UID Victim: The Asian Male, UP9355, John Doe #8, poss. died 1996-2001, found Gilgo Beach Apr 2011

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Danse_Macabre said:
Hi Websleuthers,

We are looking for some help. We know you are experts when it comes to matching unidentified remains (Jane/John Does) to Missing Persons and we are very interested in knowing what your findings have been for "Asian Male." We think out of all the Jane and John Does off Ocean Parkway, "Asian Male" maybe the best chance at identification.

We hope with good leads from the WS community we may be able to help move the investigation forward.

Thanks,
Rachel & Josh
Click to expand...


I maintain a searchable spreadsheet listing over 16,000 missing persons from the four most used missing persons sites (Charley Project, NamUs, DoeNetwork, and NAMPN).

I set the parameters for the particulars provided for "Asian Male"
* Male
* Age 17-23
* Asian
* Missing between 1-Jan-2000 and 31-Jan-2006)

I further filtered it for persons missing in the Northeastern states and Eastern Provinces of Canada. There is no reason why "Asian Male" might not be from another region, but I prefer to focus on the northeastern states and provinces. My initial screen doesn't filter for height, as height estimates are notoriously unreliable, but I will still consider the height after evaluating the resulting list.

This yielded only six names.

Asian%20Male%20Possibles%20001.jpg


* Brian Lee (23) from Queens NY - http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/l/lee_brian.html
* Siphet Chao (19) from Portland ME - http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/c/chau_siphat.html
* Neil Louis Boware (21) from Akron OH http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/b/boware_neal.html
* Mo Zheng (17) of Yorktown Virginia http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/z/zhang_mo.html
* Kevin Lim (18) of Scarborough Ontario (Canada) http://www.nampn.org/cases/lim_kevin.html
* Jackie Li (18) of Scarborough Ontario (Canada) http://www.nampn.org/cases/li_jackie.html

We can probably eliminate Brian Lee due to his height (6 feet 2 inches), and his facial shape is not particularly close to the reconstruction.
Siphet Chao's facial structure is also inconsistent to the reconstruction.
Neil Boware was part African American in addition to his Asian ancestry. That probably would have been noted by the Anthropologist. Also, the circumstances of disappearance appear to suggest a suicide. He was last seen atop a bridge in Ohio.

Kevin Lim and Jackie Li look like interesting possibilities. They went missing with Li's girlfriend and are persons of interest in the death of a friend of theirs. Jackie would probably be too tall at 5 feet 10. Kevin's height (5 feet 8 inches) is closer to the John Doe's height of 5 feet 6. If they were evading the law, they might have a reason to dress in women's clothing. However, Canadian Law Enforcement believes that these two young men and their female friend are in Hong Kong. Nothing here to rule them out, but they aren't particularly compelling as possibly being this John Doe.

The one person on this list that I do find compelling is Mo Zheng. Here he is side-by-side with the facial reconstruction of the "Asian Male" John Doe.

2002636580045078242S600x600Q851.jpg


We have no information to suggest that he had a missing front tooth, or a musculoskeletal disorder that may have affected his gait (as AMJD did). We also don't have any suggestion that he was a cross-dresser. Mo's dental and medical records aren't available to know one way or the other. Nor is there any available information pertaining to his lifestyle. The fact that something isn't mentioned should not lead one to presume that those characteristics don't exist with this person.

As for the information that is available on Mo Zheng, it matches up very nicely with the particulars of AMJD.
* His height 5'5" is within an inch of AMJD's estimated height.
* His age 17 is within AMJD's 17-23 age estimate.
* His date of last contact (09-Aug-2006) is consistent to AMJD's estimated date of death (i.e., 5-10 years prior to the 2011 discovery)
* His circumstances of disappearance aren't clear. However, his disappearance was thought to be voluntary with no suggestion of foul play at the location of his last contact (Yorktown Virginia).

And what is very interesting is the consistency of his facial structure to the artist's estimation of what AMJD might have looked like based on the shape of his skull.

I've done animated GIF image clips in a couple of other cases to show how a person's face aligns up to a facial reconstruction.

I thought that this technique would be appropriate in this case to show how closely Mo Zheng's facial structure aligns to the facial reconstruction sketch for Asian Male.

Long%20Island%20Asian%20Male%20and%20Mo%20Zheng%20001.gif


The few minor differences in the eyes and breadth of the nose are well within the tolerances for this type of facial reconstruction based on purely skeletal remains.

I called to the LISK taskforce hotline back in 2011 to suggest that they look at Mo Zheng. However, I have no way to know if they ever looked into the tip. The task force doesn't publicize rule-outs.

According to NamUs, there are no identifiers of any kind (DNA, fingerprints, or dental records) on record for Mo Zheng. If that is true, so there would be no way that they could verify this tip even if they wanted to. Based on the lack of identifiers, I would have to presume that this is still an open issue as to whether Mo Zheng is AMJD.
 
CarlK90245 said:
I maintain a searchable spreadsheet listing over 16,000 missing persons from the four most used missing persons sites (Charley Project, NamUs, DoeNetwork, and NAMPN).

I set the parameters for the particulars provided for "Asian Male"
* Male
* Age 17-23
* Asian
* Missing between 1-Jan-2000 and 31-Jan-2006)

I further filtered it for persons missing in the Northeastern states and Eastern Provinces of Canada. There is no reason why "Asian Male" might not be from another region, but I prefer to focus on the northeastern states and provinces. My initial screen doesn't filter for height, as height estimates are notoriously unreliable, but I will still consider the height after evaluating the resulting list.

This yielded only six names.

Asian%20Male%20Possibles%20001.jpg


* Brian Lee (23) from Queens NY - http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/l/lee_brian.html
* Siphet Chao (19) from Portland ME - http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/c/chau_siphat.html
* Neil Louis Boware (21) from Akron OH http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/b/boware_neal.html
* Mo Zheng (17) of Yorktown Virginia http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/z/zhang_mo.html
* Kevin Lim (18) of Scarborough Ontario (Canada) http://www.nampn.org/cases/lim_kevin.html
* Jackie Li (18) of Scarborough Ontario (Canada) http://www.nampn.org/cases/li_jackie.html

We can probably eliminate Brian Lee due to his height (6 feet 2 inches), and his facial shape is not particularly close to the reconstruction.
Siphet Chao's facial structure is also inconsistent to the reconstruction.
Neil Boware was part African American in addition to his Asian ancestry. That probably would have been noted by the Anthropologist. Also, the circumstances of disappearance appear to suggest a suicide. He was last seen atop a bridge in Ohio.

Kevin Lim and Jackie Li look like interesting possibilities. They went missing with Li's girlfriend and are persons of interest in the death of a friend of theirs. Jackie would probably be too tall at 5 feet 10. Kevin's height (5 feet 8 inches) is closer to the John Doe's height of 5 feet 6. If they were evading the law, they might have a reason to dress in women's clothing. However, Canadian Law Enforcement believes that these two young men and their female friend are in Hong Kong. Nothing here to rule them out, but they aren't particularly compelling as possibly being this John Doe.

The one person on this list that I do find compelling is Mo Zheng. Here he is side-by-side with the facial reconstruction of the "Asian Male" John Doe.

2002636580045078242S600x600Q851.jpg


We have no information to suggest that he had a missing front tooth, or a musculoskeletal disorder that may have affected his gait (as AMJD did). We also don't have any suggestion that he was a cross-dresser. Mo's dental and medical records aren't available to know one way or the other. Nor is there any available information pertaining to his lifestyle. The fact that something isn't mentioned should not lead one to presume that those characteristics don't exist with this person.

As for the information that is available on Mo Zheng, it matches up very nicely with the particulars of AMJD.
* His height 5'5" is within an inch of AMJD's estimated height.
* His age 17 is within AMJD's 17-23 age estimate.
* His date of last contact (09-Aug-2006) is consistent to AMJD's estimated date of death (i.e., 5-10 years prior to the 2011 discovery)
* His circumstances of disappearance aren't clear. However, his disappearance was thought to be voluntary with no suggestion of foul play at the location of his last contact (Yorktown Virginia).

And what is very interesting is the consistency of his facial structure to the artist's estimation of what AMJD might have looked like based on the shape of his skull.

I've done animated GIF image clips in a couple of other cases to show how a person's face aligns up to a facial reconstruction.

I thought that this technique would be appropriate in this case to show how closely Mo Zheng's facial structure aligns to the facial reconstruction sketch for Asian Male.

Long%20Island%20Asian%20Male%20and%20Mo%20Zheng%20001.gif


The few minor differences in the eyes and breadth of the nose are well within the tolerances for this type of facial reconstruction based on purely skeletal remains.

I called to the LISK taskforce hotline back in 2011 to suggest that they look at Mo Zheng. However, I have no way to know if they ever looked into the tip. The task force doesn't publicize rule-outs.

According to NamUs, there are no identifiers of any kind (DNA, fingerprints, or dental records) on record for Mo Zheng. If that is true, so there would be no way that they could verify this tip even if they wanted to. Based on the lack of identifiers, I would have to presume that this is still an open issue as to whether Mo Zheng is AMJD.
Click to expand...

Great analysis Carl. I agree of these 6 MP's, Mo Zheng seems most likely. I wonder why there has been no news on if it could be him, from the thread here it looks like he was called in years ago.

Maybe the new Documentary can put some pressure on authorities to get results.

I also like up thread the possibility of Santiago, the facial shape looks consistent with the composite drawing of John Doe.
 
Emre E said:
I believe, the victim found on Long Island in 2011 and defined as Asian Male is Tirrel Santiago.

Here is a comparison of the two

ASIAN MALE is 66 inches
TIRREL SANTIAGO is 66 inches

ASIAN MALE is slim built
TIRREL SANTIAGO is 115 pounds

ASIAN MALE is dead in 2005
TIRREL SANTIAGO went missing in August 2005

ASIAN MALE is found in women's clothing
TIRREL SANTIAGO dresses as a woman

I believe Tirrel Santiago's skull was misattributed as Asian due to his mixed bloodline and that's it. A simple mistake prevents his identification.

Another of the bodies, also yet to be identified, is believed to be that of an Asian male, Spota said.
http://archive.longislandpress.com/2011/05/09/jessica-taylor-identified-as-skull-on-ocean-parkway/

The skeleton of an adult male, wearing women’s clothing and thought to be Asian in ethnicity,
http://pix11.com/2014/08/05/the-hunt-for-a-li-serial-killer-revisting-the-gilgo-beach-murders/

Tirrel Santiago
http://www.missingkids.com/photographs/NCMC1180750c1.jpg

Asian Male
https://identifyus.org/en/medias/full/17764

Namus, SCPD and NYPD have been made aware about the possibility for more than a year. A DNA sample for Tirrel Santiago hasn't been collected so far.

NAMUS records for the two
TIRREL SANTIAGO
https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/9508/53

ASIAN MALE
https://identifyus.org/cases/9355

http://madamestbeatrice.tumblr.com/post/75512841734/the-charley-project-tirrel-santiago
https://www.google.com.tr/?gws_rd=ssl#q=tirrel+santiago
Click to expand...

Great post.

I agree, Tirrel Santiago is a strong possibility have you called it in?

The only one thing to point out, IMO, is that - wouldn't hair still be near or around the skull?

If so, then I think Tirrel's hair (if he was our JD) would strongly indicate that he is of partial African American decent... Even though his hair appears straight in pictures, to me it looks like it is chemically straightened.
 
LoyalSleuth said:
Great post.

I agree, Tirrel Santiago is a strong possibility have you called it in?

The only one thing to point out, IMO, is that - wouldn't hair still be near or around the skull?

If so, then I think Tirrel's hair (if he was our JD) would strongly indicate that he is of partial African American decent... Even though his hair appears straight in pictures, to me it looks like it is chemically straightened.
Click to expand...

Yes. I reported that to anywhere I could. No action taken so far.

Everybody talks about poor people, black people, gay people, but when it comes to real work nobody wants to sweat. Hypocrisy is the cancer of the society.

About the jawbone thing. The bone loss is a very rapid process, that's why when you get an implant the dentist puts a temporary implant. Because without the pressure bone mass is gone within just a few months.

See, the picture.

Right hand side comes down with a natural curve, lefthand side is indented. I don't know when Tirrel's picture is taken but given there is time between the photo and his death (I would really hope to be wrong, but I'm afraid I'm not) the "Asian" Male's indentation is slightly deeper, which is the expected progress.

Santiago Asian Jaw Comparison.jpg
 
Emre E said:
Yes. I reported that to anywhere I could. No action taken so far.

Everybody talks about poor people, black people, gay people, but when it comes to real work nobody wants to sweat. Hypocrisy is the cancer of the society.

About the jawbone thing. The bone loss is a very rapid process, that's why when you get an implant the dentist puts a temporary implant. Because without the pressure bone mass is gone within just a few months.

See, the picture.

Right hand side comes down with a natural curve, lefthand side is indented. I don't know when Tirrel's picture is taken but given there is time between the photo and his death (I would really hope to be wrong, but I'm afraid I'm not) the "Asian" Male's indentation is slightly deeper, which is the expected progress.

View attachment 81445
Click to expand...
Yes. I agree.

However what about the differences in hair between someone who is ''asian" vs. " African american"

Do you think thst would be hair left where the skull of JD was found?

Sent from my SGH-I747M using Tapatalk
 
LoyalSleuth said:
Yes. I agree.

However what about the differences in hair between someone who is ''asian" vs. " African american"

Do you think thst would be hair left where the skull of JD was found?

Sent from my SGH-I747M using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I don't know what they found, how well they examined it.
 
hot cawfee said:
There is also a population that live in the shadows especially in Queens.....lived there for several years and am amazed how many Asians came in illegally and live to pay off the impossible debt of coming to the US. There was a woman whose name escapes me....she promised jobs to those who wanted to leave China and come to the US for "a better life". Sad yet same story of living several to a room, working for little money and being so isolated from family and friends and unable to create a community and support system of your own.

Sadly this young man may be one of such people.
Click to expand...

Yes, they're VERY used to being working class and underpaid unfortunately... systematically, I mean. It's a cultural norm for them. Whether or not they are wealthy, that is why education and is so important for them, so they can get their kids to become doctors, engineers, etc etc.. because their bosses and well.. hate to say it, but USA pays them peanuts.. that's a nice savings at their expense I suppose... :(
 
Found this while looking for someone else. Thought I'd drop it here for Carl to take a look at (or at least add to his database). I know he's older than our Doe is supposed to be, but age is sometimes estimated incorrectly. Just a shot in the dark, really.

http://www.missingin.org/reg7515/chisun_mao.htm
 
I know that this doesn't have anything to do with who I think may be a possible match, but is it possible that the victim wasn't an escort, but was a Drag Queen. Even if he was an escort he probably did visit some Drag Queen Bars around the area. Did anyone possibly go and ask around there and see if they recognized him/her?
 
internetgirl101 said:
Hi All! Haven't posted in a while, but I recently came across a missing person that struck my interest! And forgive me if this info was posted already.

MESCALITO JOSELITO ECHAVEZ - Date Missing: October 16, 2003
Missing From: New York City, NY

Height: 5'7"
Weight: 145 lbs
Hair Color: Black
Eye Color: Black
Gender: Male
Race: Filipino

But when I realized that the age he went missing is listed as 31, I sort of dismissed it as being a possible match...UNTIL, I read that the unidentified victim may have had a musculoskeletal disorder.

The victim was a male between 17 and 23 years old and is estimated to have been 5-feet 6-inches in height. The database report states the remains had been in the location for five years and that the victim may have had a musculoskeletal disorder that affected his gait. Suffolk Police have stated women’s clothing was found on the body. The report just notes clothing.

Suffolk Police also have stated the victim had poor dental hygiene and was missing his bottom molars though the online database report does not indicate that information.

http://babylonvillage.patch.com/gro...abase-reveals-details-of-unidentified-remains


Could this mean the estimated age of the unidentified victim is off? Could he have possibly been older than 17-23?
Click to expand...

Been following the LISK case the last several years. Never posted until now. I agree that Mescalito Joselito Echavez should be submitted, if he hasn't been already. I discovered this photo of him online and he resembles the sketch of the Asian man a lot.

Screen Shot 2016-11-10 at 3.48.07 PM.png
 
Merry said:
Daniel Ted Yuen is runaway from a group home in California that he was put into but may of tried to travel back to New Jersey, where he was originally from. There was also a child rapist and murderer working at Cedu where Daniel was schooling at. If he was a victim he could be scared physiologically and somehow got to where he becamea victim of this serial killer by escorting himself or something. I really don't know what to think exactly. This is a 'unique' UID case. JMO

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/y/yuen_daniel.html

http://liamscheff.com/surviving-cedu/convicted-child-rapist-and-murderer-linked-to-cedu-school/
Click to expand...

Bumping up Merry's 2014 post regarding Daniel Yuen. I agree that Yuen is another contender for Asian male.

View attachment 104585

Yeun is originally from Edison, New Jersey. He was sent to the CEDU school in California and ran away in Feb 2004 at the age of 16. It’s possible he may still be in the area or returned to New Jersey. Edison is just southwest of Staten island, New York. His height is also 66 inches.

NAMUS CASE

Charley Project Case Info

Websleuths Case Thread
 
Concerning the unknown male: It is believed (according to the show's findings) that this man may have been an exchange student who has run away from a camp of some kind in VA. Is there enough DNA to collect and possibly match with his possible parents? There is a possible ID that the police does not want to follow up on leaving the case as "unfounded". That possible ID can lead to this man's parents thus proving he is in fact Daniel Yuen.

LMC
 
LouManChu said:
Concerning the unknown male: It is believed (according to the show's findings) that this man may have been an exchange student who has run away from a camp of some kind in VA. Is there enough DNA to collect and possibly match with his possible parents? There is a possible ID that the police does not want to follow up on leaving the case as "unfounded". That possible ID can lead to this man's parents thus proving he is in fact Daniel Yuen.

LMC
Click to expand...

The missing man mentioned by the detective via phone call in the show was referring to Mo Zhang, not Daniel Yuen. The detective stated Zhang was an exchange student who walked away before heading home, even leaving his passport behind.

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/z/zhang_mo.html
 
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