Clifford Lane Lawless

[KR2tonenow]

I might have missed this but was it stated where Pastor Lane was, and does he have an alibi when Sandra was murdered?

 

[KR2tonenow]

Based on the new information, I'm expanding on my theory a bit. L. Lawless was "saved" from his past, whatever that was, by his Elder Harris. Does anyone think Pastor Lawless is "paying it forward" by having people such as FW and Melissa Huckaby (a.k.a. Lawless) in his life? Am I making sense here?

Sure, MH was his grand daughter. That was the church's belief, stated back.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I have been wondering the very same thing...
It has been stated that Connie Lawless was home when Melissa went to the church... where was the Pastor?
Was he home, too? Was he at the church already? Where?

The only person saying Connie was home is Melissa so we do not know this to be a fact. As far as I know, LE have not given any information as to where Lane or Connie were when Sandra went missing. (I don't know if it is correct, but I do recall hearing her 5 yo daughter was not at home when Sandra went missing. I am trying to find confirmation on this.)

 

[mama2jackson]

Hi Everyone

I know i am brand new here, But i thought i could shed a little light on the subject. I know pastor Lane Lawless and his wife, and have my whole life. I have been to clover road baptist church a number of times. (I also have known the harris family my whole life). I can tell you, you will not find a nicer more genuine man of god anywhere. It breaks my heart to see this family going thru this. (I can not speak for the accused as i can not recall even meeting her.) It seems like there is a mob mentality for this man, that is so very undeserved.

Also for the person who wanted to know about Ted Huckabee, He is my grandfather, and he is not in the ministry.

Anyways thanks for listening. I will answer any questions i can.

JLB

 

[Livvy]

Hi Everyone

I know i am brand new here, But i thought i could shed a little light on the subject. I know pastor Lane Lawless and his wife, and have my whole life. I have been to clover road baptist church a number of times. (I also have known the harris family my whole life). I can tell you, you will not find a nicer more genuine man of god anywhere. It breaks my heart to see this family going thru this. (I can not speak for the accused as i can not recall even meeting her.) It seems like there is a mob mentality for this man, that is so very undeserved.

Also for the person who wanted to know about Ted Huckabee, He is my grandfather, and he is not in the ministry.

Anyways thanks for listening. I will answer any questions i can.

JLB

I feel really bad for Pator Lawless and his family! They seem like a normal family helping out a grandaughter who needed a place to live and with getting back on her feet. I feel they are being dragged through the mud for no fault of their own.

 

[marlap]

I feel really bad for Pator Lawless and his family! They seem like a normal family helping out a grandaughter who needed a place to live and with getting back on her feet. I feel they are being dragged through the mud for no fault of their own.

My heart breaks for Pastor Lawless and his family too.

 

[mama2jackson]

Thank you,

It is nice to hear that not everyone thinks he is some criminal in disguise. It made me furious :furious: to see his name dragged thru the mud.

JLB

 

[OkGrace]

Thank you,

It is nice to hear that not everyone thinks he is some criminal in disguise. It made me furious :furious: to see his name dragged thru the mud.

JLB

I understand. I thought he was being dragged from the beginning.....

 

[goofeegyrl]

And, kudos to the family of Huckaby for the words and manner in which they made their statement today.

 

[Ames]

Baptists will also allow people to be baptized again in the Baptist church. Say, if a child goes forward at the invitation then follows with baptism and goes on to later believe they didn't understand it all. That person could years later , even if after living a bad life for awhile, ask to be baptized again and the preacher will do it. Baptists consider the person a Christian, but not actually a member of the church until Baptism. When baptized, they become a member of the church that did the baptism.

My seven year old daughter just got baptized today. A baptism doesn't save a person, it is just to publicly admit that you have been saved. That is why a pastor will re-baptize a person, if they ask for it. If you are a Baptist, and you have been baptized before, in a different church...you can join the church by profession of faith...that is what my family did this morning, before my daughter's baptism. So, you do not have to be baptized in order to be a member of a baptist church...you CAN do it that way, but...you can also come by profession of faith, if you have been baptized in another church.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

Hi Everyone

I know i am brand new here, But i thought i could shed a little light on the subject. I know pastor Lane Lawless and his wife, and have my whole life. I have been to clover road baptist church a number of times. (I also have known the harris family my whole life). I can tell you, you will not find a nicer more genuine man of god anywhere. It breaks my heart to see this family going thru this. (I can not speak for the accused as i can not recall even meeting her.) It seems like there is a mob mentality for this man, that is so very undeserved.

Also for the person who wanted to know about Ted Huckabee, He is my grandfather, and he is not in the ministry.

Anyways thanks for listening. I will answer any questions i can.

JLB

How is Ted related to Melissa?

 

[FishingFunnyFrog]

Hi Everyone

I know i am brand new here, But i thought i could shed a little light on the subject. I know pastor Lane Lawless and his wife, and have my whole life. I have been to clover road baptist church a number of times. (I also have known the harris family my whole life). I can tell you, you will not find a nicer more genuine man of god anywhere. It breaks my heart to see this family going thru this. (I can not speak for the accused as i can not recall even meeting her.) It seems like there is a mob mentality for this man, that is so very undeserved.

Also for the person who wanted to know about Ted Huckabee, He is my grandfather, and he is not in the ministry.

Anyways thanks for listening. I will answer any questions i can.

JLB

mama- I too feel heartbroken for the Lawless family. It's unfortunate that in a case like this everyone must be examined...especially Lane and Connie. I can't even imagine the pain they must be going through...grieving Sandra, grieving Melissa's depravity and mental state, anger toward Melissa, deep concern for Melissa's daughter, betrayal that Melissa would cause such pain to their community, possibly feeling ashamed before the Cantu family, maybe even feelings of guilt for Melissa's problems. It's terrible. The Lawless family seems like a close family and very humble and Godly people. I've enjoyed viewing their myspace pages...the grandkids appear to be great wholesome kids. I'm glad Melissa was arrested just before Easter so the family can take extra comfort in the cross & resurrection. God bless the Cantu's and the Lawless's as they begin their journey of healing and forgiveness.

 

[daisy.faithfull]

Thank you for having this thread and bringing up these points! It seems on the discussion thread no one wanted to talk about this man.....

Elepher...I have been searching and searching, and nothing seems to come up for him until California, although it said in his bio that he was "saved" in Wenatchee, WA. So, being from WA, I started sleuthing. It got me nowhere. I'm thinking another alias based on what I've seen so far. I searched under the man who baptized him, and he's from Omak, WA, and he has more than 1 alias as well. Now, I didn't want to bring this up before tonight, but I will tell you why the town Wenatchee made my ears perk up:

http://www.seattlepi.com/powertoharm/

Research the Wenatchee sex ring and you will see. Pertinent is that once sexual allegations were made, there was a snowball effect, but one would have to imagine that there was sexual misconduct in Wenatchee. It is stated that sex offenders in Wenatchee outnumber citizens 764 to 1. I'm heavily looking into this Tracy 60, if you get what I'm saying. I'm not implicating anyone here, but the word "Wenatchee" and the fact that I can't trace him there makes me uber suspicious.

That website you posted is scary. I went through this thread earlier in the day and marked it to take a look at latter. From the little I have been able to read I am most shocked at how many perps were female or mentally disabled.

I'm not sure if I understand the part that I bolded though, does that mean that for every person in Wenatchee there are 764 sex offenders? :waitasec:

I guess it is interesting that Lawless does have connections to this community, I don't know if we can make any assumptions from it though.

 

[passionflower]

That website you posted is scary. I went through this thread earlier in the day and marked it to take a look at latter. From the little I have been able to read I am most shocked at how many perps were female or mentally disabled.

I'm not sure if I understand the part that I bolded though, does that mean that for every person in Wenatchee there are 764 sex offenders? :waitasec:

I guess it is interesting that Lawless does have connections to this community, I don't know if we can make any assumptions from it though.

After reading article, I say WOW! How big is Tracy and Wentchee cities?

 

[SeekingJana]

Baptist often don't require the same amount of formal study or a degree from an accredited seminary as other denominations require. There isn't a great emphasis on theological education in many of the Baptist denominations. So it isn't that unusual that he was ordained 4 months after being called.

LOL, the pastors in large mainstream Baptist churches have doctorate degrees in Religion, and are paid a salary commisurate with the degree.

I noticed today when reviewing some of the case material that Lawless's church in Tracy has a big sign up stating that they are an Independent Baptist church.
So. all previous documentation regarding what they believe or don't believe now has the answer- unknown.I didn't know the specifics of the particular church when I was asked questions about doctrine.

Independent in a church name means they can believe and worship any way they want to without being responsible to a regional or national governing body. He might not have to have much college education, as small as that building is. . There aren't enough members to pay very well.

 

[SeekingJana]

Thank you FFF, I didn't know any Baptist churches did that. If this is one of those branches of the Baptist denomination, it wouldn't look so hinky after all.

The Tracy church where Lawless preaches is an Independent Baptist church. It's on their sign in the videos. That means they can decide to believe in whatever they choose to and do not have to adhere to any regional or national supervision or the like.

 

[SeekingJana]

Originally Posted by mama2jackson
Hi Everyone

I know i am brand new here, But i thought i could shed a little light on the subject. I know pastor Lane Lawless and his wife, and have my whole life. I have been to clover road baptist church a number of times. (I also have known the harris family my whole life). I can tell you, you will not find a nicer more genuine man of god anywhere. It breaks my heart to see this family going thru this. (I can not speak for the accused as i can not recall even meeting her.) It seems like there is a mob mentality for this man, that is so very undeserved.

Also for the person who wanted to know about Ted Huckabee, He is my grandfather, and he is not in the ministry.

Anyways thanks for listening. I will answer any questions i can.

JLB

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He'd been a Baptist for 19 years by this time, and a minister for some years by this time ( 1979), but it is interesting that they are said to be visiting his step- mother, Esther Lawless relative.. not a Harris, LOL.
Does anyone know who Ted Huckabee is, as in, is he some kind of minister or something? The name sounds familiar.

A couple of other things- it says they lived in San Jose. CA in 1979. I think we need to add that to our places he lived and the date. In 1979, he is said in this society column note to be living in San Jose, CA.

Regarding the obit of Esther Lawless: George had 2 sons when he married Esther in 1955. Chances are, Lane Lawless is from Brewster WA, judging from this article.
Notice it says that Esther " followed the harvests". I guess this means that she worked in the fruit groves as a migratory picker?

Bold type added by me just now.
Huckabee WAS striking a nerve with me when I read the article with his name in it.. I made the above post on this thread, Post #63 on 04-09-2009 at 01:21 AM .
I have only discussed the reason for this in the private area previously, but I have a high degree of psychic ability. I don't try to make it happen, nor do I exploit it in any case on or off WS.
However, as you can see from the post, the name " Huckabee" with a slightly diffrerent spelling ( Huckaby) came to be an important name in the case AFTER the orignal post about Ted Huckabee, from a different family tree, was made. That's why the name Huckabee ( or Huckaby) stood out to me strongly before I even knew Melissa Huckaby's name.

I had honestly hoped this would not come up, and I am sorry that anyone was offended by such an innocuous remark. Nothing unseemly was said about Mr. Huckabee at all.

 

[Nora Charles]

I never noticed the "Independent" sign - indeed that does change everything. My background is primarily non-denominational so I certainly understand the range of beliefs Independent would encompass. Back to square one, although we did get an education in Baptist doctrine! It will be interesting to see what becomes significant as this case develops.

 

[SeekingJana]

I had read the short anonymous Lawless family statement in the local newspaper earlier today, but just now watched the two video clips of the family speaking.

Lane, Brian and Brett all three speak on 2 separate video clips, along with a dark haired lady whom I think is Brett's wife.
These people are extremely kind, generous in the midst of their own pain, and say they want the truth to come out, whatever it may turn out to be regarding Melissa.
I am very glad they came forward with a personal message of prayer and condolences for Sandra's family.

Both families have been hurt beyond adequate words by this senseless crime. Both families are victims of the murder, in different ways.
I won't be posting any longer on this thread about the Lawless family out of respect. They didn't do this, Melissa did.

Maria

 

[FishingFunnyFrog]

I never noticed the "Independent" sign - indeed that does change everything. My background is primarily non-denominational so I certainly understand the range of beliefs Independent would encompass. Back to square one, although we did get an education in Baptist doctrine! It will be interesting to see what becomes significant as this case develops.

Nora- which part of the Clover Rd. Baptist doctrine are you interested in? They had a pretty thorough Statement of Faith on the http://svng.com/tracy/what.htm webpage which is now taken down. I thought someone had copied the text onto websleuths but now I can't find it anywhere :waitasec: I can only find a cached version of the main page on that old website...not the "what we believe section". Did anyone take a screen shot?