FL - Jennifer Kesse, 24, Orlando, 24 Jan 2006 - #6

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that sums up the year and a half thinking here real well.

the shoes and hat didn't lead me to believe a uniform. they led me to believe a bike messenger. The taser holster and sheriff's shoulder patch in photos one and three led me to believe it's a uniform, a bike patrol uniform. the face in photo three with sunglasses, chin strap, and front of hat confirmed it.

you are right about your package statements for Monday evening, wrong about sending from work. maybe logical to you, but practically unheard of by anyone else.

and nothing is real unless seen by naked eye? that is just a remarkable statement. i saw two references to experts who looked at these photos in news, and both enlarged the images. who doesn't enlarge the images?

but speaking of naked eye, you can see the shoulder patch and face with naked eye in photo three. that alone should be enough.

the reality is i spent more time and made more effort over a period of weeks analyzing those photos than any expert or le analyst. why? because they're busy and i'm not bright enough to know when to stop looking.

the reality is, i never found any one of these things in one easy fell swoop. i posted my thoughts and finds with the photos as i went along, and i was just as dumbfounded to keep finding things as anyone is to read about it. finding an le was the last thing i would have ever imagined.

but i made it as easy for everyone else now as i could. you do have to look though, to see it.

rd
 
SS wow,

First of all, why are we all assuming that LE has these perfect cell phone records?

Just because New YORk, which probably has ten cell sites per block, was able to pinpoint this guy, and store his data, with most likely and up to date phone, and up to date cell equipment, doesnt' necessarily mean that every cell company, or site, has the same equipment, or capacity.

I would think, the more cell sites, more people, better technology. Especially after 9/11, I would think LE would want to be able to track people in New York a lot easier than in say, butte, montana.

I, for one, am not sold on LE knowing when the last locater ping was.

LE said, no "cell activity after 10pm". why would they lie? they also said, they wouldn't share the landline info. with the public.

IF they do know the cell phone info. , then shame on them for not sharing, because, I think it would be a critical clue, and help with the timeline.

Plus, we don't know how long cell companies keep this data. It would have taken at least 3 days, minimum, for LE to even ask for a subpeona, then the cell company has to retreive the data.

In New York, that guy was a suspect from day one, and he was being watched, not to mention the 30,000 cops in NY, versus 600 in ORlando, and a known murder versus a missing woman.

Don't forget, in New York, that guy walked the missing woman to her car, so he was suspect from the beginning, and cell data was fresh.

Now, related to Rd. Why can't he be right?

I don't see it, but, then again, I don't see my DNA in my blood or hair, but, I know it's there.

Who's to say that RD doesn't have better equipment, than the rest of us.

Sure, it could be an optical illusion, but, maybe not.

Sure, walking down a street dressed like a cop will open eyes, but, maybe the POI did get into a car at HOTG.

Maybe, he was part of the bike patrol at the mall, and his uniform is security, not LE. IN that case, nobody would give him a second look.

the argument that the FBI or LE would find it. Are you talking about the same LE who didn't secure the condo, didn't look at Jk's computer, and probably has the height of the POI wrong, didn't use roadblocks in front of HOTG or Mosaic, and didn't take the case seriously for 48 hours?

LE and FBI only have so much time. WE here, enjoy doing this, and hoping to find answers. LE has deadlines, and tons of cases, we have one.

I got the same answer, when we were looking at a certain individual, and it is a standard one.

HOw could LE look over something like that ?

Truth is, it happens all the time. LE doesn't share with the public, so, we rarely if ever, learn of their mistakes, but, there are plenty to go around.

They are human beings, and make mistakes.

I find RD's work interesting, but, I havn't concluded one way or another, nor should anybody.

Until somebody with half of a brain, decides to go out to HOTG, and do some experiments with different outfits, heights, weight, etc, we will never know.

Personally, I lost confidence in LE solving this case a long time ago.

Any agency that doesnt' secure a condo of a missing woman, is open to criticism.

Unless this case is shared with the public, we will never know what went on behind closed doors.

for example, why would two detectives retire in the middle of the biggest case of their careers? I find it odd. If it was planned, then why were they assigned a new "potential homicide" case, just months from retirement, when LE knows it may last a long time, and go to court.

Why weren't a young detective, and an old detective, assigned together, instead of two guys close to retirement.

this case has left a bad taste in my mouth.

there is no excuse for it to be cold, imo.

left
 
I don't mean to bust your chops, RD. I know you have spent much time on this case and on those photos. Good job! And you could very well be correct. We simply have difference of opinions and will have to eventually agree to disagree on it.

LE has botched this case from the start. It wouldn't matter if the detectives retired during this or not...since at the end of this case THEY know what they did or did not do will come back to haunt them anyway!

We can't move forward with anything as long as we don't have the facts from LE and LE isn't going to provide jack! They won't even tell the family! Why? Because they are "witholding it for the right time or they don't want to tip off the perp"...give me a break...they have already allowed the perp an 18 month head start and they are still sitting at the start line.
 
well maybe knowing he looked back in photo three and you can see his face and sunglasses is a start. I read the Wikipedia article on Jennifer tonight (in my futile search for a police statement) and it states that the POI walked away from the car without looking back.

well, he did. And I can see his face in photo three on my 15" LCD (which I keep at 1024x768) with the naked eye.

in my opinion, you can see his face well enough in the enlarged photo to exclude most people.

rd
 
yes RD

I don't have a LCD monitor, just a cheap old one.

Can you estimate his age, height, etc.

Would you say he is small, medium, or large build.

Are you convinced it is a man.

left
 
None of that matters, Left...if we have a photo of his face and can tell exactly who it is! Right?
 
SeriouslySearching said:
None of that matters, Left...if we have a photo of his face and can tell exactly who it is! Right?
Click to expand...

Well, with sunglasses on, it can get a little tough to identify someone from a picture.

Recently, the FBI caught the Mad Hatter bank robber.

He simply wore a hat, and regular prescription sunglasses as a disguise

Check out amw, and see how different he looks in real life, compared to the bank photo's. It is amazing.

IF the pOI is wearing a hat, and glasses, he would be had to identify, even if LE had a photo of his face, imo

Of course, it would help. Look at the target video. That was good video, and the guy's neighbor wasn't going to call in Edwin until they recognized his truck, so id'ing someone can be tough.

left
 
Ok so if no one can identify him from this photo...then of what consequence IS the photo in the investigation?
 
Well, the photo will give LE leads as to the possible perp.

IF that was my brother, or friend, and he would wear that type of clothing, and lived in Florida, and frequented that area, and looked similar, maybe, someone would call. But, only if the height was in the ball park. If I thought it was my friend, and LE says he is 5"4, and my buddy is 5"10 or taller, I wouldn't call. Simple as that. That is why the height is so critical in all of this. IMO

In most cases, LE needs physical evidence to tie a perp. to a crime.

IF the photo was clearer, and LE could get some better leads, than they could narrow their list down, and try to find forensic evidence from the car, or from a warrant at his house, get his cell phone records, talk to friends, his criminal background, etc.

In my opinion, LE doesn't have a "good suspect", because LE has the height way off.

In the case of Edwin, it was a lead, and the DNA tied him to the case.

Without the DNA, I don't think LE would have been able to tie him to the case. The video just wasn't clear enough. However, given the truck, and the DNA, it was then enough.

Truth is, I really don't think a picture is ever enough to get an arrest.

That is why LE wanted to get the POI to come forward, and admit it was him in the photo, and say ya, but, I was just walking by.

Obviously, it didn't work.

This guy is cold. HE is experienced, and probably no saint. I can't imagine this is his first crime, nor his last.

Heck, he could be locked up as we speak, for some other crime.

left
 
Supposedly this photo helped LE 'guess' at the height, weight, clothing and sex of the person seen walking away from Jennifer's car. Sorry but that turned out to be nothing but bs imo. Whoever took Jennifer should have been identified and arrested months ago. I've followed this case from the beginning and it has infuriated me to no end. Oh and FWIW--the picture of this so called POI looking backward is here at WS somewhere. I've seen it many times.
 
left, it wasn't as good as the Kelsey Smith suspect photo for example. I posted that photo below the blowup though. The goatee and sunglasses and short hair had a similar look as this POI, but this POI's face is broader.

The LCD is not necessary, I work with a 19" monitor and didn't even look at the pictures with the 15" LCD until I had found everything. It was then that I noticed how different things look with smaller LCD, both at 1024x768, but some things better with one, worse with the other. But it's just a matter of ease on the eye. Everything's there no matter what.

A start is just to take a look at his face with whatever, but different computers can give you different perspectives on the enlarged photos.

rd
 
The photo does not matter then because if we can't identify the guy...what difference does it make if he is wearing sunglasses or not? Looked at the camera or not?

Let's find some other needle in this haystack that will give us a solid piece of the puzzle to actually follow up on.

We NEED to find a witness, for example.

Maybe I will start by contacting the local Postal Service and ask the postman who covers that area to call me. He seems like a potential witness.
 
What I said was it was good enough to exclude most people. For example, if you had 1154 people, and some info on some of their whereabouts that morning, you could exclude most of the unaccounted for from suspicion with this picture.

What, has CSI spoiled everyone?

rd
 
Yes. CSI has. Still...good old fashioned detective work where we pound the pavement is more applicable, IMO. So I intend to start pounding on my own. I will check out my Chef theory while I am at it!

We aren't doing Jennifer any good sitting here arguing over those photos which won't bring us any answers and won't bring her home.

Pick up the phone and make some calls. Write some darn emails to people who will get out and DO something in an effort to recanvas the area. Write Congressmen, Senators, State Reps, or anyone who has some pull to get SOMEONE to listen and get something DONE in this case.

Action instead of words will go further here than what we are doing now.

By the end of next week, I hope to know the names of every Chef in the area and who was there when Jenn went missing, what people are required to wear to work there, etc. I am going to also call the Culinary school and discuss with them what they require as far as attire for their chefs to wear to class.
 
I agree with Phila, this case should have been solved within the first two months.

LE took a short, female, out to the site, and used her as a model for the POI.

Doesn't this suggest that LE thought the POI was short?

Please. Look at the height of the fence.

Then, on top of it, the cop in the henhouse where the camera is located, was "moving" the camera by hand.

You never, ever, touch a camera, and change the angle, especially related to a crime scene.

In the video of LE measuring the height, is the male with the yard stick, is he is lead detective, or a CSI guy?

I just can't believe that a modern CSI team uses a rope, and a measuring stick, to estimate the height of a potential murderer. Amazing.

Anybody who thinks the CSI teams are like on tv, well, that isn't the real world.

Look at the OJ case, and Dennis Fong. He took a blood sample from Rockingham, over to OJ's house, and never thought about contaminating the scene. Please.

SS: I think talking to the mailman is a 'great idea. HE may also serve Mosaic, or knows something.

I've said it before, but, the mailman, fedex guys and gals, ups, they know everyone, and see everything. They are an underused source.

I'm telling you, if I lived in Orlando, I would probably get in trouble, since I would be tempted to go out to HOTG, and try to get the management to allow me to do some experiments.

And you know what, it would be worth it. HEck, a woman is missing, the case is cold, and a potential killer is free. Plus, who knows, JK could be tied up somewhere, although, very doubtful.

left
 
Left..this Postman parks everyday nearly in the very spot he left the car. Of COURSE, he would be a great one talk to! You can see his truck as plain as day right there the day that the Kesse's were there taking photos with Greta's team.
 
Anything can happen in 18 months.

The perpetrator could be dead or as left said 'locked up.'

He could be in another country.

Is the suspect actually the perpetrator? He could be an accomplice.

Where is the evidence going to come from for this case to be able to get to court?
What evidence is going to be sufficient to get a conviction?

Even if a suspect was uncovered tomorrow what evidence is going to link the person to the abduction?
A grainy photo?

One big hurdle is finding a suspect; the next big hurdle is having enough to lay charges and the final huge hurdle is convincing a court the suspect you charged is the perpetrator.
I believe if this case went to court on photographs, cell phone pings and hunches any defence attorney will tear the case to shreds.

If this is a homicide case where is the body?
Where is the crime scene?
Where are the witnesses?
Where is the physical evidence?

Even a confession might not be enough to go to court on this one.

The perpetrator could be a cop or security gurard or someone posing as one.
The perp could have been known to Jennifer.
The perp could be anyone from a chef to a construction worker to a bus driver.

Unless there is some solid evidence from her car or a secret witness somewhere this case is not only extremely difficult but next to impossible to solve.
 
One step at a time.

I think the same is being done even as we speak for applicable folks by those who can identify a sheriff's shoulder patch when they look at it. I had to call it in first though.

rd
 
SeriouslySearching said:
Left..this Postman parks everyday nearly in the very spot he left the car. Of COURSE, he would be a great one talk to! You can see his truck as plain as day right there the day that the Kesse's were there taking photos with Greta's team.
Click to expand...
Is there a possibility that a mailperson was the perp and parked her car in that spot by habit when returning it?
 
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