Found Deceased TX - Thomas Brown, 18, Hemphill County, 23 Nov 2016 #3

Status
Not open for further replies.

los2188

North Carolina Tar Heels..your NCCA Champs!!
Joined
May 21, 2012
Messages
15,533
Reaction score
505
Hemphill County searching for missing teen
12547835_G.jpg

According Brown's mother, Penny Brown, he was last seen around 11:30 p.m. Wednesday, Nov. 23. after spending the evening with friends, and has not been seen or heard from since.

According to the Canadian Record, searchers found Brown's SUV around 9:30 a.m. Thursday, Nov. 24 at the municipal wastewater treatment facility parked under some trees with no signs of foul play.
http://www.newschannel10.com/story/33793738/hemphill-county-searching-for-missing-teen



Thread #1
Thread #2
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Nick217

Member
Joined
Oct 27, 2021
Messages
10
Reaction score
56
Do we know the angle of the security camera? Would it have seen a car driving past the area? I assume not or we wouldve heard something but apologize if this has already been discussed before and I missed it
 

OutWest

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2020
Messages
264
Reaction score
1,916
Do we know the angle of the security camera? Would it have seen a car driving past the area? I assume not or we wouldve heard something but apologize if this has already been discussed before and I missed it
I have never heard what the camera angle was. The Pavilion is 65 yards from the road that passes in front. As @artivail posted, the Durango was found 500+ yards from the Pavilion.
 

Attachments

  • Pavilion Area (photo).jpg
    Pavilion Area (photo).jpg
    132.7 KB · Views: 21

artiyail

Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2022
Messages
10
Reaction score
41
The small gate area itself (although it would be too far away to see from the camera) is approx 25-30 degrees from the Pavillion but that's from a straight-on POV. The [former] Sheriff NL talks about it on the TBB podcast Episode 2:

Skip (TBB host): [At 5:56 am the Durango was picked up by a camera positioned on a city-owned building near the water-treatment plant]

Former Sheriff NL "You see Tom's car driving on the road going through the gate and you can see it in the distance, the tails lights, you can see it go up over this little hill, and then that's where we found the car. That's where the car was parked. There was nobody in or out before or after on that video at all."

Skip gets confused after this because he interprets NL's explanation as he couldn't see anyone getting in or out of the car, but what NL actually claims is you cannot see anyone [vehicles] go in or out of the area because the CCTV camera covers the road.

The OAG report also mentions that no vehicles can be seen passing before the Durango is picked up: "Video at the pavilion does not show any vehicles driving though the pavilion area from 3:45 am until the Durango presumptively pulls in past the gate at 5:56 a.m.".

So what do we have here:
  • PM claims TB (Tom's brother) said he wanted to drive through the gate area but Deputy PG refused saying his shift was ending
  • Deputy PG claims that TB stopped him going in the area of the water treatment-plant
  • The OAG report and former Sheriff NL claim you can only see Tom's durango drive down the road and through the gate, and that there's no other vehicles on that road before or after, thus refuting PM/TB/Family claim that Deputy PG and TB drove by the gate 15 minutes before the Durango was there.
I would hope that the AG's office have actually seen the video and can prove this, I would hope that NL didn't destroy this video [also] and the AG's office aren't just 'taking his word' this is what the video showed. <modsnip>
 
Last edited by a moderator:

OutWest

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2020
Messages
264
Reaction score
1,916
The small gate area itself (although it would be too far away to see from the camera) is approx 25-30 degrees from the Pavillion but that's from a straight-on POV. The [former] Sheriff NL talks about it on the TBB podcast Episode 2:

Skip (TBB host): [At 5:56 am the Durango was picked up by a camera positioned on a city-owned building near the water-treatment plant]

Former Sheriff NL "You see Tom's car driving on the road going through the gate and you can see it in the distance, the tails lights, you can see it go up over this little hill, and then that's where we found the car. That's where the car was parked. There was nobody in or out before or after on that video at all."

Skip gets confused after this because he interprets NL's explanation as he couldn't see anyone getting in or out of the car, but what NL actually claims is you cannot see anyone [vehicles] go in or out of the area because the CCTV camera covers the road.

The OAG report also mentions that no vehicles can be seen passing before the Durango is picked up: "Video at the pavilion does not show any vehicles driving though the pavilion area from 3:45 am until the Durango presumptively pulls in past the gate at 5:56 a.m.".

So what do we have here:
  • PM claims TB (Tom's brother) said he wanted to drive through the gate area but Deputy PG refused saying his shift was ending
  • Deputy PG claims that TB stopped him going in the area of the water treatment-plant
  • The OAG report and former Sheriff NL claim you can only see Tom's durango drive down the road and through the gate, and that there's no other vehicles on that road before or after, thus refuting PM/TB/Family claim that Deputy PG and TB drove by the gate 15 minutes before the Durango was there.
I would hope that the AG's office have actually seen the video and can prove this, I would hope that NL didn't destroy this video [also] and the AG's office aren't just 'taking his word' this is what the video showed. <modsnip>

IMO, it doesn't appear to me that Deputy PG "refused" to return to the water treatment area. At approximate Mark 1:01:32 on the July 2018 Unfound interview with PM, she states that Deputy PG had told TB that he was nearing the end of his shift and "that's why Tucker did not ask the deputy to return to the area". I believe that it is entirely possible that PM was stating what she believed to be true regarding the alleged earlier trip through the water treatment area. Possibly repeating what she had been told or she had misunderstood what she had been told by TB.

Another thought ..... if TB had knowledge that the normally locked gate was now open, how would he know that? The Pavilion CCTV indicates no travel in the area that morning except for the Durango. So, TB must have been in that area at some earlier point since returning home from college only a few days earlier. Did that lead to PM misunderstanding regarding when TB noticed the open gate?
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Suzermom

Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2022
Messages
4
Reaction score
19
Just to clarify about the first bullet:
  • PM claims TB (Tom's brother) said he wanted to drive through the gate area but Deputy PG refused saying his shift was ending
From the Unfound podcast, PM says Tucker wanted to ask PG to go back to the gated area but doesn't actually ask him because PG already said his shift was ending and needed to get him home. Here is the transcript of exactly what PM said on Unfound:

"And just something about that kind of , it just caught his eye, and he said that he wanted to drive back through there but then he said the deputy seemed to be in a hurry and he had told him that, you know, he had to go off duty pretty soon, and so he really needed to get him home and so that’s why Tucker didn’t ask him to drive back through there, um if they had, I mean literally he missed Thomas’s car according to the sheriff um going through there um by about ten minutes." (1:01:10-40)

For a long time, I thought also that PM said Tucker asked PG to go back there and PG refused, but when I recently relistened to the Unfound Podcast I realized what PM said is he wanted to but DIDN'T ask PG. I had mis-remembered what I had heard originally.
 

jellybean96

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2016
Messages
2,508
Reaction score
8,913
You can’t tell whether a person is guilt or innocent because of what they may or may not do and say. And as far as a grand jury if one was called and the family or anyone was indicted they would only be found not guilty and could not be tried again. If the family was involved which I have thought from day one then she all the money paid to Klein was well worth it and he might have been hired for the sole purpose of making a big mockery out of this entire investigation.

Nathan Lewis made the investigation a mockery on his own. He is the one who falsified records.
 

KrisMum

Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2009
Messages
7
Reaction score
61
Hello to everyone - I'm new to this discussion. I've become so intrigued by this case since listening to the Tom Brown's Body podcast. It's to the point where I went back and literally read all of the threads here, as well as listened to the entirety of the Unfound podcast where PM is interviewed at length.

I have a couple of observations that I don't think I've really seen mentioned before. First off, in "Tom's Loop" (episode 2 of the podcast, at the 15-min mark), Nathan Lewis describes his supposed last encounter with Tom:

NL speaking:
He [Tom] was doing a public speaking event for 4-H and he went in there and was doing a public speaking, uh, deal, in the, in the Rotary Club one day. And he saw me in the Rotary Club and he approaches me and he said, “Man, I’m sorry for – for that night, um.” And he told me he told his mother a lie. He said, “Man, I fibbed to my mother.” Because he, he told his mother that I was rude, I cussed at him, pulled a gun, he said all kind of stuff to his mom, and he said, “Man, I’m sorry for doing all that stuff.” And I said, “Tom, the past’s the past, man, don’t worry about it. Just always tell the truth.” And that’s all I told him. And I didn’t see him – I’ve never dealt with him ever since.​

This seems like such an obvious lie. I'm sorry, but I cannot imagine any scenario where a teenager would approach a law enforcement officer at a social gathering and casually and voluntarily offer up an apology like this one, fully admitting that he lied to his mother to the point where she filed a complaint with the officer's boss. I'd bet anything this simply did not happen. Even the most extraordinarily mature kid would want to leave well enough alone rather than risk the wrath of his mom, or worse, potentially get into legal trouble.

Which of course then begs the question WHY. Why did NL feel the need to tell such an obvious lie and claim this was the last time he ever dealt with Tom?

The other thing I haven't seen discussed here was something that came up in the Unfound interview with PM. She mentioned that Tom's father, her ex-husband, was actually somewhat friendly with NL in the context of a fantasy football league in the town where Tom's dad lives and where NL had been a cop.

It's probably nothing, just literally fantasy football. But...in light of Klein's bizarre story about the supposed gambling ring involving high school football...I wonder if there's something else there?

Anyway, I know I'm really late to this discussion, but I needed somewhere to share these observations. Sorry for the length of my first post. Thanks for reading. :)
 

nannymo

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2011
Messages
2,452
Reaction score
6,368
Welcome KrisMum. I think your question is spot on. NL's stories and activities are very much "OFF" for a missing persons investigation. Tom was not known to lie, steal, or disobey authority. Why is this only mentioned by NL? I think you have a very valid point.
 

KrisMum

Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2009
Messages
7
Reaction score
61
I just wonder, do any of the other attendees at this Rotary Club event remember seeing Tom and NL speaking to one another at all? If so, did they chat long enough for a confession as significant as this one to even come up? Again, what NL claims Tom told him just seems ridiculously improbable, given the nature of the setting, the nature of teenagers, the nature of Tom's otherwise purportedly good and open relationship with his mom. Tom would have NO idea beforehand of what NL would do with a confession like this. Would he really initiate throwing his mom under the bus (embarrassing her, she'd filed a complaint based solely on what he'd told her) and undoubtedly making her really upset, just to schmooze with NL for what couldn't have been longer than a few minutes? In all his interviews on the podcast, NL comes across as quite an emotional, emotive, reactionary kind of guy. He does NOT seem like someone who'd brush off a blot on his work record if he could easily prove it was based on a lie.

Also, I thought it was interesting that NL claims Tom had accused NL of "pulling a gun on him." I don't have time to go back and re-listen to PM's lengthy Unfound interview, but I don't recall her mentioning this. If memory serves, NL was accused of this specific behavior by others in another incident but not the one that caused PM to file a complaint against NL.

As others have theorized here, I wonder if maybe (if NL had something to do with TB's demise) NL is "leaking" some of the truth of what happened on the fateful night.
 

OutWest

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2020
Messages
264
Reaction score
1,916
@KrisMum, IMO you are on target with your thoughts regarding the believability of NL’s statement. It is quite curious to me that the statement came from a person who had, from the beginning, demonstrated an ongoing adversarial relationship toward the very victims in a case that he was obligated by duty to investigate. His statement could have been simply another attempt to influence public opinion, nothing less.

It is still alarming to me that Sheriff NL and his cohorts spent most of two years of the investigation chasing a ghost in Denver; or chasing the ghost of an unknown "older man on the internet".
 

jellybean96

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2016
Messages
2,508
Reaction score
8,913
@KrisMum, IMO you are on target with your thoughts regarding the believability of NL’s statement. It is quite curious to me that the statement came from a person who had, from the beginning, demonstrated an ongoing adversarial relationship toward the very victims in a case that he was obligated by duty to investigate. His statement could have been simply another attempt to influence public opinion, nothing less.

It is still alarming to me that Sheriff NL and his cohorts spent most of two years of the investigation chasing a ghost in Denver; or chasing the ghost of an unknown "older man on the internet".

I, 100%, agree with y'all. There is something off with Nathans statement. When it was first brought up, I wondered why Nathan did not go report Thomas's apology to anyone. He had been accused of harassing a member of the public. Wouldn't Nathan want his name cleared publicly or at least with his boss? Wouldn't he encourage Thomas to tell his mom the truth? Wouldn't he at least tell his other officers at the SO that Thomas confessed to lying? My ex-husband is a detective in a small town and let me tell you -- they gossip and brag more than any women I've ever seen. I cannot imagine this slipping by and nothing being said. But, from what's been released, he told no one til Thomas was missing. Seems fishy, at best.
 

Razz

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 13, 2014
Messages
4,861
Reaction score
11,434
I, 100%, agree with y'all. There is something off with Nathans statement. When it was first brought up, I wondered why Nathan did not go report Thomas's apology to anyone. He had been accused of harassing a member of the public. Wouldn't Nathan want his name cleared publicly or at least with his boss? Wouldn't he encourage Thomas to tell his mom the truth? Wouldn't he at least tell his other officers at the SO that Thomas confessed to lying? My ex-husband is a detective in a small town and let me tell you -- they gossip and brag more than any women I've ever seen. I cannot imagine this slipping by and nothing being said. But, from what's been released, he told no one til Thomas was missing. Seems fishy, at best.
Perhaps he was covering his *advertiser censored** because if he did pull a gun on TB the night the boys were at the deserted theater, that is highly concerning.

I know PM reported TB's incident w/ NL to Police but I don't recall any mention of his gun being pulled.
 

LRDenton

Member
Joined
Nov 21, 2020
Messages
7
Reaction score
51
The Murder Project out of Amarillo, TX. has a three-part podcast on Tom Brown. Episode 3 contains discussion of notes from an interview with Penny and Tucker. The total podcast is approximately 4 hours long.

https://themurderproject.buzzsprout.com

Muchas gracias for this. Those episodes were awesome. Those two hosts are excellent, they really know how to cover a case well. It's rare to find a True Crime podcast so well done. From their notes in episode 3, it really makes me more suspicious of LE, especially PG. Lots of red flags about him.
 

jellybean96

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2016
Messages
2,508
Reaction score
8,913
Perhaps he was covering his *advertiser censored** because if he did pull a gun on TB the night the boys were at the deserted theater, that is highly concerning.

I know PM reported TB's incident w/ NL to Police but I don't recall any mention of his gun being pulled.

I had heard this but I am pretty sure I heard it locally and not through MSM. So I went and looked.

On page 18 of the first thread, I listened to the podcast where we (I believe) first hear about Nathan harassing Tom. I did a 'rough transcribe' on it on page 18 and here is what I wrote down as I was listening:

60. A year and 5 months before Thomas went missing, Lewis and Thomas (June 2015) had a run-in. Thomas and his friends (including Caleb) had been hanging out at a girls house, and Caleb went home. Thomas, the girl and two boys were left at girls. Girl went to bed, and the two boys hung out on the girls front porch for a few minuets (with permission). One of the boys did not have a car, though he was older than Thomas. They walk to Allsups, then around Canadian. This was around 10:45. They went to the laundry mat - open 24/7 - to cool off and get a sip of their drink. They continue walking, and cross Main Street and start going down a side stop. A car stops them and wants to know what they were doing walking around, why were you touching a door knob? They dont answer the man, so he starts swearing. Lewis recognizes Thomas and tells him to call his mom and tell her what I have been doing. Lewis says to Thomas 'get in my car'. Thomas doesn't know this man - or know that he is friends with his dad. Thomas is reluctant to get in the vehicle. Thomas's friends convince him to get in the truck. Lewis continues to question Thomas. Thomas tells him they were only walking around town. Lewis starts swearing at Thomas. Lewis also works in an oil field company and knew Thomas step dad from them. Lewis calls Thomas's stepdad at midnight. Stepdad does not answer call. Lewis leaves voicemail that Thomas was downtown, messing around. Mom and Stepdad are not sure why Lewis is calling them as he is not LE in Canadian. Thomas comes in and tells them what happened, and who Lewis is. Thomas wants to know why Lewis stopped him, accusing the boys of touching a door knob. Mom tells Thomas to go to bed, and they would deal with it the next day. The grill Thomas again, why were you touching door knob. Thomas says he never did. Thomas was leaving on Sunday to go to a camp, so Mom tells Thomas she is going to tell the sitting Sheriff what happened. Thomas swears he is telling the truth. Monday am, Mom goes to talk to Sheriff. The sitting sheriff and deputy laugh about it, reassure mom that the boys are not on their radar. Sheriff was astounded the boys were stopped, and that Lewis stopped the boys without letting Hemphill Co. know. Sitting Sheriff turns it over to the Texas Rangers to have them investigate it since sitting sheriff was running in an election against Lewis. Mom called the sheriff Dept. where Lewis did work, to report incident.Texas Rangers called mom and told her no charges were going to be pressed. Mom dropped the case. So a recap: The man investigating Thomas disappearance is someone who had a run-in with Thomas - for no reason - and Thomas' mother had complained to his employer about him stopping her son for no reason - out of his jurisdiction. Mom was under the impression that the sheriff from Lewis county got onto Lewis for his action. Ex-husband and Lewis talked and he was upset Lewis called the stepdad instead of him. According to mom, they had words.
___________________________________

So I didn't record anything about a gun being pulled -- and I am sure I would have if it were in the first podcast about that night.
 
Last edited:

nannymo

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2011
Messages
2,452
Reaction score
6,368
Also Jellybeam....didn't one of their friends Dad own the theater where they "touched" the door knob. They knew their friend and his Dad could still be there because the movie theater closed around 10-10:30. Thought they might still have the door unlocked and they could see their friend. No harm done. Again...Thomas has never been accused by any of his teachers, friends or their parents of being an unruly kid. The only person I have ever heard he has had a run-in with is NL.....go figure!
 

nannymo

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2011
Messages
2,452
Reaction score
6,368
@niikkee I guess because NL's actions have been less than acceptable for a LE officer. He botched this investigation from the beginning. I am not one to bash LE....I have family in LE. NL's actions speak louder than his words. I did not say he was involved. I just do not believe everything he says. He is a proven liar. That is why he is no longer sheriff. He lied and falsified records. That speaks volumes to me. JMO
 

OutWest

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2020
Messages
264
Reaction score
1,916
I don’t understand why the conversation keeps going back to Sheriff Lewis when he and his office has been cleared of having anything to do with Tom’s death. BUT there was some really good info pointed out about the road and gate going into the water treatment facility and testimony given by Tucker Brown. What happened to that discussion?

Former Sheriff NL has been "cleared"?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top