AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #19

[Wrenny]

(Random thoughts: Perhaps JS saw both cars in the driveway, and thus assumed they were home. Or saw lights on. There could be a variety of reasons how she knew they were home, to think they were not answering.

Another very plausible reason is that Jayme was home alone after school, and told (as many children are) to never EVER answer the door if her parents aren't home.

 

[Nerissa]

LE is well aware of statistics such as another poster shared....once a child is taken, they are almost always dead within 24 hours...
which makes me wonder that the tactic used at the press conference wasn't based on evidence that Jayme was alive, captive, whether voluntary or not.....
but more that, at that stage, if she was/is alive - essentially that's just about the only option: someone who for whatever motive has not and presumably does not have an intention on killing her...

So, they make that type of appeal, both to the perp on who Jayme is, her 'real' life he stole and to Jayme, that she can come home (I can only imagine the brainwashing she may be exposed to)....

I'd really like to think they have evidence of this type of situation: she's alive, but captive....sadly I think it's more the exploration of that possibility - more of 'it can't hurt' scenario...and maybe it is the truth...sadly, though still no breaks in the case

Like to think LE isn't grasping at straws like I am
(which isn't to say I don't know and appreciate how hard they are all working...I've no doubt this is all much harder on them...)

 

[MsBetsy]

RRinCO, my gut reaction is the same as yours. I, too, see this as a real possibility.
The sheriff went a lot further than saying he thought she was alive, he stated that he had a "100% expectation that she is alive." That statement is utterly baffling, given the facts of the case that have been released to the public. He is absolutely confident she is alive? Not even 98% or 99%, which is pretty darn certain, but 100%? IMO, LE definitely knows a whole lot more than they've shared with the public.

No, LE is not certain she is alive. That statement was made over two weeks ago and was an answer to two questions, in regard to the manner in which the investigation would be conducted. They have made no statement indicating that they think she is alive since, rather that they will continue the search for her in the hope that she will be found alive. They would never say, "We will continue to search for her, although statistically there is about a one percent chance that she has not been killed." Jmo

 

[pinkfly]

https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/digitization/201253ncjrs.pdf

When Abducted Child Was Killed <1 Hour 44%
Within 3 Hours 74%
Within 24 Hours 91%
Within 7 Days 99%
Within 30 Days 100%

(Those statistics are just devastating.)

Wow!! Very devastating and very depressing!

 

[Wrenny]

BBM. The ERT was mentioned in the dispatch log. I think we can assume that this bearcat equipped with thermal cameras was probably dispatched to the scene and put to use.

The 2017 Barron County Sheriff's Dept annual report says their vehicle inventory is

27 squads, Armored Vehicle, Drug Unit Van, Swat Bus, Mobile Command Center, Emergency Management Vehicle, School/Spare Car, motorcycle, 2 snowmobiles, 2 UTV and 2 Boats​

The ERT team consists of :

1 Commander, 13 Entry, 4 Snipers, 2 Negotiators, and 4 Tactical Medics. Members of the team are 14 Sheriff’s Department personnel, along with 1 from Rice Lake Police Department Officer, 5 from Rusk County Sheriff’s Department and 4 tactical medics from Lakeview Medical Center.​

It doesn't mention if they have dash cams.
http://barronsheriff.org/2017-annual-report/

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Wow!! Very devastating and very depressing!

Bear in mind, though, that these statistics were taken from cases in which the child was killed. It's a time frame for known child abduction/homicide cases specifically. But yeah, it paints a grim picture.

 

[Wrenny]

1) How did LE determine the crime scene to be 14 miles long and to end at a specific location, i.e., Turtle Lake?

Related facts: Highways cross US 8 at Barron (Wis 25) and Turtle Lake (US 63). In between are only county roads (in Wisconsin these are designated by 1-3 letters) or township roads. So Barron and Turtle Lake are the places where someone is most apt to turn off of 8. St Croix Casino (mentioned in the dispatcch log) is in Turtle Lake.
Speculation: Maybe it was related to what vehicles they saw on cams along the route but did, or did not see, on the casino's cam?

2) Do we know whether or not either parent had registered firearms which were not found in the home when it was searched?

Wisconsin does not require registration of firearms.

 

[Jabarn]

This, to me, is one of the oddest things to come from LE. Not so much the concept of asking for tips from OTHERS about people who might be involved with the family, but asking for people who had direct involvement to report that ? Is everyone who spent time with the Closs family, or had an argument with them supposed to call and report that ? Really? To me, it's kind of akin to saying, " Anyone who murdered 2 people and killed their daughter, could you please give us a call ? ".

I just do not get this at all. Maybe it's just me.

It is sort of odd statement for LE to make.

I would think anyone who knew of a prior conflict would have already come forward to help find Jayme and a press conference would not compel them to do so, but who knows?

On the other hand, it may also point to a theory by the investigative team that the crime was related to a conflict with one or more of the family members and an outside party.

 

[lonetraveler]

I don't think the cops have said except that the mom tried to barricade herself in the bathroom. But once the perp shot Mr. Closs, all hell would have broken loose in that both Jayme and Mrs. Closs would have been alerted. At that point the perp had to quickly eliminate the mom by forcing the bathroom door, killing her, hanging up her phone, and then getting away with Jayme within 7 minutes. Is he could force the front door, he could easily force the bathroom door.

Didn't say he couldn't force the door open, I was asking if anyone had seen anything regarding how he got into the bathroom if she was barricaded inside.

 

[Cardinal47]

Good thoughts. But what I found in googling is they're stolen right and left, and they're popular for criminals because they're FAST! Google Dodge Challenger in the news and you can find a story about one doing 198 mph on the freeway in North Carolina.

Aren't those cars really loud? Just does not seem the type of car one would take to a secluded home in the middle nowhere at midnight. Way too loud, red and identifiable.

I think those cars were around that area for another reason.

 

[Wrenny]

I just noticed this comment.
It has changed my line of thinking!

“It was all about Jayme, everything,” said Ruffin. “[Denise’s] world revolved around Jayme. When she was younger she had her in beauty pageants, ‘please vote on my daughter’s pictures’, you know, so that she wins the contest. She was all about Jayme.”
Funeral held for James and Denise Closs in Cameron

This isn't a pageant like you're thinking of. Just a cutest baby contest, they're run by local media. They're just a way to get people to visit their website or facebook page. Tell all your friends to vote daily. Here's an example:
Cutest Baby Contest - enter now!

 

[RavenDoc]

At this point, I am starting to think of Abby/Libby, only because so many people thought that the perp must be a local, that someone must know something, etc...being such a small town and unspeakable, shocking event. Yet we are going on two years in that case, even with a video of the perp, which is almost unprecedented, imo.

The difference I see is that I doubt this was a random crime in the way this prior one was (imo.) The chances should be much greater in finding the perp(s) and it is still under a month since the murders. I am not convinced that anyone else knows, especially if there was just one perp, but still feel hopeful it can be solved. Just not sure LE has any real leads as yet...

That’s been bothering me from the very beginning. JC has an absolute innocence about her. So sad.

 

[RavenDoc]

Aren't those cars really loud? Just does not seem the type of car one would take to a secluded home in the middle nowhere at midnight. Way too loud, red and identifiable.

I think those cars were around that area for another reason.

They are not loud at all unless modified.

 

[Wrenny]

I haven’t heard that they actually had the moms phone just that the call was made from the phone registered to her.

LE has mom's phone.

 

[DocBrew]

RRinCO, my gut reaction is the same as yours. I, too, see this as a real possibility.
The sheriff went a lot further than saying he thought she was alive, he stated that he had a "100% expectation that she is alive." That statement is utterly baffling, given the facts of the case that have been released to the public. He is absolutely confident she is alive? Not even 98% or 99%, which is pretty darn certain, but 100%? IMO, LE definitely knows a whole lot more than they've shared with the public.

I have a 100% expectation of the afterlife even though I am 0% certain of it.

JMO.

 

[Cardinal47]

They are not loud at all unless modified.

Every single one I have observed since the botlo has been very loud. So either they come loud or are all modified in some way!
This from the website q&a;
'Honestly, I didn't realize my car was that loud until I took some mis-delivererd mail to my neighbor, he said man I haven't seen you in a while, but I here ya when you leave and my windows rattle.'

 

[GordianKnot]

I have a 100% expectation of the afterlife even though I am 0% certain of it.

JMO.

Indeed! Point well taken, DocB!

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

Just guessing here but I don't think those cars were caught on video at the casino. The casino has excellent cameras and the front part of the casino is very close to Hwy 8. If a car went by there I am sure they could be a little more exact on the description just to to the high quality of the casino cameras coupled with there is lighting around there. I suspect both cars were caught on a security camera most likely from a private residence. I'm guessing they have video that isn't that clear and can't differentiate the difference between the Edge and the MDX as it filmed the side profile and it isn't that clear and those 2 models look quite similar when viewing from the side. Remember most houses are not that close to the road and most security cameras will struggle to get a clear image after about 100' at night and that is if you have very good cameras. They only use IR to light up the area being filmed and it just doesn't reach that far. I have to believe there would be easier evidence to process but I think finding the cars will be beneficial as it would appear after all this time any innocent person driving one of these 3 vehicles would have came forward to claim their innocence. So if they haven't come forward yet with a valid reason as to why they were there it is possibly for a good reason. This would seem to be a monumental task as they have 7 years of MDXs, 5 years of Edges, and 7 years of read/orange challengers. Looking up all those vehicles say in WI/MN/MI is one thing but nationwide that would seem to be a lot of vehicles to screen. But again, just due to the fact they are still looking for them tells me whoever was driving those vehicles at that time/date have not come forward with an alibi so that in itself might say something. MOO

I think we also need to remember the sheriff did not name these vehicles as suspect. They are per the sheriff "ONLY vehicles of interest". That's not to minimize their importance at all. I hope any sighting is called in and LE can determine how to proceed with the info. But we need to be careful that in our desperation for information, it doesn't cause us to interpret information as anything other then LE states. JMO
Barron County Sheriff's Department
ETA source

 

[Randazzo]

This, to me, is one of the oddest things to come from LE. ... Is everyone who spent time with the Closs family, or had an argument with them supposed to call and report that ? Really? To me, it's kind of akin to saying, " Anyone who murdered 2 people and killed their daughter, could you please give us a call ? ".

It is baffling, unless LE has reason to think this was done out of a grudge which it sure looks like to me.

Something else I haven't seen mentioned (though it probably was and I just missed it) was whether any of the Closs family traveled and had a misunderstanding or altercation with someone out of the area.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

Sorry if already posted. Winter weather advisory in Barron. Call me a fool for being positive but if someone is holding Jayme in an outdoor, underground place a serious change in weather could cause a move.
"WINTER WEATHER ADVISORY
The NWS has issued a Winter Weather Advisory for Barron County. This Advisory runs from now until 4:00 PM with predictions of 2” to 4” of snow expected, and 3” to 5” inches east of Rice Lake.
Even though it’s been warm lately, please slow your driving speed and allow a little extra time to safely reach your destination.
Mike Judy, Emergency Services
Barron County Sheriff’s Department"
Barron County Sheriff's Department