VERDICT WATCH UK - Constance Marten & Mark Gordon charged, Newborn (found deceased), Bolton Greater Manchester, 5 Jan 2023 #8

I know I've said this before, but whoever selected a juror for this case who had a holiday booked at the 6 week mark, really needs to have a rethink in future. Anyone who follows trials knows they always over run even if just by a few days. I am sure with the full 12 they would have got the verdicts through.
the fact that there were so many pretrial hearings and both defendants changed their legal representatives at least once should have given some indication that this trial was highly likely to overrun.
 
I dare say the Argus did too. I really would love to be a fly on the wall. What is going on?
IME the counsel for both sides are told when the reason for the court resuming is that the jury has reached a verdict, and this information isn't confidential. Ask someone in one of the teams whether there's been a verdict and they will tell you.
 
Do Mark and Constance travel to court each day the jury are considering their verdict or are they fetched from prison when the jury say they have reached a verdict?

Just had a quick google. C is over an hour away ( Bronzefield ) so I think they would bring her in each day.

M - not sure if he's Belmarsh or Wandsworth, but both showing best part of an hour journey, so I guess he has to be brought in as well.
 
I don't know that prison officers would mind too much to be honest. I used to work as a civilian in a Cat C men's prison... the wings are dire! I think they would prefer to have been in a van / courtroom and out of the prison. Plus they only have one person to look after, rather than a whole bunch of men shouting/bangingdoors/taking drugs (delete as appropriate!)
 
And wasn't it the case in the Letby trial that the jury had been returning verdicts in dribs and drabs which couldn't be reported until all the verdicts were in. Couldn't something similar be happening here?

I agree.
After 7 days the jury surely have already decided on several of the charges and provided these to the judge. Or else the jurors could return on the 20th, having had a rethink or change of heart on charges already agreed upon within the jury room. Then have to essentially start deliberations all over. JMO

I think it was a juror(s) preplanned holidays which prompted the request for initial longer days and this was rejected.
 
I don't think there's enough charges for this one to do it the same was as LL.

I'm not convinced I'd be able to say guilty for the charges on this one, even though it was hideous actions and willful neglect. I think the burden of proof may be a bit wobbly and that's why it is taking so long
 
I can’t see 7 days of deliberations not yielding a single verdict on any of the counts, guilty or not guilty.

As in the LL case, the verdicts were coming in, the court, prosecution, defense and media knew, except the public who were completely oblivious to any progress being made. There was much frustration that the deliberations was taking too long, with speculation mounting on what this meant in terms how the charges were being deliberated and of the verdicts.

So for this case, it was interesting the Argus updated there page and went live for verdict watch around 2:17pm and then nothing, as if there was a media blackout. I reckon some verdicts were read at this point. Between 2pm and end of day there was time for all parties to assemble, order CM&MG back to the dock, verdicts read, jurors polled, housekeeping etc etc and to dismiss the jury until 20th. For me that’s the most plausible explanation for the deafening silence between 2 and the end of day announcement.

JMO
 
Doesn't look like it to me. Gosh I've just read a little about it as haven't been following. Wish I hadn't!
Does anyone know how to find the sentencing remarks for the earlier part of the Gustavson trial, where Jacob Crimi Appleby and others were sentenced for their part in this, it was 15 Jan at The Old Bailey. Are they published anywhere?
 

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