Found Deceased UT - MacKenzie "Kenzie" Lueck, 23, Salt Lake City, 17 June 2019 #18 *ARREST*

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About the cameras: they either have to send wireless signals (so expensive infrastructure needs to be set up because once the public has the idea that a place is on camera, it should be on camera - no major breakdowns in service) OR they have to store the info in the camera (which is much cheaper).

People storing information at home can usually place a camera within range of their on wifi network. Each park could have its own 24 hour hub for this, but that becomes a target for thieves.

At colleges, the hub is in the police station. Colleges have conferences and extensive planning to decide how to do this, because many in the public assume that cameras mean real time monitoring and that someone will come to help them if things go wrong. SO, one of the bigger expenses is the staff to monitor the cameras. The more cameras, the more staff needed.

At my college, the real time monitoring enabled police to capture a young man with a rifle on the athletic field, whose stated intention was to "shoot up the school" (he had been shooting at objects not people, so far). We are, however, out of budget to add more monitors (we have one person who watches 16 monitors, each of which changes to a different camera every 10 seconds or so, unless the person monitoring chooses to watch someone - we're working at getting more sophisticated software that would allow a monitor to choose a "route" to watch a particular person - facial recognition software would help, but we don't have the funds for that and it would need to be written into public education policy to do it).

Most regular security cameras at stores only hold about 48 hours of information, so by the time ML was officially missing, that window of opportunity would have been gone. Since it's so expensive to install and maintain, the public needs to know that sometimes dollars can be better spent elsewhere.
 
As far as privacy, your right. We basically have none. Those days are done. We are tracked in cyber space, on the road, anywhere we go.

But most criminals and evil people dont care. They act on impulse and couldnt care less about the consequences and punishment.
 
JUL 17, 2019
North Salt Lake will replace ‘dummy’ cameras at park where Mackenzie Lueck disappeared
[...]

Cameras and signs that say Hatch Park, 50 W. Center St., is “monitored by video surveillance” are meant to deter crime, but the cameras don’t actually record. When Lueck went missing after she was last seen in Hatch Park, the city revealed that the cameras could not have captured any evidence of her disappearance.

[...]

“I don’t think it would have saved her life, but I think it would have given us a lot more evidence,” Lueck’s friend AF said. “It would have saved a lot of tax dollars because the police wouldn’t have had to get as many warrants, and just time, precious time.”

[...]

The city may also look into putting cameras in other parks around the city.

Council members commended Lueck’s friends for bringing the issue before the city and making a real change.

“The way they’ve pursued this has been wonderful. It’s been very productive, and I can’t say enough about them being involved and trying to make communities better,” Arave said.

[...]
 
There have been several posts, although not a lot, where people speculated that he might have ‘blackmailed’ her into meeting him. I guess you missed those? As I see it, that theory would be extremely unlikely, with not a shred of evidence in its favor, and at least one bit of evidence against it. (The Lyft driver’s description of her demeanor.)
I think the OP was referring to "force" as opposed to coersion or persuasion to meet at that hour and specific place.

When one is forced, they do not have much choice, for example, if one is threatened with a weapon.

We still don't know the content of the text messages, but it's pretty clear that she was not forced to meet him there.
Whether or not she was manipulated into meeting him at that time we still don't know.

But we do know that at some point it became a situation that was beyond her control, and that it was something she had not anticipated.

Whether that occurred at the airport when she was texting him, or in the car, or at the house we still don't know. Imo
 
“I don’t think it would have saved her life, but I think it would have given us a lot more evidence,” Lueck’s friend AF said. “It would have saved a lot of tax dollars because the police wouldn’t have had to get as many warrants, and just time, precious time.”

Sadly, unless someone was watching every camera in SLC all the time (massive expense), there was no way to know she had gone to Hatch until after she was reported missing on Thursday and then they got the warrant for her phone.

And the camera would not have shown any criminal activity nor would any person monitoring know who the people were or what they were up to. Running motor vehicle records is usually reserved for uniformed personnel and investigators of a particular rank. It's not a minimum wage job. When more people have access to our license plate linked information, there's way more risk than I'd like to see.
 
About the cameras: they either have to send wireless signals (so expensive infrastructure needs to be set up because once the public has the idea that a place is on camera, it should be on camera - no major breakdowns in service) OR they have to store the info in the camera (which is much cheaper).

People storing information at home can usually place a camera within range of their on wifi network. Each park could have its own 24 hour hub for this, but that becomes a target for thieves.

At colleges, the hub is in the police station. Colleges have conferences and extensive planning to decide how to do this, because many in the public assume that cameras mean real time monitoring and that someone will come to help them if things go wrong. SO, one of the bigger expenses is the staff to monitor the cameras. The more cameras, the more staff needed.

At my college, the real time monitoring enabled police to capture a young man with a rifle on the athletic field, whose stated intention was to "shoot up the school" (he had been shooting at objects not people, so far). We are, however, out of budget to add more monitors (we have one person who watches 16 monitors, each of which changes to a different camera every 10 seconds or so, unless the person monitoring chooses to watch someone - we're working at getting more sophisticated software that would allow a monitor to choose a "route" to watch a particular person - facial recognition software would help, but we don't have the funds for that and it would need to be written into public education policy to do it).

Most regular security cameras at stores only hold about 48 hours of information, so by the time ML was officially missing, that window of opportunity would have been gone. Since it's so expensive to install and maintain, the public needs to know that sometimes dollars can be better spent elsewhere.

Expense would certainly be an issue especially with live cams and someone to watch in real time. I think simply the recording kind at minimum would be a great thing if there were more of them. I truly do not want to see a Walmart or casino on every corner but one must admit the cameras inside and outside at each have been used to help in arrests, and other businesses as well of course.

Does anyone really think they are ever off camera? I guess some perps seem to believe that. I don't mean there are not areas of course where there is no footage, particularly in a rural area.

I have seen some gas station still shots that are better than HS senior photos for seeing the perp with detail. Even before cameras, gas stations and many stores had those mirrors that allowed them to watch the entire store.

In Samantha Josephson's case, some changes came to Uber and Lyft, even though I need to stress neither was at any fault in the case; it looks like in KL's case, cameras may be one of the positive changes that result from this tragedy--actually that has already happened--with regard to Hatch Park.

Jmo.
 
Sadly, unless someone was watching every camera in SLC all the time (massive expense), there was no way to know she had gone to Hatch until after she was reported missing on Thursday and then they got the warrant for her phone.

And the camera would not have shown any criminal activity nor would any person monitoring know who the people were or what they were up to. Running motor vehicle records is usually reserved for uniformed personnel and investigators of a particular rank. It's not a minimum wage job. When more people have access to our license plate linked information, there's way more risk than I'd like to see.

If the footage was reviewed after they knew they were at Hatch Park according to Lyft and GPS if close enough and lighting could have shown if door closed and reopened several times if she was trying to get out, a scuffle inside and if they got out, produced a weapon, knocked her in the back of head and dragged her back in the car. My ex husband and dear friend is a retired city LE officer where I reside. You would be surprised what video footage have shown around our local parks, parking lots, malls etc. have shown crimes which helped in investigation. Too much to get into it here.
 
Sadly, unless someone was watching every camera in SLC all the time (massive expense), there was no way to know she had gone to Hatch until after she was reported missing on Thursday and then they got the warrant for her phone.

And the camera would not have shown any criminal activity nor would any person monitoring know who the people were or what they were up to. Running motor vehicle records is usually reserved for uniformed personnel and investigators of a particular rank. It's not a minimum wage job. When more people have access to our license plate linked information, there's way more risk than I'd like to see.
BBM

No, LE knew ML went to Hatch Park after speaking to Lyft and their driver. At that point, they could have pulled the camera footage and possibly gotten a license plate number, traced it to AA and interviewed him sooner. Or not. MOO
 
If the footage was reviewed after they knew they were at Hatch Park according to Lyft and GPS if close enough and lighting could have shown if door closed and reopened several times if she was trying to get out, a scuffle inside and if they got out, produced a weapon, knocked her in the back of head and dragged her back in the car. My ex husband and dear friend is a retired city LE officer where I reside. You would be surprised what video footage have shown around our local parks, parking lots, malls etc. have shown crimes which helped in investigation. Too much to get into it here.

Also too much to get into here, but I can never overstress the importance of cameras to protect your property and the community. My neighbor’s house got robbed and the criminals had the IQ of AA here. They didn’t notice the house directly across the street having cameras over the driveway with a direct view of the public street. Between my cameras and another neighbor’s we got the car, plates, and criminals jumping the wall of the victim on video.
 
Also too much to get into here, but I can never overstress the importance of cameras to protect your property and the community. My neighbor’s house got robbed and the criminals had the IQ of AA here. They didn’t notice the house directly across the street having cameras over the driveway with a direct view of the public street. Between my cameras and another neighbor’s we got the car, plates, and criminals jumping the wall of the victim on video.
I agree the Wyze cameras from Amazon are cheap and work really well. Plus they work with Alexa $25 the pan cam is $37. You can read all the good reviews.
 
BBM

No, LE knew ML went to Hatch Park after speaking to Lyft and their driver. At that point, they could have pulled the camera footage and possibly gotten a license plate number, traced it to AA and interviewed him sooner. Or not. MOO
And the footage could be used in court evidence at trial, backing up Lyft drivers statement and AA's phone pinging at the park at the same time.
 
Also too much to get into here, but I can never overstress the importance of cameras to protect your property and the community. My neighbor’s house got robbed and the criminals had the IQ of AA here. They didn’t notice the house directly across the street having cameras over the driveway with a direct view of the public street. Between my cameras and another neighbor’s we got the car, plates, and criminals jumping the wall of the victim on video.

Exactly. I am a huge fan of installing home personal security cameras now too. Started with 3 and now have 7 security cameras :)

It took me a long time to jump on the band wagon and get them installed because I was not sure of the price, didnt want another monthly fee, and not sure if I could self install them. Once I started to see the cost go way down and to learn more about the different kinds and what some of the features are I decided to purchase some not so expensive ones and boy was I surprised how easy it was to hook them up and get them running which surprised myself. I was able to install them with no help other than studying the manual a few times. LOL

Mine may not be the best but they sure were inexpensive and the best thing is "no monthly fee". They are only battery operated so I do have to change the batteries out in the individual cameras if I have them in a high traffic area where they go off a lot by motion detection. I like the battery ones because they are cordless for the most part.

The beauty of these systems like the one I have is they immediately record upon motion detect and send the video immediately to my router and onto a server where my smart phone has an App that allows me to get a notification if the camera went off and I can view the short videos it took or even get a live shot of the cameras on my phone. So even if a thief breaks in , its too late if he wants to destroy the camera because the video is already on the server and on my phone.

There is all kinds of settings that can be adjusted and mine have night vision and sound as well. I really like them and it gives you peace of mind that at least you can know if people are entering the doors of your home. I even have one on the inside so if someone broke in then I would get additional footage of them inside the home.

My system has cameras that are totally portable with no wires and they work off of 2 AA batteries each for the camera part. The 1 station module sits near the router and it needs electricity to operate. The stations job is to communicate with the cameras and send the videos to the server. Its all rather simple once you start to use them.
 
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And the footage could be used in court evidence at trial, backing up Lyft drivers statement and AA's phone pinging at the park at the same time.

Depending on the lighting, any active cameras might not have caught much in the first place.

His phone data alone, is more than enough.

He was at that park.

Minutes later he was back at his house.

He had texted her prior to their meetup.

He lied about it.

Done.
 
Depending on the lighting, any active cameras might not have caught much in the first place.

His phone data alone, is more than enough.

He was at that park.

Minutes later he was back at his house.

He had texted her prior to their meetup.

He lied about it.

Done.
Wow, I guess we are "done."
Apparently your comment stunned everyone into silence.
Anyway, I agree. Cameras would likely not have made much of a difference. Imo
 
Wow, I guess we are "done."
Apparently your comment stunned everyone into silence.
Anyway, I agree. Cameras would likely not have made much of a difference. Imo
Haaaa. It was silent to begin with, although I’ll gladly take the credit.

Cameras will be great going forward, but I’m not convinced they would have made much of a difference here.

They certainly wouldn’t have saved her life.
 
BBM

No, LE knew ML went to Hatch Park after speaking to Lyft and their driver. At that point, they could have pulled the camera footage and possibly gotten a license plate number, traced it to AA and interviewed him sooner. Or not. MOO

They didn't contact Lyft until after she was reported missing, right? How did they know to talk to Lyft? Was anyone looking at her phone records on June 17?

They got a subpoena just to look at her phone records (fairly quickly, I might add) but that was on Thursday. So, unless some person was watching the video and saw something really unusual (and that would mean that people were watching every park/public area in SLC), they wouldn't have seen much more than the Lyft driver saw. You'd almost need one person per camera, trained to look for criminal malfeasance.

At least, I think that was the timeframe. MOO. She was reported missing, the subpoena was gotten, then they found she'd arranged a Lyft, then they talked to the Lyft driver (but they didn't need the driver to talk - the Lyft records showed that she was dropped there).
 
They didn't contact Lyft until after she was reported missing, right? How did they know to talk to Lyft? Was anyone looking at her phone records on June 17?

They got a subpoena just to look at her phone records (fairly quickly, I might add) but that was on Thursday. So, unless some person was watching the video and saw something really unusual (and that would mean that people were watching every park/public area in SLC), they wouldn't have seen much more than the Lyft driver saw. You'd almost need one person per camera, trained to look for criminal malfeasance.

At least, I think that was the timeframe. MOO. She was reported missing, the subpoena was gotten, then they found she'd arranged a Lyft, then they talked to the Lyft driver (but they didn't need the driver to talk - the Lyft records showed that she was dropped there).

Her parents, IMO. She spoke to her mom to say she's there, it'd be logical to assume that she said "just getting a lyft home" or told her prior to getting on the plane "Yeah, I'll get a lyft home". That would seem a reasonable explanation.
 
They didn't contact Lyft until after she was reported missing, right? How did they know to talk to Lyft? Was anyone looking at her phone records on June 17?

They got a subpoena just to look at her phone records (fairly quickly, I might add) but that was on Thursday. So, unless some person was watching the video and saw something really unusual (and that would mean that people were watching every park/public area in SLC), they wouldn't have seen much more than the Lyft driver saw. You'd almost need one person per camera, trained to look for criminal malfeasance.

At least, I think that was the timeframe. MOO. She was reported missing, the subpoena was gotten, then they found she'd arranged a Lyft, then they talked to the Lyft driver (but they didn't need the driver to talk - the Lyft records showed that she was dropped there).

My guess is that she told her parents she was getting a Lyft that night, or she paid for it using a card that her parents had transaction details for.

Those were the first records law enforcement apparently obtained, and I’m a bit (pleasantly) surprised that they were able to get them so quickly.

Perhaps they didn’t need a warrant to compel Lyft’s cooperation.
 
Depending on the lighting, any active cameras might not have caught much in the first place.

His phone data alone, is more than enough.

He was at that park.

Minutes later he was back at his house.

He had texted her prior to their meetup.

He lied about it.

Done.
I respectfully disagree. You can never be absolute when it comes to evidence. A defense attorney could say someone else was using his phone. Just like OJ's bloody glove should have been enough, but it wasn't. If there were cameras OJ would have been convicted. No framing there.
 
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My guess is that she told her parents she was getting a Lyft that night, or she paid for it using a card that her parents had transaction details for.

Those were the first records law enforcement apparently obtained, and I’m a bit (pleasantly) surprised that they were able to get them so quickly.

Perhaps they didn’t need a warrant to compel Lyft’s cooperation.

Or maybe when the news broke, the Lyft driver recognized her name and contacted LE and told them what he knew.

Maybe????
 
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