UK UK - Sarah Everard, 33, London - Clapham Common area, 3 March 2021 *Arrests* #7

[T2000]

BBM. One does not have to twist it to see that that is exactly what this post implies. Men cannot help harassing because women pose in bikinis?

Well no, but as per post, I do wonder if some of this mixed messaging helps to catalyse such behaviour. Maybe not at all - and it was in no way a suggestion that it's women's fault.

I just wonder though if harassment etc would reduce if the media wasnt so full of images that in effect encourage that sort of activity

 

[Happymoon]

For anyone questioning the possibility that she wouldn’t have complied if he had told her he was Police...

If I was stopped and addressed by someone claiming to be the police, I strongly suspect that I wouldn’t question it, I would panic, and would do exactly what they asked. I’m also 33, and have a professional career. It wouldn’t even occur to me to challenge them - they’re the police, they’re there to protect us.

I guess Id probably do differently now, however until you’ve been in a situation like that you can’t possibly know how you, never mind anyone else would respond.

 

[SpursGyal]

If you need to say 'please don't twist this' - then there's an issue.
If I want to walk around the streets in a bikini, or post selfies online in my underwear, or make an OnlyFans account (or whatever the hell they are) or sleep with 2 men everyday (even though I'm a lesbian) I can... and I shouldn't ever have to fear being murdered.

How i wish i could like this more than once!

 

[Crazy Mama]

She had tight leggings on I think it would be obvious it was a women either from the front or behind and she was only 5.4ft ( not saying blokes can't be that small but it's not as common as it is for a women) If he was in his car the headlights could have illuminated her also.

He might have tooted his horn for her to turn around and then with lights on full beam blinded her for a second while he took the opportunity to nab and cuff her. It only takes a few seconds. She was in a happy mood, nearly home and just finished a pleasant phone call.
That’s my opinion.

 

[sundaaaay]

I believe the woods they are talking about are the ones that EC put pictures on her fb from. If so, they’ve made an assumption as these are not the same woods.

Strange to go walking in woods which are not public

Also, note areas of drainage/bodies of water

 

[lello2]

I know it's not there, but it's not far away from the Tulse Hill or Brixton area, both of which I would imagine to be horrific at night.

I was more so commenting on the fact it doesn't surprise me that there are sex street workers there. Every area I've stayed in with sex street workers have turned into places you definitely do not want to be out alone in at night time.

Friendly reminder that many people on this thread live in these areas, which by the way are relatively large population-wise and geographically for London so a bit unfair to tar all of Tulse Hill and all of Brixton with the same brush. Having lived here all my life I can say categorically that for the large part they are not “horrific” at night or any other time of the day and up until now I have felt completely safe living in this area. Thanks

 

[L White]

Brixton is not horrendous at night. Or in the day. And I don't think I've ever seen any prostitutes or similar there (and I used to live there a few years ago).

There's at least 3 areas in Brixton.

 

[4NSIC]

Of course this goes without saying, but trauma in a persons life leaves a deep imprint that can explain people’s later actions and relationship styles.

Abandonment by a Mother at a young age would have a tremendous impact on a person, obviously not that this excuses anything, or that everybody would be affected on the same way, it’s just interesting for me to look at the background and family life of the perp. But if this is the wrong place to do so I will refrain. It’s all JMO

Yes, IMHO fractured relationships can be one of the social factors that interact with biological brain abnormalities to form unhealthy coping mechanisms. These poor coping mechanisms may lead to someone with reduced empathy or other deficits lacking the self control later in life to resist acting on urges to harm others.

 

[InvSmith]

Any news about this separate and prior indecent exposure charge?
Sarah Everard: 'Murder suspect' Met officer found via CCTV from bus camera | Daily Mail Online[/QUOTE]

 

[nozomu]

I just wanted to address two things here:

1) That Sarah may have ended up in his car for many reasons. She could have been persuaded in a way that in a normal situation wouldn't have worked but when you are in the dark and intimidated, reason goes out of the window. It's very hard to know exactly how you'd react in this situation - especially if a uniform/police identity is involved.

(some speculation here obviously as we don't know what happened)

2) Sexual assault is constantly minimised by society. I've had some really quite disturbing comments made to me when walking on my own - one being when I was 13 and a middle aged man said I was just how I liked his girls (young) which the men he was with just laughed at. All these experiences I guess are completely legal but nevertheless it doesn't make them right.

I think one of the main problems we have in society is that intimidating behaviours are not challenged often enough, and a lot of sexual assault is treated as a minor crime. It's pretty obvious that a lot of this horrible behaviour can be the gateway for even more violence towards people and yet there is little that seems to be done to stop that.

But obviously sexual assault is a horrible and potentially completely life ruining crime in itself - and I hope maybe this case can help to protect any victims of similar crime.

 

[TheBorez]

WHERE ARE THE MODS PLEASE??

The thread has been closed temporarily because people have published unverified reports yet someone is very clearly suggesting that women posting images online in bikini pictures is a catalyst for young women being raped and murdered and the comment remains??

 

[factorfiction77]

I’m going to try to answer this because it’s a great question.

But because I’m not verified I hope (please tell me if I’m not) to couch this in the correct terms.

It is my opinion that those individuals who are experiencing urges to abuse, frighten, injure or kill others, be that due to paranoid delusions or sexual interest, be offered telephone counselling free of charge much like The Samaritans.

A number, with a guarantee of anonymity, that would direct potential perpetrators to treatment pathways before offending could reduce the incidence of sexual crime. It would need to be manned 24/7 and offer judgement free “talking down” from the urges, as well as making individuals aware that they can receive help without facing imprisonment simply for their ideas.

It is again my opinion that volunteering for such a service ought to be one option of several mandatory placements required for professionals in the clinical psychology field to gain their BPA / similar membership.

In the society we now inhabit, where so much focus is given to gender equality, moral outrage appears to dissuade people in my field from suggesting this to the public. But -in my opinion again- this approach has been shown to help reduce incidences of sexual abuse towards children in other countries.

Prevention is better than cure!

I think this is good in theory for a percentage of those perpetrators with any kind of self awareness but unfortunately statistics show that many offenders committing serious crimes are sociopaths / psychopaths and therefore lack self awareness and empathy. So to expect these characters to call for help IMO is wishful thinking. I just don’t think many perpetrators could be reasoned with especially sexual deviants acting on urges, fantasies and impulses of and also opportunities presenting themselves. I do know where you are coming from though so this is not a critique of your comment. In an ideal world this would be the solution.

 

[LorriB]

The wording some people are using about her being too intelligent, savvy or professional to get into his car implies that to do so would be stupid. That makes me very uncomfortable and is bordering on victim blaming.

I'm a woman 2 years older than Sarah. I lived about 10 miles from where this happened for 25 years. I work in marketing and I'm a professional woman who walked home at night alone many times. I can't guarantee I wouldn't get into what I believe to be a policeman's car especially when afraid.

 

[TheBorez]

I am actually furious. What an absolute imbecile.

How i wish i could like this more than once!

 

[Newthoughts]

Yes but he wouldnt want to be seen buying it

It's a really common chemical in any lab - lots of uses. Any reaction that requires a basic pH for example or removing excess acids from a product. So in a lot of labs it's kind of like a staple item not one bought in specially. Probably one bought in bulk.

If his wife was the lab manager I doubt anyone would notice if she took some. My colleague takes some of ours to clean his oven. That's assuming that is what was used which none of us know

 

[Lucy6226]

Brixton is not horrendous at night. Or in the day. And I don't think I've ever seen any prostitutes or similar there (and I used to live there a few years ago).

Sex workers.

 

[4NSIC]

I think this is good in theory for a percentage of those perpetrators with any kind of self awareness but unfortunately statistics show that many offenders committing serious crimes are sociopaths / psychopaths and therefore lack self awareness and empathy. So to expect these characters to call for help IMO is wishful thinking. I just don’t think many perpetrators could be reasoned with especially sexual deviants acting on urges, fantasies and impulses of and also opportunities presenting themselves. I do know where you are coming from though so this is not a critique of your comment. In an ideal world this would be the solution.

I used to feel the same way. But my opinions changed over time due to experience I can’t reference here as I’m unverified but you’d be surprised I think by the journey from functioning society member to perpetrator. However, yes, in extreme cases of psychopathy it is *my opinion* that the desire for help doesn’t exist. Self awareness does though. That’s why they don’t go around telling everyone all of their thoughts.

 

[serenelyso]

Thinking about motives.... and to be a little provocative....

I read lots of articles saying about women being harassed.
However, there's some irony that on sites such as Daily Mail, these articles are alongside countless pictures of 'influencers' in bikinis

Now, I am NOT suggesting that women shouldnt be free to do what they want, or that one justifies the other.
I just do wonder though if the unavoidable endless Kardashian bikini shots in the media etc create a message of 'ogle us'....
... and that for an unstable mind, this can encourage harassment. Make it feel ok...?

Ie. If we want to try and clean up harassment from the streets, would more consistent messaging ONLINE help with that?

Please dont twist this into any suggestion that women ask for harassment

(Somewhat off topic, please delete if needed. I'm just trying to think how sad events like this could be reduced in frequency)

Saudi newspapers don’t have pictures of women in bikinis, nor is *advertiser censored* or sexual imagery legal there, is the plight of women any better there?

Before the internet and photography existed, before even bikinis existed, were we women any safer than today?

As a young woman, the only messaging that has ever been consistent in my life is that I am responsible for other people’s actions.

 

[sriraaacha]

Um, little ****** to imply it's the WORKERS who make the area unsafe.

Re read your comment and possibly misunderstood.
Yes, the areas where workers work usually attracts low lifes, unfortunately not much can be done unless the police are willing to work directly with the SWers.

I'm not saying they make it unsafe, but it's bound to attract a certain type of person. And often can lead to offences/crimes etc.

Brixton is not horrendous at night. Or in the day. And I don't think I've ever seen any prostitutes or similar there (and I used to live there a few years ago).

From my own experience it was pretty sketchy in the daytime, I wouldn't even attempt it at night just based off of what I've seen/heard.

Was referring to previous comment btw about there being sex workers in Tulse Hill, not Brixton. Sorry for confusion there.

 

[factorfiction77]

WHERE ARE THE MODS PLEASE??

The thread has been closed temporarily because people have published unverified reports yet someone is very clearly suggesting that women posting images online in bikini pictures is a catalyst for young women being raped and murdered and the comment remains??

What the hec... I missed that post.. They must be looking for a reaction

I used to feel the same way. But my opinions changed over time due to experience I can’t reference here as I’m unverified but you’d be surprised I think by the journey from functioning society member to perpetrator. However, yes, in extreme cases of psychopathy it is *my opinion* that the desire for help doesn’t exist. Self awareness does though. That’s why they don’t go around telling everyone all of their thoughts.

Yes I know where you are coming from completely, sorry I wasn’t clear with what I meant .. self awareness with empathy as in a desire to get help and stop the behaviour or draw attention to it ..