Found Deceased UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen getting into taxi outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #9 *ARREST*

[Joolz1975]

I'm still thinking a second vehicle too, have done for a while now

I'm not sure if anyone else was fully involved though, it may have been as simple as ' can I borrow your car mine is broke.

People have said someone would have come forward had he used their car but we can't know that for sure, especially if it was someone from his community who may be doesn't speak much English and things or was involved in other crimes.

The 3am thing confuses me, I'm assuming that.

A. His wife confirmed this was when he got home.
B. He was caught on cctv heading back home
C. His phone pinged at home at this time.

But what if he went home at 3am, and parked his car up then knocked and borrowed someone else's and went back out (possibly leaving his phone at home).

Also what if his wife never confirmed the time he got home because she wasn't there (she's apparently in Poland now but what if she was there all along). Giving PR perfect opportunity to come and go as he wants.

 

[Joolz1975]

Yes definatly a likeness. Even more so when you see them side by side.

 

[Newthoughts]

All the previous crimes were committed in a small area. Can I just ask does that area contain a lot of student houses? If no does that mean he likes to stay close to home? If yes is it just because there would be a ready source of young women away from home for the first time? By it's very nature it's hard to be caught for voyeurism so is it possible he was watching students a lot? Escalation to abduction less hard to understand in that scenario.

ImI guessing this may have been asked before but are there other places he have taken her within the time frames - given the police probably have cctv suggesting he stayed within a certain area?

 

[Strontium69]

Hmmm ... I do see where you’re coming from and underground connections are certainly a possibility. In that kind of network he could seek help. And you’re right, the scenario does seem to run from opportunistic ‘luck’ to accomplished concealment of a crime. But I’m still putting that down to good fortune on his part. The weather / the dark / the location. Sadly I think she’s in the water and that it’s simply such a vast a search area, her body has not yet been found.

I do think the language barrier falls in his favour where confession under pressure is concerned. If he were able to stick to his story during the early part of the interrogation and with that process maybe being slower than usually (allowing for translation) he perhaps built up the confidence to believe they were not going to pin this on him. After all, he’d only have to answer ‘no comment’ or stick to his story of dropping a tearful girl at home. Now that it’s been a few weeks and still no charges - where this case is concerned at least - I should imagine he’s feeling quite invincible.

But there's no way she's in the pond. And I'm sure there'd be some physical sign along the river edge, even in -5 I'm sure if he was struggling with her alone to the river, even using the rowing steps, I'm sure he'd have left some mark, the task is just too much.

As for the language - yes possibly - but he's also a Polish National, so they will have been able to put all sorts of pressure on him, how his own govt won't help him for something so serious as this, he'll spend 25 years in a UK prison then be deported to Poland? Not sure he's got 3 weeks worth of 'language barrier' there to use. If they press that he was the last to see her alive?

About the underground connection - he could have 'associates' that he fears more than the British justice system?

* Has the snow/ice hampered the early dog searches? So that any foot trails vanished in the thaw, so they can only look for the end point?

I do fear you are right about the river though - but I just can't get her and PR from the car to the river...

 

[Newthoughts]

I'm not sure about the underground connection. I'd think that serious criminals snuggling drugs and people don't anyone whose going to risk their operations by flashing and knicker stealing. Also are they going to risk snatching a much loved student who is going to generate instant searches?

I do wonder about someone being in on it tho. If he'd discussed his fantasies with others?

 

[Strontium69]

All the previous crimes were committed in a small area. Can I just ask does that area contain a lot of student houses? If no does that mean he likes to stay close to home? If yes is it just because there would be a ready source of young women away from home for the first time? I'm guessing this may have been asked before but are there other places he have taken her within the time frames - given the police probably have cctv suggesting he stayed within a certain area?

He lives in the heart of what is one of the densest student areas, away from the immediate vicinity of the university. I don't know about those particular streets, but the whole Newland area has only seen an increase of houses in the area going for student specific HMOs, as locals are complaining that almost the entire stock of rented houses along Newland are going to HMOs, also pushing up prices faster than the local trend.

I was surprised at just how many student HMOs there were along Beresford/Wellesley. But it would reflect the general trend as the University expands more and more taking up housing closer to it first. In the other direction from Haworth, towards the University campus itself, the bottom halfs of Cranbrook and Auckland Avenues are probably about 90% University owned HMOs.

I have speculated that Piper/Newland was his main area of 'operation', and that perhaps he had noticed large numbers of students heading to Beresford area. (Perhaps he already had the park in mind?) And that potentially he had noticed Libby, or one of her housemates, and that is what brought his offending away from his own streets, to Wellesley, where he had identified a potential target.

* Had he used Haworth Street as a parking spot before to watch these students he had followed from Piper? (more likely to be walking than from Welly)

 

[Strontium69]

I'm not sure about the underground connection. I'd think that serious criminals snuggling drugs and people don't anyone whose going to risk their operations by flashing and knicker stealing. Also are they going to risk snatching a much loved student who is going to generate instant searches?

I do wonder about someone being in on it tho. If he'd discussed his fantasies with others?

Yeah it's a possibility, but the underground thing doesn't really fit I agree. If it was a 'clean' snatch without his weird previous offending maybe that would be a higher option?

 

[Joolz1975]

I'm not sure about the underground connection. I'd think that serious criminals snuggling drugs and people don't anyone whose going to risk their operations by flashing and knicker stealing. Also are they going to risk snatching a much loved student who is going to generate instant searches?

I do wonder about someone being in on it tho. If he'd discussed his fantasies with others?

No I'm not sure about drug or people trafficking either, he would be a liability.

I think if someone else was involved it was a lot less sophisticated than that.

More likely he borrowed another car and went back after 3am or he knows a friend that's not exactly innocent themselves and he persuaded them to help.

 

[Strontium69]

Yeh i feel his "pathological dissociation from 'normal society'" as his unusual preoccupations drew him deeper and deeper into a shadowy twighlight world all of his own.
Query - it has been reported that the oak road park park would have been locked , so he would have had to find somewhere else to park up. By Scootermuppet iirc.
Very difficult to imagine how an assault would have played out , i guess he might have taken her into the park but personally i think he would have tried to get his way amicably at first in the car , if things had turned ugly then he might have felt compelled to physically subdue her and then , either alive or dead , get her away from the car somewhere dark. I can even imagine him not actually sexually assaulting her at all , apart from in a voyeuristic fashion.
Or he may have stowed her in the car and moved her elsewhere , he is reported to have been cleaning his car soon afterwards , i wonder if cadaver dogs would still detect a corpse in a recently cleaned vehicle , im assuming they would.

The car park would have been locked, but there is ample space to park in the turnabout where Beresford Road ends, technically now part of Oak Road.

(1) in the attached pic; the length of that arrow that ends at (1) is an area of tarmac, brightly lit, easily an area to park up and chill for a while at night and not be disturbed.

 

[Jmcc211]

The man who originally posted those photos of the two guys said he had his dates wrong I think.

Also running to walk man looked like he had a high vis vest on. The other guys is more like a puffa jacket

If you look it wasn’t the man who posted this picture of these two males but a woman. I have read the cemetery theory and then I read he had discounted it. If I’m right this person who had this picture of the males is entirely different to the other report

 

[BrianJohnson]

I doubt he has any gangland connections, if he does then most likely he would be eliminated if he is ever freed to stop him talking/grassing anyone up if he got gangland help, and Polish/Eastern European mafia like discretion, people keeping a low profile, PR would be a massive liability

 

[BrianJohnson]

What was the timeframe between Libby going missing and PR getting arrested?

Would he have had time to dump her body in a bush that night and go home and then return to the park the next day and pick up the body and drive out of Hull with it for instance?

 

[Joolz1975]

If you look it wasn’t the man who posted this picture of these two males but a woman. I have read the cemetery theory and then I read he had discounted it. If I’m right this person who had this picture of the males is entirely different to the other report

Thank you..Will look again.

 

[Joolz1975]

What was the timeframe between Libby going missing and PR getting arrested?

Would he have had time to dump her body in a bush that night and go home and then return to the park the next day and pick up the body and drive out of Hull with it for instance?

Libby went missing early hours of the Friday .

I think PR was arrested late on the Wednesday night (That's when police were at his home)

I think they would have had him under surveillance prior to that though personally.

We don't know when he was actually first on their radar.

 

[BrianJohnson]

Libby went missing early hours of the Friday .

I think PR was arrested late on the Wednesday night (That's when police were at his home)

I think they would have had him under surveillance prior to that though personally.

We don't know when he was actually first on their radar.

That probably gives him a 48 hour window of opportunity to dispose of the body/cover up his tracks before police were monitoring him, god she could literally be anywhere within 100 miles of Hull

 

[BrianJohnson]

If he was arrested on the Wednesday evening does anyone know whether he was at work Monday/Tuesday? wondering if any media or police said

They should be extending the search area to woodland/fields/layby’s etc on his route to work

 

[Joolz1975]

That probably gives him a 48 hour window of opportunity to dispose of the body/cover up his tracks before police were monitoring him, god she could literally be anywhere within 100 miles of Hull

People seem to be of the opinion that he first came into the police's investigation on the Sunday when they were handed the Howarth St CCTV, as MSM also got hold of that footage the same day and were asked not to release it by the police.

My own opinion is they got the footage and asked the media not to release it because they wanted him under surveillance .

The media obliged and didn't release it till after he had been arrested for abduction, even then they only released very select snippets of 20mins worth of footage.

So unless they had their eyes on him much much earlier than that he could have driven her anywhere I suppose.

 

[Joolz1975]

If he was arrested on the Wednesday evening does anyone know whether he was at work Monday/Tuesday? wondering if any media or police said

They should be extending the search area to woodland/fields/layby’s etc on his route to work

I read he was at work on the Friday (PM shift) but that's just rumour I think.

Other people have said the factory only operates mon-thurs.

 

[mrjitty]

That probably gives him a 48 hour window of opportunity to dispose of the body/cover up his tracks before police were monitoring him, god she could literally be anywhere within 100 miles of Hull

That's what I think.

 

[Joolz1975]

That's what I think.

Me too.

I'd be searching his route to work to be honest.