GUILTY WI - 12-Year-Old Girls Stab Friend 19 Times for Slenderman, Waukesha, 31 May 2014 #2

Discussion in 'Recently Sentenced and Beyond' started by SurfieTX, Jun 2, 2014.

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  1. ICS

    ICS New Member

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    From the Wisconsin statute (BBM):

    I'd say that:

    (1) is arguably the case given their ages (if they were 16 or 17 that may be different)

    (2) I have no idea how this could ever be proven true! The reason they're being tried as adults is the nature of the crime. So
    its always going to be life versus out at max age 25. And the goals of the juvenile and adult system are not the same - its
    more rehabilitation for the former versus punitive in the latter.

    (3) Cases in juvenile court are not open - so how could any such trial act as a public deterrent for any crime?

    The above requirements appear to be written to make it highly unlikely that any reverse waiver appeal will succeed.

    Doesn't look like this case will wind up in juvenile court.
     


  2. blefuscu

    blefuscu Bsc (hons) Criminology

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    I'm very uncomfortable with the thought of two 12 year olds being tried as adults, especially as one has obvious mental health issues. It's proven that brain development and cognition isn't complete until as late as 26. So a court is prepared to judge two children who are not even half way mentally developed as adults? What are they going to gain from that. MG needs to be in a secure paediatric psych unit to get treatment for her mental health issues at the very least.
     
  3. Elley Mae

    Elley Mae Well-Known Member

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    Police say Geyser and Weier plotted for months the best way to kill their friend.

    According to authorities, they first plotted to duct-tape her mouth and stab her in the neck.

    Then, they wanted to stab her in a park bathroom, because they said there was a drain on the floor for the blood to go down.

    http://www.tristatehomepage.com/sto...riend-to-be-trie/35861/qAiy3nJn6kWTb2xB4Og9BQ

    I hope they throw the book at them, 60 years minimum, I can not imagine having friends do this to me. Who needs friends. jmo
     
  4. LinasK

    LinasK Verified insider- Mark Dribin case

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    I totally agree with you and the very facts you have stated above is exactly why they should be treated as adults. It was an adult crime!!!
     
  5. angelainwi

    angelainwi Certified Trauma Counselor

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  6. Softail

    Softail Active Member

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  7. blefuscu

    blefuscu Bsc (hons) Criminology

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    How is 60 years in prison going to help an obviously mentally ill child? Surely time in a secure mental health centre is needed? Adults with mental illnesses don't get the correct treatment in jail, how can anyone condemn a child who is mentally ill to that? She needs treatment.
     
  8. blefuscu

    blefuscu Bsc (hons) Criminology

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  9. ICS

    ICS New Member

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    According to the court records (and some newspaper articles now) the attorneys of both defendants are asking for reports to be prepared as though the process was going through juvenile court. These reports are supposed to outline what the defendants would need in terms of education, healthcare and so on. The judge - against the wishes of the defense - agreed. This seems to be an incredibly important tactic from the defendants' POV because the information will be available before the "Reverse Waiver" hearings at which the judge could order that one or both cases be sent to Juvenile Court.

    I hadn't thought about this case too much for a while, but with the release of some of the interrogation videos, I believe the following happened:

    - MG had been starting to behave strangely since 4th Grade, presumably as a result of her now-diagnosed Childhood-Onset Schizophrenia. Until AW arrived on the scene (6th Grade), MG's only friend (by her own admission) was the victim herself.

    - MG's behavior became markedly worse when she fell under the influence of AW, who introduced her to the Slender Man meme. She became "weirder and weirder and scarier and scarier" according to the victim who wanted to discontinue their friendship.

    - There is clear evidence that the victim was already being bullied by the other two: AW admitted to hitting her (then apologizing when MG wasn't around) and I found evidence of online bullying by MG via the victim's social media account (this has since been closed). The victim's mother stated that MG had become more and more controlling.

    - The victim seems to be a very trusting and unsophisticated person (I mean this in a positive way) who would put up with the weird behavior when others clearly would not. She was completely uninterested in the horror stuff, however, and this evidently caused discord between her and MG in which the victim felt she was responsible for reconciliation. I still feel that her rejection of Slender Man (and the effect of that on MG) played a key part in what followed

    It's impossible to say whether MG would or would not have become dangerous due to her encroaching illness had AW not been around. The problem was that AW doesn't seem to have the same moral compass as others. She knows academically what's right and wrong, but I don't think she herself feels it. When asked what she thought about the victim having survived, she replied: "It makes you feel good she's alive", which sounds as though the question was "how are you supposed to feel if someone survives being stabbed?" which is the kind of response one might expect from a psychopath which (again IMO) she may well be.

    AW was at least curious about the notion of being a psychopath as evidenced by several online "psychopath tests" which she took, posting the results on Google+. She claimed she had scored highly on these. Ironically, one of her remarks was "Cuff me officer..."

    Assuming that it was MG that suggested the murder plot due to her psychosis, what happened next was crucial: instead of being appalled by the idea, AW thought it was "surprising but exciting". Her brother claimed she wasn't able to tell fantasy from reality. I wonder if this ALSO meant she was unable to tell pretend horror from real horror on an emotional response basis? In other words, killing the victim would be no worse in reality than in fantasy. I'm not convinced she thinks Slender Man is really real - while there are a few references to him on her Google + comments, there are many more for Ninja Turtles, Transformers and so on.

    The first opportunity that AW had to (literally) stop the madness was when MG told her about her plan. But she didn't. Instead, the two plotted secretly which I can only imagine must have fueled MG's psychosis. I think AW needed MG as a "tool" to do the actual dirty work. She could have stopped the plot on many, many occasions but she didn't. Irrespective of the fact that she's "sorry now" (as she knows she's supposed to be), there has been no suggestion that she is mentally ill, and she is clearly intelligent.

    If I was a betting person (which I'm not), I'd say that MG's case may wind up in juvenile court due to her illness, but AW is going to wind up locked away for a very long time, because she made a rational decision to do wrong when she clearly knows that it was wrong. In her case, I think Slender Man is far more likely to be an excuse now, and earlier a convenient tool to engineer a situation that held fascination for her: killing someone.
     
  10. Madeleine74

    Madeleine74 Knower of Things

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    Plotting doesn't fuel psychosis. Psychosis is the driver.

    I don't think such analysis as above is valid without having met, spoken to, interviewed, and/or seen or read the battery of psychological tests for the 2 offenders, along with being a qualified and trained professional. IMO.
     
  11. blefuscu

    blefuscu Bsc (hons) Criminology

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    What we do know though is that MG is a very sick little girl. Not treating her schizophrenia is tantamount to torture in my book. I've experienced psychosis and it is utterly terrifying as an adult. I can't imagine how a child is coping with it being untreated.
     
  12. angelainwi

    angelainwi Certified Trauma Counselor

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  13. Queen Bee

    Queen Bee Crown Winner by Default ~ Don't Judge :D

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    thank you so much angela.....i was just coming to "bump" this thread for the hearing starting tomorrow.........do we know if this is going to be streamed anywhere? i'm not counting on it but does anyone happen to know of any reporters that might be tweeting updates? tia..........
     
  14. Queen Bee

    Queen Bee Crown Winner by Default ~ Don't Judge :D

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    :bump:

    sorry to quote myself............but wondering? :tyou:
     
  15. Queen Bee

    Queen Bee Crown Winner by Default ~ Don't Judge :D

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    Slender Man case attorneys call charging law unconstitutional

    http://www.jsonline.com/news/crime/...w-unconstitutional-b99505478z1-304916571.html

    Leading into a key hearing in her case Tuesday, one of two Waukesha girls charged in the Slender Man stabbing case has asked a judge to declare the law that required her to be charged as an adult unconstitutional and dismiss the case.

    Attorneys for 13-year-old Anissa Weier filed a motion last week challenging the law as it applies to her, saying it violates the Eighth Amendment's ban on cruel and unusual punishment, and that keeping her from the juvenile court system violates her rights to equal protection and due process.
    [​IMG]
    Judge Michael Bohren
     
  16. Queen Bee

    Queen Bee Crown Winner by Default ~ Don't Judge :D

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    Judge in Slender Man case focuses on length of penalty in juvenile system

    (snip)
    In the juvenile system, the longest time Weier could spend in secure detention is three years, followed by supervision until age 18.

    Prosecutors, who oppose Weier's transfer from adult court, also point out that within a maximum juvenile sentence of five years, decisions of when to release Weier from custody to after care in the community would fall to juvenile corrections officials, not the elected, sentencing judge.

    If convicted as an adult, Weier could be sentenced to up to 65 years, but would reside at Copper Lake School for girls until age 18, the same place she would serve any juvenile incarceration.

    After two days of testimony, Circuit Judge Michael Bohren said he will wait until after a similar hearing for Weier's co-defendant next month before deciding whether their cases should move to the juvenile court.

    (snip)
    Bohren also delayed ruling on Weier's request that the law requiring she be charged as an adult amounts to unconstitutional infliction of cruel and unusual punishment. The Attorney General may file a brief opposing the motion.
    ------------
    much more at link, very in-depth

    http://www.jsonline.com/news/crime/...in-juvenile-system-b99508117z1-305179351.html
     
  17. watergirl62

    watergirl62 .

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    Maybe... Bohren will decide to try AW as an adult and MG as a juvenile but wants to wait until he has heard from both girls' defense teams to weigh the individual cases against each other first. I can certainly understand the logic for waiting if he is potentially pondering such a decision.

    :HHJP:
     
  18. Queen Bee

    Queen Bee Crown Winner by Default ~ Don't Judge :D

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    Lawyers for Anissa Weier, charged in “Slenderman” stabbing, win small victory in court

    http://fox6now.com/2015/06/10/lawye...enderman-stabbing-win-small-victory-in-court/
     
  19. Queen Bee

    Queen Bee Crown Winner by Default ~ Don't Judge :D

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    Family history of schizophrenia revealed in Slender Man case

    Waukesha — The early-onset schizophrenia diagnosed in Morgan Geyser, one of the 13-year-old Waukesha girls charged in the stabbing of a classmate last year, may have a genetic basis.

    At a hearing Wednesday on her attorney's request to have the case moved to juvenile court, an expert witness revealed that Geyser's father had suffered from a similar mental illness as an adolescent and was hospitalized at least four times when he was 14 or 15.

    (snip)
    Geyser and Anissa Weier, also 13, are charged as adults with attempted first-degree homicide of their sixth-grade classmate in May 2014. The victim, Payton Leutner, survived 19 stab wounds and was found near a park by a passing bicyclist after she'd been left for dead. Both defendants are seeking to have their cases transferred to juvenile court.

    Moving the case to juvenile court would mean the girls would spend no more than three more years in custody and would get more intense supervision and services when released back to the community. As adults, they could be sentenced to up to 45 years in prison.

    Collins, who has interviewed Morgan Geyser several times, including last week, said the girl continues to believe in fantasy characters and opposes medication for her condition because she fears it would lead to the loss of her "friends." Geyser reports interacting with various Harry Potter characters and a girl named Maggie with whom she claims to have interactions, Collins said.

    more at link http://www.jsonline.com/news/crime/...ase-to-begin-today-b99520903z1-307851871.html
     
  20. blefuscu

    blefuscu Bsc (hons) Criminology

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    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...maginary-character-asked-her-to-10333993.html

    My heart goes out to Morgan. I know her actions were horrendous. But she's obviously a very mentally ill young girl. I don't believe that someone with that level of psychosis can be held responsible for their actions. If she were faking she would have been found out within a couple of weeks of psychiatric observation. This child is ill.
     
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