TX - Uvalde; Robb Elementary, 19 children and 3 adults killed, shooter dead, 24 MAY 2022

[WichitaFalls]

I’m trying really hard to stand down and wait for the story. I am so stunned by this. I’m from the North and always thought of Texas as being the one place where there were so many good guys with guns that they would be able to overtake the bad guys. Now this…

I live in Texas, there are tons of people with guns - I would not say the good guys with guns outweigh the bad guys with guns by any stretch of the imagination. Personally I'm more anxious about the young, angry white men with guns than I am any other threat.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

I recall the story, as it was posted in Newsweek.

Cops Accidentally Got Child Shot While Trying to Stop Texas Shooter—Student

"The cop said: 'Yell if you need help!' And one of the persons in my class said 'help.' The guy overheard and he came in and shot her," said a student.

www.newsweek.com

WLTX posted the interview of the little boy who apparently wanted to tell his story.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

What is the purpose of this window?
If it can be shattered and makes it possible to open the door?

to be able to see who is outside knocking. I know I posted one with a frosted window but all the classrooms I have ever seen or had this window was clear. I talked about having to have a piece of construction paper taped next to it on the inside so if a lockdown / active shooter code was called - you went to the door and moved that paper over the window to cover it up.

 

[steeltowngirl]

WLTX posted the interview of the little boy who apparently wanted to tell his story.

Thank you for sharing this. The boy telling of the teachers who saved them is a bright spot amid this horrific darkness. Those teachers are true heroes.

 

[Dotta]

to be able to see who is outside knocking. I know I posted one with a frosted window but all the classrooms I have ever seen or had this window was clear. I talked about having to have a piece of construction paper taped next to it on the inside so if a lockdown / active shooter code was called - you went to the door and moved that paper over the window to cover it up.

But how does this construction paper protect the window?

The window shouldn't be so close to the door handle in my opinion.

 

[musicaljoke]

I am asking the question, the teacher props a door open 5 mins before a shooter enters and why did that teacher do that?? This is really incredible.

What I find incredible is that there is an expectation that doors are bolted at all times lest a person come through it and randomly murder school children. It sounds like a problem found only in a war zone in a developing nation.

But, I don't live in the US <modsnip>

 

[HMSHood]

I wonder why that door was unlocked to begin with.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

But how does this construction paper protect the window?

The window shouldn't be so close to the door handle in my opinion.

It doesn't. The strategy behind it is that an active shooter will walk down a hall, trying door knobs as he goes, and looking in to see if that room is occupied. By covering up the window it blocks the shooter's view and he will just move on to the next room. This thought strategy came out of Sandy Hook - Laanza walked from room to room, looking inside and trying door handles. He passed up rooms that were empty - looking for an occupied classroom.

 

[LolaAngelina]

I have a real problem with the children who survived being interviewed by the media so soon after what they experienced. <modsnip>. it just bothers me-- in order to answer those questions, they have to re-live what they just experienced, while at the same time distancing themselves from the experience in order to answer those questions.

And only days later! I was actually watching an interview with Lance from the Columbine shooting. He said doing press was probably the worst thing he could have done. He said he wished his parents had of protected him and said no.

 

[RANCH]

With that type of weapon, a shooter could blow out the window easily, then unlock the door from the inside and walk right in.

We have shades on our door windows and they are locked from outside. But there is that window. And that gun.

If that was possible in this case why didn't the swat team do that to gain entry? Instead they had to get a key to open the classroom door.

 

[x_files]

I'm smelling a bit of a rat here!
Since when does a school PD take control of dangerous active shooter incident???
They are normally only in charge until back up arrives.

Maybe he is the fall guy...they want someone to blame. But I want to know why he was in charge, the Feds should have taken over.

 

[branmuffin]

If all the doors had been closed and locked, as they should be, there would be a very slim chance of him getting inside the building before LE got there. And likely the only death we'd be talking about (or not) would be his. God how I wish that is what happened!

There appears to be several hundred windows in Robb Elementary. I'm sure they are not bullet proof. The shooter could have opted to shoot them out to enter the school. He could have shot out the window in the back door where he entered.

The school is spread out, he could have entered and killed several people before half the school would have been aware that children were being killed. If he was athletic there are numerous ways he could have climbed on the roof; climbing on top of several air conditioning units; fencing close to the building that would allow him to get up there.

The gym or auditorium appears to have clerestory windows which could have allowed him to kill numerous people. If he'd been there one hour earlier he could have lain on the roof and shot children and their parents during their graduation. He could have just walked around on the roof taking pot shots into the classrooms below. The ammunition he used would have made that easy. He could have picked them off one by one when they ran from the buildings.

He could have run back and forth from building to building using the covered walkway as a means of transport. He could have done a lot of things that no one can ever prepare for. I don't think this guy expected to survive the event so thinking a locked door would have stopped him is short sighted, imo.

If there was a film taken of this event from beginning to end, we could rewind it pointing out every short fall that occurred up to his death. There: the open door, there: no officer on site, there: no armed teachers: etc etc etc. But the problem is the beginning of the event wasn't filmed when this young man was able to buy two high powered rifles online and ammunition used by US military. The ammunition was introduced to cut costs as a lighter product producing less recoil as the 7.62 mm but being able to travel at supersonic speed and still be able to pierce a standard issue ballistic helmet at 500 yards. Think about that for a while. He was an 18 year old who was able to buy that product. He couldn't drink until he was 21 but he was able to buy bullets that would obliterate a child's body <modsnip>

Link to US Defense News YT video regarding 5.56 ammo.

 

[Jenesaisquoi]

I wonder if the door was propped open regularly. How many days of school cctv footage is likely to be available to investigators?

Would their be cctv from other buildings that may show external doors of the school, or are those buildings too far away?

What about car dashcam footage?

 

[x_files]

There appears to be several hundred windows in Robb Elementary. I'm sure they are not bullet proof. The shooter could have opted to shoot them out to enter the school. He could have shot out the window in the back door where he entered.

The school is spread out, he could have entered and killed several people before half the school would have been aware that children were being killed. If he was athletic there are numerous ways he could have climbed on the roof; climbing on top of several air conditioning units; fencing close to the building that would allow him to get up there.

The gym or auditorium appears to have clerestory windows which could have allowed him to kill numerous people. If he'd been there one hour earlier he could have lain on the roof and shot children and their parents during their graduation. He could have just walked around on the roof taking pot shots into the classrooms below. The ammunition he used would have made that easy. He could have picked them off one by one when they ran from the buildings.

He could have run back and forth from building to building using the covered walkway as a means of transport. He could have done a lot of things that no one can ever prepare for. I don't think this guy expected to survive the event so thinking a locked door would have stopped him is short sighted, imo.

If there was a film taken of this event from beginning to end, we could rewind it pointing out every short fall that occurred up to his death. There: the open door, there: no officer on site, there: no armed teachers: etc etc etc. But the problem is the beginning of the event wasn't filmed when this young man was able to buy two high powered rifles online and ammunition used by US military. The ammunition was introduced to cut costs as a lighter product producing less recoil as the 7.62 mm but being able to travel at supersonic speed and still be able to pierce a standard issue ballistic helmet at 500 yards. Think about that for a while. He was an 18 year old who was able to buy that product. He couldn't drink until he was 21 but he was able to buy bullets that would obliterate a child's body <modsnip>

Link to US Defense News YT video regarding 5.56 ammo.

I would like to give you a standing ovation.

"But the problem is the beginning of the event wasn't filmed when this young man was able to buy two high powered rifles online and ammunition used by US military."

 

[Wise Old Owl]

If that was possible in this case why didn't the swat team do that to gain entry? Instead they had to get a key to open the classroom door.

SWAT wasn't there (yet?) In Uvalde the SWAT team is part-time and volunteer. I, personally, don't understand this as SWAT is usually a highly trained team of experts - but again, this is small town and have probably not needed a SWAT assist on scene in a while.

 

[Seattle1]

May 27 Texas school massacre news

Nineteen children and two teachers were killed in a shooting at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas, on Tuesday, the Texas Department for Public Safety said. Follow here for the latest news updates.

www.cnn.com

​

CNN analyst explains why a school district police chief took control as "incident commander" during shooting​

From CNN's Dave Alsup

Anthony Barksdale, CNN law enforcement analyst and former acting Baltimore Police Commissioner, offered some context as to why larger law enforcement agencies responding Tuesday to the deadly mass shooting at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas, were taking commands from the school district's police chief as they arrived on scene.

"The incident command system comes from the fire fights in California in the 70s. It establishes who is in charge," Barksdale told CNN's Victor Blackwell and Alisyn Camerota. "So, if the chief says, ‘I’m the incident commander’, then he’s in charge. And every resource that falls under him has to follow what he or she says, because that’s ultimately the boss at the time."

But if officers on the scene of an incident come to believe the "incident commander" is making the wrong calls, they can ignore or overrule his decisions, Barksdale said. "And you face him later on and... deal with it," he added.

"This was a case where they should have kept the pressure up; kept engaged trying to breach that door and deal with this shooter,” Barksdale continued. "If things get quiet, if there’s a lull, maybe there’s a weapon malfunction. Maybe he’s trying to reload. Maybe he’s out of ammo. And that’s the time to get him. You keep going; you pour it on. You put the pressure on, and you don’t stop until that threat is completely incapacitated."

“You’re going in there to kill this shooter. Those little kids deserved that on that day,” said an emotional Barksdale. “And they didn’t get it."

 

[bestill]

Maybe he is the fall guy...they want someone to blame. But I want to know why he was in charge, the Feds should have taken over.

Are the Fed's investigating how this went down that day?

 

[x_files]

I wonder if the door was propped open regularly. How many days of school cctv footage is likely to be available to investigators?

Would their be cctv from other buildings that may show external doors of the school, or are those buildings too far away?

What about car dashcam footage?

It might have been a habit right AFTER or BEFORE Lunch break. Maybe SR did some recon, and watched the school for a few days and took notes?

 

[x_files]

Are the Fed's investigating how this went down that day?

I would like to say yes...but I do not know.

FBI Statement on the Mass Shooting at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas | Federal Bureau of Investigation

The FBI shares in the sorrow of the Uvalde community, and we extend our deepest sympathy to those who lost their family, friends, and children in yesterday's tragedy.

www.fbi.gov

Rep. Joaquin Castro asks FBI to investigate police response timeline in Texas school shooting as controversy grows

The police version of what happened during the shooting at the elementary school in Uvalde, Texas, has changed since Tuesday.

www.cnbc.com

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I would like to say yes...but I do not know.

FBI Statement on the Mass Shooting at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas | Federal Bureau of Investigation

The FBI shares in the sorrow of the Uvalde community, and we extend our deepest sympathy to those who lost their family, friends, and children in yesterday's tragedy.

www.fbi.gov

Rep. Joaquin Castro asks FBI to investigate police response timeline in Texas school shooting as controversy grows

The police version of what happened during the shooting at the elementary school in Uvalde, Texas, has changed since Tuesday.

www.cnbc.com

From the first link:

" In the coming days, we will continue to support the victims and help uncover the events leading up to this vile crime."