Why would the Ramseys need to stage?

[887sMtreme]

Yes, all this and the apparent lack of interest by anyone in the RN's time frame for a phone call having passed by without the call. There should have been a great deal of drama wrapped up in that but there is no report of anything other than the BPD setting up a way to tap the call when/if it came through. Is there any record of a comment about this from the BPD or anyone else? If so, I've not encountered it.

 

[Userid]

Yes, all this and the apparent lack of interest by anyone in the RN's time frame for a phone call having passed by without the call. There should have been a great deal of drama wrapped up in that but there is no report of anything other than the BPD setting up a way to tap the call when/if it came through. Is there any record of a comment about this from the BPD or anyone else? If so, I've not encountered it.

Forgot who exactly on the BPD said it, but yes, police were aware that the call had never come, and they took note of the suspicious lack of response/reaction by the R's.

 

[887sMtreme]

I do know LA later commented on that. I just wondered if it had ever made its way into an official report.

 

[Userid]

Oh okay, that I don't know, definitively.

 

[Cottonstar]

I do know LA later commented on that. I just wondered if it had ever made its way into an official report.

“After I had spoken briefly with Patsy I returned to the den area of the house. Each time the telephone rang I was present when John Ramsey answered the phone. There were at least three times that John Ramsey was not present when the phone rang. I personally saw John Ramsey run to the den to answer the phone. For each incoming phone call received at the Ramsey home on the morning of Dec. 26, John Ramsey told me the caller was not associated with the suspected ransom note.”

From Linda Arndt’s official police report.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Cottonstar]

I do know LA later commented on that. I just wondered if it had ever made its way into an official report.

More from LA police report:

“John Ramsey paced between the area of the den and the formal dining room. John was usually by himself. I did not see John or Patsy interact with each other. No one in the house made any obvious comment to me that it was after 1000 hours and the suspected kidnappers had not called.”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[887sMtreme]

Thank you, Cottonstar. These two quotations from LA could seem inconsistent, though I guess technically, they’re not.

 

[UKGuy]

Thank you, Cottonstar. These two quotations from LA could seem inconsistent, though I guess technically, they’re not.

887sMtreme,
JR knew full well where JonBenet was and that nobody had found her including Fleet White.

So he had to keep up appearances and play the anxious father whilst sneaking about checking the forensic situation was in accord with the R's version of events. We all know where PR was that morning, not so JR !

The R's initial assumption had to be that JonBenet would be found quickly and that they would hopefully be able to talk their way out of being arrested, hence the early lawyering up.

Once that never happened and JR was denied flight out of Colorado State via his plane, he must have started refactoring and planning his next move, just to reiterate, Patsy was surrounded by friends, we knew where she was, JR was free to roam and tamper.

Minimally this is what I reckon he did, maximally he relocated JonBenet to the wine-cellar, perplexing Fleet White since I reckon FW would have smelt a deceased JonBenet, including the stench of urine?

The case might even be JDI otherwise why all the effort on JR's behalf when BR is in a safe place, and Patsy is being comforted?

Why does JR need to keep pushing the boat out, e.g. fleeing Colorado State via plane, which must mean leaving JonBenet behind in a desolate wine-cellar, how would that have played out in the media?

Why did JR need to lawyer up so fast and have FW interviewed so quickly, like a chessmaster setting his pieces out on the board, JR seemed to know what he was doing and he has largely succeeded?

.

 

[Latinbeauty]

887sMtreme,
JR knew full well where JonBenet was and that nobody had found her including Fleet White.

So he had to keep up appearances and play the anxious father whilst sneaking about checking the forensic situation was in accord with the R's version of events. We all know where PR was that morning, not so JR !

The R's initial assumption had to be that JonBenet would be found quickly and that they would hopefully be able to talk their way out of being arrested, hence the early lawyering up.

Once that never happened and JR was denied flight out of Colorado State via his plane, he must have started refactoring and planning his next move, just to reiterate, Patsy was surrounded by friends, we knew where she was, JR was free to roam and tamper.

Minimally this is what I reckon he did, maximally he relocated JonBenet to the wine-cellar, perplexing Fleet White since I reckon FW would have smelt a deceased JonBenet, including the stench of urine?

The case might even be JDI otherwise why all the effort on JR's behalf when BR is in a safe place, and Patsy is being comforted?

Why does JR need to keep pushing the boat out, e.g. fleeing Colorado State via plane, which must mean leaving JonBenet behind in a desolate wine-cellar, how would that have played out in the media?

Why did JR need to lawyer up so fast and have FW interviewed so quickly, like a chessmaster setting his pieces out on the board, JR seemed to know what he was doing and he has largely succeeded?

.

Very well stated. Ditto to you

 

[887sMtreme]

887sMtreme,

[snip]
Why does JR need to keep pushing the boat out, e.g. fleeing Colorado State via plane, which must mean leaving JonBenet behind in a desolate wine-cellar, how would that have played out in the media?
[snip]

.

This has perplexed me. These seem the actions of one driven to desperation but JR does not seem like me to be a man who would lose control so dramatically, even given the hideous circumstances. By all accounts, he was everything from "cordial" (LA) to what we could describe as, at the most, concerned. I have heard at least one sleuth suggest that JR was actually making calls to *cancel* a meeting in Atlanta and cancelling the flight to Charlevoix. Those would both be reasonable things to do.

On a related topic, I have wondered if the Rs thought about secreting JBR in the plane, with JR piloting it himself, so they could jettison her body somewhere en route to Charlevoix, without alerting anyone (via RN or any other means) that she'd been "kidnapped" back in Boulder, then making up some kind of wild story about an accidental Charlevoix demise, the authorities there being probably even less prepared for crime-solving than the BPD. Thoughts?

 

[UKGuy]

This has perplexed me. These seem the actions of one driven to desperation but JR does not seem like me to be a man who would lose control so dramatically, even given the hideous circumstances. By all accounts, he was everything from "cordial" (LA) to what we could describe as, at the most, concerned. I have heard at least one sleuth suggest that JR was actually making calls to *cancel* a meeting in Atlanta and cancelling the flight to Charlevoix. Those would both be reasonable things to do.

On a related topic, I have wondered if the Rs thought about secreting JBR in the plane, with JR piloting it himself, so they could jettison her body somewhere en route to Charlevoix, without alerting anyone (via RN or any other means) that she'd been "kidnapped" back in Boulder, then making up some kind of wild story about an accidental Charlevoix demise, the authorities there being probably even less prepared for crime-solving than the BPD. Thoughts?

887sMtreme,

I have heard at least one sleuth suggest that JR was actually making calls to *cancel* a meeting in Atlanta and cancelling the flight to Charlevoix. Those would both be reasonable things to do.

Maybe so, he was overheard on the phone making interstate flight plans out of Colorado, this meant leaving JonBenet's body behind alone in the cellar !

Since the flight plan was vetoed by officers present it has not been highlighted as much as other Ramsey actions.

Yet it tells us that JR thought his plan was working so far, and he was putting Plan B into action.

i.e. Plan A , deal with the scenario where JonBenet is found quickly. Plan B is when JonBenet is not found and JR can formulate an escape route.

With Plan A and Plan B inoperable JR decided to find JonBenet and took the first opportunity to do so, hence the possibility JR relocated JonBenet's body to the wine-cellar, once his flight out of Colorado was refused.

Your daughter has been kidnapped and you want to fly to some business meeting, give me a break!

On a related topic, I have wondered if the Rs thought about secreting JBR in the plane, with JR piloting it himself, so they could jettison her body somewhere en route to Charlevoix, without alerting anyone (via RN or any other means) that she'd been "kidnapped" back in Boulder, then making up some kind of wild story about an accidental Charlevoix demise, the authorities there being probably even less prepared for crime-solving than the BPD. Thoughts?

Yes, they must have considered the scenario where they put JonBenet's body in a bag, or case, and flee by their pre-arranged flight.

with JR piloting it himself

nope, JR has extremely bad eyesight. This is why he has a pilot. He is not allowed to fly for medical reasons.

Also for those alert, if JR has such bad eyesight, and he does, how come he could quickly see JonBenet in the wine-cellar, yet Fleet White could not?

It might be that by not taking JonBenet's body on the pre-arranged flight, this indicates that JR was not aware of JonBenet's death until he was awakened?

.

 

[icedtea4me]

This has perplexed me. These seem the actions of one driven to desperation but JR does not seem like me to be a man who would lose control so dramatically, even given the hideous circumstances. By all accounts, he was everything from "cordial" (LA) to what we could describe as, at the most, concerned. I have heard at least one sleuth suggest that JR was actually making calls to *cancel* a meeting in Atlanta and cancelling the flight to Charlevoix. Those would both be reasonable things to do.

On a related topic, I have wondered if the Rs thought about secreting JBR in the plane, with JR piloting it himself, so they could jettison her body somewhere en route to Charlevoix, without alerting anyone (via RN or any other means) that she'd been "kidnapped" back in Boulder, then making up some kind of wild story about an accidental Charlevoix demise, the authorities there being probably even less prepared for crime-solving than the BPD. Thoughts?

Please state how this would be done without arousing any suspicion from John Andrew, Melinda, and/or Stewart, who they were scheduled to rendezvous with in Duluth, MN.

 

[887sMtreme]

Please state how this would be done without arousing any suspicion from John Andrew, Melinda, and/or Stewart, who they were scheduled to rendezvous with in Duluth, MN.

Ah, I forgot about that stopover. Thanks. Should have checked the timeline before tossing that out there. I suppose if I put on my fiction writer hat, I could come up with a way no less bizarre than the truth, but we’re not here to make things up.

So much seems to ride on JR’s behavior that day, whether he killed JBR or not, so I’m looking more deeply now into his actions. This seems like a good time to brush up on all those details. Something tells me not to discount LA’s version of her interactions with JR that day, but that’s challenging.

 

[Cottonstar]

Ah, I forgot about that stopover. Thanks. Should have checked the timeline before tossing that out there. I suppose if I put on my fiction writer hat, I could come up with a way no less bizarre than the truth, but we’re not here to make things up.

So much seems to ride on JR’s behavior that day, whether he killed JBR or not, so I’m looking more deeply now into his actions. This seems like a good time to brush up on all those details. Something tells me not to discount LA’s version of her interactions with JR that day, but that’s challenging.

For starters, ask why he didn’t report the broken, open window when he checked the basement in the morning? Then ask why was it open because FW said it was closed when he checked the basement prior to JR visit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Hatfield]

This has perplexed me. These seem the actions of one driven to desperation but JR does not seem like me to be a man who would lose control so dramatically, even given the hideous circumstances. By all accounts, he was everything from "cordial" (LA) to what we could describe as, at the most, concerned. I have heard at least one sleuth suggest that JR was actually making calls to *cancel* a meeting in Atlanta and cancelling the flight to Charlevoix. Those would both be reasonable things to do.

On a related topic, I have wondered if the Rs thought about secreting JBR in the plane, with JR piloting it himself, so they could jettison her body somewhere en route to Charlevoix, without alerting anyone (via RN or any other means) that she'd been "kidnapped" back in Boulder, then making up some kind of wild story about an accidental Charlevoix demise, the authorities there being probably even less prepared for crime-solving than the BPD. Thoughts?

JMO
I actually agree with this theory somewhat. I really think the plan they had was to remove the body to where it would never be found. That ties in nicely with the ransom letter. And if body was deposited out of the plane somewhere deep in the Rockies wilderness it may have not been found because of animals taking care of most of the remains. Or if they had open water in mind. I think maybe he was going to offer money to the pilot to keep silent when they threw body out of plane. Or even try to dump body on way to airport.

Lets remember they were basically in panic mode and not thinking too rationally at the time.

One thing I am pretty sure of is their plans were evolving and they were having to make decisions on the fly. Once JR realized LE would not let him leave then it finally sunk in to him how ludicrous the idea of leaving the home in the first place while his child was missing.
It was about that point where he realized that he may as well "find the body" because he wanted things to proceed.

If this was about what I think happened then he should have just been patient and waited because later on when things calmed down and most of LE left the home there may have been a chance for him to sneak the body out of the house.

If the boy ended up killing the child in some sort of rage incident then it still baffles me why they didnt just call 911 the moment they found the scene. It is likely nothing would have happened to the boy in the long run. He was too young to be put in prison and he could have gotten the help he needed.

The whole coverup seemed so unecessary and just made things 10 times worse IMO.