GUILTY UK - Sarah Everard, 33, London, Clapham Common area, 3 Mar 2021 *Awaiting Sentencing*, #15

Discussion in 'Trials' started by tesni, Mar 5, 2021.

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  1. Marantz4250b

    Marantz4250b Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely, it's something I mentioned a few posts back. Of course, we don't know for sure that he did use his warrant card, but if he did then that is very strongly suggestive of his motives being murderous from the outset, rather than merely sexual.
     


  2. Gemmie

    Gemmie Clam dip nose

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    <Snipped for focus & BBM>

    Hmmm.... I respectfully disagree that most thought he was good mannered. At least some of the things I've read such as he had the nickname The Rapist (so he gave women the creeps), it was also mentioned that he was an oddball, and also that he'd only pull over women, never men, which didn't set too well with those that worked with him. And last but not least... he was reported to bosses for slapping a female cop’s bum. Those things don't make for a very good mannered person, at least in my book.

    “It used to be the talk of the station that he would only pull over women and never any blokes. “It got to the point that people didn’t want to go on patrol with him.

    The 3 clues that could've seen Wayne Couzens sacked before killing Sarah

    As for being below Sarah's level... First off, I agree. He likely was well below her level. BUT, people put on their best faces when they are trying to impress someone. I always tell those that fall hard for someone to give it time and wait for the infatuation period to end. Time needs to go by for true colors to come out. So, IF (and it's a huge unlikely IF if you ask me) they ever did go out, even once, he'd have been on his best behavior and she wouldn't have had a clue what a despicable person he was. I'll end by saying I do think it's extremely unlikely that she had anything to do with him in the past. I think it was a stranger abduction and she was his unlucky victim that night.

    Lastly, both women and men have been known to have flings (and more) with those below their level so it does happen. I've done it myself so I can speak from experience and not just make generalizations that it happens. And I KNEW he was well below my level (it wasn't something that was hidden from me) and still did it, and rather enjoyed myself for the time I was with the person. Was it going to be a forever thing? Oh heck NO. I knew that going in. LOL Marriage and having kids was brought up and that's when I bowed out. But I had fun. :p

    To recap... I do think it's extremely unlikely that she had anything to do with him in the past. I think it was a stranger abduction and she was his unlucky victim that night.
     
  3. Dotta

    Dotta Well-Known Member

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    Yes, but it was reported that he drove for 90 mins without stop, right? :)
     
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  4. Flyakite

    Flyakite New Member

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    I’d be interested to know if the car was a manual or automatic as it would make a difference if WC would be able to continually threaten her with a knife when driving (if she was in the front seat and not bound).
     
  5. Italia

    Italia Active Member

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    I read a report from the former receptionist at the garage who worked with him- she said he was polite and respectful etc …
    Looks like he changed a lot after leaving the garage??
    Wayne Couzens: the former Met officer who hid dark secrets behind family-man facade
     
  6. johnlair

    johnlair Active Member

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    Ok fair play... I agree with all you said.. I was just airing an unpopular opinion it's not what I think happened just something I have seen thrown about.. I think the Car in the bus cam being on the pavement and in the next shot both doors open could be a big clue now rereading...
    If the car was on the pavement he blocked her path and she would have had to go around at which point only one set of doors is available if the drivers doors are next to a wall or something so she may have walked to get around the car with it's hazards on and he pushed her in ...in whatever way she could not have got out the other side... but the next cam showed the car with both doors open? maybe she got out who knows till we see the cams
     
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  7. Marantz4250b

    Marantz4250b Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely, it's something I mentioned a few posts back. Of course, we don't know for sure that he did use his warrant card, but if he did then that is very strongly suggestive of his motives being murderous from the outset, rather than merely sexual.
    They aren't allowed to wear their uniform off duty (at least I don't think they are but not 100% on that), but he would have had access to police clothing. Then again, they aren't allowed to commit kidnap, rape and murder either. Most probably had baseball-type caps as that's what armed cops use and probably things like anti-stab vests and suchlike. Any police officer could make a pretty decent shout of being able to pretend to be on duty if they were that way inclined.

    It's not without precedent, either; ok, he wasn't an actual cop but Anders Berivik in Norway had a police uniform and managed to direct people towards him so they were easier to shoot.
     
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  8. Marantz4250b

    Marantz4250b Well-Known Member

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    There is an excellent film on Netflix at present which is a true story of a 17 year-old who was abducted and raped multiple times by a guy who turned out to be a serial killer they'd been looking for for months (I forget his name). She was the only one he let go which was purely due to the way she dealt with him and his ego. The especially awful thing was that she learned how to placate him after having to do the same with her psychotic step-dad. The whole thing was utterly heart-breaking, quite honestly.

    She's a cop specialising in violence against women and girls now, I believe. Called Believe me, I think.
     
  9. infinit

    infinit Well-Known Member

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    I'm a male and I was once having a cigarette in the early hours while on the phone on a quiet street. I noticed a BMW go past with what looked like 4 men all staring at me which was weird, it was not at all subtle. I hear the BMW continue and wheelspin as it does a 180 at the next side street. At which point I'm thinking "Oh boy." Stupidly I told the person I was on the phone to "I'll call you back" - No information on what I'd seen or what was happening - Which just goes to show you do dumb stuff in the moment.

    Car brakes, men getting out right next to me. I remember my fists being clenched ready to start swinging. Something they perhaps get quite often because the male in the passenger seat had his badge showing and had said "Police" 3 times before the door was even fully open. But when I think back, I couldn't tell you what a legit police badge or warrant card looks like because I have no clue what they are meant to look like, I don't think I even read his name. They seemed pleasant and they had that way of dealing with people where it was clear they weren't inexperienced. Probably something that Wayne can also probably pull off. I wasn't asked to get in the car but if I had been I probably would - What are you going to do - Run away from the Police? It's a bold move.

    Edit: I've just realised he could have used a search/empty your pockets as justification to get the phone potentially. He could turn it off as he walks around to the drivers side and she wouldn't see.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2021
  10. Gemmie

    Gemmie Clam dip nose

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    I'd say "Been there, done that" but I've been there and didn't do that (get into the car).
     
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  11. johnlair

    johnlair Active Member

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    All very true..Her phone could have ran out of charge tho aswell as there was a bit of a gap between her phone going dead and the camera footage at 9.30 ...She may have just been unlucky or trying to save charge

    Who knows? But I dont think it exists anymore ..
    Pretty certain it went in the fire with her and the knife.. He could have took the SD card if she had one to look at her even more tho ..maybe that's what he was reported to have been thrown out the window..

    I keep reading around he was in a relationship with a 14 year old girl when he was in his twenties .. does anyone know where this story came from
     
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  12. Dotta

    Dotta Well-Known Member

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    It was hammered into my head by my mother when I was a girl:"Dear child, never ever get into an unknown car". Im a good daughter:) Mum is always right. Right?
     
  13. Gemmie

    Gemmie Clam dip nose

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    That's a really good question. If so, did he ask for a specific make, model and color, or just take whatever rental they gave him?

    And I'm very sorry for your loss. I can't even imagine what you are going through. It must be very hard to view this thread. My hope is for Sarah, friends, and family, to get justice for what was done to her. She did not deserve this. No one does, actually. :(
     
  14. cestmoi

    cestmoi Active Member

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    I was offered, and accepted, a lift from two police officers in their car in London. They were not known to me. Still here to tell the tale...
    My point is that it's not unusual that SE could be talked into the car. It's down to what a person is taught about police, about getting into cars of people we don't know, personality styles, the list goes on. I know the charge reads that she was taken by force (I hope I have that right) but I would be interested to know what the various interpretations of that particular charge could be. Would deception cover it, or must it be physical force that brought her into the car?
     
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  15. Marantz4250b

    Marantz4250b Well-Known Member

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    The charge was Taken by force or fraud. That suggests that they have not yes established all the pertinent facts and why his sentencing is delayed several months.
     
  16. Sherlockhames

    Sherlockhames Well-Known Member

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    I believe the charge reads “by force or by fraud”. So the exact nature of how she ended up in the car is irrelevant. She wasn’t supposed to be there and had no reason to be there even if he talked her into it as a policeman. Hence the fraud bit. (Also I think this definitively points to them not knowing each other in any way. If he had known her, he might be trying to claim she went voluntarily. Clearly this was not his initial story. But he hasn’t changed it to dispute a kidnap charge. So it is safe to say this was completely random).
     
  17. annpats

    annpats Well-Known Member

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    Don't leave us hanging! What happened? What did they want? Did they just question you about where you where going or had been? We're you in a town? Rural? Evening? Day?
    It's good to know these things for future reference.
     
  18. annpats

    annpats Well-Known Member

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    Well, the garage was a family business, and he obviously kept his inner evil well-hidden from all of his family......he wouldn't let them know what a deranged maniac he is. Which is even more worrying, because it means he can control it, on and off.
     
  19. Marantz4250b

    Marantz4250b Well-Known Member

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    My betting is that they just had nothing particular on. Maybe he looked a bit like someone they knew was the local crim? Maybe it was unusual to see that type of person loitering in that area?

    On a related note, and I'm conscious of not wanting to derail the thread here so will keep it brief. Back in the 90's and stretching back into the 1960's, my family had a reasonably large tobacco wholesaling business which went through several periods of being robbed or having attempts at its warehouse. During one of these periods my Uncle noticed an old Fiat (Miafiori, or something) parked across the road with four exceptionally unpleasant looking occupants essentially spilling out of it. We locked the doors and called the local control room be be greeted with a reply along the lines of oh, don't worry that's just some of our CID undercover guys keeping an eye on the place as we haven't seen X, Y or Z in a few days. or something to that effect.
     
  20. infinit

    infinit Well-Known Member

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    Apparently there had been a spate of burglaries in the area and one of the tactics was to use a lookout which I apparently fit the description of. They just asked for some details which someone seemed to pass to someone via a radio and to pat me down. This was in Bromley funnily enough around the time Couzens would have worked there at about 1am.

    They were good natured, I did inform the main one who speaking to me I'd been half a second from kicking his car door back into him because of how dodgy they all looked (this was non-marked car and non-uniformed offices) and when they left they apologised for disturbing my night.
     
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