Bottom line is that the av wx reports leave lots of room for the crew to have seen things on the ground (even PDX) and also for seeing glow through clouds or reflecting off the higher cloud layers.
goody nite
Reflecting last night, somone could work the physics and the weather of
this until the cows come home, but it still isn;t proof - unless someone
happened to take a photograph of "could see the lights of Portland coming
up", which I doubt. Nobody has ever contended hard evidence or even a
comment in the radio transcripts exists, and I have never found that. :banghead:
99 brought up "comments the chase pilots made"! I wonder what that is
and now I wonder if it even exists. 99 would not explain.
On the analytical side the fact of two cloud layers (~2500/3500 and
~5000 feet ?), is also a bit interesting. I assume ice crystals would have
been part of the mix. Now we are potentially talking about reflection and
re-reflection between, and within, clouds layers - potentially. And there
are several studies I have which speak of an 'amplifying effect in luminosity'
under just such conditions, as seen from above. But again, none of this amounts
to proof of anything but merely theoretical conjecture ... unless somebody happened
to snap that crucial photo or Scott actually radioed saying 'we can see Portland and
Vancouver coming up"? We know it was just after this period that the mysterious
long gap in communications (in the transcripts) occurs. 99 is convinced the Transcripts
were censored.
The fact 99 would reply citing Nuttall at all, is interesting also. Many of us
talked to Nuttall personally at the publication of his book. George was
adamant about two things, with me: (a) he was sure Jerry Thomas knew
who Cooper was, had met Cooper in the service, and (b) that Cooper
bailed near Vancouver using the lights of Vancouver-Portland "coming
up" to make his decision to bail. But, then George's book cites Grady and
Himms as saying "the crew could not see Portland-Vancouver" ? This is
one of the reasons I had to swallow hard when 99 cites Nuttall as the
official source on visibility! George needs to make up his mind, and get
his claims consistent, literally.
I take "could see the lights of Portland coming up" as official statements -
by Rataczak, Anderson, and Scott, backed up by interviews with Bohan's
crew etc etc.
And I would love to hear 99's recitation of what the chase pilots had to say,
on any issue. That is one area I know almost nothing about having never
talked to any of those people personally - has anyone else talked to them?