Nancy Guthrie, 84, (mother of TODAY Show host Savannah Guthrie) missing - last seen in the Catalina foothills area on Jan 31, 2026

cherryleaf · Mar 5, 2026

StarryStarryNight said:
I agree. Whoever did this is either dead or moved on.
They tried their big plan for a big payday and it failed epically on that level. Probably because 84 year old NG died in the process.
But they didn’t get caught.
When a million dollars doesn’t inspire somebody, it’s over.

It’s not over, they’re working everyday and narrowing it down and closing in and it’s coming. One way or another it’s coming. And it’s gonna hit hard and fast. They’re gonna find who did this and bring Nancy home. I have faith in the investigation, investigators, and the fbi, all of them doing all the ground work. Which , btw thank you LE and FBI for not giving up!
The perp is nothing but a coward. Hiding and lying like the coward they are. I’ll never give them credit for anything.

Sakura2Sophia4Lucia · Mar 5, 2026

factseeking said:
I really liked how detailed Clemente was about others recognizing the perp. I'd never really thought about how pre-abduction people might have noticed certain things like the perp saying his luck was about to change or his behavior being more tense. He really emphasized how high the perps stress level would have been pre, during and post event. He was adamant that someone who knows this person knows something.

I know its important for LE not to release info too soon but if they really don't have any suspect or poi I think they should help the public understand what kinds of things they might have noticed about people around them. I'm pretty well versed in human behavior but had not stopped to think about what kind of behaviors might have been noticed pre and post event.

Clemente was thought provoking for me at least.

Same. Thought-provoking and helpful

cherryleaf · Mar 5, 2026

SMK777 · Mar 5, 2026

Sakura2Sophia4Lucia said:
Yes, I think because we don't think an evil, violent person is in our circle of neighbors, friends, family etc. We think it's good for anybody else to pay attention but if someboy in my circle looked different and was acting differently, I'd generally think it was related to stress with job, marriage, children, health issue, the list goes on. JMO

Exactly.

And also, as I think was the case with Richard Allen, the killer goes out of his way to maintain a sense of daily normalcy so no one will notice him.

[Think of killers Paul and Karla Bernardo hosting a Father's Day dinner with her parents in their own home after abducting and killing a 14 year old girl, and chatting and having cake and coffee with her body beneath them in the basement.]

Cassie P · Mar 5, 2026

StarryStarryNight said:
Just my thoughts, but I don’t think he’s dead and I certainly don’t think he killed himself. He’s a coward. It doesn’t take the bravest little man in the world to kidnap an 84 year old woman.
He has melted back into the woodwork.

I agree, I didn't mention suicide for a reason. Narcissists and psychopaths don't usually commit suicide. They might however if they feel cornered or trapped.

Yes a man who will take an elderly frail woman is a coward.

I agree, he is most likely alive, going back to his usual routine.
It is a long shot to check death reports.

I do think however if there are two perps, the thought of life in prison or the death penalty might make one of them take care of any possible leaks.

Cassie P · Mar 5, 2026

GrannySheri said:
Was the signal sniffer helicopter in the air before the FBI agents started canvassing? I'm just wondering if the 2 are related.. assuming a signal in the air would have to be then located on the ground?!

JMO

Maybe in case someone bolts for the back door. Only half joking.

Cassie P · Mar 5, 2026

wibbleflea said:
Some way down the first page of this thread, there’s a good discussion of ideas around this. Discussed up thread in detail, too.

If it’s a thin mesh mask, it’s possible that even the teeth in the video footage are part of it and cover the real mouth. Moustache could be real, showing through the mesh. The bite light would be shining through the mesh.

I don’t know how the mesh mask would look under infrared, but in the video, there’s something off about the mouth and the placement of the flashlight. All discussed at the link. Worth a look.

Thank you Wibble, there is so much information here sometimes I miss pieces of information. I knew people were talking about fake mustaches, etc but I didn't realize how sophisticated some of these masks are today. Even the teeth are part of the mask.

If the light is behind the mesh mask, isn't it a choking hazard and risky to use this way?

you betcha · Mar 5, 2026

Sigh. I wish that creep's stupid crotch gun had shot It off.

Where are you, Nancy?

Katrinepa · Mar 5, 2026

FaviousM said:
I think it'll be 'someone nobody expected' in the sense that it wont be anyone we currently know of connected with this case.

But once they're arrested, I don't expect there'll anything too surprising about the type of person who committed the crime, they'll undoubtedly have the same traits we see again and again in criminals

I'm sure the perp will look very obvious to us in hindsight, but hindsight is 20/20

A couple ex FBI LE have said they think it won't be shocking, and that it probably won't be someone 'new' in the case. Not sure what that means. MOO

Data Sleuth · Mar 5, 2026

GrannySheri said:
Was the signal sniffer helicopter in the air before the FBI agents started canvassing? I'm just wondering if the 2 are related.. assuming a signal in the air would have to be then located on the ground?!

JMO

I don’t believe that we know with certainty that the helicopter has the pace maker sniffer equipment on board. If you have specific info could you please attach a link?
They may just be looking at various locations for any number of reasons.

Sadi · Mar 5, 2026

Cassie P said:
Thank you Wibble, there is so much information here sometimes I miss pieces of information. I knew people were talking about fake mustaches, etc but I didn't realize how sophisticated some of these masks are today. Even the teeth are part of the mask.

If the light is behind the mesh mask, isn't it a choking hazard and risky to use this way?

Yeah, it would have been nice if he did choke on the light in his mouth because he’d dead and Nancy would still be alive. Makes me think he’s familiar with using it? I know it’s been talked about before who would use a light like this. Someone has to be suspicious of someone they know right now and probably scared out of their mind.

Katrinepa · Mar 5, 2026

you betcha said:
Sigh. I wish that creep's stupid crotch gun had shot It off.

Where are you, Nancy?

Some days ago, nearer the beginning, someone mentioned that there are some Mexica gang members that wear their guns like that. Maybe they have no cajones to protect?(lol) MOO as I never heard any confirmation of that.

Trish51 · Mar 5, 2026

Cassie P said:
If she worked at a university she would know academics and general university staff. Do we know what area of the university she worked? When did she retire? How many years ago?

AG also worked at the U of A, if I remember correctly. She has done other things in Tucson with her poetry and jewelry. It would not be unreasonable that a student or someone did this as a revenge for a grade or critique of sorts. Maybe she has a fan who loved her poetry and she rejected him or her.

Cassie P · Mar 5, 2026

factseeking said:
I really liked how detailed Clemente was about others recognizing the perp. I'd never really thought about how pre-abduction people might have noticed certain things like the perp saying his luck was about to change or his behavior being more tense. He really emphasized how high the perps stress level would have been pre, during and post event. He was adamant that someone who knows this person knows something.

I know its important for LE not to release info too soon but if they really don't have any suspect or poi I think they should help the public understand what kinds of things they might have noticed about people around them. I'm pretty well versed in human behavior but had not stopped to think about what kind of behaviors might have been noticed pre and post event.

Clemente was thought provoking for me at least.

Just the perp's detailed work on what he was going to wear took some time to think about, plan, purchase, dry runs, etc. And how to figure out how to buy all of it and leave no trail. The clothing, masks, gloves, etc. The perp seemed to have specific ideas about how to totally disguise himself which could have taken some trial and error to achieve. And we know he did a dry run before the crime night.

Most women know an important outfit doesn't magically come together in a few minutes.

So someone buying clothing, masks, gloves. Trying them on, wearing them to try them out. Returning some items or destroying them?

If he planned the rest of the crime down to the smallest detail that would have taken time as well.

So someone working on clothing, masks, outfits. And spending time on some sort of project. Trips where he was gone for some hours checking out the crime site, etc.

Katrinepa · Mar 5, 2026

Data Sleuth said:
I don’t believe that we know with certainty that the helicopter has the pace maker sniffer equipment on board. If you have specific info could you please attach a link?
They may just be looking at various locations for any number of reasons.

I've heard sniffers are attached to drones, as they have to be close to the ground to detect any signal from a pacemaker. Can't remember how far away. MOO

SlimPickens · Mar 5, 2026

Napoli said:
The clue has already been called in, IMO. The FBI doesnt want, "I think it's my neighbor weirdo Joe". They want clues. He was away for a few days. I saw him with blood on his sneakers etc. They said they had 15,000 tips. The name is there. . After the embarrassment of the Carlos and LD raids, LE is sulking in a corner and not acting on anything but a guy wearing a sign saying I did it. JMO

I don't know about sulking, but definitely lots of doubts and second-guessing in the upper echelons/political classes. Two impending lawsuits will do that to them. Hopefully they'll lick their wounds and get back on the horse. Nancy's and even others' lives could depend on it.

JMO.

Cassie P · Mar 5, 2026

Sadi said:
Yeah, it would have been nice if he did choke on the light in his mouth because he’d dead and Nancy would still be alive. Makes me think he’s familiar with using it? I know it’s been talked about before who would use a light like this. Someone has to be suspicious of someone they know right now and probably scared out of their mind.

Yes I think it is a risky thing to do at any time. But if you are running a criminal operation worth potentially $6 million it would be foolhardy to risk it. Unless as you say the person uses this light every day and is comfortable with it. Or perhaps he is overly confident and thinks he is invincible.

wibbleflea · Mar 5, 2026

Cassie P said:
Thank you Wibble, there is so much information here sometimes I miss pieces of information. I knew people were talking about fake mustaches, etc but I didn't realize how sophisticated some of these masks are today. Even the teeth are part of the mask.

If the light is behind the mesh mask, isn't it a choking hazard and risky to use this way?

If you’re out to abduct someone (or worse), a tiny keyring light in your mouth is probably the least of your worries. It also reduces the chance of the light falling out and of saliva falling out. Would explain the odd misalignment between flashlight and mouth, too. Just a theory.

The IR video isn’t sharp and may blur out the mesh but I’m wondering if a mask wouldn’t be brighter under IR – more like the ski mask. Not sure!

Trino · Mar 5, 2026

Love Never Fails said:
Just my opinion, the eyes and eyebrows of the perp always looked like a woman to me. But the body looked like a man. So I’m guessing he wore a face mask and maybe it had eyebrows? The eyes are real.
Lots of questions for all of us.

Katrinepa said:
A couple ex FBI LE have said they think it won't be shocking, and that it probably won't be someone 'new' in the case. Not sure what that means. MOO

I think we might guess but not post.

Cassie P · Mar 5, 2026

wibbleflea said:
If you’re out to abduct someone (or worse), a tiny keyring might in your mouth is probably the least of your worries. It also reduces the chance of the light falling out and of saliva falling out. Would explain the odd misalignment between flashlight and mouth, too. Just a theory.

The IR video isn’t sharp and may blur out the mesh but I’m wondering if a mask wouldn’t be brighter under IR – more like the ski mask. Not sure!

As I just said in another comment, if you are planning a crime potentially bringing in $6m and involving the life of someone else, you might not take the risk of choking on the job.

I didn't realize it was tiny. What size is it? I was thinking larger.
Maybe this guy uses it in his job or a hobby all the time and is fine with it.

Yes it does solve the problem of leaving DNA behind. Yes and the odd appearance of the mismatch of light and mouth.

Nancy Guthrie, 84, (mother of TODAY Show host Savannah Guthrie) missing - last seen in the Catalina foothills area on Jan 31, 2026

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