ended” there...
But if that were the case, there still should have been phone pings during that 67 min window correct?
Do we know that LE has obtained cell phone ping data at this point? I believe his dad said they were still waiting on information from lots of tech companies. It's possible that when they say his digital footprint essentially ended, they just mean that there isn't any more activity in the data they currently have.

Based on the LE press release, it seems like they have information on what apps he used and possibly location data. But the locations could have been obtained in a lot of ways (traffic cameras, RFID toll card, etc). So maybe they just have basic app usage data? It's possible that someone (his provider? apple/google) gave them that without a court order, but they'll have to wait for more detailed info.

If his phone was on for those 67 minutes (which it seems it was), then I have to imagine that the ping data exists. It doesn't seem like he went far enough from the town to enter a no-coverage area, but I guess it's possible.
 
Sorry if this has already been discussed...

Was he wearing a regular watch or a smart watch? I know he ditched it with his clothes, but if it was a smart watch they might get some clues from his heart rate while he did have it on. Just a thought.
His Dad discussed his watch on the long video interview, he did not clarify whether it was a smartwatch or not. I have a feeling it would have been mentioned in the latest police presser, had it been taken into evidence. I suspect it was a normal straightforward watch.
I wondered whether it had a special significance for him, personally, but this was never discussed.

Welcome to Websleuths, btw!
 
Reportedly, this was JL's first semester at TSU-- and prior to San Marcos, he was at SFASU where he proudly tweeted his acceptance letter in 2018. I believe his FB indicates he attended additional schools than those above.

Was JL struggling to find the right fit? Also, interesting tweet on Nov 26, 2020.

https://mobile.twitter.com/jasonlandry_?lang=en
DXQjO7hVwAA6wpf


Poor kid was overwhelmed. Understandably alot of our youth are. Just made me anxious reading that.

Still praying they find him alive somewhere.
 
Do we know that LE has obtained cell phone ping data at this point? I believe his dad said they were still waiting on information from lots of tech companies. It's possible that when they say his digital footprint essentially ended, they just mean that there isn't any more activity in the data they currently have.

Based on the LE press release, it seems like they have information on what apps he used and possibly location data. But the locations could have been obtained in a lot of ways (traffic cameras, RFID toll card, etc). So maybe they just have basic app usage data? It's possible that someone (his provider? apple/google) gave them that without a court order, but they'll have to wait for more detailed info.

If his phone was on for those 67 minutes (which it seems it was), then I have to imagine that the ping data exists. It doesn't seem like he went far enough from the town to enter a no-coverage area, but I guess it's possible.
I think this is possible. Could they even get a warrant for a tower dump with no evidence of a crime? Do you need a tower dump for ping data or is there another way? It is much easier to get a warrant for a missing person's app because they are the missing person. A tower dump is more difficult because you are infringing on many innocent person's rights.
 
His Dad discussed it at some length in the long interview

Thanks, I found it.

This makes me lean away from the paradoxical undressing due to hypothermia. If undressing in a desperate attempt to cool down I have a hard time picturing someone removing their watch before their shirt.

I'm now thinking there may be some weight to the theory of some sort of sleepwalking. (This could be in conjunction with use of marijuana at some point that evening.) Removing a watch before the shirt makes more sense if one's mind thinks they're heading to the shower or bed. I have witnessed three family members that have done some wild things while sleepwalking. They seem like they are wide awake. We have carried on conversations. In the morning, they have no recollection of any of it.

Alternately, if he had the presence of mind to purposely place the watch underneath the shirt, to hide it in some way, that opens up a whole other door of possibilities.

MOO
 
Thanks, I found it.

This makes me lean away from the paradoxical undressing due to hypothermia. If undressing in a desperate attempt to cool down I have a hard time picturing someone removing their watch before their shirt.

I'm now thinking there may be some weight to the theory of some sort of sleepwalking. (This could be in conjunction with use of marijuana at some point that evening.) Removing a watch before the shirt makes more sense if one's mind thinks they're heading to the shower or bed. I have witnessed three family members that have done some wild things while sleepwalking. They seem like they are wide awake. We have carried on conversations. In the morning, they have no recollection of any of it.

Alternately, if he had the presence of mind to purposely place the watch underneath the shirt, to hide it in some way, that opens up a whole other door of possibilities.

MOO
Indeed.
I wondered what his typical bedtime routine might be.
His pre-bathing routine.
Or even if it is the kind of thing he might do if swimming in a public place, keep his watch out of sight in order to protect it from thieves.
Then again,his wallet was in his backpack,dropped already..
Even sticking to the bare facts we know, it is a most perplexing case.
 
I think this is possible. Could they even get a warrant for a tower dump with no evidence of a crime? Do you need a tower dump for ping data or is there another way? It is much easier to get a warrant for a missing person's app because they are the missing person. A tower dump is more difficult because you are infringing on many innocent person's rights.
Highly inaccurate and unreliable. This would not in any way be useful information in my view. Even w/triangulation, pinpointing the location wouldn't be very useful. I've used this information before on numerous occasions and the area is very very broad; much larger than the area we are dealing with here. Far more useful is data from GPS and attempts by the phone to connect to servers. The remote area of SFR means his phone is not really attempting to connect w/various servers. I think - from a location standpoint - there is very little information that can be gleaned from the cell phone subscriber. They key - is in the apps - and without physical access to the phone, ie to crack the security code on the device, there is no way to really know what apps he was using that night.
 
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