Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #11

[MD MOMMY]

First, in the scenario I envision, Joran may not even have attempted to "extort" any money from anyone. I don't think we know all the facts here; the FBI can't even get it straight about whether they provided the funds or Beth did. Regardless, it would be my contention that Joran, who admittedly is addicted to both gambling and doing almost anything for money, came into a large sum of money in some way, through this sting (however it worked).

I surmise the the intention was not to arrest him for "extortion" (or he would have been arrested on May 10, as any other victim of a sting would normally have been), but to lure him to Peru for whatever was initially planned for him there. I now strongly suspect that whatever that original plan was, it didn't include the murder of Stephany. I'm not sure exactly what happened to abort the original plan (as I theorized in another post, it could very possibly have been that Stephany was supposed to be involved in some way, and ended up backing out and alerting Joran).

Obviously, I don't know exactly what happened, and neither does anyone else on this forum. I'm only speculating- in a wild way, I admit. I interpret the video, and all the leaks and statements from Peruvian authorities far differently than everyone else here, I guess. We'll just have to await further developments in this story.

Thinking out loud here but say they did "lure" him to Peru, don't you think they would have kept WAY better tabs on his actions? Don't you think they would have had the hotel under surveillance..hidden cameras in the hotel room etc? He was in that hotel for a LONG time. It's not as though he was jumping around Peru.

 

[Carolina Girl]

In my opinion, this story is bizarre enough the way it appears to have happened.

 

[Flow]

Imagine that - Beth felt bad that her $$$ may have financed Joran's trip to Peru. [Per JQK on Dateline NBC.]

Didn't I read that very thought on here several days ago?

 

[KR2tonenow]

I think Joran is being framed because of the Natalee Holloway case.

In my view, there are powerful interests who do not want the truth about that case to come out. Again, a lot of this will be in the book.

I agree the timing is too much of a coincidence of the murder of NH 5 years later, and the extortion plot as well as the opening of the Natalie Holloway Rescue center. But then the finger would be pointed at the Holloway's, which I seriously doubt. However, we do know that the Peruvian father of SF ran for President 2x and lost. Does this play into Peru Politics or the FBI? What is your theory, respectively.

 

[i.b.nora]

Conspiracy theories usually put me to sleep, and the one being discussed now is no exception.

 

[Flow]

Then why is he implicating his father saying his Dad disposed of her body? Why is he in trouble for taking money from Natalees mom under the guise of knowing where her daughters body is?

Joran has made a living for 5 years "confessing" over and over again about what happened to Natalee and where her remains are. And to date, how many of these turned out to be supported by anything beyond his own words?

eta - I forgot to respond to your post. JMO - he was willing to exploit any situation to get another 5 minutes of "fame" and fortune.

 

[passionflower]

Have we heard anything about the 2 missing girls from a gambling casino where JVS was ?? Columbia????

 

[panthera]

Listening to JQK's description of Joran's story about how Natalee died on Dateline: Joran says he threw Nataleee to the ground and she hit the back of her head. If this story has any kernel of truth, it is surely not a coincidence that Stephany, too, suffered an injury to the back of her head.

I too noticed that, and more than one similiarity which seems to be his MO.

MOO

 

[Chablis]

The thing that sucks for Joran the most, is that this hotel is not one with cards you scan to get into the rooms, so the card couldnt have gotten lost and someone else could have used it, you had to go to the front desk to get the key to gain access, and when you leave you would give the key to the front desk.

Its said someone called for Joran to see if he was there, and then they realized this guy owed two days worth of rent. I have no doubt hes probably the one who called looking for himself, I bet he is shocked it took them so long to find the body.

However, Joran also confessed because he saw that camera by his room, he knew there was no defending that.

But now hes changed his tune as expected.

jmo

 

[panthera]

Have we heard anything about the 2 missing girls from a gambling casino where JVS was ?? Columbia????

My dear passionflower it was said tonight on NG that he only stopped at the airport in Colombia to change planes and this story isn't true. MOO

 

[panthera]

The thing that sucks for Joran the most, is that this hotel is not one with cards you scan to get into the rooms, so the card couldnt have gotten lost and someone else could have used it, you had to go to the front desk to get the key to gain access, and when you leave you would give the key to the front desk.

Its said someone called for Joran to see if he was there, and then they realized this guy owed two days worth of rent. I have no doubt hes probably the one who called looking for himself, I bet he is shocked it took them so long to find the body.

However, Joran also confessed because he saw that camera by his room, he knew there was no defending that.

But now hes changed his tune as expected.

jmo

I read that the phone call was legitimate, from someone at the casino. I believe it came from one of the Peruvian media outlets. MOO

 

[glorybug]

I get that you for some reason feel that VDS is innocent. Not sure if you think he's also innocent of NH murder as well, but that's beside the point.
I have no problem with people believing anything they want.

I do get bothered when it appears people ignore something they can see, or pick and choose evidence if it bolsters their theory. You have stated in several posts that the coffee video somehow exculpates VDS. What you keep failing to mention is your explanation for why in the world he would leave the hotel room, fail to shut the door completely, immediately begin knocking, realize he has not shut the door, pull the door shut, and then immediately begin knocking again. Please explain how this shows anything other than VDS trying to create an alibi. Please explain why he knocks on a still-open door, and then shuts it and knocks again.

Innocent people rarely need to create alibis- because they usually naturally have one. It's the thing they were doing when they weren't committing crimes.

I am not trying to be snarky, but I really want to know why it does not bother you that VDS KNOCKS ON AN OPEN DOOR, then sees it's open, closes it and begins again. I am not the only person who has seen this in the video, and the newspapers have reported it as well.

An Occam's Razor take on this would be that he had planned to do something- who knows what? See if knocking would draw attention? Check out how busy the corridor was? Most likely once he saw the camera he realized he shouldn't be practising his alibi in the hallway, and then realized he'd either left his key at the front desk or in the room. He had no keys in his hand, and did not lock the door from the outside. He did not need to. ALL motel rooms lock automatically from the outside, and the inner locks are just an extra security lock. I have been to many hotels/motels in my life, and it's pretty obvious that staff are trained to NEVER enter a room when they open the door for you, unless you ask them to bring baggage inside. There was no chance the staff would have entered and seen the body, unless he called attention to it, which he did not.

....
I have watched that coffee video again and again, and simply don't understand how people can find it incriminatnig. Weird, yes. However, as I noted, the fact that he went and got an employee to open the door just flies in the fact of any notion that a dead body was lying inside. But again, that's just my typically contrarian take on it.

 

[suzihawk]

I think Joran is being framed because of the Natalee Holloway case.

In my view, there are powerful interests who do not want the truth about that case to come out. Again, a lot of this will be in the book.

Who are these powerful interest?

 

[Chablis]

I read that the phone call was legitimate, from someone at the casino. I believe it came from one of the Peruvian media outlets. MOO

Oh, I didn't know that, well there goes my theory!

 

[burbqueen]

Ok but why would any sane or innocent person confess to killing Natalee??? He's been cleared. Go live your life, go to school etc. But no he pokes the situation over and over again. So is this some grand conspiracy? IMO no. For what end?? Jvs really isn't anyone important here in the u.s or Peru. He has lied over and over. What about the videos in thailand? Sex trade? Prostitution? Oh that's a conspirarcy too?? He even blames his dad! What about the secret hidden video. He confessed for what?!?!?

 

[Kimster]

Hey y'all! My mom wanted me to ask you guys if there is anything on this case recently that has not been on HLN and such. Sorry I haven't been keeping up. :blush:

But I gotta ask for my mama.

 

[ks1]

I'm definitely not trying to pull anyone's leg here. As for why Joran confessed, I think I've made it clear that I don't really think he did confess. Or, if he did, that it was coerced out of him. At this point, we are at the mercy of press releases and leaks from Peruvian authorities.

The crime scene evidence just keeps on changing. From mutliple stab wounds and a bloody mess everywhere to no murder weapon to the baseball bat to the tennis racket to the broken neck to the latest- Joran strangled her with his own shirt and may have hogtied her as well. I can't understand why I'm apparently the only one who finds this suspicious. Little mistakes can happen, incorrect information can leak out in the early stages of any crime, but this is well over a week now, and the "facts" in this case just keep evolving.

While I am a harsh critic of our own justice system, at least we are not at the Peruvian, third world level yet. If Joran was in America, and had access to a top defense attorney (like his old lawyer Joe Tacopina), it would be relatively easy to create reasonable doubt in the minds of any jury, just by concentrating on all these changing "facts" about the crime scene, many of which can be traced to the most official of sources- direct quotes from the head of the police investigation and the medical examiner's office.

I think that many of you would feel a bit differently if the American media would report on this story like journalists, instead of frothing at the mouth and leading the lynch mob. There have to be some defense attorneys and/or civil libertarians out there who are concerned about the terribly biased news coverage, and whether or not Joran is guilty of anything more than incredible stupidity, but if so they are never invited on any of these t.v. shows (Nancy Grace, Jane Velez-Mitchell, Greta, etc.) that devote so much time to this case. There is another side to every story.

I respect your opinion, though I wonder how you so easily dismiss the blood on his shirt, his skin under her fingernails, the fact that he fled the country and changed his appearance, moved her vehicle etc.... yet base your entire framed theory on changing "facts" which appear to me to be created by the media due to the LACK of any information being release by the police themselves.

 

[Chablis]

I respect your opinion, though I wonder how you so easily dismiss the blood on his shirt, his skin under her fingernails, the fact that he fled the country and changed his appearance, moved her vehicle etc.... yet base your entire framed theory on changing "facts" which appear to me to be created by the media due to the LACK of any information being release by the police themselves.

I just wonder why he didn't take the vehicle and drive two days worth with it!

 

[angela]

Really, what does it matter whether or not Anita is in Peru? She and Joran had not spoken for some time. He was heading down a road she did not want for him but was powerless to stop. I am sure she is thinking of her other two boys now. I am sure she will go to Peru and attempt to see Joran but is in no position, as a mother, to drop her other sons and their needs at this time.

Never has it been proven that Anita has done anything wrong.

 

[Unreals]

I agree the timing is too much of a coincidence of the murder of NH 5 years later, and the extortion plot as well as the opening of the Natalie Holloway Rescue center. But then the finger would be pointed at the Holloway's, which I seriously doubt. However, we do know that the Peruvian father of SF ran for President 2x and lost. Does this play into Peru Politics or the FBI? What is your theory, respectively.

I think you're on the right track; Stephany's father appears to be a powerful figure- another "coincidence" that Joran happens to choose his daughter to murder, on the exact five year anniversary of Natalee's disapperance?

Keep in mind that everything you are hearing, from Joran's "confession" to all the leaks about him supposedly leading them to Natalee's body, now claiming his father buried her, etc., are coming from behind closed doors, through sources (Peruvian authorities) that should be viewed with great skepticism.

The way this is progressing, I think that Joran will not live to stand trial. The police in Peru will not be criticized at all for his death- on the contrary, they will be lauded for their exceptional efforts at investigation, which produced a "confession" from the wiley, impossible to nail down "psychopath" in only a few days. Joran will then go down in history as the killer of Natalee Holloway and Stephany (perhaps they'll add on a few more "confessions" for good measure- like the girls in Columbia- and portray him as the "casino" serial killer many believe him to be).

I hope I'm wrong, but at this point there is little reason to be confident.