MI, Grand Blanc - Mass Shooting at Mormon Church, fire, 28 Sept 2025

[kuromiiiilove]

i’m not very knowledgeable about the LDS church (except that i know they are very good at teaching languages to their missionaries!), are there specific groups that have issues with their beliefs? is it a common thing for conspiracy thinkers to say they are “the antichrist”? do other christian churches have issues with the LDS church? (trying to understand more of the context and whether this is one random man or some kind of movement, of course this is all horrible no matter what )

As Ontario Mom said, a lot of Christians think Mormonism is essentially a cult and that Joseph Smith was a cult leader. It’s mostly due to its relative ‘newness’ on the stage of world religions.

There is lots of controversy regarding Mormonism, whether it be other denominations judging them, or intra-religion issues regarding polygamy (no longer typically practiced), their views on the trinity/Godhead, their previous views on black folks (that they are descendants of Cain and their skin color is due to Cains ‘curse’), segregation regarding the priesthood, temple ordinances, etc.

But in every day life, there is not a huge amount of conflict between Mormons and Christians. I have heard many Christians (I grew up in the Southern Baptist church) say that Joseph Smith was a false prophet, but there was really never any vitriol towards them, at least where I grew up.

MOO

 

[Yellowbelly]

It sounds like he had a girlfriend when he lived in Utah who was a Morman and he attended with her

I was reading the BBC live feed with regards to this individual's political views, and thinking that it didn't make much sense. I concluded that he'll turn out to be somebody with a grudge against the Mormons who was having a mental health crisis. If the above is true, then I think we might see where that grudge might have started. Basically, it's a tragedy all round, with nothing there for anybody who might be tempted to push a particular angle.

Motive in Michigan church shooting still unknown, officials say as suspect among five killed

Police say a gunman drove into a church, opened fire and set the building ablaze, before being killed himself.

www.bbc.co.uk

Motive in Michigan church shooting still unknown, officials say as suspect among five killed

Police say a gunman drove into a church, opened fire and set the building ablaze, before being killed himself.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Chimera]

I must have missed some info since I haven't read or heard anything about that. Do you have a link?

Here ya go :

https://www.cnn.com/2025/09/28/us/thomas-sanford-michigan-shooting-suspect-

"..... the medical care of Sanford’s son, who was born with a rare genetic disorder.

The newborn baby was diagnosed with a condition called Congenital Hyperinsulinism, which required a lengthy hospital stay and several surgeries to remove portions of the pancreas ..."

What we know about the suspect in the deadly Michigan church shooting

Authorities identified Thomas Jacob Sanford as the suspect in the shooting and fire at the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Grand Blanc Township.

www.nbcnews.com

"...Sanford’s son's battle with congenital hyperinsulinism, a rare condition in which the insulin cells of the pancreas produce too much insulin.

As of Sunday night there had been no motive established in the investigation, nor had there been any suggestion from authorities that Sanford’s political views or his son’s condition played a role in his thinking..."
Pbm.
No motive established yet according to the second link.

It sounds from reading other posts here T.J.S. was increasingly hostile towards the Mormon church ?
But I think there were much deeper problems going on with the murderer !

(There are also a few comments upthread, addressing the ill child of his.)
Imo.

 

[Marlowe93]

I haven't heard a lot of actual hatred toward the LS church, just more of folks poking fun at it (see The Book of Mormon, etc.) - and having been raised Christian (Catholic) I was never taught that other factions of Christianity were wrong - just that we were all just slightly different parts of the whole.

Things could have changed over the years as it's been a long time since I've had much of anything to do with any sort of church, but it's nothing I've ever heard about.

I would suspect (and I'll admit I've only read the little that's been published on this in the media) that this might relate to his military service. PTSD / Mental health crisis of some sort maybe triggered by someone involved with that particular church.

 

[kuromiiiilove]

Michigan gunman Thomas Sanford’s mom posted eerie message about someone ‘avoiding accountability’ days before shooting

Thomas Sanford’s mom, Brenda Walters-Sanford, posted the eerie message on Facebook before Sunday’s carnage.

nypost.com

 

[Inthedetails]

I would say that's the motive right there.

It would help, imo, to know if the perp was affiliated with another religion/denomination in recent years. Why did he dislike LDS so much that he attacked? Was he mad at LDS for personal reasons or doctrinal beliefs?

"Dislike" would indicate an outsider and "disgruntled" would indicate an insider (or former insider), imo.

Given that the attack was at a church during worship, info about the perp's own religion seems slow in coming. I am curious about it.

jmopinion

 

[Diddian]

The Happy Land fire in the Bronx is one that was local-ish to me. Perp's gf worked there, he showed up, she had the bouncer kick him out, he came back later with a gas can. The gf was one of the few survivors.

Happy Land fire - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The level of violence in this crime - crashing his vehicle through the wall of the building, shooting multiple times into a crowd, setting volatile fire, and creating and bringing IED's - seems like it reflects a very substantial degree of hostility toward a broadly defined target OR a desire to commit a violent crime that draws significant attention (or maybe both).

The perpetrator chose to display two large USA flags on his vehicle while committing the crime. To me, that suggests some kind of messaging in this act, but it is also possible he regularly drove around that way. Who knows at this point?

 

[Ontario Mom]

The level of violence in this crime - crashing his vehicle through the wall of the building, shooting multiple times into a crowd, setting volatile fire, and creating and bringing IED's - seems like it reflects a very substantial degree of hostility toward a broadly defined target OR a desire to commit a violent crime that draws significant attention (or maybe both).

The perpetrator chose to display two large USA flags on his vehicle while committing the crime. To me, that suggests some kind of messaging in this act, but it is also possible he regularly drove around that way. Who knows at this point?

It's entirely possible he drove around that way all the time. After the Trucker Convoy in Canada during covid, LOTS of people still drive around with huge Canadian flags on their trucks.

As to the level of violence and terror he caused, to me that says him going out in a blaze was his intention all along.

 

[Inthedetails]

Confirmed 5 dead.
Everyone is accounted for at this time.

I am so relieved. I was very worried there were more people in the ashes and rubble.

Whew.

jmopinion

 

[Serononin]

It would help, imo, to know if the perp was affiliated with another religion/denomination in recent years. Why did he dislike LDS so much that he attacked. Was he mad at LDS for personal reasons or doctrinal beliefs?

"Dislike" would indicate an outsider and "disgruntled" would indicate an insider (or former insider), imo.

Given that the attack was at a church during worship, info about the perp's own religion seems slow in coming. I am curious about it.

jmopinion

I guess it's also possible that he had some kind of personal issue with an individual who just also happened to be Mormon, and somehow he projected his anger towards that person onto the LDS church in general?

 

[NervousNellie]

I am so relieved. I was very worried there were more people in the ashes and rubble.

Whew.

jmopinion

Just to clarify - they confirmed they had not finished clearing the entire building yet, but that everyone is accounted for. I worry that maybe someone is in there that no one is missing, if that makes sense.

 

[Leilei]

I guess it's also possible that he had some kind of personal issue with an individual who just also happened to be Mormon, and somehow he projected his anger towards that person onto the LDS church in general?

I think that this is much more likely.
Plus I think that he was just a hateful, angry man.
IMO.

 

[Inthedetails]

Just to clarify - they confirmed they had not finished clearing the entire building yet, but that everyone is accounted for. I worry that maybe someone is in there that no one is missing, if that makes sense.

I see. Yes, that does make sense. Thanks for correcting my misunderstanding.

I hope we will hear an "all clear" notice.

jmopinion

 

[Iwatchingeye]

Grand Blanc Township church shooting live updates: What we know about victims, suspect

The latest news on the shooting and fire at the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Grand Blanc Township on Sept. 28, 2025.

www.freep.com

The fact that he had a Mormon girlfriend and they don't typically date/marry outside the Mormon faith, might have been a point of contention and possibly in his mind ended his relationship along with other stressors. Purely speculation on my part based on what we know.

 

[Warwick1991]

In the BBC article linked by @Yellowbelly, there's a photo of the wreckage that shows charred wood studs. That would indicate that the building was brick veneer supported by wood framing. Sanford's truck unfortunately would have been able penetrate this with ease, IMO.

 

[NervousNellie]

I see. Yes, that does make sense. Thanks for correcting my misunderstanding.

I hope we will hear an "all clear" notice.

jmopinion

Oh, no!! I don't think it was your misunderstanding. I was adding bullet points from the press conference quickly and realized later that the additional detail is probably important.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

i’m not very knowledgeable about the LDS church (except that i know they are very good at teaching languages to their missionaries!), are there specific groups that have issues with their beliefs? is it a common thing for conspiracy thinkers to say they are “the antichrist”? do other christian churches have issues with the LDS church? (trying to understand more of the context and whether this is one random man or some kind of movement, of course this is all horrible no matter what )

Yes, other Christians have issues with the LDS Church, and LDS has issues with other Christian sects and denominations. That IS religion.

Moo of course, but based on having LDS in my immediate family.
I personally, believe that LDS stands apart from many of the other religious denominations because they are taught to believe all other religions were basically corrupt before Joseph Smith declarations. moo, of course.

There are so many elaborate and concise writings, readings on this topic. More contemporary thinkers, writers can make these differences look minor, and some can make them look major.

What Some Christian Denominations Say about the LDS Church

Consistent with the radical differences between the LDS Church and traditional Christianity, several major Christian denominations have issued statements explicitly denying that the LDS religion is an acceptable form of Christianity. We present these statements in order to document that...

mit.irr.org

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Suspect Thomas Jacob Sanford railed against Mormons before church assault. Live updates

Authorities say the deadly attack at a church in Grand Blanc Township, Michigan, was carried out by 40-year-old Thomas Jacob Sanford.

www.usatoday.com

also..happening today.
Officers on Monday stopped a man who tried to drive through the police barricade surrounding the church where Sunday's attack took place.

Inside the man's car, officers found a long gun in the front seat, according to Detroit Free Press reporters who saw the weapon being removed from the car.

At a news conference, Grand Blanc Township Police Chief William Renye said a 21-year-old man was taken into custody and that officers were "still in the process of investigating that incident."

 

[Dotta]

In the press conference, the police chief said the perpetrator had previous arrests for burglary and OWI. Does anyone know what OWI is? Is it like DUI?

ETA: Never mind, I should have looked it up first. Operating while under the influence.

No surprise here

A criminal through & through.

JMO

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Grand Blanc Township church shooting live updates: What we know about victims, suspect

The latest news on the shooting and fire at the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Grand Blanc Township on Sept. 28, 2025.

www.freep.com

The fact that he had a Mormon girlfriend and they don't typically date/marry outside the Mormon faith, might have been a point of contention and possibly in his mind ended his relationship along with other stressors. Purely speculation on my part based on what we know.

He rented a room in Utah in 2010. This was 15 years ago, so it is hard to imagine it would be such a monumental issue for him right now. I do hope we get some information of the health of his marriage, and any other recent situations in his life.

So, at the moment I am blanking out on his profession or work??? Hopefully some one will fill me in...