WI WI - Evelyn Hartley, 15, La Crosse, 24 Oct 1953

Marilynilpa said:
I think that Evelyn was subdued inside the house after a struggle, possibly at knifepoint. Since there was little if any blood inside the house, I don't believe she was seriously injured at first. Once she was outside, Evelyn began screaming and was silenced by the kidnapper(s) - I think a knife was the weapon, and Evelyn was either stabbed or badly cut, accounting for the blood found outside the home. As for the blood on the neighbor's house, I don't really have a good explanation for that.

Interesting scenerios everyone.

About the blood on the neighbor house/garage, one of my guesses is as she was staggering she brushed up against the buildings. Or as they were carrying/and or supporting her, she fell against the buildings momentarily. Also maybe as they were rushing away and carrying her they knocked her against the buildings, causing more injury. Then again the maybe the blood was from her previous wounds and got on the buildings as her hand dragged past while being carried. Some accounts say it was a splash of blood, while others describe it as more of a line of blood and looked like some one's bloody hand dragged across it.

The police must have crime scene pictures of this. They would be interesting to see.
 
joellegirl said:
Interesting scenerios everyone.

About the blood on the neighbor house/garage, one of my guesses is as she was staggering she brushed up against the buildings. Or as they were carrying/and or supporting her, she fell against the buildings momentarily. Also maybe as they were rushing away and carrying her they knocked her against the buildings, causing more injury. Then again the maybe the blood was from her previous wounds and got on the buildings as her hand dragged past while being carried. Some accounts say it was a splash of blood, while others describe it as more of a line of blood and looked like some one's bloody hand dragged across it.

The police must have crime scene pictures of this. They would be interesting to see.
In the book you have, are there any pictures that show you how close together the houses are? I'm trying to picture the scenarious you listed, and they make sense if the houses were fairly close together. I can see her staggering in an effort to get away, or brushed up against the house as she was carried past it, if the houses aren't too far apart.

Have you made any attempt to get reports or other information from the police department about this case? Also, the author of the Evelyn Hartley book obviously had access to some police documents - do you know how she can be contacted to see if she would share that information with us?
 
Marilynilpa said:
In the book you have, are there any pictures that show you how close together the houses are? I'm trying to picture the scenarious you listed, and they make sense if the houses were fairly close together. I can see her staggering in an effort to get away, or brushed up against the house as she was carried past it, if the houses aren't too far apart.

Have you made any attempt to get reports or other information from the police department about this case? Also, the author of the Evelyn Hartley book obviously had access to some police documents - do you know how she can be contacted to see if she would share that information with us?

Yes, from pictures of that time (in the book)and seeing the neighborhood myself recently the houses are very close together. Picture your typical 1950's subdivision with mostly ranch homes. It appears Evelyn was dragged through backyards adjacent and behind the Rasmusen home. Then past the detached garage of one home then into it's backyard then past the side into front and to the street.It was kind of a diagonal-kiddy corner type path. All the houses kind of made a rectangle, with houses on one street, then up the side on another street, then directly behind each other and around again. I hope that makes sense! The Rasmusen home is on a corner, with houses to the side and behind at that time. There wasn't a house on the side of the open basment window, it was an empty lot at the time. Today all the lots are filled.

I've haven't called police as I don't feel I have any new info that they haven't heard already. They say they get lots of calls. I live too far away to just stop in. Though on our next trip up there maybe I can stop by and ask some questions. Not sure if they will even talk to me or show me anything as I am not writing a book or anything, and am just another average citizen interested in the case.
 
joellegirl said:
Yes, from pictures of that time (in the book)and seeing the neighborhood myself recently the houses are very close together. Picture your typical 1950's subdivision with mostly ranch homes. It appears Evelyn was dragged through backyards adjacent and behind the Rasmusen home. Then past the detached garage of one home then into it's backyard then past the side into front and to the street.It was kind of a diagonal-kiddy corner type path. All the houses kind of made a rectangle, with houses on one street, then up the side on another street, then directly behind each other and around again. I hope that makes sense! The Rasmusen home is on a corner, with houses to the side and behind at that time. There wasn't a house on the side of the open basment window, it was an empty lot at the time. Today all the lots are filled.

I've haven't called police as I don't feel I have any new info that they haven't heard already. They say they get lots of calls. I live too far away to just stop in. Though on our next trip up there maybe I can stop by and ask some questions. Not sure if they will even talk to me or show me anything as I am not writing a book or anything, and am just another average citizen interested in the case.
Thanks for answering my question about the houses. I figured they were pretty close together, most houses built in the 50's were. So it makes sense that the blood could have come from Evelyn either staggering over to the house, or brushing up against it as she was carried past. Or it could even have come off of one of the kidnappers, who had her blood on him.

I've found that sometimes writing a police department works wonders in opening doors. There is one very cold case I am interested in, and I did some research and located the name of someone in the records department. I wrote her a letter, and she responded by telephone to me within a couple of days. Unfortunately she had nothing for me as all file materials relating to the case had long been destroyed, but in the case of Evelyn, I'm sure the file materials are still around.
 
Found something in the archives that I found interesting...

On October 30th of 1956, 16-year old Judy Rodencal of Auroraville, WI, disappeared after leaving home to catch the school bus. She never boarded the bus.
Local law enforcement began a large-scale search of the area. Bloodhounds, brought in from La Crosse, traced her scent to a nearby creek. Judy's socks and handkerchief had been found on a bridge about a mile from her home.

On the evening of November 1st, Edgar Timm, a local farmer, found Judy unconscious on his doorstep. An investigation revealed that Judy had apparently been staying in a barn on the farm. She was fuly clothed, though barefoot. She could relate no details of what had happened to her. She was taken to a local hospital, where she was treated for shock and exposure. Other than scratches to her legs, there appeared to be no signs of injury or violence.

Judy bears a resemblance to Evelyn. Both are of similiar height and weight, with brown hair and blue eyes, even the hairstyles in the articles reporting their disappearances are similar...

With no further evidence, and Judy unable to reveal any details of what had happened to her, the sheriff closed the case on her mysterious disappearance.
 
That is interesting, thanks for sharing it. I wonder how close that little town is to La Crosse. Is it in Newspaper Archives? I wish I still has my subscription so I could see her picture.

As for Evelyn, I keep hoping we will hear more about the Clyde "Tywee" Peterson tape recorded confession and what supposedly took place in LaFarge, WI. LE said this was their best lead but I haven't heard anything since.

Here is a good article about this(I've posted this before earlier in this thread)..

http:www.jg-tc.com/articles/2004/05/24/news/news09.txt
 
Did the investigation consider the possibility that Evelyn might have been taken across the Mississippi River into Minnesota? Over the years, I recall stories about a body being found on one farm or another, but the ones that I recall from way back are not in the Doenetwork or NCMEC files.

Was the FBI involved in the investigation at any point? I would think that it being a possible/likely kidnapping and the proximity of LaCrosse to the state line (Mississippi River), the FBI certainly could have stepped in.
 
Evelyn's disappearance was huge news nationwide at the time. The FBI and every state and local agency seemingly were involved. Any girl who bore a resemblance to Evelyn was checked out.
 
Richard said:
Did the investigation consider the possibility that Evelyn might have been taken across the Mississippi River into Minnesota? Over the years, I recall stories about a body being found on one farm or another, but the ones that I recall from way back are not in the Doenetwork or NCMEC files.

Was the FBI involved in the investigation at any point? I would think that it being a possible/likely kidnapping and the proximity of LaCrosse to the state line (Mississippi River), the FBI certainly could have stepped in.

According to the book "Where's Evelyn?" by Susan Hessel, Evelyn's family and residents of La Crosse wanted the FBI to get involved but the FBI refused, saying to local law enforcement they couldn't unless there was definite proof that a state line had been crossed and only up to seven days after the crime. A headline in the LaCrosse Tribune read "FBI REFUSES TO TAKE PART IN HARTLEY ABDUCTION CASE"

This, of course distressed everyone, especially Evelyn's family and they tried to organize to get the law to change but it appears they were not successful. From what I read the FBI said they just didn't have proof Evelyn had been taken out of state and they hoped local authorites would have success in solving the case. It says the FBI were monitoring the case but I'm not sure for how long, and it appears they never did get involved in the past 52 years.

This is too bad because it is possible Evelyn may been taken into Minnesota, or even Iowa which isn't very far from La Crosse either. It is true that Evelyn's story went nationwide and there were several sightings of girls who looked like her but nothing ever came of those stories.

Just a year or so ago there were remains of two females found under the basement of a home in Hokah, Minnesota, which is just across the Mississippi River from La Crosse. Of course law enforcement and many residents thought of Evelyn, and also of a woman who went missing in Hokah in the 1920's. It turned out, I believe, the bones were much older than 50 plus years and believed to be Native American.
 
I recall back about 1975 in Hawaii, there was a guy who was believed to be involved in a lot of burglaries and thefts. He was a Navy man, but was living in a house off base with some friends. The Naval Investigative Service did not have jurisdiction to request a Search Warrant of his place, but the NIS agent (like anybody else could have done) did notice a motorcycle parked in the guy's yard - a cycle that the guy had been seen riding.

Checking the Vehicle Identification Number, the NIS agent learned that the bike had been stolen from someplace on the Island. The fact that the motorcycle had been stolen more than 24 hours before gave the FBI cause to get involved simply because there was an assumption that the bike COULD have been driven across a state line within 24 hours. This was, of course nonsense because even if you could drive the motorcycle across the ocean to cross another state line, it would take more than 24 hours!

But this 24 hour rule had become a standardized way of doing business, and because the law was to be applied equally in all states, the FBI entered the investigation (at the request of NIS) and they requested a search warrant. The house was searched and all kinds of stolen items were found. The guy was placed in the brig and charges were referred to trial by court martial.

It would seem to me that the FBI can and does apply the law in whatever way they see fit. In one case, they can pursue a search warrant based on a technicality which allows them to do it, based on the convoluted presumption that the motorcycle might have crossed a state line. Yet in a more serious case involving a missing girl, they won't get involved unless local cops get them absolute proof that she WAS IN FACT taken across a state line.
 
Bumping this interesting case up. I drove through LaCrosse twice this past week. Although I did not have time to check out the area, I did think about Evelyn's disappearance.
 
Richard said:
Bumping this interesting case up. I drove through LaCrosse twice this past week. Although I did not have time to check out the area, I did think about Evelyn's disappearance.

Thanks for bumping Richard. There hasn't been any news at all, which is frustrating. There was all the talk in 2004 of the discovery of the tape recording done in a bar in 1968 in La Farge Wi where this man is practically saying he and some other men murdered her and where she was buried. It was all being investigated but nothing more has been said. Not sure if they are keeping things quiet for now or it just hasn't been pursued any further.

Evelyn was mentioned again in the papers last summer when the class she would have graduated with were in La Crosse to celebrate their 50th class reunion, and the book "Where's Evelyn" by Susan Hessel was pubished.

The author of the book "Where's Evelyn?" did a presentation at the La Crosse Library this past May where she discussed the book and the case. She said it was a great turnout, every seat filled. The interest in what happened to Evelyn is still strong in La Crosse.

We will be in La Crosse in a few weeks and I'm sure I'll drive by the house again. The street is so peaceful, hard to believe what happened there 53 years ago.
 
I am joining this thread a little late in the game but here are a few things I was thinking over whilst reading everyone's posts. I dont know how to do multiple quotes on here so here is the best I could come up with as a substitute:


Marilynilpa post #43
7. The kidnapper's tennis shoes were eventually found tossed beside a highway. They were size 12 1/2, and identified as having been worn inside the house where Evelyn was babysitting. A bloodstained denim jacket was also found, along with bloodstained panties and bra, all Type A blood - same as Evelyn's.


Concerning type A blood, there are two type A's an A+ and an A-. A+ are more frequent with an appearance rate of 34.3% of the population or 4 out of 5 people. A- on the other hand is more rare with a frequency of 5.7% or 1 out of 8. Finding clothing with blood on it that was type A doesn’t necessarily mean it was her clothing as type A is the second most popular blood type (following O+).

Richard post #80

The amount of blood sounds like a severe head cut, or possibly a cut artery. Blood which is 4 feet high on a building did not get there by gravity, it was likely pumped out at an angle. A head injury tends to bleed straight downward, soaking hair, eyes, and clothing.

I agree with this statement, however, head wounds tend to bleed profusely. If she had any violent head movement, blood could have been projected sideways or above the wound itself. The only reason I say that she was not wounded by a severed/nicked artery is that bleeding out occurs fairly rapidly through the damaged artery and thus renders the victim incapacitated quickly. The witness (although there has been some debate as to the validity of the statement) claims to have seen two men supporting a girl between them who had the appearance of being intoxicated. This means that she was at least had limited mobility. This wording leads me to believe that she had a very bad head wound more so than a nicked artery as a result of stab wounds.

As for the window, I was thinking of how I would approach such a situation. If I found the only entrance being a basement window I would attempt to enter it. My hubby is 6'4 and wears a size 12 shoe. He is very lean and though he would have to squeeze he could probably worm himself though a 14" window. If there were more than one person involved #1 would go through the window and then look around to find an item (ladder) to help #2 into the window. If the intent was abduction and not burglary I would not go back through the window but used an easier exit such as the self locking door.

Of course Im not a criminal and Im only attempting to conduct a what if in my head. I dont have a criminal mindset which of course is what hinders most of us (hopefully ;) ).
 
1. The shoes. The shoes are referred to here in this thread as being size 12 & 1/2. Inthe chapter on Evelyn's kidnapping in "Getting Away with Murder" they are described as being size 11. This would be more in line with someone able to get through the narrow basement window. Is there some comfirmation of which size is correct out there somewhere?
1a. The mark on the bottom of the shoes is described as circular. I have seen bicycle pedals with curved front and rear sections which would leave a circular indention. It also occurs to me that perhaps they meant 'cylindrical' . If you look at the Whizzer in the following link, you'll see that it has fixed footpegs, not pedals, that would leave a cylindrical impression in a shoe. There's also a circular piece between the engine and the rear wheel that may be an auxiliary footrest.
http://www.geocities.com/whizzer_17044/images/600eng.jpg

2. The jacket. Again, in "Getting Away with Murder", the jacket is described as a 'farm jumper' having had the tail cut off and sewn up with white thread. The jacket originally would come down past the hips of the wearer. If Josephson's deduction of it having belonged to a steeplejack is correct, then he could possibly have sat on the tail, causing it to wear out sooner than the rest of the jacket. This makes me think that perhaps the jacket had been discarded, or given away by the original owner.

3. Ed Gein. When police searched the farm of Ed Gein, among the body parts they found were two vulvas that had come from teenage girls. According to Judge Gollmar's book on Gein, there were no girls of that age buried in the graveyard(s) during the relevant time period Ed robbed graves. Ed may well have murdered two teenage girls, which would put Evelyn into his victim type group.
Judge Gollmar also says that Ed's victim, Mary Hogan, was carried to Ed's car after he killed her, not dragged. Given that Hogan was a large woman (some accounts say she was 200 lbs.) It is highly unlikely that Ed carried her by himself. Gollmar says Ed did have a friend named Gus, that went insane shortly after Hogan's murder. If correct, this would show that Ed had someone he could trust to help him carry out his criminal activities and that he could have had help in kidnapping Evelyn, if indeed, he did it.
Against this, Gollmar's book is not without errors. He gets missing girl, Georgia Jean Weckler's name wrong. He calls her Mary Jane Weckler and implies that she was 15, not 8. He also decribes the car that might have been used to abduct her as white, not dark or black. Gein did own a white Ford that no one had seen him drive, but if it's the wrong color, it may be irrelevant. However, Gein did have a dark colored Ford Which I've found described as both maroon and black, which would fit the description of a dark car. Still, the vulvas found at his house would be from too old a person to have been Georgia's.

Could one of the people that have bought "Where's Evelyn" tell me the price?

Anyway, some things to think about.
 
The cost of the "Where's Evelyn" book is around $22.00 I believe, and can only be bought from the author and her email is shessel3248@charter.net. I believe the book can also be bought locally around LaCrosse.

There are pictures of the shoes in the book. On the bottom there are circular and triangular indentions, matching perfectly the footprint in the mud around the Rasmussen home.

I was just going to post about Evelyn as the 53rd anniversary of her disappearance is coming up on October 24. I wonder if it will make the local papers. Seems LaCrosse police are too busy with binge drinking college students falling to their demise in the Mississippi River to spend any time on Evelyn's case. I do know it is still an open case with them and they do look into leads, but it has just been so quiet. I wish a break in the case would happen.
 
joellegirl said:
The cost of the "Where's Evelyn" book is around $22.00 I believe, and can only be bought from the author and her email is shessel3248@charter.net. I believe the book can also be bought locally around LaCrosse.
Maybe as a Christmas present to myself, if no more unexpected expenditures come up. Yeah, right. (sigh)
 
joellegirl said:
The cost of the "Where's Evelyn" book is around $22.00 I believe, and can only be bought from the author and her email is shessel3248@charter.net. I believe the book can also be bought locally around LaCrosse.

There are pictures of the shoes in the book. On the bottom there are circular and triangular indentions, matching perfectly the footprint in the mud around the Rasmussen home.

I was just going to post about Evelyn as the 53rd anniversary of her disappearance is coming up on October 24. I wonder if it will make the local papers. Seems LaCrosse police are too busy with binge drinking college students falling to their demise in the Mississippi River to spend any time on Evelyn's case. I do know it is still an open case with them and they do look into leads, but it has just been so quiet. I wish a break in the case would happen.
Joellegirl
Was there anything in the local media for the anniversary? I'm guessing nothing new; I was hoping for some update about that tape.
 
reportertype said:
Joellegirl
Was there anything in the local media for the anniversary? I'm guessing nothing new; I was hoping for some update about that tape.

Hi Reportertype.
No, nothing at all was mentioned on the anniversary . I was hoping there would be something in the paper. I have been wondering why there has been no updates on that tape, which was discovered almost three years ago now. From what I have read, the tape mentions the house she was supposedly taken to and the area she was buried . I sure hope they looked into this. I know LE is busy but this is one of, if not the biggest and well known Wisconsin mysteries and many people still want to know "Where is Evelyn?????" LE says it is still an open case and they do follow leads, so I hope they really did look into this. Just wish we could get an update. Even if it is a little tidbit. Just something....

Thanks for posting Reportertype!
 
For anyone who is still interested in this case (I am and always will be, just wish there would be some break in the case, it is so quiet lately), but I saw on ebay someone is selling "Where's Evelyn" and in the listing is some pics from the book, including one of the livingroom where one can see Evelyn's glasses and shoe and blood stains(or dirt). For those of you who did not buy the book you might be interested in some of the pictures. I read my book from time to time and wish I could think of some new angle that could maybe just maybe help solve this cold case.

I had trouble linking the auction so just go to ebay and in the search box put 280115356310 and the listing should come up. Scroll down for pics of the book. Not sure how long the listing will be up.
 
For anyone who is still interested in this case (I am and always will be, just wish there would be some break in the case, it is so quiet lately), but I saw on ebay someone is selling "Where's Evelyn" and in the listing is some pics from the book, including one of the livingroom where one can see Evelyn's glasses and shoe and blood stains(or dirt). For those of you who did not buy the book you might be interested in some of the pictures. I read my book from time to time and wish I could think of some new angle that could maybe just maybe help solve this cold case.

I had trouble linking the auction so just go to ebay and in the search box put 280115356310 and the listing should come up. Scroll down for pics of the book. Not sure how long the listing will be up.

I want to buy this book but unfortunately can't afford it right now. The listing on eBay is in a store and those usually stay on for 30 days at a time. If it isn't sold in that time period, some people will have it automatically renewed to run for another 30 days. I'm hoping to be able to purchase the book sometime next month. Thanks for putting the link on here so I can watch it on eBay. If it sells on there before I can buy it, I will e-mail Susan Hessel for a copy. I'm very much interested in this case and have been for a long time so I will definitely buy the book when I can.
 

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