UK UK - Sarah Everard, 33, London - Clapham Common area, 3 March 2021 *Arrests* #6

[Noscrubs]

My partner is a chemist and I asked him how common Lye was in labs. He said labs usually only order in stock they need, but Lye is common and useful so would likely be in most labs. He also said that something like Lye wouldn’t be actively monitored (measured to see if any has been taken etc) as it’s not a controlled substance. The only reason it may ever be checked is for stock control/cost.

 

[Steveparadox]

what was he doing in London in the first place? looking for a victim? my view that he saw SE walking alone approached her about lockdown rules ( not saying she broke any but he could have used it as an excuse) and enticed her into his car to take her details then drove off? I've been stopped once by police for my break light being out, they were not friendly they told me to get out of my car and into the back of theirs while they took my details, I found the whole thing intimidating , two large male cops and me a small female but i complied , sitting in that back seat i was stressed , this happened some years ago but i have never forgotten how it made me feel , totally powerless.

He works in London, not far away, and had apparently finished his shift at 9pm

 

[stormyseas]

BBM. I have seen this claimed several times. What could be accidental about someone dying in an attempt at consensual sex?

It makes me incredibly uncomfortable to think someone may be claiming SE had consented to sex with the perpetrator... IMO

 

[JosieJo]

Just thinking out loud really..imo if it was his plan to "just" expose himself or sexually offend i doubt very much he would be in uniform..far to easy to identify...so this was either an escalated sexual attack outside the car initially and she was put in the car after the effect...or the end game of murder was the plan from the outset it he used his uniform to get her in or near his car ...jmo

 

[CuriousObserver1]

The above case (Call for witnesses after south London sexual assault - Southwark News) should definitely be flagged to the police as you never know it could well be missed, although I like to think they would as a matter of course go through all unsolved sexual assault crimes in the South London Area and route down to Kent - surely that is basic policing?

 

[LeopardLeotard]

Apologies for multiple post, phone is still up the wall due to weather conditions

 

[CocktailQueen]

I hope they didnt get very far with that defence!

Look up Natalie Connelly. Violently murdered and her killer claimed it was a sex game gone wrong and only got sentenced to 3 years 8 months.

 

[jazzygal19]

I'm new to this forum and joined because I have been rattled by this case ever since the news broke.
Like make people, it has hit home (both literally and metaphorically for me).
What a tragic loss of life of an innocent young women who had everything to look forward to. I feel desperately sad for her family and loved ones, who must be going through hell right now.
I just can't get over how perverse, twisted and sick WC must be to do this. I just can't understand the motivation, particularly as father.
I'm particularly disturbed that she might have suffered or felt terrified for a long time, as it's a long drive from London to Kent. I dread to think the ordeal she has gone through. I hope it happened instantly and quickly. RIP

First time poster here. I’m a clinical psychologist specialised in personality disorders and have a background in LE.

I think Sherlockhames has it broadly correct, according to what I’d expect to come out later.

A few points re other general discussions.

- “hands on” sex offenders tend to have a personality disorder, even if it is somewhat subtle
- psychopaths & those with other cluster B disorders are reasonably common in society
- they tend to have a lower than average IQ, possibly around the 90 mark
- premeditation and their -perception- of risk often shows hallmarks of low cunning rather than the glamourised, filmic, highly sophisticated psychopathic thinking style many imagine
- unsolved cases are predominantly due to loss of evidence over time rather than the skill of the perpetrators in covering the crime
- hire cars are not unusual in cases like this, the low cunning thinking style perceiving them less likely to be traced
- ANPR cams all over the UK lead LE to WC and he was subsequently subject to surveillance by plain clothes teams for days
- cordon at Poynders Court probably to some degree timed to give media smokescreen whilst arrest planned at WC’s home
- PaDP officers are almost always -not- trained in forensics, investigative policing techniques or related specialist functions
- PaDP are trained in tactics related to security and weapon handling, usually involving 5 week training sessions at a specialised residential facility in Kent
- This training is repeated every X months / years as are psychological screenings for ones suitability to be a firearms officer
- these screenings are not repeated often enough IMO as much can change between times and they are widely self report questionnaires which are known to be unrealiable
- one may expect that a sex offender would escalate from “hands off” ie flashing to “hands on” over time if he is subject to worsening mental health, fractures in personal relationships, death or illness in the family, a narcissistic injury such as humiliation at work or with his wife etc
- yes, it is possible that a first killing occurs at 48
- yes, it is statistically likely that Sarah got into his car voluntarily
- yes, it may have been an accidental killing as a result of a failed attempt at consensual sexual activity
- or a panic killing to reduce the chances of prosecution

EDIT to add: its highly unlikely that his Met issue taser or other weapon could be used in this attack as they are strictly booked in and out before & after shifts. However police CAN carry: baton, warrant ID, uniform, nylon cuffs, and other small items away from work easily / with permission.

There’s so much more to say but I have to go to work!

This is really informative, thank you. The one thing that has bothering me, and I think a lot of people, is that is it common for killers/psychopaths to have children? When I think of past cases and notorious killers, I don't remember any of them having a family. Somehow, it makes it more disturbing the fact he has a young daughter.

 

[Binkacat]

I think they must suspect the wife of doing more than providing a false alibi or saying he wasn’t at home when he was. If it was just that then she’d have been arrested on a lesser charge of something like perverting the course of justice.

Which is what Luke Mitchell’s mum was charged with when she provided a false alibi in the Jodi Jones murder.

assisting an offender makes me think it’s more to do with helping conceal/dispose of the body.

MOO

 

[gunsh0tglitt3r]

He just never anticipated the power her friends and family had in their social media appeals. They're all in marketing/social media and were obviously relentless in their appeal. So many people are missing in London and their families never get the media/public behind them like Sarah did.
She was obviously very much loved and failed to show up when planned. If it was anyone else, say me, all my close family are in another country, weeks could have easily passed by before anyone might even think about reporting me missing.
Ultimately she was very unlucky, and lucky. A Paradox.

 

[4NSIC]

BBM. I have seen this claimed several times. What could be accidental about someone dying in an attempt at consensual sex?

That is to say that someone with psychological deficits in the areas of impulse control, theory of mind, empathy and fear of risk / harm to others may explode in a rage & lash out when rebuffed. Or physically restrain a distressed victim using force that is lethal. Or in the act of self defence, when a victim uses force, accidentally cause a death via their responsive actions. In the mind of someone at that time, there may not be an intent to kill, but they kill nevertheless ie accidental versus their intent. I would highly recommend some of the interviews available on YouTube where you can watch the questioning of similar perpetrators.

For clarity: I am not suggesting that this is a legal or moral defence for ones actions. I am speaking to the recorded, studied and reasonably well understood phenomena of a perpetrators *potential* mindset when escalating from one form of sexual crime to sexual crime + murder.

 

[GemmaNut]

I hope they didnt get very far with that defence!

Several men have been very successful with that defence and secured acquittals or lesser convictions and sentences. Horrific and there is an organised pushback now, in several countries.

 

[Rileysmum]

Sarah Everard police swooped on 'murder suspect' Met officer after CCTV breakthrough from bus camera | Daily Mail Online

 

[Sherlockhames]

There is still a possibility he rents an apartment in the Poynders block I guess. Has all police activity there ceased now?

Edited: to add that the above is my opinion only.

No police tape or activity there as of yesterday afternoon (although there was a met police unmarked car there yesterday - i saw the log book on the dashboard as I walked past).

I am fairly sure there is zero chance WC rents a flat in Poynders Court (never say never!!). He has a family in Deal and they live in a modest family home down there. The rent on a flat in Poynders Court is likely up to 3x what the family would be paying on a mortgage in Deal. Even a studio flat in Poynders Court would be 2X the value of the Deal property.

He works in the met and his wife works too but down in Kent ie not London weighted salaries. They don’t have a London “Pied a Terre”, and even if they did, it wouldn’t be in Clapham paying £1400 a month.

I could believe the specific location had something to do with the case when there was a chance she knew her attacker. But this just looks completely random, and the specific location was incidental.

 

[Alyce]

It's the way you would drive back from Nine Elms (Battersea) to get to Kent. It's about two miles away though. So if his shift finished at 8pm, it suggests some premeditation that he was around there still at 9.30, the drive is about 10 mins

I saw another timing, earlier in this thread, that said shift finished 8.30pm.
Perhaps he had a coffee/sandwich, chat with colleagues ? before starting his drive home.

 

[jazzygal19]

Look up Natalie Connelly. Violently murdered and her killer claimed it was a sex game gone wrong and only got sentenced to 3 years 8 months.

In the UK, they've actually altered the rough sex defense (thankfully) following the murder of Grace Millane.

"On Monday 6 July MPs voted in favour of the bill in the Commons - the bill now rules out "consent for sexual gratification" as a defence for causing serious harm to a person."

Source: Rough sex defence: What will a change in the law mean?

 

[Mersault]

Apologies for multiple post, phone is still up the wall due to weather conditions

Thanks for the updates Leopard. Did you see an ambulance at the property a few days before the arrest? Or three cars regularly there?

 

[Juliet B]

I suspect the police will be looking back on a lot of past unsolved sexual offences and even missing women. This can’t be a one off - false plates, disposal of the body - it doesn’t shout indecent exposure gone wrong and a panicked cover up to me.

 

[Bethan]

One thing that I haven’t seen mentioned is about the outside of Poynders Court (sorry if I’m repeating a post I’ve missed) pictures in Daily Mail and other newspapers showed forensics swabbing the pavement (right near the kerb) outside Poynders Court as soon as they blocked it off ! I googled the make of wipes and they are used to retrieve blood traces! Did they find something on the pavement to suggest a kidnap occurred there?

Search for missing Sarah Everard, 33, enters sixth day as new CCTV footage shows no sign of her | Daily Mail Online

Could the ‘indecent exposure’ incident have taken place at this location & the search was for DNA evidence ( ? semen)

He could have stopped Sarah & offered a lift telling her there had been a sexually motivated crime in the area that evening.

 

[Armchair_Defective]

The other thing I find fascinating is his psyche. The Sun reported that he only joined the Met in 2018, transferring straight into DPG (his current unit). And had only ever worked in Deal, and then Dungeness in Kent until 2018. It also says he didn't like London and wanted to quit the police and take up hospitality back home in Kent. So can't have been perpetrating acts in London before 2018? And can't have left any DNA/traces previously, or it would have been picked up on his security checks in 2018.

His job at DPG involves him spending all his shift guarding diplomatic buildings or security at events. It's not one where he is out and about on the streets of London or gets any real downtime tbh. He then has a 4 HOUR commute to and from home. So can't be drinking after work or socialising much. And then a family to look after as his wife works full time in Dover - so between them they must have to juggle school runs and child care?

If he had a history of such acts in Deal or Dungeness, these are small enough towns that in 30+ years, someone would have noticed or reported it? So it makes me wonder if all this started only once in London?

Met cop 'may have used warrant card to entice Sarah Everard into car'

I read in one report that he hadn't settled into his work in London even though he'd not been there that long. Someone else posted about personality disorders further up, with many of them they find it hard to fit in and are always changing careers, trying to 'start again' but it's their interactions with people that are the problem. The commute may have been getting to him and that causes further stresses and a feeling of the need to be reckless in some way.
I'm guessing that as in the Libby Squire case, he's someone that feels entitled to use women and assault them. He knew what he wanted to do but will never admit it and will use all manner of excuses like it was consensual. It's like with the 'fetish burglars' who use breaking in and stealing physical goods as an excuse to break in and be closer to women and eventually assault them. So that's what I guess will be next, his excuses of how something accidental happened.