Fingerprints and gloves

[ClockWatcher]

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFil...ommunications with Law Enforcement, et al.PDF

I actually just read this renewed motion front to back. WoW! Seems to indicate where LKB is going with things.

Two items that reach out and slap me:
1) I was astounded at the 18 finger prints mention on page 60! This really excites me as after the reports of there being no prints from the other A's etc etc, I was giving up on the notion. This seems to confirm that there WERE prints found...18 of them....and they weren't GA, CA, or LA's!

2) They plan on tearing us Dr. Vass! Requesting the last 12 years of info is just ridiculous!

1) Oh yeah! What was that defense team? There are no finger prints? Huh?

2) Agreed! Dr.Vass is da man! LKB can try, but Dr. Vass has a superior reputation and is jury friendly. He's articulate without being condescending, able to convey very complicated science in an easy to grasp manner and has a charming personality. I adore him!

 

[Oakley]

I don't understand why the SA office does not turn over all of this evidence over to the defense. Everyone keeps saying that this is going to cost $4 million or more. It's soooo obvious that she is guilty as sin! I just don't get why the state would want to prolong all of this. I'm baffled by it. I know that everyone dislikes the defense team but they are doing their jobs just like the SA. The gentlemen for the SA that is always wiggling in his chair, talking out loud and tossing his arms around (tall skinny guy) really really really gets on my nerves. If he does this in front of jurors I wonder what kind of effect it will have? He acts like he is 7 yrs old on the playground bullying the defense (JB). And the judge just sits there and lets it happen!!! I'm flabbergasted every time I see him in court. It would be horrific if she gets off b/c the SA wont do it's job fairly! I DO NOT THINK SHE IS INNOCENT! I have watched and read all the files from the get go. She deserves what she gets whether it be life or death in jail. I just worry about the SA having a backwards effect on the outcome b/c they are holding back evidence. It sure does seem like a slam dunk case to me. I just don't understand. Especially if her prints are on the gloves and misc. items from the crime scene. :waitasec: I watched the OJ trial from start to finish and I cried so hard when the verdict came in. I can only pray that justice is done here and she doesn't get off or by some freak chance b/c the SA isn't treating her "fairly" in the eyes of the law, not turning over evidence etc. Does anyone agree with me or am I all alone in my views? :headache:

I wonder if we are watching the same broadcast. I am quite impressed with the SA in this case, and haven't observed any of what you are describing. I HAVE observed the defense behaving badly, Jose making faces when others are speaking, unprofessional smirks, clumsy & poorly written motions, etc. There is post after post here describing same. Sorry! MOO.

PS Reason defense doesn't have docs is they don't retrieve them.

 

[LambChop]

I think the fingerprints were taken from the car not the duct tape. It talks about a print on the exterior of the trunk in the same paragraph.

 

[snow_walker]

I still don't know if it is up to the state to provide all the requested info, or if it is up to the defense to go fetch the info for themselves, but I know if it were my client, and I wanted that info, I might ask for it from the state first, but if it wasn't sitting on my desk in a timely fashion, I would be out there beleaguring the FBI and whoever else to give me a copy.
It would seem to me if this is state evidence, then the defense team is entitled to a copy (but admit to being ignorant of whether that is true or not) but surely there is more than one way to get copies.

 

[kew17]

It must be kept in mind that to the extent of the info defense is requesting, the SA "wouldn't" have. ie: bench notes, standards, peer review policies for 2 years, yadi yadi, plus Vass' records for 12 years and info on his grants, ethics disclosure forms, internal/external information & records of any allegations of wrong doing on the part of an investigator or lab person for the last 12 years (page 21)......the list goes on, for about 90 pages. Their request is extremely lengthy and bottom line, the SA's office doesn't have alot of the info they are requesting.

I had to shake my head at the insinuation that Oak Ridge is NOT a "crime lab".

Back to the prints. LP said their were KC prints and was quite adamant about it. Looking at the 2/18/09 doc dump, the info on prints was kinda vague to say the least. There was alot of room open for interpretation. It said no GA, CA, or LA latent prints, but no mention of KC. I get the feeling that as it was still being investigated, the info was not released then and when they found the results may have been around the time we saw the DP put back on the table. Just my humble opinion of course.:crazy:

 

[watcher9]

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFil...ommunications with Law Enforcement, et al.PDF

I actually just read this renewed motion front to back. WoW! Seems to indicate where LKB is going with things.

Two items that reach out and slap me:
1) I was astounded at the 18 finger prints mention on page 60! This really excites me as after the reports of there being no prints from the other A's etc etc, I was giving up on the notion. This seems to confirm that there WERE prints found...18 of them....and they weren't GA, CA, or LA's!

2) They plan on tearing us Dr. Vass! Requesting the last 12 years of info is just ridiculous!

This is the first I remember hearing about finding actual fingerprints. Do we know yet where they were located?
I hope some of them can put another nail in the coffin for KC instead of being used to place the blame on whomever just happened to touch some of the items in the trash bag from bf's apartment..

 

[Valhall]

ADDED NOTE: After reading more of the discovery and speaking to a contact. This is referring to "known samples taken" from cloth and plastic items found. Sorry for confusion.

List of items I have found so far in latest doc dump that had known prints taken. Note the bold ones are from the crime scene. Haven't found written ID of whose prints they are...but this is potentially big. If they are KC, CA, GA or LA - tie back to Anthony home.

q23 - spare tire cover
q24 - left side of trunk liner
q25 - right side of trunk liner
q82 - blanket found at crime scene
q83 - piece of fabric at crime scene
q84 - laundry bag at crime scene (two knowns taken - one on bag, one on strap)
q90 - piece of fabric at crime scene
q91 - piece of plastic from crime scene
q101 - piece of fabric crime scene
q102 - piece of fabric crime scene
q103 - blanket at crime scene
q111 - piece of fabric at crime scene
q243 - pull up from car
q244 - mama doll from car
q245 - rug from Anthony front porch
k13 - pull up from Anthony home
k14 - package of pull ups from Anthony home
k33 - laundry bag from Anthony home (two knowns taken)

 

[Valhall]

I don't think I'm interpreting correctly. You can remove this thread. In my reading I've concluded that means they took "known samples" of each of these items.

Boy was it exciting for a minute though!

 

[QB.]

Yes, that was exciting until I read your 2nd post.

It is disappointing to read the findings of fingerprint info in this latest discovery. But let's not forget about the fingerprint info that was requested by JB in this motion filed back in January.
http://www.wftv.com/news/18594108/detail.html page 4

What are those about and where is the info in the latest discovery?

 

[Valhall]

Yes, that was exciting until I read your 2nd post.

It is disappointing to read the findings of fingerprint info in this latest discovery. But let's not forget about the fingerprint info that was requested by JB in this motion filed back in January.
http://www.wftv.com/news/18594108/detail.html page 4

What are those about and where is the info in the latest discovery?

Unfortunately, those 18 latents he is referring to there are all from items taken from the Anthony home that might have Zanny prints on them. They came from CD's mainly. Nothing probative really.

 

[QB.]

What about the 8 areas of latent fingerprint lifts referred to on page 3234 of discovery (is this page out?) and
the fragment of the latent fp lift from exterior of trunk of vehicle from page 3194 (also have not seen this page of discovery?) as referenced in the motion.

 

[magic-cat]

What about the 8 areas of latent fingerprint lifts referred to on page 3234 of discovery (is this page out?) and
the fragment of the latent fp lift from exterior of trunk of vehicle from page 3194 (also have not seen this page of discovery?) as referenced in the motion.

SO what does "knowns taken" mean for sure? And I also noted in some of the handwritten FBI notes that they were talking about some latent lifts that OCSD had...can't recall on what...it is in the 1405 page document...

 

[Valhall]

SO what does "knowns taken" mean for sure? And I also noted in some of the handwritten FBI notes that they were talking about some latent lifts that OCSD had...can't recall on what...it is in the 1405 page document...

Well, I found out for sure...it means a "known sample". In other words, let's say I have a napkin from my kitchen and I clip a sample from it. That sample is "known" because I know it is from the napkin in my kitchen. So then if I go and do analysis on my duct tape and I find fibers that match this "known" of my napkin, I can do a tieback to a "known".

I should probably get some one to change my gimped up thread title.

lmao - I was really excited there for about 15 minutes!

 

[snow_walker]

Your not the first person to think they have found something really exciting and then realise it wasn't.. so back to the drawing board time. Bet we all get a turn at that before this case is finished. It has happened to me several times already, so must be someone elses turn.

 

[tasylshari]

Valhall, MM, etc: which latent prints do you believe have NOT been released by the FBI, as heard in todays court session?
Drooling here....

 

[kaRN]

I think it's possible she wore gloves. A tight fitting leather glove wouldn't make it really difficult to use duct tape. A latex glove would be impossible. I just don't see KC handling anything dead without gloves.

 

[magic-cat]

Valhall, MM, etc: which latent prints do you believe have NOT been released by the FBI, as heard in todays court session?
Drooling here....

Does anyone recall the single fingerprint on the page all by itself in one of the doc dumps? It was just a lone fingerprint with no explanation at all...hmmm...explanation forthcoming? Perhaps...

 

[AZlawyer]

Does anyone recall whether the FBI's Latent Print Unit tried the vacuum metal deposition method on any of the items checked for prints? I know there was a note in the handwritten portion of the FBI materials saying that OSCO wanted them to consider using VMD on, IIRC, the black plastic bags in which the remains were found.

Maybe the latent print reports saying "no latent prints found" meant that no prints were found using the methods they had used so far (black powder, etc.). But perhaps they went back later and tried VMD on certain items....

 

[Tulessa]

Interesting. JA refers to the evidence as latent prints but JB refers to it as latent evidence.

 

[QB.]

Interesting. JA refers to the evidence as latent prints but JB refers to it as latent evidence.

Yes, I did notice that too.