GUILTY UK - Bernadette Walker, 17, left parent's car, Peterborough, 21 July 2020 *Arrests* #5

[Agent Startled]

Hi, thanks for explaining your thoughts, so much to think about. The bit i don't follow is, If the trip to Cowbit was to lay a false trail, then why were the phones off?

My parents live in Glinton, so I know the area/distances/timings involved very well and you're right the timings work well if they spent 5 or 6 minutes in the layby near my house. If SAW helped lift her out the boot and SCW rolled her deep into the bushes - maybe wrapped in groundsheets he had retrieved from the lock up at Monatgue Rd, this would stack up with steps taken, if SAW was stood in the layby on look out, SCW phone left in the car. I can confidently say they would be very unlucky to be seen at that location at that time by anyone, very rare for even a car to be going past at that time. I'm not sure how often the bins are emptied there, I would say the phone has been left with Bee, as this ties in with (or they think it does) with their story, all their fake messages pretending to be her. Also you state driving east, which ties in too maybe driving around in the loop to drive by and see if anything was visible driving by again and SAW panicking that they may have left visible evidence..

As mentioned above the avoidance of cameras is a bit of a mystery but turning down the road to Deeping St James would avoid cameras, - this turning is very close to the layby.

Again, just MOO.

 

[MissMarbles]

I keep wondering why Sarah changed B's passwords on her social media- what was the purpose of that? B wasn't coming home so there would be no point.

Likewise if B was going to home then she would soon create new log ins herself, or else make sure everyone knew what her mum had done.

 

[Legally Bland]

I keep wondering why Sarah changed B's passwords on her social media- what was the purpose of that? B wasn't coming home so there would be no point.

Likewise if B was going to home then she would soon create new log ins herself, or else make sure everyone knew what her mum had done.

Somebody (can't remember who, sorry) pointed out that if SaW had access to Bee's email then she could access Bee's SM accounts by resetting the passwords if she didn't know them. Sounds logical to me.

 

[Agent Startled]

I keep wondering why Sarah changed B's passwords on her social media- what was the purpose of that? B wasn't coming home so there would be no point.

Likewise if B was going to home then she would soon create new log ins herself, or else make sure everyone knew what her mum had done.

I've read that she was trying to exercise damage control, read what Bee had told people and send messages out pretending to be Bee and stating that she had told lies about the SCW sex abuse claims and that she was running away, AKA a smokescreen to stop friends/family finding out she had passed and they would then assume she's a runaway! twisted

MOO

 

[SaintMoore]

I keep wondering why Sarah changed B's passwords on her social media- what was the purpose of that? B wasn't coming home so there would be no point.

Likewise if B was going to home then she would soon create new log ins herself, or else make sure everyone knew what her mum had done.

She only changed them because you have to to get onto the accounts.

 

[MissMarbles]

She only changed them because you have to to get onto the accounts.

Thank you. So that suggests Bernadette was in the habit of logging into her social media every time she used it...... So Sarah had to enter "forgot password" to get a reset link emailed (to B's email? I think password resets can only be sent to the email address used when social media accounts were set up).

Then she could pretend to be B sending messages.

 

[CSIAngus]

Hi, thanks for explaining your thoughts, so much to think about. The bit i don't follow is, If the trip to Cowbit was to lay a false trail, then why were the phones off?

My parents live in Glinton, so I know the area/distances/timings involved very well and you're right the timings work well if they spent 5 or 6 minutes in the layby near my house. If SAW helped lift her out the boot and SCW rolled her deep into the bushes - maybe wrapped in groundsheets he had retrieved from the lock up at Monatgue Rd, this would stack up with steps taken, if SAW was stood in the layby on look out, SCW phone left in the car. I can confidently say they would be very unlucky to be seen at that location at that time by anyone, very rare for even a car to be going past at that time. I'm not sure how often the bins are emptied there, I would say the phone has been left with Bee, as this ties in with (or they think it does) with their story, all their fake messages pretending to be her. Also you state driving east, which ties in too maybe driving around in the loop to drive by and see if anything was visible driving by again and SAW panicking that they may have left visible evidence..

As mentioned above the avoidance of cameras is a bit of a mystery but turning down the road to Deeping St James would avoid cameras, - this turning is very close to the layby.

Again, just MOO.

What you are suggesting is that ScW and SaW held on to BW's body, with a high risk of being caught with it, and did not use either of the two obvious windows to dispose of it, by which time decompostion will have started, especially given the time of year. I don't think this fits with any of the evidence that we have.

 

[Agent Startled]

What you are suggesting is that ScW and SaW held on to BW's body, with a high risk of being caught with it, and did not use either of the two obvious windows to dispose of it, by which time decompostion will have started, especially given the time of year. I don't think this fits with any of the evidence that we have.

Hi, I don't think the timeline would mean holding onto the body...what are we talking here 15 ish hours...or have i mixed up timings? I'm sure I've read that there could have been a temporary/rushed burial site (not very well hidden) before disposing for real (a much more secure hiding place). Also do we know how long it took Bee to pass? horrible to think about but possible that it was not a quick death.

All MOO

 

[Beckxsy]

Let's for instance say Bernadettes time of death being 1300 hrs on saturday 18th and disposal 1159pm sunday 19th this will give us 35hrs of decomposition. I've been looking and rigo mortis being stage one. It says putrefaction which is 2 to 3 days after death which is when the body would start to smell and leak fluids I believe. Disposal could very well have been on the midnight cowbit trip. Moo

 

[Beckxsy]

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[Beckxsy]

Edit

 

[CSIAngus]

Hi, I don't think the timeline would mean holding onto the body...what are we talking here 15 ish hours...or have i mixed up timings? I'm sure I've read that there could have been a temporary/rushed burial site (not very well hidden) before disposing for real (a much more secure hiding place). Also do we know how long it took Bee to pass? horrible to think about but possible that it was not a quick death.

All MOO

The police/prosecution believe she was killed in the first window of opportunity, immediately before/after ScW turned his mobile off heading east from the Gunthorpe area, i.e. Saturday 18th lunchtime. Based on the known timeline, it would be 36 hours later before it was possible to visit the layby near Deeping St Nicholas. The body may have begun to pong by then given that it was Summer (23 degrees on the Saturday, 20 on Sunday which was also humid after the rain in the early hours). I doubt whether a temporary resting place would be used only for them both to recover the now potentially ponging body and drive around with it up to Cowbit and the Apple Garage. I don't believe SaW ever saw her dead daughter.

It's far more likely and less risky if BW was killed at the first opportunity that ScW had and who immediately moved her to where she is now buried. MOO

I recommend anyone joining this thread more recently goes back to the beginning and reads through as I'm sure most of this will have been discussed a number of times. I mean that sincerely and not in a patronising way. My own train of thought over many months has led me to focus on Cowbit, Pode Hole, Barn Garden Centre, Barnoak Road, Hill House Farm, Deeping St Nicholas, Etton, Maxey and more besides. The key piece of evidence for me, which only came out in court, was ScW's direction of travel when he switched his phone off that Saturday lunchtime - east from Gunthorpe. But I don't think we will ever know for sure unless we have a confession.

I have asked myself where the ideal location for disposal would be east of Gunthorpe and I came up with the fresh spoil tips at Pode Hole Quarry, south of the A47, as they will only continue to have many hundreds, if not thousands of tons of material added. I don't know how accessible they are or whether they work at weekends. Wherever the location, it has to be somewhere that ScW knows well and feels confident about being there in the daytime and at night.

 

[CSIAngus]

Aggregates Industries Peterborough, who operate the aggragates and concrete business at Pode Hole Quarry, south of the A47, close at 12 Noon on a Saturday, and are closed on Sundays. I can't see that ever being dug up unless ScW points to there. There are other areas like the triangle of wood where Thorney Road meets the A47. the quarry areas easy of Eye, and the old garden centre on the Causeway at Thorney. Wherever it is it has to be relatively discreet and accessible at different times of the day without arousing suspicion.

 

[Agent Startled]

The police/prosecution believe she was killed in the first window of opportunity, immediately before/after ScW turned his mobile off heading east from the Gunthorpe area, i.e. Saturday 18th lunchtime. Based on the known timeline, it would be 36 hours later before it was possible to visit the layby near Deeping St Nicholas. The body may have begun to pong by then given that it was Summer (23 degrees on the Saturday, 20 on Sunday which was also humid after the rain in the early hours). I doubt whether a temporary resting place would be used only for them both to recover the now potentially ponging body and drive around with it up to Cowbit and the Apple Garage. I don't believe SaW ever saw her dead daughter.

It's far more likely and less risky if BW was killed at the first opportunity that ScW had and who immediately moved her to where she is now buried. MOO

I recommend anyone joining this thread more recently goes back to the beginning and reads through as I'm sure most of this will have been discussed a number of times. I mean that sincerely and not in a patronising way. My own train of thought over many months has led me to focus on Cowbit, Pode Hole, Barn Garden Centre, Barnoak Road, Hill House Farm, Deeping St Nicholas, Etton, Maxey and more besides. The key piece of evidence for me, which only came out in court, was ScW's direction of travel when he switched his phone off that Saturday lunchtime - east from Gunthorpe. But I don't think we will ever know for sure unless we have a confession.

I have asked myself where the ideal location for disposal would be east of Gunthorpe and I came up with the fresh spoil tips at Pode Hole Quarry, south of the A47, as they will only continue to have many hundreds, if not thousands of tons of material added. I don't know how accessible they are or whether they work at weekends. Wherever the location, it has to be somewhere that ScW knows well and feels confident about being there in the daytime and at night.

Trust me I have spent hours reading up on this! but thanks for the advice. I spent time last night reading back on your theories and at one point you talked about potential body disposal in more than one site..there is also the possibility of it not being a quick passing for Bee. The prosecution put forward a scenario, it doesn't mean it was the exact way it played out.

I just want the police to check the two areas of concern...its upsetting me to the point i will have to go down there myself just so I can stop worrying about it. The thought of her discarded like rubbish is haunting me.

Does anyone know where he worked during his time living in DSNicholas? I haven't found that info out yet. There are gravel pits at the back of mine. Actually the turning to these pits is opposite the layby im worried about and potentially a 13 minutes drive to Glinton Services.

I need to go back and check the timeline, I understood she was potentially killed on Saturday morning and the drive out to COwbit was early hours of Sunday morning, I've obviously misunderstood the timeline. Thanks for patiently responding again edited to state All MOO

 

[Agent Startled]

.

oooh intrigued to know what you posted here and then I assume deleted?

 

[Agent Startled]

Let's for instance say Bernadettes time of death being 1300 hrs on saturday 18th and disposal 1159pm sunday 19th this will give us 35hrs of decomposition. I've been looking and rigo mortis being stage one. It says putrefaction which is 2 to 3 days after death which is when the body would start to smell and leak fluids I believe. Disposal could very well have been on the midnight cowbit trip. Moo

Thanks for your post, you're braver than me reading about this horrible stuff. Did you find out any information on how long it might give of a smell? The stench at the layby was bad but it was about 8 months after...

 

[Agent Startled]

Let's for instance say Bernadettes time of death being 1300 hrs on saturday 18th and disposal 1159pm sunday 19th this will give us 35hrs of decomposition. I've been looking and rigo mortis being stage one. It says putrefaction which is 2 to 3 days after death which is when the body would start to smell and leak fluids I believe. Disposal could very well have been on the midnight cowbit trip. Moo

Also, some have mentioned they think the Cowbit trip was to make us believe Bee had gone to her ex boyfriends but why were the phones switched off if they wanted to lay a false trail? They must have been up to no good, MOO

 

[Tortoise]

Also, some have mentioned they think the Cowbit trip was to make us believe Bee had gone to her ex boyfriends but why were the phones switched off if they wanted to lay a false trail? They must have been up to no good, MOO

It wasn't her ex-bf that lived out that way, it was a friend C. SaW asked the ex-bf if Bee was still with him, he messaged back saying Bee was never with him, then SaW started messaging C before they drove out in the early morning hours of Monday.

The phones went like this -

12:42am - Sarah's and Scott's phones connected to Crowland Water Tower.
12:43am - Sarah's phone disconnected
12:44am - Scott's phone disconnected
12:54am - Bee's phone connected to the network in Cowbit area
messages were sent from Bee's phone
1:29am - Bee's phone disconnected for the last time ever (10 mins after car was seen at Applegreen services)
1:32am - Sarah's phone tracks 33 steps over 5 minutes
1:49am - car captured on cameras at Glinton
3:03am - Sarah's phone switched back on. 4 mins later it pinged at Century Sq.
4:08am - Scott's phone switched back on at Century Sq.

 

[Mercsw]

Some great ideas here. I’m leaning to the whole deed being done in that first window, and subsequent trips to lay false trails and dispose of evidence. We have no struggle, no dna, no witnesses etc.

I am also leaning towards cuckoos hollow, but that was checked previously.

i am sure I made a post about deeping st nicks and the exotic pet refuge part near the nature reserve. I can’t find it now.

 

[Beckxsy]

Thanks for your post, you're braver than me reading about this horrible stuff. Did you find out any information on how long it might give of a smell? The stench at the layby was bad but it was about 8 months after...

I'm not an expert by any means but it may be possible.
Stages of decomposition can be affected by lots of things. If a body left in open area with little or no burial it's likely not to perhaps emit odour after that amount of time. .(I could be wrong)
If a body is theoretically wrapped in plastic or tarpaulin dependant on how it was wrapped then possible after 8 months it could omit odour. I theorised whether she was in fact she was taken to the the lock up. Prepared at the lock up. They had ample opportunity esp scott to take his time with wrapping her. Its unbelievable to think that would be case but we just dont know moo